Talk Your Way Out Of This One Johnson

[BillyStubbsTears]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

[bpoolrover]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

[drfchound]

Two wrongs don’t make a right, unless includes one of the wrongs involves Starmer of course.

[drfchound]

starmer himself has said he couldn't go and see his family, so why on earth just because he is at work can he have beer and a curry! just because he didn't raise his glass and say cheers does not make it morally right

If he was at work and NOT eating and drinking, would that have been OK?

What about if he'd been at work and eating a sandwich and drinking coffee?

What about if he'd been at work and popped outside for a fag, while continuing to talk with a colleague about the work issues he was addressing?

Whataboutery in vogue again.

[SydneyRover]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

Can I attempt a translation here (snigger) Johnson has to go but only if Starmer goes too.

[drfchound]

And why would johnson lie about it if he had nothing to worry about? it wasn't a party apparently

You and your mates, sorry, Labour supporting co posters, had demanded the PM resign as soon as the news broke.  Before an investigation began.  Before the police got involved.
But, but but, that was ok wasn’t it.

[SydneyRover]

''One staffer describes what happened when they watched the prime minister denying, in the House of Commons, that anything had gone wrong.

"We were watching it all live and we just sort of looked at each other in disbelief like - why?" they say.

"Why is he denying this when we've been with him this entire time, we knew that the rules had been broken, we knew these parties happened?"''

bbc

[SydneyRover]

''Partygate: Inside the Storm Panorama

''Ahead of Sue Gray's report into parties in government buildings, Laura Kuenssberg investigates what went on under Boris Johnson's roof during lockdown.

Panorama follows MPs as they react to events and decide whether to support the prime minister or call for his resignation as he is fined and forced to apologise.

Three former staffers who worked in Downing Street give accounts of how they attended parties, for which two of them were fined. They say there was a complete lack of social distancing and rules were routinely broken''

A clip of the story

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0c8p2jb

[Ldr]

There’s not a cat in hells chance Starmer will be fined let’s be right about it. At worst case it’s an honest mistake. Incidentally durhams police and crime commissioner is Labour, sure this won’t influence anything mind………

[SydneyRover]

There’s not a cat in hells chance Starmer will be fined let’s be right about it. At worst case it’s an honest mistake. Incidentally durhams police and crime commissioner is Labour, sure this won’t influence anything mind………

I'm sure the Durham police crime commissioner will put as much effort into the Starmer investigation as he did with the cummings one.

[Ldr]

There’s not a cat in hells chance Starmer will be fined let’s be right about it. At worst case it’s an honest mistake. Incidentally durhams police and crime commissioner is Labour, sure this won’t influence anything mind………

I'm sure the Durham police crime commissioner will put as much effort into the Starmer investigation as he did with the cummings one.

Do you ever sleep?

[SydneyRover]

I'll sleep well tonight knowing both countries are in good hands 

[Ldr]

Not too sure of the UK !

[River Don]

Is a leaving do a work event? In my experience, no. It's a social after work, usually involving drinks.

What we seem to have here is a photo of a social event involving drinks. Some of those pictured have been fined for attending a social event. And there is a photo of Mr Johnson socialising too, so why no fine?

is standing in your office like starmer stood up chatting having a beer a work event or is it just chilling being social after a long day at work?

Starmer claims it was a working meal.

Food was in the kitchen to be collected as people wanted it after a long working day. For some that work would continue into the early hours and they have proof of that.

But yes, Starmer had a bottle of larger with his food. How many others did likewise, we don't know. So it's up to the Police to decide whether or not that makes it a party.

For me one of the obvious questions is how much did you drink? If it's just one beer with food then, for me it's clearly not a party.

Compare that to the leaving do, which is obviously a party with photographic evidence of empty bottles strewn about the place.

[wilts rover]

Insiders who attended events at Downing Street during lockdown have told the BBC how staff crowded together, sat on each other's laps and how party debris was left out overnight.

For the first time, insiders who were at some of the events have told BBC Panorama in detail what they saw.

They describe arriving for work the morning after a get-together to find bottles lying around parts of the building, bins overflowing with rubbish and empties left on the table.

They also tell of events with dozens of staff crowded together, and parties going so late that, on occasion, some ended up staying in Downing Street all night.

And they say staff mocked others who tried to stop what was going on.

Speaking anonymously, three insiders have opened up about a world behind No 10's famous front door where the lockdown rules the country was living by were routinely ignored, socialising was regular, with, they felt, the prime minister's implicit permission.

At the party on the eve of Prince Philip's funeral on 16 April 2021, they portray a "lively event... a general party with people dancing around".

The gathering becoming so loud that security guards in the building told them to leave the building and go into the No 10 grounds.

"So everyone grabbed all the drinks, the food, everything, and went into the garden," one source says.

"We all sat around the tables drinking. People stayed the night there."

They now concede what went on was "unforgivable".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

[ravenrover]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?

[mugnapper]

Over 300 photos submitted to the Met Police with regards to partying in No.10. (Three Hundred!!!).
1 photo of Starmer drinking a beer after a day when we know he had been working.
Do you think the guy who took the Starmer photo took just one pic and did a runner?
Or do you think he sat there all night and that was the best ‘evidence’ of law breaking he could come up with?
(Maybe he’s keeping back the pic of Starmer doing the Okey Cokey with Rayner, till the price is right)?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

Bpool.
I'm interested in your take on these questions.

https://www.drfc-vsc.co.uk/index.php?topic=283810.msg1161606#msg1161606


Where do you draw the line between what was an acceptable bodily need or choice, and what wasn't?

See to me, it is all about a spectrum from unquestionably acceptable to unquestionably unacceptable.

To me, the acceptable end of the spectrum looks like this. If a group of people had been working together and needed sustenance during that work, it is bordering on Taliban fundamentalism to say that they should not eat while working. It doesn't matter whether they are eating a sarnie from Sainsburys or a Chicken Vindaloo from the curry house. I'll grant you, the drinking of 1 can of beer is at a different point on that spectrum but if work is still going on, after a gruelling day, I wouldn't have a problem with that. The Met have already established that precedent, because they didn't even bother to investigate the May 2020 No 10 garden drinks and snacks, because they considered it to be people reasonably eating and drinking while working.

At the other end a regular timetabled knees up, with people congregating not to work while eating and drinking, but specifically to socialise. That was precisely what we were supposed to be avoiding during lockdowns. Social get togethers that weren't absolutely necessary.

Maybe I'm being simplistic, but it seem bleeding obvious to me. What do you think I'm not getting?

[normal rules]

I doth  my cap to the person(s) that took all these photos. Genuinely. I wonder if they were taking knowing full well the damage they would cause.
And then disclosed them at the relevant times.
They do seem to be trickling out to cause the most damage possible.
I wonder if anyone is getting paid for them? They would appear to be very, very valuable.
I suppose it would not be hard to work out who took them if you were there.
The press don’t seem to keen to disclose who the photographers are though ?
Never reveal your source I suppose?

[drfchound]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?

Could that be because bst knows that Durham police have already said they won’t issue fines retrospectively?

Just saying like.

[River Don]

You know, I just think Cummings has connections within Downing St.

There will be a lot of staff feeling hard done by after being thrown under the bus to protect Johnsons skin.

[normal rules]

You know, I just think Cummings has connections within Downing St.

There will be a lot of staff feeling hard done by after being thrown under the bus to protect Johnsons skin.

Perhaps that was the intention of the photos all along.
Cummings’ gang v Boris.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Over 300 photos submitted to the Met Police with regards to partying in No.10. (Three Hundred!!!).
1 photo of Starmer drinking a beer after a day when we know he had been working.
Do you think the guy who took the Starmer photo took just one pic and did a runner?
Or do you think he sat there all night and that was the best ‘evidence’ of law breaking he could come up with?
(Maybe he’s keeping back the pic of Starmer doing the Okey Cokey with Rayner, till the price is right)?

He claims to have watched them eating for 45 minutes.

[i_ateallthepies]

I doth  my cap to the person(s) that took all these photos. Genuinely. I wonder if they were taking knowing full well the damage they would cause.
And then disclosed them at the relevant times.
They do seem to be trickling out to cause the most damage possible.
I wonder if anyone is getting paid for them? They would appear to be very, very valuable.
I suppose it would not be hard to work out who took them if you were there.
The press don’t seem to keen to disclose who the photographers are though ?
Never reveal your source I suppose?

The photo of Johnson raising a glass doesn't appear to have been taken surreptitiously.  It's difficult to believe that such a large number of photos could have been taken without raising suspicion.  Seems to me nobody seemed bothered, more evidence of the contempt the good people of this country are held in by Johnson and his chums.

[danumdon]

https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1529102628155695104%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fpolitics%2Flive%2F2022%2Fmay%2F24%2Fboris-johnson-sue-gray-report-partygate-photos-uk-politics-latest%3FfilterKeyEvents%3Dfalsepage%3Dwith%3Ablock-628ce8388f084f9a73ca53c5block-628ce8388f084f9a73ca53c5

Fair enough, Sadiq wants an explanation from the Met as to why Johnson was not fined for attending a leaving party for the worst director of communications ever.

Can we also have an explanation from Sadiq as to why he's presided over the management of law enforcement of the capital that beggars belief and why he took so long to remove a commissioner who was plainly not up to the task.

[ravenrover]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?

Could that be because bst knows that Durham police have already said they won’t issue fines retrospectively?

Just saying like.

Are you sure that might not happen in view of events elsewhere?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Good old Hound, convincing himself I'm a hypocrite again.

As well as talking nonsense.

The Durham Police said 2 years ago that their policy was not to issue fines retrospectively. A lot can happen in 2 years. Only 6 months ago, the Met said their policy was not even to investigate old cases of lockdown evasion. That soon changed when the circumstances changed.

The idea that the Durham Police, in the current atmosphere, would find clear evidence of Starmer having broken the law and NOT fine him is ridiculous.

But even if they did, I've said consistently that I'd call for Starmer to resign.

But, when you've spent years wanting to convince yourself someone is a hypocrite, despite never having found a solid reason to support that, the need to keep on trying must be overwhelming.

[drfchound]

Still the same bst.  Still picking out my posts and having a go.
Even though he accepted my request to block my posts he still can’t resist firing at me when someone copies me into a post to respond to.

As it happens, my post about the Durham police was not aimed at bst at all but at the notion that Starmer is clinging on to the thought that Durham police have suggested they will not take retrospective action against lockdown parties or even high profile beergate gatherings.

[drfchound]

Well this ups the ante rather.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410

But yeah. Curry.

it does not make it right no matter what bst, how many times on the corona virus thread have you gone on about morals, it seems you don't have many yourself when it comes to politics

I seem to recollect that BST has said Starmer must resign if fined, what more can he say?

Could that be because bst knows that Durham police have already said they won’t issue fines retrospectively?

Just saying like.

Are you sure that might not happen in view of events elsewhere?

Raven, no of course I’m not sure, how could I be?
The truth is though that Durham police did say that.
Who knows if they will change their mind.
I genuinely do think though that Starmer is hanging his hat onto that possibility.

[scawsby steve]

Regarding the Panorama investigation, I take it that some of you on here will be dropping your agenda against Laura Kuenssberg, now that she's obviously not pandering to the Tory Party, which you've accused her of in the past.