Taiwan China war

[normal rules]

There is some worrying rhetoric coming out of Taiwan. Seems they are convinced they are on the verge of war with China. And they do not intend to back downif it happens. Taiwan already seeking the assistance of Australia, who we have just entered into agreement with over nuclear subs.

could this be the next big conflict in the world. ?

[BillyStubbsTears]

It is inevitable at some point. This, more than anything else in the world gives me sleepless nights.

At some point in the next few decades China is going to be the world's economic superpower while America remains the leading military power. History tells us that those sorts of situations don't usually end without some form of conflict.  Somewhere along that path China will decide that it is strong enough to test if America REALLY has the stomach to meddle in China's back yard. Then it gets interesting...

[ravenrover]

It wont really be a war if China decides to take Taiwan. No contest there
It will only become a war if the West and the Pacific Nations inclusing USA decide it merits becoming a war
We then have to consider what role Russia will play in this

[SydneyRover]

Australia has a drawing of a sub, just in case

[normal rules]

It wont really be a war if China decides to take Taiwan. No contest there
It will only become a war if the West and the Pacific Nations inclusing USA decide it merits becoming a war
We then have to consider what role Russia will play in this

Indeed .China  v Taiwan we be a very one sided affair. Essentially the whole of Taiwan’s military, which is tiny by comparison, would be wiped out in a very short period of time. A complete and utter steamrollering. Huge social loss. I wonder if countries of the the West would just sit back and let China bully them.

[BillyStubbsTears]

That was always the question in the USA-USSR standoff. If the USSR had invaded Western Europe, I was never convinced that the USA would take them on and risk Chicago being incinerated to save Frankfurt.

[normal rules]

We have probably both lived through the Cold War era.

The thought that Russia probably have enough nuclear capability parked off the eastern seaboard to flatten every major city in the eastern us with the push of a button. I dread to think what they, and us combined with the USA are capable of.

It was this backdrop that made the recent Vigil drama such a good watch for me.

[River Don]

The Royal Navy sailed a warship up the Taiwan straight the other week.

This whole Aukus business is about sending a message to China about Taiwan. There can be no doubt what Taiwans future would be under Beijing. Look at Hong Kong. There was a report in the paper the other week suggesting the Chinese had determined that the only way to take Taiwan would be by military force.

It's shaping up to be a new Cold War. Hopefully the Chinese will take the threat of nuclear annihilation just as seriously as the Russians have always done.

[SydneyRover]

''Australia warns China against ‘threat or use of force’ following Taiwan air incursions
Canberra weighs into dispute saying it wants ‘an Indo-Pacific region that is secure, prosperous and based on the rule of law’''

The photo of the sub is on stand-by

[Filo]

There will be at least one UK sub and one US sub in the region already, China will know or assume this

[normal rules]

Ooo I wonder if Suranne Jones is on it?

I do like her and the thought of her coming to harm upsets me.

[Axholme Lion]

The Chinese need to be under no illusion that they will not be allowed to get away with this.

[Sprotyrover]

Get ready,this is going the way of The last War, China is short of Energy and needs to get its Hands on fossil fuels. We have sleep walked into an Arms race, we should not have taken our eye off the ball, we have allows china to build the worlds largest Navy,Canada let its fleet rot, Australia assumed that they were too far away to worry, both nations have done a deal with the UK Canada is building 15 Type 26 Frigates, Australia is building 12, Canada will be the next to buy nuclear Subs they need at least 8. we are building 18 Frigates to take our fleet from 19 to 24 Destroyers and Frigates.we have sent three OPV's out into other Oceans recently toShow the flag.
'Bidets' US is also in a Warship building frenzy.

[Herbert Anchovy]

Listened to a report on the wireless about this earlier. Something similar happened in the early 90’s. It’s countries flexing their muscles and seeing how far they can push each other. For the first time in decades the UK can stake a claim to have one of the best Navy fleets in the world. Technologically speaking we are extremely advanced hence the Aussies want to use our expertise. Whilst the Chinese have the numbers they are way behind us in the technology stakes. The collective numbers and expertise of the US, UK and Japanese fleets leave the Chinese way behind.

[Sprotyrover]

We currently have three Frigates on the build at ship yards, plus HMS Glasgow being rushed into service a year early. We went 5 years without any being built.

[BigH]

The Royal Navy sailed a warship up the Taiwan straight the other week.

This whole Aukus business is about sending a message to China about Taiwan. There can be no doubt what Taiwans future would be under Beijing. Look at Hong Kong. There was a report in the paper the other week suggesting the Chinese had determined that the only way to take Taiwan would be by military force.

It's shaping up to be a new Cold War. Hopefully the Chinese will take the threat of nuclear annihilation just as seriously as the Russians have always done.

Without in anyway wishing to sound unpatriotic, I can only imagine the bemused look on Chinese faces as they watched our warship.

Like smirking at a driver who's clearly taken the wrong road...

[Herbert Anchovy]

The Royal Navy sailed a warship up the Taiwan straight the other week.

This whole Aukus business is about sending a message to China about Taiwan. There can be no doubt what Taiwans future would be under Beijing. Look at Hong Kong. There was a report in the paper the other week suggesting the Chinese had determined that the only way to take Taiwan would be by military force.

It's shaping up to be a new Cold War. Hopefully the Chinese will take the threat of nuclear annihilation just as seriously as the Russians have always done.

Without in anyway wishing to sound unpatriotic, I can only imagine the bemused look on Chinese faces as they watched our warship.

Like smirking at a driver who's clearly taken the wrong road...

Apparently the Chinese navy is largely made up of smaller type ships such as coastal patrol boats and are years behind us in the technology stakes.

[ravenrover]

Get ready,this is going the way of The last War, China is short of Energy and needs to get its Hands on fossil fuels. We have sleep walked into an Arms race, we should not have taken our eye off the ball, we have allows china to build the worlds largest Navy,Canada let its fleet rot, Australia assumed that they were too far away to worry, both nations have done a deal with the UK Canada is building 15 Type 26 Frigates, Australia is building 12, Canada will be the next to buy nuclear Subs they need at least 8. we are building 18 Frigates to take our fleet from 19 to 24 Destroyers and Frigates.we have sent three OPV's out into other Oceans recently toShow the flag.
'Bidets' US is also in a Warship building frenzy.

Sproty, let me assure you China is in no way desperate for fossil fuels. Working for a Mining Machinery company in the late 90's - 00's that supplied China with it's first piece of Western mining equipment, I worked in China on several ocassions, in outer Mongolia they simply rock up to a high point of land and drive straight in no deep mining there. Every mountain/high point is just full of coal. The 1st machine the Company sent over never saw a mine it was dismantled piece by piece in order  for them to replicate a Chinese version. The one piece of information we didn't give them was how the electronics worked but I'm sure they worked it out. The crazy thing is that the Company was US owned but they would not buy directly from US each machine had to be ordered  through and despatched from UK so the full machine was shipped to the UK from US and then sent on to China

[Sprotyrover]

Get ready,this is going the way of The last War, China is short of Energy and needs to get its Hands on fossil fuels. We have sleep walked into an Arms race, we should not have taken our eye off the ball, we have allows china to build the worlds largest Navy,Canada let its fleet rot, Australia assumed that they were too far away to worry, both nations have done a deal with the UK Canada is building 15 Type 26 Frigates, Australia is building 12, Canada will be the next to buy nuclear Subs they need at least 8. we are building 18 Frigates to take our fleet from 19 to 24 Destroyers and Frigates.we have sent three OPV's out into other Oceans recently toShow the flag.
'Bidets' US is also in a Warship building frenzy.

Sproty, let me assure you China is in no way desperate for fossil fuels. Working for a Mining Machinery company in the late 90's - 00's that supplied China with it's first piece of Western mining equipment, I worked in China on several ocassions, in outer Mongolia they simply rock up to a high point of land and drive straight in no deep mining there. Every mountain/high point is just full of coal. The 1st machine the Company sent over never saw a mine it was dismantled piece by piece in order  for them to replicate a Chinese version. The one piece of information we didn't give them was how the electronics worked but I'm sure they worked it out. The crazy thing is that the Company was US owned but they would not buy directly from US each machine had to be ordered  through and despatched from UK so the full machine was shipped to the UK from US and then sent on to China

Reverse engineering.

[Sprotyrover]

US Nuclear Sub collided with unknown object under South China Sea.
Earlier today.

[SydneyRover]

If a nuclear sub was parked in Brid harbour could the locals plug extension cords into it this coming winter?

[SydneyRover]

There is some worrying rhetoric coming out of Taiwan. Seems they are convinced they are on the verge of war with China. And they do not intend to back downif it happens. Taiwan already seeking the assistance of Australia, who we have just entered into agreement with over nuclear subs.

could this be the next big conflict in the world. ?

It's an agreement about an agreement to talk about it atm.

''US and UK begin jostling to supply Australia with nuclear submarine fleet''

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-10-10/us-and-uk-begin-jostling-for-nuclear-submarine-contract/100525756

[i_ateallthepies]

They're neuclear-POWERED as opposed to nuclear armed.  Big difference.

[SydneyRover]

They're neuclear-POWERED as opposed to nuclear armed.  Big difference.

That's true pies, but Oz doesn't have much of a nuclear industry to speak of apart from a medical facility at Lucas Heights just south of Sydney therefore it will mean gearing up to possibly be involved in part of the build but definitely the maintenance. The Oz pop were dead against mining yellow cake or any activity before this, the older inner city where I live has a nuclear ban which is of course symbolic.

It's making some of our neighbours a tad nervous as they may see this as a stepping stone.

[normal rules]

Well, so much for strategic ambiguity. Biden has announced that “of course they would defend Taiwan if China attacked.

Over to you China…………….

[Metalmicky]

Well, so much for strategic ambiguity. Biden has announced that “of course they would defend Taiwan if China attached”

Over to you China…………….

If China attached what...?

[belton rover]

Well, so much for strategic ambiguity. Biden has announced that “of course they would defend Taiwan if China attached”

Over to you China…………….

If China attached what...?

If China attached a picture of Scunthorpe United in an Email to Taiwan and said ‘See that football team? That’s your football team, that is. That’s the best football team you’ve ever had.’

[Filo]

Well, so much for strategic ambiguity. Biden has announced that “of course they would defend Taiwan if China attached”

Over to you China…………….

Never open an attachment from China

[SydneyRover]

''President Joe Biden said the US would defend Taiwan if China attacked, in an apparent departure from a long-held US foreign policy position.

But a White House spokesman later told some US media outlets that his remarks did not signify a change in policy.

The US has a law which requires it to help Taiwan defend itself.

But it pursues a policy of "strategic ambiguity," where it is deliberately vague about what it would actually do if China were to attack Taiwan.

China has yet to respond to Mr Biden's comments''

so no change then


https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-59005300

[Sprotyrover]

Sydders re your comment on Nuclear powerr, I watched a lecture on the Aus French Sub scheme,quite interesting as The strategic aim of the 2010 defence paper was not to buy 12 Subs built in foreign yards it was about building the facilities,training a workforce and then building the entire fleet in a vastly expanded Aus ship yard. This procrastinated on for 5 whole years from 2010 to 2015 but in that time of the three contenders they managed to completely naff off the Germans and the Japanese so much so that they can't even go back and buy two off the Peg subs. Of course whilst all of this was happening and 385 million $Aus was blown nothing was built. The French had recruited a ex AUs Naval officer and he pretty much steered the project their way. Then they go with the French and nothing happens for another 5 years, other than the French renage on their original promises and manipulated the contract so more and more of the build would happen in France .which was contrary to what AUs wanted, back in 2010 they were happy with a final cost of £80 Billion For the life of the project which would see the last ship built in 2050.
Looks like the French messed about with the language difference and
Tried to get as much as possible built in France they had taken their eye off the ball as the strategic aim of Aus about committing a massive amount of the future defence budget which was as I said earlier about creating a technological basis and facilities and worker skill set to build Naval subs (The cost of the project would have been about a third of the home build cost if they had order foreign built boats) whilst all of this was happening the Chinese built a huge Navy
and suddenly Aus saw itself moving from being an out of the way backwater to a state with a very large and possibly hostile nearby neighbour, they realised that they would be better off taking on the Potential enemy in the South China Sea rather than off the coast of Aus. The Biden administration provided them with a nice chart which BST would love it showed the capabilities of both Nuclear and conventional subs at different locations in the region for a example a Nuclear Sub could operate in the waters off China for 90 Days a standard sub...No Days.. a Nuclear Sub could operate in the vicinity of Singapore for 120 days a conventional Sub 14 Days. The decision to opt for Nuclear was a no brainer particularly after they saw through the French scheming. The problem is that you won't see a new build Sub until 2035 so they are now looking at refurbishing the Collins class to extend their operational life.