Wigan and Owls

[tyke1962]

I suspect he would. Wouldn't make me wrong though.

Even the most ardent Wigan fan seems to go deadly quiet when you point out that they've a turnover of £11.5m and a wage bill of £19.4m with 4k less fans in the stadium than ourselves .

Opinions eh !!! .

[BillyStubbsTears]

Tyke.

And the new owner wasn't aware of that information when he bought the club?

THAT is the key to the issue.

[Magicman]

I think it is corrupt the Wendy's get 12 points for breaking the football law, but get the points deduction next season.  Wigan fall on hard times and get 12 now so to me it is double standards, but it is the EFL think

[tyke1962]

Tyke.

And the new owner wasn't aware of that information when he bought the club?

THAT is the key to the issue.

Well the EFL did have wriggle room , the 12 point deduction isn't mandatory , they could have deducted them 9 points for instance .

Neither the EFL or the independent appeal panel were convinced by Wigan's version of events .

Bear in mind this wasn't a big club situation , two small clubs in the Championship were in the spotlight here .

[RoversAlias]

Bolton, Wycombe, Wigan. Three utterly dreadful decisions.

I don't think it's fair to put Wycombe in the same bracket to be honest, it's completely different to the situations with Bolton and Wigan. PPG may not have been the way forward but it was applied across the leagues so that's just that. Barnet were 11th in the National League but made the Play Offs and could easily have won promotion, so it's not just Wycombe, who happened to beat two other teams to earn promotion.

Anyway, I wish Wigan had stayed up but understand why the deduction has been applied. The fact Wednesday have avoided relegation this season despite their impropriety - wilful on the part of their owners - sticks though. That isn't fair.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

https://youtu.be/u6cN42EOngk

Worth a listen. Also talks about the Owls situation.

[idler]

Surely the bookies can just refuse to pay out on Wigan's relegation due to suspicious circumstances?

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Surely the bookies can just refuse to pay out on Wigan's relegation due to suspicious circumstances?

I think bookies both here or overseas will have the capability to investigate any irregular betting and if necessary report it to the authorities but as you say, the first step maybe voiding the bets.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Bolton, Wycombe, Wigan. Three utterly dreadful decisions.

I don't think it's fair to put Wycombe in the same bracket to be honest, it's completely different to the situations with Bolton and Wigan. PPG may not have been the way forward but it was applied across the leagues so that's just that. Barnet were 11th in the National League but made the Play Offs and could easily have won promotion, so it's not just Wycombe, who happened to beat two other teams to earn promotion.

Anyway, I wish Wigan had stayed up but understand why the deduction has been applied. The fact Wednesday have avoided relegation this season despite their impropriety - wilful on the part of their owners - sticks though. That isn't fair.

I wasn't complaining about using PPG. Rather the bizarre refusal to weight home and away PPG which was simply ridiculous.

[tyke1962]

My honest two penneth .

On the field have we deserved to stay up ? , absolutely not , we've given it a good go but in points earned on the field we fell short .

Do I have any sympathy for Wigan Athletic ? .

None what so ever , they've lived beyond their means for years .

This is a smaller club than ourselves and I haven't seen us enjoy a good number of seasons in the PL .

I haven't seen us beat Manchester City to win the FA cup and I've never seen us in Europe either .

They've had a good run on money they never generated through turnover and it's caught up with them .

There's a price to pay for reaching the heights they've hit as a small club and they've paid that price today in my opinion .

They aren't the first and they won't be the last either to suffer this fate .

You eventually reap what you sow .

[roversdude]

Excellent post tyke and one that some of our fans should read and digest

[Guernsey Exile]

My honest two penneth .

On the field have we deserved to stay up ? , absolutely not , we've given it a good go but in points earned on the field we fell short .

Do I have any sympathy for Wigan Athletic ? .

None what so ever , they've lived beyond their means for years .

This is a smaller club than ourselves and I haven't seen us enjoy a good number of seasons in the PL .

I haven't seen us beat Manchester City to win the FA cup and I've never seen us in Europe either .

They've had a good run on money they never generated through turnover and it's caught up with them .

There's a price to pay for reaching the heights they've hit as a small club and they've paid that price today in my opinion .

They aren't the first and they won't be the last either to suffer this fate .

You eventually reap what you sow .

I think there is an endless list of clubs you could apply 90% of that list to

[BillyStubbsTears]

Tyke.

May I politely point out that you are utterly missing the point.

It's not about Wigan.

It's not about how they are managed.

It's not about Barnsley. Or how THEY are managed.

It's about a crook, scamming the game, and being given a nod through by the inadequate EPL processes.

This is where we are.

Barnsley have gained. The entire game has lost.

THAT is why it's an outrage against natural justice.

I humbly suggest that, right now, you are too close to the issue to see the wood for the trees.

You will. One day.

[tyke1962]

Tyke.

May I politely point out that you are utterly missing the point.

It's not about Wigan.

It's not about how they are managed.

It's not about Barnsley. Or how THEY are managed.

It's about a crook, scamming the game, and being given a nod through by the inadequate EPL processes.

This is where we are.

Barnsley have gained. The entire game has lost.

THAT is why it's an outrage against natural justice.

I humbly suggest that, right now, you are too close to the issue to see the wood for the trees.

You will. One day.

Worth a read Billy , note the reference to the previous ownership .

Which is why I don't see Wigan as the victims .


https://threeamigoswigan.com/2020/08/06/why-relegation-to-league-1-might-not-be-such-a-bad-thing-for-wigan-athletic/

[BillyStubbsTears]

Tyke.

You obviously aren't reading my posts before replying to them. I'll spell it out again.

It's nothing to do with Wigan.

[tyke1962]

Tyke.

You obviously aren't reading my posts before replying to them. I'll spell it out again.

It's nothing to do with Wigan.

I know exactly what your saying but I don't view them in the same way you do .

Your clearly influenced by what happened to yourselves under Richardson which is understandable where as I'm looking at them under the previous Wigan ownership too .

All about opinions .

[BillyStubbsTears]

Once again. My opinion has nothing whatsoever to do with Wigan. It is about allowing a crook to scam the rules.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

The reasons for Owls points deduction applying next season have been published.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53803735

Note the EFL wanted to apply the sanction immediately but the Independant panel ruled against it.

[selby]

  The Wednesday are now about to take the Mick and appeal the 12 points being administered next season.
   Their appeal is going to be that the points should come off the season before last when they were 24 points clear of relegation and I suppose the offence was committed.
   This is going to roll on and on, just because the EFL can be run around and have no clout.
    Now is their chance to make a stance and relegate them this coming season, it will not happen, and if it does not, with a club now admitting their guilt, and only questioning the timing of their guilt to their advantage, if the wendies get away with it I can't see any club being bothered about any ruling the EFL try to dish out again, what a team of clowns.

[drfchound]

The reasons for Owls points deduction applying next season have been published.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53803735

Note the EFL wanted to apply the sanction immediately but the Independant panel ruled against it.

It does seem odd that an Independant panel, appointed by the EFL to make a decision, can overrule the EFL on when the points deduction can be applied.

[IDM]

But doesn’t the fact that it is an independent panel, take away any thought that the EFL may be biased.?

Folks on here were saying the EFL were favouring Wednesday but throwing the book at Macclesfield.  So if it is now clear the timing of the Wednesday punishment is not the EFL’s doing, will posters now start to be more thoughtful when they instantly criticise the EFL for every perceived failing.?

[selby]

  IDM, it is my view they are biased to the more influential teams, and the Wendies have also had a pull for a long time, even if a World Cup had come here their decrepit stadium was picked as one of the centres.
  Every remotely bigger club has been treated historically differently from the Stockport's Macclesfield's and Hereford@s of this world.
  The shoving out responsibility to a so called independent authority has just muddied the waters so that they can carry on as always, two examples last season Bolton and now the Wendies, with everyone in the circle pointing fingers at the next person in the circle saying not us, we wanted to but couldn't. A brilliant system of getting off the hook if required.
  Meanwhile the clubs that do not seem to matter to them one jot get shafted.

[drfchound]

But doesn’t the fact that it is an independent panel, take away any thought that the EFL may be biased.?

Folks on here were saying the EFL were favouring Wednesday but throwing the book at Macclesfield.  So if it is now clear the timing of the Wednesday punishment is not the EFL’s doing, will posters now start to be more thoughtful when they instantly criticise the EFL for every perceived failing.?

That is fair enough IDM, but DBR said that the EFL wanted to apply the points deduction this season.
Doesn’t that mean that the clubs (who are evidently the EFL) had decided that is what they wanted to do.
He said that the IP wouldn’t let them do it.

[selby]

  If the Wendies carry out their threat of an appeal they will do so under the impression they will get away with it for a second time.

[drfchound]

Don’t know if it has been mentioned already but the bbc sport website says that if Wigan haven’t been sold by 31st August then they may not be allowed to start the new season.
The statement is made by the  Latin’s administrations so I don’t know how much clout  that will hold.
That deadline is less than two weeks before the scheduled start to the new season.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

The reasons for Owls points deduction applying next season have been published.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53803735

Note the EFL wanted to apply the sanction immediately but the Independant panel ruled against it.

It does seem odd that an Independant panel, appointed by the EFL to make a decision, can overrule the EFL on when the points deduction can be applied.

The Independant panel is not appointed by the EFL!! Otherwise, it wouldn't be Independant.

There are guidelines in the rules about the make up on an Independant panel and whom appoints the personnel!

It's another blow for the EFL in any case.

Yes, Wigan could be another Bolton/Bury. Let's hope the EFL have learned from last season and dont allow Wigan to start the season unless a buyer is in place.

[selby]

DBR, I see your point about the way an independent panel is formed, and how the guidelines are followed.
  The thing I question is the results being the same every time, the small club gets hammered and the big club gets a slap on the wrist.
  Very independent, and in fairness they have a ten out of ten record up to press. You can throw in the Teves affair as well if you want.

[Janso]

Tevez was nothing to do with the Football League, surely?

Do they and the Premier League use the same panel then 

[DonnyBazR0ver]

DBR, I see your point about the way an independent panel is formed, and how the guidelines are followed.
  The thing I question is the results being the same every time, the small club gets hammered and the big club gets a slap on the wrist.
  Very independent, and in fairness they have a ten out of ten record up to press. You can throw in the Teves affair as well if you want.

I think the increase in cases appears to have increased the EFLs workload somewhat. I think to the average punter there appears to be some inconsistencies with the outcomes however, other than the administration cases, every other case is different and no doubt the Independant panel will say they judge each case on merit based on the evidence presented to them.

What is also a concern is with the panel appearing to criticise the EFL about their investigations, they probably don't know whether they want a sh*t or a shave at the moment. They probably feel they're on trial themselves.

[drfchound]

The reasons for Owls points deduction applying next season have been published.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53803735

Note the EFL wanted to apply the sanction immediately but the Independant panel ruled against it.

It does seem odd that an Independant panel, appointed by the EFL to make a decision, can overrule the EFL on when the points deduction can be applied.

The Independant panel is not appointed by the EFL!! Otherwise, it wouldn't be Independant.

There are guidelines in the rules about the make up on an Independant panel and whom appoints the personnel!

It's another blow for the EFL in any case.

Yes, Wigan could be another Bolton/Bury. Let's hope the EFL have learned from last season and dont allow Wigan to start the season unless a buyer is in place.

Fair enough DBR, perhaps I should have said the IP which was designated to make a decision.
However i still think it is odd that the EFL wanted to apply the points deduction this season But we’re overruled by the panel.