European super League

[sha66y]

I hope this happens and happens fast,

I can’t abide these elite team supporters talking about historical pride and grass roots football when I’d wager 99% of them wouldn’t be able to name a National League team if their life depended on it...

They know the cost of everything and the value of nothing, happy to see a 100 million pound acquisition for their team, yet little realising nor caring that 1% of that would keep the lights on at a 5th tier teams ground for a couple of years....” oh there are teams lower than the premiership?”

I want this to happen so that we can all be involved in the great reset...and it would be nice to watch the aftermath meltdown of the elite plastic fans....

Rant over, ................... for now

[silent majority]

I'm not sure if any of you follow Brazilian football but they have been in crisis for a while.

This article draws a great comparison between the struggles in Brazil and the setting up of a European Super League. Its a good read, just imagine that Brazil is Europe and the states in Brazil are individual European countries;

https://www.espn.com/soccer/brazilian-serie-a/story/4274748/fan-unrest-in-brazil-serves-as-warning-to-europes-super-league-dreams

[ian1980]

I hope this happens and happens fast,

I can’t abide these elite team supporters talking about historical pride and grass roots football when I’d wager 99% of them wouldn’t be able to name a National League team if their life depended on it...

They know the cost of everything and the value of nothing, happy to see a 100 million pound acquisition for their team, yet little realising nor caring that 1% of that would keep the lights on at a 5th tier teams ground for a couple of years....” oh there are teams lower than the premiership?”

I want this to happen so that we can all be involved in the great reset...and it would be nice to watch the aftermath meltdown of the elite plastic fans....

Rant over, ................... for now

I’m sure there’s somewhere, possibly Sweden, where 1% of every player transfer received goes to a local grassroots team from their area

Seams like a very good idea to me

[silent majority]

It has been inevitable for some years though that the ESL was going to happen.
Just like those builders who get planning refused but keep coming back with a revised set of plans until they get their own way.
The building goes ahead, some of the protesters even buy one of the houses and everyone gets used to things as they have become.

The protestors did their best but nothing could stop the development.

Your analogy doesn't really work as this was a different set of builders. The last time it was the ECA, not this time.

Furthermore they still haven't got planning permission, nor have they got any land to build on, the land belongs to someone else.

I don't think I've ever seen supporters so closely aligned as they are with this issue. Fans of the big six have all been active today in telling their clubs that they won't sit idly by.

I am on the same side as you SM and support the same things.
I just feel that the ESL is going to happen and has been inevitable for quite a few years.

I appreciate that, I was just pointing out that your analogy doesn't work.

And, that I don't believe that this is inevitable. Having spent some years working with colleagues in other national supporter organisations I am always in awe at how highly organised the Germans are with regard to protest etc.

Unfortunately for us supporters still seem to be drawn very much on partisan lines, but that may change, yesterday saw a surge of people signing up with the FSA.

[normal rules]

BBC news reporting that someone close to one of the six are saying the six are very unified in their joining the ESL. They are waiting for the storm to die down. they knew they were declaring nuclear war effectively on supporters and players and managers. They have signed the contracts to join last weekend and it is a binding contract.

The storm should never die down on this until such time as they are expelled from everything to do with the national and European and worldwide game. And even then, anyone connected with any of these clubs should live their lives knowing they will be  resented and disrespected forever.
There has to be consequences for taking this course of action, and those consequences have to be very firm, very robust, very long lasting and ever present.

I’m looking forward to seeing protests outside Stamford bridge tonight, and outside elland rd at the weekend and at villa park and any ground where top six will play. Sadly, the playing staff will bear the brunt, but given the owners are faceless, the playing staff will be in the firing line.

[Metalmicky]

I am hoping that we see some players protesting also... they have been shafted also - but have a means to influence... even if it means that they deliberately under-perform...  Fans are rightly furious and at the end of the day, they have the power to withdraw their money.

I saw this and it made me mad though...



They could have used uppercase throughout FFS.....

[normal rules]

Nice bit of humour from Wolves. They are claiming they were PL champions in 2018/19 having finished 7th behind the breakaway six.
They are suggesting it’s too late for a parade ?

[Metalmicky]

Other than financial gain, I can't see the benefits to these clubs - they will be essentially turning themselves into the football equivalent of the  Harlem Globetrotters.... 

[DonnyOsmond]

Nice bit of humour from Wolves. They are claiming they were PL champions in 2018/19 having finished 7th behind the breakaway six.
They are suggesting it’s too late for a parade ?

If they remove the results against those teams then Watford won the league that year.

[the vicar]

I don’t think the owner give a shit about having one fan in there ground as they will probably make more from American Chinese and oceanic tv rights

[sha66y]

I’m sure the Managers players of these teams are rubbing their grubby hands at the prospect of all that money they will receive ........ multi multi millionaires playing against multi multi millionaires.....

Oh! ...but the Players could refuse .....

[MachoMadness]

These clubs are run by shysters who only care about the financial side MM. They don't give a shit about the competition aspect or all the intangible things that make football great. Just the numbers on the accounts.

[Beerseller]

Since 2000, if my arithmetic is correct, only 18 teams have appeared in a Champions League final.  Extending that back to 1980 only increases it to 28 teams.  Since 2010, the 12 clubs plus PSG, Bayern and Dortmund have contested every final. The chances are that anyone aged 25 or younger, doesn't remember a final without them.

These clubs don't want to break away as such, they want to run their own European competition in an almost closed shop alongside their existing domestic league season.  It really isn't that much different from what we have now, except for the guarantee of the closed shop.  For all the talk of dreaming of reaching these heights, it never happens for almost every club.   Let the big boys have their own way.  The fact is, nothing much changes.

So who are we feeling sorry for?  Everton?  West Ham? Leicester?  They didn't feel sorry for us when they started all this with the Premier League cash cow or when 1998 happened to us.  They haven't been worried that we are never realistically going to be in with a chance of European qualification. When they were selling their souls for pots of money for coming anywhere above 18th in the EPL they weren't thinking about the fairness of it all.  There were no cries of foul from them when parachute payments were brought in or extended.  And before anyone says "what about their fans?", what about them?  They aren't bothered about us either. "The likes of Doncaster" isn't  a compliment.  If we go into oblivion they won't even wave goodbye. 

They'll all have to do what we do, manage on what they get and manage their expectations accordingly.  Boo f**king hoo.

[wilts rover]

You can almost read the outcome of the "fan-led" review now. Will just entrench the current status quo, as that will be presented as some kind of golden age worth preserving, rather than literally the problem that needs solving. Any review led by a Tory MP is not going to deliver any radical change. Doubtless plenty will make the case for change but you can predict now that bugger all will come of this.

I think you're missing the point! This is a fan led review based on the work we've done and presented to the FA and others.

https://thefsa.org.uk/news/fsa-statement-government-fan-led-review/

A government that wont let workers reps join company boards and allows the gig economy is going to support fans running £multi-billion football clubs. Oh aye...

I have absolutely no idea how you arrived at that from  anything I've posted. 

It's not about what you posted SM - Wilts is on a personal crusade against the Tories - and will use any avenue possible.... 

I am afraid it relects my experince of what this government says - and what this government does. I hope I am wrong in this instance - but doubt it.

[Filo]

Given these billionaire owners of these clubs are fond of top secret zoom meetings, the players and staff of those clubs should hold their own top secret zoom meetings and come out with a common statement, lets see player power at it’s best. We are all guilty of moaning about player power when a player wants away, but in this case player power is key, without the Worlds top players the European Super League is not going to be very super is it?

[Not Now Kato]

Saw this on another site....
 
Tottenham joining a European Super League is like Bananaman getting called up as an Avenger

[Metalmicky]

It will be interesting to see what (if any) fans would turn up at these games.... I guess it depends on the venue's etc etc.  However, we have all seen that playing without fans doesn't offer the same atmosphere or enjoyment - and may affect then armchair audience also.

[Metalmicky]

Meanwhile....... while some complain, some want to be part of the ESL...

https://www.101greatgoals.com/news/benfica-lobby-for-inclusion-in-the-esl-and-jp-morgan-approach-napoli/

[DRNaith]

Pep's press conference on SSN is very awkward.

[wilts rover]

Looks like some of the clubs are getting cold feet - from Sky:

Strong differences of opinion emerging in private between breakaway clubs. Some of execs involved believe they're being hung out to dry & are beginning to get cold feet. They're nervous & disappointed about way it's been handled. One says: “This is not what we signed up for”

https://twitter.com/SkyKaveh/status/1384437700418281472

It is of course exactly what they signed up for.

[normal rules]

Premier lge statement just released.

The Premier League, alongside The FA, met with clubs today to discuss the immediate implications of the Super League proposal.

The 14 clubs at the meeting unanimously and vigorously rejected the plans for the competition. The Premier League is considering all actions available to prevent it from progressing, as well as holding those shareholders involved to account under its rules.

The League will continue to work with key stakeholders including fan groups, government, Uefa, The FA, EFL, PFA and LMA to protect the best interests of the game and call on those clubs involved in the proposed competition to cease their involvement immediately.

The Premier League would like to thank fans and all stakeholders for the support they have shown this week on this significant issue. The reaction proves just how much our open pyramid and football community means to people.

Nothing groundbreaking here.hollow words without action.

[normal rules]

Since 2000, if my arithmetic is correct, only 18 teams have appeared in a Champions League final.  Extending that back to 1980 only increases it to 28 teams.  Since 2010, the 12 clubs plus PSG, Bayern and Dortmund have contested every final. The chances are that anyone aged 25 or younger, doesn't remember a final without them.

These clubs don't want to break away as such, they want to run their own European competition in an almost closed shop alongside their existing domestic league season.  It really isn't that much different from what we have now, except for the guarantee of the closed shop.  For all the talk of dreaming of reaching these heights, it never happens for almost every club.   Let the big boys have their own way.  The fact is, nothing much changes.

So who are we feeling sorry for?  Everton?  West Ham? Leicester?  They didn't feel sorry for us when they started all this with the Premier League cash cow or when 1998 happened to us.  They haven't been worried that we are never realistically going to be in with a chance of European qualification. When they were selling their souls for pots of money for coming anywhere above 18th in the EPL they weren't thinking about the fairness of it all.  There were no cries of foul from them when parachute payments were brought in or extended.  And before anyone says "what about their fans?", what about them?  They aren't bothered about us either. "The likes of Doncaster" isn't  a compliment.  If we go into oblivion they won't even wave goodbye. 

They'll all have to do what we do, manage on what they get and manage their expectations accordingly.  Boo f**king hoo.

Comparisons to the formation of the Premier League are ludicrous. Anyone can be promoted to or relegated from the PL and it’s made both it and the EFL so competitive. The ESL would be an exclusive rich boys club and destroy the competitive nature of the PL with no top 4 race. 49 clubs have so far spent time in the PL.

[MachoMadness]

Glad we've had a 14-club meeting to determine that the ESL is bad. That'll show em.

[DRNaith]

I feel a little disappointed by what seems to a rather tepid response from the Premier League 14. "The 14 clubs want the six breakaway clubs to stay in the Premier League". Not really what I was expecting, but I suppose they have more to lose than I do.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Other than financial gain, I can't see the benefits to these clubs - they will be essentially turning themselves into the football equivalent of the  Harlem Globetrotters....

I might be wrong but I think it's about the financial gain.

[Beerseller]

Since 2000, if my arithmetic is correct, only 18 teams have appeared in a Champions League final.  Extending that back to 1980 only increases it to 28 teams.  Since 2010, the 12 clubs plus PSG, Bayern and Dortmund have contested every final. The chances are that anyone aged 25 or younger, doesn't remember a final without them.

These clubs don't want to break away as such, they want to run their own European competition in an almost closed shop alongside their existing domestic league season.  It really isn't that much different from what we have now, except for the guarantee of the closed shop.  For all the talk of dreaming of reaching these heights, it never happens for almost every club.   Let the big boys have their own way.  The fact is, nothing much changes.

So who are we feeling sorry for?  Everton?  West Ham? Leicester?  They didn't feel sorry for us when they started all this with the Premier League cash cow or when 1998 happened to us.  They haven't been worried that we are never realistically going to be in with a chance of European qualification. When they were selling their souls for pots of money for coming anywhere above 18th in the EPL they weren't thinking about the fairness of it all.  There were no cries of foul from them when parachute payments were brought in or extended.  And before anyone says "what about their fans?", what about them?  They aren't bothered about us either. "The likes of Doncaster" isn't  a compliment.  If we go into oblivion they won't even wave goodbye. 

They'll all have to do what we do, manage on what they get and manage their expectations accordingly.  Boo f**king hoo.

Comparisons to the formation of the Premier League are ludicrous. Anyone can be promoted to or relegated from the PL and it’s made both it and the EFL so competitive. The ESL would be an exclusive rich boys club and destroy the competitive nature of the PL with no top 4 race. 49 clubs have so far spent time in the PL.

Ok, I'll give you relegation not that its likely to affect the ESL six.  Other than that, its so competitive that no-one has won it without oodles of cash. Its a rich boys club.  Leicester would have been nowhere without billionaire owners, Blackburn were early rich boys before Jack Walker's demise and the only other winners are the ESL clubs in 27 out of 29 seasons.

Do Rovers have a hope of winning it in the next 20 years? No, not a chance in hell unless some Saudi price decides we're the next Man City  (that's a real "ludicrous" for you).  Same for probably 84 other teams in the current 92.

Man City - now there's a perfect example.  2002 they return to the Premier League and then pumped full of money, they become the next big thing.  That's not Man City being given a fair crack, that's akin to financial doping.  They wouldn't be where they are without the money.  Competitive my arse.

[sha66y]

If they decide not to go

I’m sure the FA will allow them to dominate the disposition of finances to compensate them for the troubles and aggravation they’ve had to endure recently.........

Thus securing better long term financial deals for years to come, and if all the other teams involved do the same, they WILL have their cake and eat it........ win win !

[Metalmicky]

Since 2000, if my arithmetic is correct, only 18 teams have appeared in a Champions League final.  Extending that back to 1980 only increases it to 28 teams.  Since 2010, the 12 clubs plus PSG, Bayern and Dortmund have contested every final. The chances are that anyone aged 25 or younger, doesn't remember a final without them.

These clubs don't want to break away as such, they want to run their own European competition in an almost closed shop alongside their existing domestic league season.  It really isn't that much different from what we have now, except for the guarantee of the closed shop.  For all the talk of dreaming of reaching these heights, it never happens for almost every club.   Let the big boys have their own way.  The fact is, nothing much changes.

So who are we feeling sorry for?  Everton?  West Ham? Leicester?  They didn't feel sorry for us when they started all this with the Premier League cash cow or when 1998 happened to us.  They haven't been worried that we are never realistically going to be in with a chance of European qualification. When they were selling their souls for pots of money for coming anywhere above 18th in the EPL they weren't thinking about the fairness of it all.  There were no cries of foul from them when parachute payments were brought in or extended.  And before anyone says "what about their fans?", what about them?  They aren't bothered about us either. "The likes of Doncaster" isn't  a compliment.  If we go into oblivion they won't even wave goodbye. 

They'll all have to do what we do, manage on what they get and manage their expectations accordingly.  Boo f**king hoo.

Comparisons to the formation of the Premier League are ludicrous. Anyone can be promoted to or relegated from the PL and it’s made both it and the EFL so competitive. The ESL would be an exclusive rich boys club and destroy the competitive nature of the PL with no top 4 race. 49 clubs have so far spent time in the PL.

Ok, I'll give you relegation not that its likely to affect the ESL six.  Other than that, its so competitive that no-one has won it without oodles of cash. Its a rich boys club.  Leicester would have been nowhere without billionaire owners, Blackburn were early rich boys before Jack Walker's demise and the only other winners are the ESL clubs in 27 out of 29 seasons.

Do Rovers have a hope of winning it in the next 20 years? No, not a chance in hell unless some Saudi price decides we're the next Man City  (that's a real "ludicrous" for you).  Same for probably 84 other teams in the current 92.

Man City - now there's a perfect example.  2002 they return to the Premier League and then pumped full of money, they become the next big thing.  That's not Man City being given a fair crack, that's akin to financial doping.  They wouldn't be where they are without the money.  Competitive my arse.

Stolen from another site..... but I largely agree with this bloke.

The bit of it's that bothering me about the opposition to it is this idea that we want the clubs to actually stay.

For me the fight is to make sure they go. The cat is out of the bag and they've made their intention's clear. I don't think the six/twelve should compete in a domestic or CL/Europa fixture ever again. There is no competitive merit to playing these clubs.

This should go ahead and the 12 should go. Whatever is left of our sport is ours to re-shape. There is opportunity here for the rest of us. The one result I don't want out of this is for the grovelling, sycophantic press releases to accompany re-entry to the Premier League, as these wretched institutions twist themselves in knots trying to explain how it wasn't them all along and they never actually wanted to do it.

[Metalmicky]

I also note that David Beckham has joined the cries of outrage...

https://www.sportsmole.co.uk/football/man-utd/european-super-league/news/david-beckham-hits-out-at-european-super-league_443963.html

That's the same Beckham who just bought a club in a league with no promotion/relegation, with the sole aim of financial gain.

[sedwardsdrfc]

The one hope is reaction is so strong that the powers don't just leave it as it is but go further to make it even fairer. As Beerseller says there's essentially been a cartel anyway which requires Man City money to join so the odds are against everyone else. Hopefully the ESL gets thrown out then the fabric of the game changes for the better taking more power away from these clubs.

As i've said earlier how is it that these owners can do whatever they want with the football clubs (they'd play every game outside of england if it made more money) yet if you own a listed property you are tied up in knots with what you can't do legally! The Gov needs to give all football clubs certain legal protections.