Culture War

[Campsall rover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

Think this debate is not going places Sydney because you know the Labour Party are a shambles of an opposition and are in deep shit.
This Tory government have had a desperate job to do in the last 16/17 months and at times have made a pigs ear of a job I agree.
Many mistakes have been made. Hindsight eh. Lots of hypocrisy going on. Mixed messages etc etc.

But you know of course the Labour Party would never have got anything wrong. They would have had this pandemic sorted in 6 months max. We would have had a vaccine by lat July at latest.

Sorry your in some sort of fantasy world out their in Aussie if you think the opposition party would have done a better job.

No this debate is going nowhere because it’s GB 3 Sydney 0        Just joking OK.

Don't answer the questions but don't expect to be taken seriously.

Oh dear Sydney which question is that please? I can’t be any more clear surely. I am neutral politically.

My eyes are wide open to the evils of the far right and the far left. Which neither of our 2 parties are thank goodness. But both are far from sensible middle road politics.
Right I think I have said my piece ok. GB 5 Sydney 0   

[drfchound]

Camps.  The last few posts clearly define how difficult it can be to post anything that isn’t liked by the more extreme left wing forum members.
No doubt two or three will be at me now.
Like busses, they will all come along together.

[Campsall rover]

Camps.  The last few posts clearly define how difficult it can be to post anything that isn%u2019t liked by the more extreme left wing forum members.
No doubt two or three will be at me now.
Like busses, they will all come along together.

The thing is i am neither blue nor red and still Sydney is acting like i am defending the Tory party to the hilt.

He just cannot see that the British public will not vote for Kier Starmer until he comes up with some clear vision for Britain which will appeal to the wider public.

All he does is attack everything the Tory government does even after saying he will support the Government through this Covid 19 pandemic.

What Sydney cannot see ( let us face it he is 11,000 miles away ) is the hypocrisy of the Labour leader and that the British public are not stupid. They can see what is being said and will vote accordingly.

If he cannot win public support when the Prime Minister is quite frankly an eccentric buffoon at times ( Quite a likeable one I might add) yes he means well his heart is in the right place and he genuinely wants to build a better Britain but unfortunately he makes far too many blunders to ever achieve what he has set out to achieve.

I am banging my head against a brick wall hound.  The blinkers are on and these hard core socialists cannot see what is in front of them or maybe they do not want to see.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Canpsall.

Starmer clearly irks you. Which of these blunders do you think are the worst?

[Campsall rover]

Canpsall.

Starmer clearly irks you. Which of these blunders do you think are the worst?

No Starmer clearly irks many Traditional Labour voters. Talk to them BST. Seriously he will not win any popularity contests right now.

[BillyStubbsTears]

So. These blunders?

[SydneyRover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)


Added: (please don't use this to avoid answering the questions above)

On comment 48 you appeared to want to claim some sort of neutrality and have us all sing kumbaya where we support the government and you take umbrage at the suggestion that you're not, to show faith when you have answered the questions above pop a few links to show posts where you support labour in any way.

[Campsall rover]

So. These blunders?

What blunders BST.

The word was never mentioned by me.

[BillyStubbsTears]

If he (Starmer) cannot win public support when the Prime Minister is quite frankly an eccentric buffoon at times ( Quite a likeable one I might add) yes he means well his heart is in the right place and he genuinely wants to build a better Britain but unfortunately he makes far too many blunders to ever achieve what he has set out to achieve.

[tyke1962]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

The proven imbeciles and corrupt liars won a landslide in the last General Election.
What does that say about the Labour Party?

Do you think the British electorate are all completely off their rockers?

The Labour Party need to do some very inward looking and sort themselves out.
We need a strong Labour Party. We always need a strong opposition. That’s what democracy is about.

The current Labour party are still making the same mistakes and would still lose a General Election tomorrow by a considerable margin.
What does that say about the Labour Party Sydney given they up against imbeciles and corrupt liars?

Welcome to the party Campsall as I know your not a regular visitor to this section of the board .

Clearly you see the fault lines that exist within the Labour Party and yet your view is trashed by the usual incumbents which isn't unsurprising .

It's impossible to compromise with these people that much I do know personally .

Just let them get on with it mate .

The chips fall where they fall .

[Campsall rover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

So Covid was the Tory governments fault. Brilliant.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.
I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.
If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.
I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.

I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

[Campsall rover]

So. These blunders?

You mis read my post BST
I said Boris Had made blunders. Happy now I take it. Or maybe not as the case maybe.

[BillyStubbsTears]

My apologies for the misunderstanding Campsall. Your sentence started off talking about Starmer. I assumed he was the one you were talking about after the divergence of mentioing what he was up against..

[Campsall rover]

My apologies for the misunderstanding Campsall. Your sentence started off talking about Starmer. I assumed he was the one you were talking about after the divergence of mentioing what he was up against..

Apology accepted.

Can I ask you BST do you agree with anything i have said.

[SydneyRover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.

Austerity should never have been contemplated it was a financial dud from beginning to end that left the economy in a weaker position to tackle covid. Where is the evidence to show it was a sound fiscal policy, not just taken too far, it was tory ideology plain and simple.


I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

Please show what you mean rather than include generalisations, where and who would benefit and when is the impossible likely to happen, impossible meaning that being taken out of the richest market on earth would deliver financial benefit.


So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.

When have you voted for labour? if not a tory why is it that you only appear to ask 'lefty' supporters to take political discussions off topic?


If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.

Agreed.

I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.




I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

You have said in the past that the tories are not a far right wing party but a party that employs a person to stir up racial hatred with policies to deter voters getting to the polls smack of the far right would you not agree?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Campsall

I agree that Starmer is not cutting through. absolutely. The rest, I've no idea because you don't say much beyond generalities. Regarding Brown's "terrible mess", you and I have been through that before and I still do not understand what your actual criticism is.

[Campsall rover]

Campsall

I agree that Starmer is not cutting through. absolutely. The rest, I've no idea because you don't say much beyond generalities. Regarding Brown's "terrible mess", you and I have been through that before and I still do not understand what your actual criticism is.

Brown spent a fortune. On what though. Did he help the poorest in our society? I don’t see it.
At least this government have borrowed with a clear objective. The hadn’t a choice the pandemic chose it for them.
Which party has taken the lowest paid out of taxation the most in the last 30/40 years. Personal allowances were increase far more under Conservative governments than Blair or Brown ever did.
They claim to be the party of the working class. Don’t make me laugh, what in the last 40 years both in opposition and power have they done for the working class in this country?  Please tell me.

Any way the working class is now an almost redundant term as so many traditional Labour voting families are earning decent salaries in good jobs that they don’t see themselves as working class any more.

It’s a term i hate and is not relevant in our modern society imo.

Labour have lost their heartland so they better get their act together and find their new identity or the could possibly be banished to the history books. Lib Dem could take their place. Would have been laughable to say that even 4/5 years ago but it could happen if the find some seriously strong leadership.

[Campsall rover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.

Austerity should never have been contemplated it was a financial dud from beginning to end that left the economy in a weaker position to tackle covid. Where is the evidence to show it was a sound fiscal policy, not just taken too far, it was tory ideology plain and simple.


I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

Please show what you mean rather than include generalisations, where and who would benefit and when is the impossible likely to happen, impossible meaning that being taken out of the richest market on earth would deliver financial benefit.


So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.

When have you voted for labour? if not a tory why is it that you only appear to ask 'lefty' supporters to take political discussions off topic?


If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.

Agreed.

I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.




I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

You have said in the past that the tories are not a far right wing party but a party that employs a person to stir up racial hatred with policies to deter voters getting to the polls smack of the far right would you not agree?

Sydney what are you ranting on about. “Deter people from getting to the polls”  sorry which socialist rag are you reading in Aussie to come up with that statement.
You are so anti Tory that you don’t seem to be able to distinguish fact from fiction.

Right enough is enough I am off to bed just noticed the time and I need my Beauty sleep. Now that’s fiction.

[SydneyRover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.

Austerity should never have been contemplated it was a financial dud from beginning to end that left the economy in a weaker position to tackle covid. Where is the evidence to show it was a sound fiscal policy, not just taken too far, it was tory ideology plain and simple.


I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

Please show what you mean rather than include generalisations, where and who would benefit and when is the impossible likely to happen, impossible meaning that being taken out of the richest market on earth would deliver financial benefit.


So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.

When have you voted for labour? if not a tory why is it that you only appear to ask 'lefty' supporters to take political discussions off topic?


If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.

Agreed.

I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.




I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

You have said in the past that the tories are not a far right wing party but a party that employs a person to stir up racial hatred with policies to deter voters getting to the polls smack of the far right would you not agree?

Sydney what are you ranting on about. “Deter people from getting to the polls”  sorry which socialist rag are you reading in Aussie to come up with that statement.
You are so anti Tory that you don’t seem to be able to distinguish fact from fiction.

Right enough is enough I am off to bed just noticed the time and I need my Beauty sleep. Now that’s fiction.

If that gets you out of answering any questions have a good sleep, questions to sleep on .... have you ever A/ voted and B/ voted for labour

[Campsall rover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.

Austerity should never have been contemplated it was a financial dud from beginning to end that left the economy in a weaker position to tackle covid. Where is the evidence to show it was a sound fiscal policy, not just taken too far, it was tory ideology plain and simple.


I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

Please show what you mean rather than include generalisations, where and who would benefit and when is the impossible likely to happen, impossible meaning that being taken out of the richest market on earth would deliver financial benefit.


So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.

When have you voted for labour? if not a tory why is it that you only appear to ask 'lefty' supporters to take political discussions off topic?


If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.

Agreed.

I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.




I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

You have said in the past that the tories are not a far right wing party but a party that employs a person to stir up racial hatred with policies to deter voters getting to the polls smack of the far right would you not agree?

Sydney what are you ranting on about. “Deter people from getting to the polls”  sorry which socialist rag are you reading in Aussie to come up with that statement.
You are so anti Tory that you don’t seem to be able to distinguish fact from fiction.

Right enough is enough I am off to bed just noticed the time and I need my Beauty sleep. Now that’s fiction.

If that gets you out of answering any questions have a good sleep, questions to sleep on .... have you ever A/ voted and B/ voted for labour

Not answered any questions! Come on your the one who is not answering, not me.

Yes I always vote and since 1973 when I was first eligible to vote,  I have never voted Labour but I haven’t always voted Conservative either.
I will not vote for anyone who I think will do a job worse than another party.
Wilson I didn’t like, Callaghan was in the pockets of the Unions and Blair was the nearest Labour leader I came to voting for but thought it too much of a gamble.

David Milliband would probably have got my vote but Ed my own Doncaster North MP who misguidedly made leader was far too left wing to even contemplate voting for.
Corbyn was unelectable for reasons we all know, too many to mention.
So yes I have voted for another party with yellow rosettes more than once.

[SydneyRover]

Of course I did, but a lot of what you say is to support your team. when they are proven imbeciles and corrupt liars, and yet you want others to come together and support them, it doesn't quite work like that. You get your team in order first and I may think about it.

And the Labour Party are whiter than white.

As for my team. The two major parties are not my team thanks.

My teams just for clarification are DRFC, Yorks CCC & Featherstone Rovers. Oh and any team representing England or GB

I'm not sure this debate is going to go anywhere Campsall as your attempts at reconciliation always appear to be directed at those that don't support conservatives.

labour have not been in power for over 10 years and the economy is a wreck, the response to covid has been infantile at best and on top of that getting brexit done is nowhere near being done. Tell me I'm wrong.

The questions I posed here would be a good place to start, the three biggest topics this government has faced for the 10 years plus it has been in government and has failed them all.

The economy weaker that it should have been due to Austrerity
Brexit just about the worst deal possible
Covid death and destruction

Any time you have a spare moment Campsall. (you can phone a duck for help)

.
The government has had to borrow billions to help its people financially through this pandemic.
Should they not have bothered then. Just let everyone starve, loose their homes and jobs.

Yes austerity was taken too far agreed. I have already said that.

Austerity should never have been contemplated it was a financial dud from beginning to end that left the economy in a weaker position to tackle covid. Where is the evidence to show it was a sound fiscal policy, not just taken too far, it was tory ideology plain and simple.


I don’t think the Cameron government did a good job for the country. They speeded the life out of the economy imo.
But the Gordon Brown government had made a terrible mess of their time in power and that mess had to be cleaned up or we were on a slippery path.

Brexit as I have already stated was not what I voted for.
In the long term it may turn out to be very beneficial for the UK but it will be 5/10 years before we see the benefits imo.

Please show what you mean rather than include generalisations, where and who would benefit and when is the impossible likely to happen, impossible meaning that being taken out of the richest market on earth would deliver financial benefit.


So you see i am not a Tory. I vote for the party which i consider will do the least damage to this country. 
The Labour Party are not and haven’t been that party for a very long time.

When have you voted for labour? if not a tory why is it that you only appear to ask 'lefty' supporters to take political discussions off topic?


If they had made David Milliband leader instead of his brother then who knows they may just have been the ruling party even to this day.
But no they press the self destruct button and appoint Ed instead and then Corbyn who would have been a complete disaster for this country and now Starmer who is so inept he is unable to win a popularity contest against Boris who is making blunder after blunder.

Open your eyes. Look at where the Labour Party is right now and stop pretending they know how to run this country. They have no more idea than the Tories. In fact far less. What are their policies?  They have 3 different factions within the same party.
Someone tell me what the Labour Party stand for because I haven’t a clue.
What is their identity. Tens of millions are asking the same question.

We need a strong opposition it is vital for democracy in this country.

Agreed.

I would be delighted to see the Labour party sort themselves out and give the electorate a serious choice to make at the next GE.
As it stands the Conservatives will win again without having to try very hard.




I am saying no more on this because I have said all I need to say and if you hard core Socialists can’t get it then that’s your problem quite frankly not mine.

You have said in the past that the tories are not a far right wing party but a party that employs a person to stir up racial hatred with policies to deter voters getting to the polls smack of the far right would you not agree?

Sydney what are you ranting on about. “Deter people from getting to the polls”  sorry which socialist rag are you reading in Aussie to come up with that statement.
You are so anti Tory that you don’t seem to be able to distinguish fact from fiction.

Right enough is enough I am off to bed just noticed the time and I need my Beauty sleep. Now that’s fiction.

If that gets you out of answering any questions have a good sleep, questions to sleep on .... have you ever A/ voted and B/ voted for labour

Not answered any questions! Come on your the one who is not answering, not me.

Yes I always vote and since 1973 when I was first eligible to vote,  I have never voted Labour but I haven’t always voted Conservative either.
I will not vote for anyone who I think will do a job worse than another party.
Wilson I didn’t like, Callaghan was in the pockets of the Unions and Blair was the nearest Labour leader I came to voting for but thought it too much of a gamble.

David Milliband would probably have got my vote but Ed my own Doncaster North MP who misguidedly made leader was far too left wing to even contemplate voting for.
Corbyn was unelectable for reasons we all know, too many to mention.
So yes I have voted for another party with yellow rosettes more than once.

So you are prepared to vote for grossly imperfect parties as long as they are not labour.

[SydneyRover]

Campsall as you have stated you have never once in 50+ years voted labour but not always tory, from the number of times you have voted how many times have you not voted tory?

You may think this a tad impertinent but all I'm trying to do is establish your debating bona fides, your voting record shows you have never once voted labour, this tells me in all probability you are unlikely ever to do that. Therefore all your arguments saying labour needs to do this or that are academic as there is never going to be a time when labour will match the criteria that you lay down as being worthy of your vote. It appears you want to offer magnanimity towards labour and labour supporters but never want them to gain power. I don't have a problem with your political position I just prefer a bit of honesty within a debate that I see as important is all.

[DonnyOsmond]

Some people just prefer the conservative (small c) approach to handling the countries economy. If he prefers less spending of tax money, more privatisation, etc then that's his personal choice and voting Labour, a party that believes in welfare statism, won't get him that result.

[Campsall rover]

Sydney how many times have you ever voted Conservative?

Maybe a silly question if you live in Australia.

Would you ever vote Conservative or are you so anti Tory you could not even consider them.
I have an open mind and then vote accordingly.
If that’s a crime I am guilty along with millions of others. My hands are held up.

[SydneyRover]

Sydney how many times have you ever voted Conservative?

Maybe a silly question if you live in Australia.

Would you ever vote Conservative or are you so anti Tory you could not even consider them.
I have an open mind and then vote accordingly.
If that’s a crime I am guilty along with millions of others. My hands are held up.

Not a crime at all Campsall and not the question either, I have never voted tory wherever I have been but neither am I trying to portray myself as anything else. Not a difficult question for someone across the issues.

The question was how many times have you not voted tory?

[Campsall rover]

Sydney how many times have you ever voted Conservative?

Maybe a silly question if you live in Australia.

Would you ever vote Conservative or are you so anti Tory you could not even consider them.
I have an open mind and then vote accordingly.
If that%u2019s a crime I am guilty along with millions of others. My hands are held up.

I

Not a crime at all Campsall and not the question either, I have never voted tory wherever I have been but neither am I trying to portray myself as anything else. Not a difficult question for someone across the issues.

The question was how many times have you not voted tory?

That is a personal question is it not, but if you read my previous posts I have answered that already.

Not voted Labour because their manifestos were less preferable to one or more of the other parties at the time or the Leader was imo not fit to run this great nation of ours. Or both of course.
It is as simple as that.

Would I ever vote Labour. Yes I would if both of those two criteria were met.  Looks like I am having to wait an awful long time.

How honest do you want me to be. I cannot spell it out any clearer than that.

[SydneyRover]

Not interested why you don't vote labour Campsall, there a whole load of pundits on here telling the world why they don't vote labour.

You are claiming honest broker status as a neutral, you have already said you have never voted labour all I'm interested is as you know is how many time you haven't voted tory.

[SydneyRover]

Not interested why you don't vote labour Campsall, there a whole load of pundits on here telling the world why they don't vote labour.

You are claiming honest broker status as a neutral, you have already said you have never voted labour all I'm interested is as you know is how many time you haven't voted tory.

No harm done Campsall, I think a can guess close to the answer anyway. I like your football comments if that's any consolation.

Hound is always in need of a friend if you need to chat.

[SydneyRover]

I see Katie Hopkins is on her way home, rumours are she has been offered the job as cultural advisor to the tory party.

[Campsall rover]

Not interested why you don't vote labour Campsall, there a whole load of pundits on here telling the world why they don't vote labour.

You are claiming honest broker status as a neutral, you have already said you have never voted labour all I'm interested is as you know is how many time you haven't voted tory.

No harm done Campsall, I think a can guess close to the answer anyway. I like your football comments if that's any consolation.

Hound is always in need of a friend if you need to chat.

Oh believe me Sydney we do. Thanks for that.