US Election

[BillyStubbsTears]

Looking like the nightmare scenario.

Massive win for Biden on the national vote share.

Much tighter on the Electoral College and Pennsylvania looking key. But Pennsylvania counts mail in votes very slowly. So this could take days to resolve. Meanwhile, based on the votes cast today, Trump insists he has won and starts firing up his base to resist if the mail in votes take Pennsylvania off him.

Going to be ugly...

[dknward2]

Watching sky news right now and most places seem to close to call

[BillyStubbsTears]

Barring strange results elsewhere, Biden needs to win Michigan and Wisconsin plus any one of:

Florida
Georgia
North Carolina
Arizona
Pennsylvania.

Current votes counted put Trump ahead in the first three of those. Arizona was always a knife edge. That's why Pennsylvania is looking key. If it is, we'll not know a result for several days.

[scawsby steve]

There'll be no shenanigans from me. If the results are as close over the next 2 days as they seem to be, I'll just pay my £50 into the Rovers foodbank anyway, no matter who looks likely to win.

[ChrisBx]

It's starting to feel a little like 2016 again.

[Donnywolf]

At times like now I wonder just one thing. Is it me ? Is it me thats out of touch (albeit with another Nations Politics) and Trump really is something different to what I actually see him as.

I cant believe that so many people still see a Trump that I dont. He seems to insult them - be racist in the extreme - appoint hire fire who he sees fit and yet in some States they seem to vote 60/40 in his favour

In as much as I have noticed in my lifetime he (to me) is without doubt the worst there has been and yet here "we" are possibly stuck with him for another 4 years

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Got to remember Americans are on a whole quite different to us in their political views.  Even the views of Biden would be seen as far too central or right wing to the left in this country, it is generally a more right wing country and trump plays up to that narrative.  He also plays on the optimism card and promises to give Americans more money in their pockets. That's always a good selling point.

Add to that as I've said all along Biden is not a strong opposition in my view and his campaign just doesn't inspire like say Obama did or even for all his faults Trump.

[SydneyRover]

Just watching and listening to the coverage from ABC News America live coverage and they were  talking about the positive effect the optimism that trump pushes out all the time (true or not) having an effect on voters.

I'll reaching for the bottle very soon I think

[Campsall rover]

Just watching and listening to the coverage from ABC News America live coverage and they were  talking about the positive effect the optimism that trump pushes out all the time (true or not) having an effect on voters.

I'll reaching for the bottle very soon I think

I do not claim to be a socialist Sydney but I find Trump abhorrent. The man is behaving like a dictator, not a USA president.
Don’t think Biden would be good for USA economy which will not be good for the UK. But Trump is a danger to himself never mind the world.

[Hounslowrover]

Trump declaring victory and going to the Supreme Court, millions of votes become worthless, or as he would say ‘fraudulent’.   I really worry about democracy.

[SydneyRover]

Just watching and listening to the coverage from ABC News America live coverage and they were  talking about the positive effect the optimism that trump pushes out all the time (true or not) having an effect on voters.

I'll reaching for the bottle very soon I think

I do not claim to be a socialist Sydney but I find Trump abhorrent. The man is behaving like a dictator, not a USA president.
Don’t think Biden would be good for USA economy which will not be good for the UK. But Trump is a danger to himself never mind the world.

My view of a Biden win would be that he would stabilise the WH and the country (if trump supporters allow it) He will have a mountain of a workload and normalise relations with other countries.

[River Don]

Frankly I never saw a candidate as unispiring as Biden. How they managed to make him their pick to go up against Trump, I'll never understand.

Everytime Obama leant him support, he looked the real deal by comparison.

[Donnywolf]

Trump declaring victory and going to the Supreme Court, millions of votes become worthless, or as he would say ‘fraudulent’.   I really worry about democracy.

I have said also leading on from your point that if he gets a second term that he will then try to change to Constitution (like Putin did) to allow himself a chance of further terms in the future

Ive seen so much "twisting" of the truth from him - that I would not put it past him. Even he might not get away with it though

[DonnyOsmond]

Pensylvania and Georgia will be the key seats now. If they go blue then Bidens done it. If either go red then Trump's won the election.

[Filo]

America has a strange way of deciding elections, how can half a dozen states decide who becomes President, it’s like the rest of the Country does n’t matter and its a waste of time voting

[BillyStubbsTears]

Same as here Filonbut just on a larger scale.

The real outrage there though is that Biden is probably going to win the overall popular vote by 4-5%, but possibly lose the election. That really isn't a fit for purpose democratic system.

[DonnyOsmond]

America has a strange way of deciding elections, how can half a dozen states decide who becomes President, it’s like the rest of the Country does n’t matter and its a waste of time voting

Based on population, isn't it? A desert shouldn't get the same say as NY or California.

[selby]

  I am really not bothered who wins another countries elections at all, in fact this is the first time I have commented at all.
  My gut feeling is that if Biden wins within his first presidency he will step aside on health grounds and we will have the first woman president which will be no bad thing considering the last two men.

[BillyStubbsTears]

America has a strange way of deciding elections, how can half a dozen states decide who becomes President, it’s like the rest of the Country does n’t matter and its a waste of time voting

Based on population, isn't it? A desert shouldn't get the same say as NY or California.

True.

But Wyoming with 600,000 population gets 3 Electoral College votes. 200,000 per vote.

California with 40million population, gets 55 votes. 725,000 per vote. It is a grossly undemocratic system.

[Filo]

America has a strange way of deciding elections, how can half a dozen states decide who becomes President, it’s like the rest of the Country does n’t matter and its a waste of time voting

Based on population, isn't it? A desert shouldn't get the same say as NY or California.

I have n’t a clue, from what I read some states give all their electoral college votes to the winner, and a few states split them into the winners of districts, in my opinion it’s a really strange and complicated way to decide a Presidential election

[Donnywolf]

America has a strange way of deciding elections, how can half a dozen states decide who becomes President, it’s like the rest of the Country does n’t matter and its a waste of time voting

Based on population, isn't it? A desert shouldn't get the same say as NY or California.

Yes its a strange system but of course its their system - and there are many articles explaining it and how it can mean all votes are not equal

We are no better though with FPTP - but till either change you can have Trump winning with 3 or 4 million votes less than Clinton got - and who knows maybe 2 million or more less than Biden

Seems that is a fairly recent scenario though

[EasyforDennis]

The US is a really weird country in every way. Money is God in America. Morals take no part in their thinking and without doubt the majority of the population are the thickest people you can imagine. I remember my first visit many years ago when the company I worked for visited Florida to plan the first holidays offered from the UK to Miami. Boy was it interesting.

The fact that the majority of them haven't got a passport because they never leave the country tells you a lot. Nobody or nowhere else matters to them.

The best saying I ever heard explains a lot about them. Q. "Why do we have wars in the world?" A. "To help the Americans learn geography!"

I believe no matter what the result of the election Trump will do everything in his power to still be POTUS for the next 4 years and there will a huge amount of civil unrest.

He is a covid denier and did anyone notice how many of his disciples wore masks this morning? Covid will never go away whilst this clown rules the largest infected country in the world.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I've been saying for weeks that Trump would immediately challenge the legitimacy of the mail in votes and use dangerously inflamatory language to stir up his angry supporters. I've often wondered if I was overplaying it and being too dramatic, but he's done it before even going to bed on polling day. he's claimed that he's won and the Democrats are trying to steal the election.

This is horrifically dangerous. Whoever wins, he is widening fractures in society and undermining trust in the very basis of democracy. And potentially stirring up violence.

[bpoolrover]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

[Filo]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

What a ridiculous statement

[bpoolrover]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

What a ridiculous statement

in what what way? There was a vote leave won the remain tried for the next 2 years to overturn the result! Of course it’s not the same but the principle is the same people didn’t get the result they wanted and refused to accept it

[Donnywolf]

The fact that the majority of them haven't got a passport because they never leave the country tells you a lot. Nobody or nowhere else matters to them.

Ive toured there many times - and have now been stopped 1 short of visiting half the States (stuck on 24)

Its right what you say about Passports and it goes further than that. On a tour of New England 20 years or so since I was checking out of a very posh Motel in Vermont and the lady owner asked if we were going anywhere nice that day - yes I said New Hampshire

She said - yes they tell me its really nice. I said what have you never been and she said NO. She lived I estimated 60 miles from the border with NH. At its widest part Vermont would be 100 miles from its Western border to its Eastern border with New Hampshire so she must have really loved Vermont

I worked (by being sold to) an American Company and on the day I went into EH&S I was welcomed by loads of Colleagues in Ohio - and they all sent me best wishes and asked me questions and I replied to most - well I have been to the USA and been in 23 States and want to do the lot. Most of them could not get above 3 and again that must be a choice but it being so big they call a trip of a lifetime a Tour of the West Coast if they are back east - not going to Europe or the Far East

[Donnywolf]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

What a ridiculous statement

in what what way? There was a vote leave won the remain tried for the next 2 years to overturn the result! Of course it’s not the same but the principle is the same people didn’t get the result they wanted and refused to accept it

There isnt a result yet for anyone to overturn or not respect - and one of the Parties (Trump) cannot claim victory as he has 213 "Seats" and he needs 270. Neither can Biden who is still on 224.

So bit early for saying Trump is not respecting the Vote as he has not lost yet

[Glyn_Wigley]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

What a ridiculous statement

in what what way? There was a vote leave won the remain tried for the next 2 years to overturn the result! Of course it’s not the same but the principle is the same people didn’t get the result they wanted and refused to accept it

In what way? Trump wants to use the courts to negate the vote of the people. Remain wanted the people to democratically vote again on the final deal. That way.

[IDM]

Trump is like the vote remain of brexit, have a vote then just refuse to accept the result and no doubt try and get it overturned

What a ridiculous statement

in what what way? There was a vote leave won the remain tried for the next 2 years to overturn the result! Of course it’s not the same but the principle is the same people didn’t get the result they wanted and refused to accept it

Bullshit.

The post brexit referendum argument for a second referendum was about there being no definition of the finer detail of what Leave actually means in practice.  It’s nearly 4 and a half yeas on and it’s still no clearer..

That was the issue, it wasn’t about not accepting the result.  Totally different argument so there is no analogy here..

What Trump was saying this morning was more like arguing for a football match to finish early when you’re winning by one goal, but to carry on for the full 90 minutes plus, when you’re losing.