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Author Topic: Batley & Spen Byelection  (Read 3467 times)

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GazLaz

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #120 on July 02, 2021, 06:54:15 am by GazLaz »
A victory for hard work and getting out there and engaging people. The Tories put zero effort into the campaign and thought they would just have to roll the bell into an empty net. A lazy and arrogant that has bitten them in the arse.



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Filo

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #121 on July 02, 2021, 07:07:53 am by Filo »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left

Donnywolf

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #122 on July 02, 2021, 07:25:44 am by Donnywolf »

donnywolf, of course the tories will spin it what would you expect them to do?


I know every Party spins everything - particularly after by-elections - and I referred to the Tories doing it before the result ONLY to highlight the fact that they thought they had lost
« Last Edit: July 02, 2021, 09:10:48 am by Donnywolf »

wesisback

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #123 on July 02, 2021, 07:39:00 am by wesisback »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left
Galloway going to court you say? He must have the busiest lawyer in the world.
A good result for Labour in the end especially with Galloway outperforming expectations.
As already said the Tories really relied on the vote split to be enough and it wasn't.
As my Tory supporting friend has pointed out, its no huge loss if it means Keith gets to lead Labour into a General Election.

Filo

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #124 on July 02, 2021, 08:00:25 am by Filo »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left
Galloway going to court you say? He must have the busiest lawyer in the world.
A good result for Labour in the end especially with Galloway outperforming expectations.
As already said the Tories really relied on the vote split to be enough and it wasn't.
As my Tory supporting friend has pointed out, its no huge loss if it means Keith gets to lead Labour into a General Election.

Galloway said that, not me

tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #125 on July 02, 2021, 08:12:29 am by tyke1962 »
Well it's hardly a ringing endorsement for Labour but a win is a win and at least stops some of the bleeding .

I sincerely hope Kim makes a success of it and can heal many of the divides that exist in the area .


big fat yorkshire pudding

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #126 on July 02, 2021, 08:30:40 am by big fat yorkshire pudding »
Well it's hardly a ringing endorsement for Labour but a win is a win and at least stops some of the bleeding .

I sincerely hope Kim makes a success of it and can heal many of the divides that exist in the area .



That second point is most important. A typical unique by election but one that was far too nasty.

The conservatives need to think about recent things a bit more. I suspect the Matt Hancock affair hasn't helped (polls suggest that) and possibly enough in isolation to cost them the votes.  No disasters for anyone and kier starmer will be relieved this morning.  Now he needs to push that party on further.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #127 on July 02, 2021, 08:46:52 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left
Galloway going to court you say? He must have the busiest lawyer in the world.
A good result for Labour in the end especially with Galloway outperforming expectations.
As already said the Tories really relied on the vote split to be enough and it wasn't.
As my Tory supporting friend has pointed out, its no huge loss if it means Keith gets to lead Labour into a General Election.

Perhaps if the Left concentrated on fighting the Tories rather than fighting Starmer, you might be able to make your pal eat his words.

Metalmicky

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #128 on July 02, 2021, 09:06:29 am by Metalmicky »
Well it's hardly a ringing endorsement for Labour but a win is a win and at least stops some of the bleeding .

I sincerely hope Kim makes a success of it and can heal many of the divides that exist in the area .

Agree with you Tyke - not a resounding win.  The fact that Starmer has hailed the result as 'fantastic' says a lot - at least it keeps him in a job......... for the time being.

tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #129 on July 02, 2021, 09:19:14 am by tyke1962 »
No Tyke you are not irrelevant. You are just a long, long way from being a majority in the party or the country.

Labour cannot win without you. But Labour sure as f**king hell cannot win with only you.

Your call.

And don't flatter yourself that you have the faintest idea what "my lot" are.


You only have to read the comment sections in The Guardian to obtain the view of what " you lot " feel about the brexit voter in the former red wall .

Feck pondering to the tory racists in the red wall .

Wanting to steer Labour towards a policy of rejoining the EU .

Hoping Brexit is a complete and utter disaster and leavers suffer terrible consequences for having the audacity to vote differently .

Anyone who puts their head above the parapet and announces he voted leave is quickly subjected to the bigot and xenophobic card and bullied .

It's an intolerable mindset .

Under such circumstances it's almost impossible to find compromise .

tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #130 on July 02, 2021, 09:23:28 am by tyke1962 »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left
Galloway going to court you say? He must have the busiest lawyer in the world.
A good result for Labour in the end especially with Galloway outperforming expectations.
As already said the Tories really relied on the vote split to be enough and it wasn't.
As my Tory supporting friend has pointed out, its no huge loss if it means Keith gets to lead Labour into a General Election.

Perhaps if the Left concentrated on fighting the Tories rather than fighting Starmer, you might be able to make your pal eat his words.

The irony of your post isn't lost on me .

Many within the centre of the Labour Party plotted everyday to bring its twice elected leader down rather than fight the Tories as well you know .


BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #131 on July 02, 2021, 09:27:08 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Tyke.

You keep that mindset old lad. You keep your Brexit. It'll be a Brexit defined by Tories for the rest of your life.

You just don't get it do you? Brexit has been weaponised by the Tories to keep this split going on the left. You are walking straight into their trap.

Simple question. Do you ever want an economically left wing Govt again in your lifetime. Just yes or no, it doesn't need a machine gun rant.

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #132 on July 02, 2021, 09:30:38 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Don't lecture me on loyalty. I didn't just vote for Corbyn's Labour party, I was on the streets campaigning for it. Because the difference between you and me is I'd rather see a Labour Govt that I didn't fully agree with than see Johnson's spivs and kleptocrats running us.

Maybe you need to have a think what you really want.

tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #133 on July 02, 2021, 09:39:08 am by tyke1962 »
Tyke.

You keep that mindset old lad. You keep your Brexit. It'll be a Brexit defined by Tories for the rest of your life.

You just don't get it do you? Brexit has been weaponised by the Tories to keep this split going on the left. You are walking straight into their trap.

Simple question. Do you ever want an economically left wing Govt again in your lifetime. Just yes or no, it doesn't need a machine gun rant.

The only people who have weaponised brexit these last five years are people such as yourself and a number of others on this board , you only have to look at the number of threads on the subject and the constant trashing of the referendum result .

The Tories don't have to weaponise anything you do it for them .

Of course I want an economically left wing government the question is do those in charge of the party want one ?


tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #134 on July 02, 2021, 09:41:18 am by tyke1962 »
Don't lecture me on loyalty. I didn't just vote for Corbyn's Labour party, I was on the streets campaigning for it. Because the difference between you and me is I'd rather see a Labour Govt that I didn't fully agree with than see Johnson's spivs and kleptocrats running us.

Maybe you need to have a think what you really want.


Did the centre of the Labour Party plot against Corbyn , ?  yes or no will suffice .

IDM

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #135 on July 02, 2021, 09:52:38 am by IDM »
Erm, folks aren’t trashing the referendum result - it is what it is..

The problem with brexit is the rolling goatf**k on how it has been implemented, however much it has been overshadowed by the pandemic.

Anyway…
« Last Edit: July 02, 2021, 10:51:47 am by IDM »

albie

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #136 on July 02, 2021, 10:08:45 am by albie »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left

Filo,

What makes you think Galloway is a left candidate?
Genuine question, because I think he is just an opportunist, as likely to be right wing if he reckons votes are to be had.

Great result for Kim, really pleased for her.
Achieved despite a very poor campaign from Labour head office.

Herbert Anchovy

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #137 on July 02, 2021, 10:11:50 am by Herbert Anchovy »
Both Labour & the Tories are framing the result in their own ways. They’re both valid, but offer differing views of the end result. Labour should be pleased as their vote was undoubtedly split thanks to Galloway but they still won. The Tories should be pleased because they got within a whisker of gaining a previously untouchable seat.

The challenge now for Labour is to understand, and act upon, just why people in their traditional heartlands feel that the Tories represent their hopes, aspirations and concerns more than they do. It’s worth remembering that the Tories have, historically done nothing for these places except to decimate the very industries in which they relied on, yet they’re seen as a better option than Labour?

While Labour spend their days naval gazing and infighting, they’re never going to find the answer.

The Tories need to work out how to keep these places blue (or target blue) whilst managing the huge cuts to public services which are inevitably on the way, and in which many people in these places rely.

Many in the Labour Party need to concentrate on the political fight rather than the ideological fight.

Filo

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #138 on July 02, 2021, 10:48:15 am by Filo »
Both Labour & the Tories are framing the result in their own ways. They’re both valid, but offer differing views of the end result. Labour should be pleased as their vote was undoubtedly split thanks to Galloway but they still won. The Tories should be pleased because they got within a whisker of gaining a previously untouchable seat.

The challenge now for Labour is to understand, and act upon, just why people in their traditional heartlands feel that the Tories represent their hopes, aspirations and concerns more than they do. It’s worth remembering that the Tories have, historically done nothing for these places except to decimate the very industries in which they relied on, yet they’re seen as a better option than Labour?

While Labour spend their days naval gazing and infighting, they’re never going to find the answer.

The Tories need to work out how to keep these places blue (or target blue) whilst managing the huge cuts to public services which are inevitably on the way, and in which many people in these places rely.

Many in the Labour Party need to concentrate on the political fight rather than the ideological fight.

That previously untouchable seat was Tory until 1997

tyke1962

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #139 on July 02, 2021, 10:54:57 am by tyke1962 »
One of the ways Starmer and the Labour Party could go about healing the divides is to roll out a big campaign and put some serious resources around recruiting for want of a better term real people to eventually become Labour MP's .

A road map in to politics for everyone

The single mother , the nhs nurse on the frontline , the tube driver , the small business person , the lad who wasted his education and found himself in a warehouse on a zhc .

A real programme on a government by the people for the people campaign .

Or would this campaign force the Labour Party to face some uncomfortable truths and put too many noses out of joint and a threat to a cosy existence ?

SydneyRover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #140 on July 02, 2021, 11:10:32 am by SydneyRover »
One of the ways Starmer and the Labour Party could go about healing the divides is to roll out a big campaign and put some serious resources around recruiting for want of a better term real people to eventually become Labour MP's .

A road map in to politics for everyone

The single mother , the nhs nurse on the frontline , the tube driver , the small business person , the lad who wasted his education and found himself in a warehouse on a zhc .

A real programme on a government by the people for the people campaign .

Or would this campaign force the Labour Party to face some uncomfortable truths and put too many noses out of joint and a threat to a cosy existence ?

I'd have thought momentum would have been full of them already tyke?

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #141 on July 02, 2021, 11:33:18 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left

Filo,

What makes you think Galloway is a left candidate?
Genuine question, because I think he is just an opportunist, as likely to be right wing if he reckons votes are to be had.

Great result for Kim, really pleased for her.
Achieved despite a very poor campaign from Labour head office.

Because he only tries to attract votes from the left.

Given that he is funded through RT, as are many other ostensibly left wing populists, I'm wondering if there's a Kremlin policy to destabilise and fragment the Left.

Herbert Anchovy

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #142 on July 02, 2021, 11:42:34 am by Herbert Anchovy »
Both Labour & the Tories are framing the result in their own ways. They’re both valid, but offer differing views of the end result. Labour should be pleased as their vote was undoubtedly split thanks to Galloway but they still won. The Tories should be pleased because they got within a whisker of gaining a previously untouchable seat.

The challenge now for Labour is to understand, and act upon, just why people in their traditional heartlands feel that the Tories represent their hopes, aspirations and concerns more than they do. It’s worth remembering that the Tories have, historically done nothing for these places except to decimate the very industries in which they relied on, yet they’re seen as a better option than Labour?

While Labour spend their days naval gazing and infighting, they’re never going to find the answer.

The Tories need to work out how to keep these places blue (or target blue) whilst managing the huge cuts to public services which are inevitably on the way, and in which many people in these places rely.

Many in the Labour Party need to concentrate on the political fight rather than the ideological fight.

That previously untouchable seat was Tory until 1997
[/quote

The seat went through a number of boundary changes up to 1997 so until that point it’s difficult to compare like for like. Labour have held the seat for 24 years with majorities ranging between 3000 and 6000. That is fairly untouchable.

SydneyRover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #143 on July 02, 2021, 11:44:49 am by SydneyRover »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left

Filo,

What makes you think Galloway is a left candidate?
Genuine question, because I think he is just an opportunist, as likely to be right wing if he reckons votes are to be had.

Great result for Kim, really pleased for her.
Achieved despite a very poor campaign from Labour head office.

I'd be interested to know what you thought they did wrong .......... and right Albie.

SydneyRover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #144 on July 02, 2021, 12:06:16 pm by SydneyRover »
There's an interesting graph showing that labour's vote in the seat steadily fell away from around 2000 to 2015-2017 where it peaked to above the 2000 level before dropping again below 2015-2017 from where it continued down to today's number.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batley_and_Spen_(UK_Parliament_constituency)
« Last Edit: July 02, 2021, 12:23:39 pm by SydneyRover »

SydneyRover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #145 on July 02, 2021, 12:30:58 pm by SydneyRover »
Not sure why the link above doesn't work properly but it shows the vote falling off a cliff around 2016-17, it will be good to have someone 'local' to have look and interpret what appears to be a big call to expect a new leadership team to turn it around.

« Last Edit: July 02, 2021, 12:42:57 pm by SydneyRover »

scawsby steve

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #146 on July 02, 2021, 04:01:52 pm by scawsby steve »
First of all, congratulations to the Labour Party, and particularly Kim Leadbeater. She's a good person, and has fought hard for this seat.

However, regarding Starmer's leadership, a 2.9% swing to the Tories in a safe Labour seat is nothing to be ecstatic about; and before anyone mentions it, it's not just because of the Galloway vote splitting the Labour vote; apparently he ate into some of the Tory votes as well.

Also, according to Professor Michael Thrasher, there's evidence of tactical voting by some Lib Dems to bolster the Labour vote.

A bit of relief for Starmer, but far too early for the champagne bottle corks.

albie

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #147 on July 02, 2021, 04:23:19 pm by albie »
Galloway says he is going to court to overturn the result, given his vote count was well behind Labour and Conservative he must want the Conservatives to win. It’s there for all to see a far left candidate wants a right wing candidate to win, and folk bleat about The labour centre uniting with the left

Filo,

What makes you think Galloway is a left candidate?
Genuine question, because I think he is just an opportunist, as likely to be right wing if he reckons votes are to be had.

Great result for Kim, really pleased for her.
Achieved despite a very poor campaign from Labour head office.

I'd be interested to know what you thought they did wrong .......... and right Albie.

Sydney,

There is a good summary from Andrew Fisher here;
https://inews.co.uk/opinion/batley-and-spen-by-election-why-labour-won-kim-leadbeater-activists-matt-hancock-keir-starmer-1082853
I agree with most of that.

Contrary to BST claiming Galloway looks to attract the left, I know no-one on the left who support him.
Many will agree with him on Palestine, but there is little else to appeal to the left, and a good deal to oppose.

wilts rover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #148 on July 02, 2021, 08:20:15 pm by wilts rover »
That friend of murderous right-wing dictators (including Putin here), Galloway, conducted a homphobic campaign against a local women whose sister was murdered by a fascist in the streets where he stirring up hate. What exactly is left-wing about him? That he supports a Palestinian state - so do the United Nations!

Anyone who thinks he is doesn't know him or what left-wing politics actually involves - but have been suckered by the right-wing media to discredit anyone who actually campaigns for fairness and equality.

wilts rover

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Re: Batley & Spen Byelection
« Reply #149 on July 02, 2021, 09:29:03 pm by wilts rover »
Missed this earlier - Tory Party chair telling Nick Ferrari that the Tories didn't loose the bye-election!

https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1410884537698115588

 

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