Clubs going bankrupt?

[drfchound]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

I suppose that if players adhere to the 2mtr rule it would stop all the grappling at free kicks and corners.

[The Red Baron]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

TRB, I don't doubt it will be difficult, but the EPL and EFL have every intention of finishing the season. I hear what you say, but the briefings we've had all point to them finishing this season, and money of course drives that. The Bundesliga will be the 1st major league to open up again, and lessons will be learnt from that, therefore, hopefully, we can complete.

There are some details that the authorities have shared with us that are not yet in the public domain, and if I could I would tell you. However, they have a plan, and several variations on that plan as well.

The big test is keeping all the various clubs on side. The EPL speaks with one voice pretty much, only 3 clubs want things done differently, but the EFL is a completely different ball game. Trusting them to get things over the line is a massive challenge.

OK Martin. Like I say, finishing the season is certainly desirable. I'll be interested in the plan when it emerges.

On your point about the clubs, it seems some, especially in League Two, are breaking ranks already.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

Austria are apparently going to try and finish behind closed doors, with everybody taking part being tested for Covid-19, and presumably anybody who tests positive not being allowed into the venue.

[Campsall rover]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

I suppose that if players adhere to the 2mtr rule it would stop all the grappling at free kicks and corners.

There is always a silver lining to everything.

[Wiltshire Exile]

On Talksport it was stated that the  players wages of every club in that division was equal to 106% of every clubs total income.
  Some (very few) may be within their total income, so some will be flying high into trouble quickly unless the owners are willing to stump up a lot of money. I can't see the banks being very helpful at the moment. If nothing is resolved within the next month I expect the dominoes to start to fall.

Well if nothing else this should be a wake up call for Football.

The bubble was going to burst eventually. This is going to be one massive crash. Hopefully some long term sense will return to the game.
Let’s hope we still have at least 70 of the 91 clubs left when normality resumes.

Blimey, Camps, surely you mean “let’s hope we still have all 91 clubs left when normality resumes”?!

[albie]

What the Premier League decide to do does not automatically mean that lower division clubs will do the same.

The financial pressures on clubs differ according to status, but also according to levels of debt that may fall due, and be called in.

If you are a creditor under extreme pressure from the business lockdown, can you afford to let outstanding debts remain on the books until profligate FC return to trading?

[Campsall rover]

On Talksport it was stated that the  players wages of every club in that division was equal to 106% of every clubs total income.
  Some (very few) may be within their total income, so some will be flying high into trouble quickly unless the owners are willing to stump up a lot of money. I can't see the banks being very helpful at the moment. If nothing is resolved within the next month I expect the dominoes to start to fall.

Well if nothing else this should be a wake up call for Football.

The bubble was going to burst eventually. This is going to be one massive crash. Hopefully some long term sense will return to the game.
Let’s hope we still have at least 70 of the 91 clubs left when normality resumes.

Blimey, Camps, surely you mean “let’s hope we still have all 91 clubs left when normality resumes”?!

Well yes obviously i do. But if a lack of income for clubs goes on for say another 4 + months do you think there won’t be substantial casualties?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

I suppose that if players adhere to the 2mtr rule it would stop all the grappling at free kicks and corners.

I suggest we re-sign Mark Wilson. He was the master of never quite getting close enough to make a challenge.

[drfchound]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

I suppose that if players adhere to the 2mtr rule it would stop all the grappling at free kicks and corners.

I suggest we re-sign Mark Wilson. He was the master of never quite getting close enough to make a challenge.

As the old joke goes.
Willo was very deceptive.......he was slower than you think.

[RoversAlias]

I love Willo. What he lacked in sheer talent he made up for in...being there.

Us Willo fanatics will always have that game against Derby.

[drfchound]

To be fair RA, he was a decent enough player for us but he was with us at a time when we had some very good midfielders.

I remember Richie Wellens being asked in a radio interview why he thought he never made the first team at Man Utd.
He said he could answer that in four words.......Keane, Giggs, Scholes, Beckham.

[redarmy82]

Rumours doing the rounds is that we might be lucky to see crowds in stadiums in 2020?  Clubs will be folding by the dozen.... 😪

I'd say that's almost certain. You might be lucky to go and watch a game of football in 2021, if we have to wait for a vaccine.

[since-1969]

Rumours doing the rounds is that we might be lucky to see crowds in stadiums in 2020?  Clubs will be folding by the dozen.... 😪

I'd say that's almost certain. You might be lucky to go and watch a game of football in 2021, if we have to wait for a vaccine.

You are so far from the truth you wouldn’t believe it . Heard immunity   is what is being subscribed . By locking families up for weeks it will and is taking effect . I’ve had the virus along with 4 others in my house hold by that , means  we should have the Immunity now necessary not to be infected . If you imagine 20 or so million house holds in a similar circumstance then vaccination is not the immediate priority as the economy IS . If people are allowed to back to work then they demand sport is returned also . I can see an August season start without last season having been resolved beyond no relegation and all results remaining classed as draws . IMO .

[BillyStubbsTears]

Good to see you're alright after having the virus 1969.

We aren't remotely close to Herd Immunity though. Absolute maximum, maybe 4-5 million have had a dose. It needs to be getting on for ten times that for HI to be effective.

[drfchound]

Rumours doing the rounds is that we might be lucky to see crowds in stadiums in 2020?  Clubs will be folding by the dozen.... 😪

I'd say that's almost certain. You might be lucky to go and watch a game of football in 2021, if we have to wait for a vaccine.

You are so far from the truth you wouldn’t believe it . Heard immunity   is what is being subscribed . By locking families up for weeks it will and is taking effect . I’ve had the virus along with 4 others in my house hold by that , means  we should have the Immunity now necessary not to be infected . If you imagine 20 or so million house holds in a similar circumstance then vaccination is not the immediate priority as the economy IS . If people are allowed to back to work then they demand sport is returned also . I can see an August season start without last season having been resolved beyond no relegation and all results remaining classed as draws . IMO .

Well I don’t know of anyone who can tell me whether or not they have had the virus.
I also dont know anyone who has been tested.
Personally, I wouldn’t fancy going into a football stadium without knowing whether I was immune or that the people near me or travelling with me couldn’t pass the virus on to me.
The proposed 100,000 (checked the noughts BST) tests per day that I keep reading about will still need nearly two years to test everyone in the UK.
Since-1969, even you say that you “should” be immune, not that you will be immune, so you are not certain of it yourself.

[redarmy82]

Rumours doing the rounds is that we might be lucky to see crowds in stadiums in 2020?  Clubs will be folding by the dozen.... 😪

I'd say that's almost certain. You might be lucky to go and watch a game of football in 2021, if we have to wait for a vaccine.

You are so far from the truth you wouldn’t believe it . Heard immunity   is what is being subscribed . By locking families up for weeks it will and is taking effect . I’ve had the virus along with 4 others in my house hold by that , means  we should have the Immunity now necessary not to be infected . If you imagine 20 or so million house holds in a similar circumstance then vaccination is not the immediate priority as the economy IS . If people are allowed to back to work then they demand sport is returned also . I can see an August season start without last season having been resolved beyond no relegation and all results remaining classed as draws . IMO .

I hope you're right.

Although there are reports coming out of South Korea that a significant number of people may have been infected twice, which would cast serious doubts on herd immunity being a viable way out of this.

Again, it's back to testing. We have to ramp up to a significant amount. Millions per week. How long it will take to carry out that many, is anyone's guess.

[Wiltshire Exile]

On Talksport it was stated that the  players wages of every club in that division was equal to 106% of every clubs total income.
  Some (very few) may be within their total income, so some will be flying high into trouble quickly unless the owners are willing to stump up a lot of money. I can't see the banks being very helpful at the moment. If nothing is resolved within the next month I expect the dominoes to start to fall.

Well if nothing else this should be a wake up call for Football.

The bubble was going to burst eventually. This is going to be one massive crash. Hopefully some long term sense will return to the game.
Let’s hope we still have at least 70 of the 91 clubs left when normality resumes.

Blimey, Camps, surely you mean “let’s hope we still have all 91 clubs left when normality resumes”?!

Well yes obviously i do. But if a lack of income for clubs goes on for say another 4 + months do you think there won’t be substantial casualties?

Sadly, if we don’t resume soon, then, yes, there could well be some casualties...but 21 out 91?. That’s nearly a whole Division of the EFL! 

[Campsall rover]

On Talksport it was stated that the  players wages of every club in that division was equal to 106% of every clubs total income.
  Some (very few) may be within their total income, so some will be flying high into trouble quickly unless the owners are willing to stump up a lot of money. I can't see the banks being very helpful at the moment. If nothing is resolved within the next month I expect the dominoes to start to fall.

Well if nothing else this should be a wake up call for Football.

The bubble was going to burst eventually. This is going to be one massive crash. Hopefully some long term sense will return to the game.
Let’s hope we still have at least 70 of the 91 clubs left when normality resumes.

Blimey, Camps, surely you mean “let’s hope we still have all 91 clubs left when normality resumes”?!

Well yes obviously i do. But if a lack of income for clubs goes on for say another 4 + months do you think there won’t be substantial casualties?

Sadly, if we don’t resume soon, then, yes, there could well be some casualties...but 21 out 91?. That’s nearly a whole Division of the EFL! 

If clubs don’t get the support they need from the FA, EFL & the PFA then who knows how many teams could fold. Many were financially unstable before this Virus started.

Season ticket sales for next season will be very small, maybe almost non existent at a time when they should be at there peak, i would have thought, and cash flow will be hit very hard indeed.

Clubs without very wealthy and generous benefactors or without very healthy bank balances may simply not have the ability to keep afloat.
21 might be optimistic. Hope i am wrong and all survive. They won’t though unless massive financial help is given by the football bodies.

[drfchound]

I have already paid for next seasons ST.

[Barmby Rover]

Playing behind closed doors is surely possible once all players can be tested regularly (once a week if testing kits become more widely available, if you believe this government!). If that is the case I would pay a tenner every week to watch Rovers play via the internet. How many more would, at least then the club will have some income.

[idler]

I would,definitely.

[rich1471]

Playing behind closed doors is surely possible once all players can be tested regularly (once a week if testing kits become more widely available, if you believe this government!). If that is the case I would pay a tenner every week to watch Rovers play via the internet. How many more would, at least then the club will have some income.

Paying a tenner would be cheaper than the ticket price and travel with all the away games left to play, count me in

[drfchound]

Me too.

[Campsall rover]

I have already paid for next seasons ST.

So have i.
The more that can renew or have already will help the clubs massively.

[nightporter]

Maybe this is the perfect time to switch to Summer football, new season kicking off in Feb 2021 gives time to complete this one. 

[ravenrover]

Martin- although I think finishing the 2019-20 season is highly desirable, for the reasons you point out, I just don't see how it can be achieved. The "Behind Closed Doors" business is the least of the obstacles. For example, how can you maintain the safety of players and club staff?

TRB, I don't doubt it will be difficult, but the EPL and EFL have every intention of finishing the season. I hear what you say, but the briefings we've had all point to them finishing this season, and money of course drives that. The Bundesliga will be the 1st major league to open up again, and lessons will be learnt from that, therefore, hopefully, we can complete.

There are some details that the authorities have shared with us that are not yet in the public domain, and if I could I would tell you. However, they have a plan, and several variations on that plan as well.

The big test is keeping all the various clubs on side. The EPL speaks with one voice pretty much, only 3 clubs want things done differently, but the EFL is a completely different ball game. Trusting them to get things over the line is a massive challenge.

Andnot forgetting any legal actiona which would occur. Can youimagine if Bournemouth were telegatedon goal difference with a number of games to play or,  Forest and Fulham not getting achance to finish in the automatic places or any other Promotion/Relegation in the other leagues being decided without the season being finished? As for West Brom and Leeds being promoted to The Premwith no relegations fromThe Prem just doesn't bear thinking about JMHO

[selby]

I suggested this a couple of weeks ago, and got negative responses, but to keep the advantages and disadvantages gained this season points wise, just start another full season with the points as they stood when this season was curtailed, and add points gained next season on to get a final total. That is only if this season cannot be concluded within the time scale and safely.
  The odd team that are a game or two behind could make up those fixtures to maintain parity somewhere in the season or knock the last results off to the team playing the least number of games in the season to maintain parity.
  Apart from Liverpool no other team is assured of promotion and Southend and Bolton would start minus any other point deductions. I would award Liverpool this seasons championship as there is no way they could be caught.

[silent majority]

What the Premier League decide to do does not automatically mean that lower division clubs will do the same.

The financial pressures on clubs differ according to status, but also according to levels of debt that may fall due, and be called in.

If you are a creditor under extreme pressure from the business lockdown, can you afford to let outstanding debts remain on the books until profligate FC return to trading?

They are indelibly linked though albie.

The working party is formed of the EFL, EPL, PFA and FA with money trickling down from the EPL. They've already released £50m of next seasons money to help keep EFL clubs afloat and a further £125m has been earmarked although this is proving contentious in some quarters.

[Dagenham Rover]

What the Premier League decide to do does not automatically mean that lower division clubs will do the same.

The financial pressures on clubs differ according to status, but also according to levels of debt that may fall due, and be called in.

If you are a creditor under extreme pressure from the business lockdown, can you afford to let outstanding debts remain on the books until profligate FC return to trading?

They are indelibly linked though albie.

The working party is formed of the EFL, EPL, PFA and FA with money trickling down from the EPL. They've already released £50m of next seasons money to help keep EFL clubs afloat and a further £125m has been earmarked although this is proving contentious in some quarters.

Yeh but its not all supposed to go to Bolton   

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Yes, I saw some reference to 90% of that £125m will be destined to Championship clubs as this 'advance' includes parachute payments that would have been due to clubs.