Sunak or Truss

[phil old leake]

BST you might be right if what she does fails.  If she is a success (and I’m no economist so I’m like everyone else just guessing what I think) then Labour will struggle.
She has 2 years to turn it around.

[BillyStubbsTears]

This by The Treasury today.

"The Chancellor updated the Governor on his growth and fiscal strategies, noting that reforms which create the conditions for a high-growth economy can help to alleviate inflationary pressures."

That is possibly THE most astonishing thing the Treasury has ever published. There is no established economic theory, or practical example of "reforms" giving high growth and low inflation. Kwarteng has been in the job 24 hours and he's imposed voodoo economics on the Treasury.

The damage this could do is difficult to describe. It is the same argument that the Tory Chancellor Anthony Barber used in the 1972 Budget, which led directly to the inflation explosion of the 1970s, which itself led to 20 years of high unemployment.

I can see what they are doing. Like Barber before them, they are going for a splurge of money pumped into the economy in order to get a boom roaring before the Election. And to f**king hell with anything after that. I'm hoping the Governor of the BoE has told Kwarteng some basic economic truths.

[selby]

  Used to have a nice big pad in Wentbridge Anthony Barber, a nice bloke too.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Absolute car crash of a Chancellor. Worst since the War, but Kwarteng sounds like he wants to give him a run for his money.

[Sprotyrover]

It must be absolutely sickening for the Lefties on here to have the new Primeminister make a supportive and very positive statement regarding Doncaster Airport during her very first  Question time.
Ah well never mind!

[drfchound]

It wasn’t mentioned sproty until you brought that to the table.
I doubt that she will be given any time to prove herself.

[selby]

  Billy, he knew how to make money, and was the director and chairman of some of the biggest companies in the country, and had a successful career and life.
  Give it a break buddy, it was the working man and unions led by communists with an agenda to bring down the governments of the time that caused the troubles in the UK at the time.
  The unions in the motor trade even brought down the labour Government of Callaghan over the 9% maximum wage rise imposed wanting 14% for Ford workers when Labour MPs voted with the Tories, and gobbled Thatcher's trap.
  Labour wins the next election companies will leave these shores and investment will stop, jobs will be lost it happens every time labour win an election.

[phil old leake]

BST what’s your miracle cure for our current situation

[phil old leake]

Shelby don’t be silly everyone knows that the only solution to the UK and it’s problems is a Labour government led by a man that just objects to everything and promises anything knowing he will probably never have to deliver

[phil old leake]

Selby apologies for the Shelby

[Sprotyrover]

It wasn’t mentioned sproty until you brought that to the table.
I doubt that she will be given any time to prove herself.

Yes it's easy to have a pop when you know you haven't got a prayer of ever having to be in the 'Hot Seat'

[SydneyRover]

BST you might be right if what she does fails.  If she is a success (and I’m no economist so I’m like everyone else just guessing what I think) then Labour will struggle.
She has 2 years to turn it around.

The thing is phil, I could have bet on that before you announced it, what we don't know is what truss is qualified in as wiki is blank on that bit, but if you were confronted with a choice of spending your last quid on a sandwich or trying to double it at the bookies for fish and chips what would you do?

The bit about having 2 years to prove herself? 2 years to gamble all on something that economists are already rubbishing.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BST what’s your miracle cure for our current situation

Invent a time machine. Go back to 2010 and tell anyone even thinking of Austerity that we'd have the worst economic growth in 200 years over the next decade.

That'd be a start.

[Colemans Left Hook]

Absolute car crash of a Chancellor. Worst since the War, but Kwarteng sounds like he wants to give him a run for his money.

didn't realise you were so old to remember   you must be in your 80's (and the rest)   otherwise it's heresay

out of interest i just checked him out and you will be both amazed and humbled to what he actually did as I was . [

People were people then.

wilts will certainly respect him  when he reads the sp on him

http://www.donny.co.uk/Doncaster/news/?ID=1133

now what is the recipe for humble pie

[BillyStubbsTears]

Selby.

Barber may well have been brilliant at making money for himself.

It's a matter of historical fact that he was an utter disaster as Chancellor.

And the signs so far are that Kwarteng and Truss want to repeat his madcap dash for growth.

[SydneyRover]

Hang on tight it's going to be a full on with no holds barred till the next election.

''Liz Truss’s chief of staff brings key figures from lobbying firm into No 10
Mark Fullbrook asserts grip on Downing Street by giving senior roles to founding members of Fullbrook Strategies''

''The political consultant, a former longtime colleague of the election strategist Lynton Crosby, was appointed to the most senior role in Truss’s team this week, having previously worked on the failed leadership campaign of Nadhim Zahawi.

Senior advisory roles in No 10 have now also gone to Mac Chapwell and Alice Robinson, both founding members of his lobbying firm, Fullbrook Strategies.

The company, which launched in the spring, has lobbied the UK government on behalf of clients including the controversial Libyan parliament and a firm that won a £680m PPE deal in the pandemic.

Two more senior No 10 staff, Beatrice Timpson, the deputy press secretary, and Reuben Solomon, a digital adviser, have done stints at CT Group, Crosby’s political consultancy, where Fullbrook worked for over a decade''

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/sep/07/liz-trusss-chief-of-staff-brings-key-figures-from-lobbying-firm-into-no-10

This is going to be a dirty fight with full cooperation from the yellow press.

[phil old leake]

Syd from your sarcastic comment I assume you’re putting your self up as a self claimed economic expert. 

[SydneyRover]

Syd from your sarcastic comment I assume you’re putting your self up as a self claimed economic expert.

Not at all phil, but what I do know is that 2 years is way too long for people to wait for relief with energy bills, people are struggling now and have been for some time and require some certainty. I would suggest that the government needs to demonstrate capability with short term fixes such as a freeze on bills coupled with and paid for partly by windfall taxes and then have some other longer term plans such as greater incentives to insulate and expand the heat pump installation program in homes.

The energy retail market and distribution networks requires some major reforms and possibly a return to public ownership, the government has fannied around with short term fixes and fixed nothing, with modern software, metering and solid management public ownership and performance can be monitored much more easily than in the past to ensure that the admin margins do not blow out with excessive executive pay and make sure that the distribution system is maintained.

But my thinking is the new government will want a fight just as much if not more than the johnson government did and the solutions selected will highly favour its voting bloc. It is already flying kites to see what the public will accept. The newly hired spin team are not there to give the long suffering public a fair go and complete the task of levelling up, they are there to pick the battles and decide how and where they should be fought to continue to divide the nation give the truss what they think will be the best chance at the next election.

[tommy toes]

I despair. I really do.

This country's prospects have been ruined by this disaster of a government since they came to office in 2010.

And we're now completely f***ed

They've got every big decision wrong.

Austerity

A complete disaster that shelved growth and had zero effect on its objective ie to reduce the national debt.
This weakened our economy and put a squeeze on all of us, when they could have borrowed money then at zero interest rates to get growth moving

So... Let's blame the EU and foreigners said the Tory Brexiteers

So we voted for Brexit.

Despite what Brexiteers say this has and will continue to be a disaster for our economy. Where's the sense in alienating our near neighbours, while trying to get a trade deal with Australia FFS?
Now we have a nutcase in charge who will borrow billions at God knows what interest rate rather than take money from companies who don't deserve it and will only give it to their shareholders.

And that's not even mentioning them putting a buffoon like Johnson in charge.
And there's still people on here who support them.

[phil old leake]

I’m on the fence about windfall tax Syd I can see both sides of the argument
I do 100% agree with you that there needs to be incentives to get homes properly insulated and boiler systems upgraded.  I dread to think how much energy and heat is being wasted
It amazes me how many people have short memories.  Apparently all this started in 2010 with the Tories.  I’m sure there’s been common knowledge about needing to insulate houses and being more energy efficient for years. Which Labour governments also failed to address
This country is an island surrounded by sea. Why are we not investing in hydro and wind power.

[SydneyRover]

I’m on the fence about windfall tax Syd I can see both sides of the argument
I do 100% agree with you that there needs to be incentives to get homes properly insulated and boiler systems upgraded.  I dread to think how much energy and heat is being wasted
It amazes me how many people have short memories.  Apparently all this started in 2010 with the Tories.  I’m sure there’s been common knowledge about needing to insulate houses and being more energy efficient for years. Which Labour governments also failed to address
This country is an island surrounded by sea. Why are we not investing in hydro and wind power.

As far as the long suffering British public is concerned I would think that the polls are correct and the vast majority think there is only one argument, a windfall tax, which is not as stated elsewhere on here an increase, but a tax on the massive profits that have effectively 'fallen from the sky' onto these lucky companies that choose to base their operations in relatively safe countries such as the UK, the US, almost anywhere in the EU rather than Afghanistan, North K, Iran, Russia etc.

There is no impediment to investment from a windfall tax, think of trying to stand in the way of a fossil fuel company and a new gas/oil field.

As Billy says put part of this money into renewables of any sort on behalf of the British people as an investment for the future. Especially those kids born around May 2010 that are now working out their futures and have only known tory governments.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I’m on the fence about windfall tax Syd I can see both sides of the argument
I do 100% agree with you that there needs to be incentives to get homes properly insulated and boiler systems upgraded.  I dread to think how much energy and heat is being wasted
It amazes me how many people have short memories.  Apparently all this started in 2010 with the Tories.  I’m sure there’s been common knowledge about needing to insulate houses and being more energy efficient for years. Which Labour governments also failed to address
This country is an island surrounded by sea. Why are we not investing in hydro and wind power.

Why do you say the Labour Govt failed to address this?

Labour instigated a massive project to increase the number of houses with adequate lift and cavity wall insulation. The project doubled the houses adequately insulated from about 35% to about 70%.

That project ran until 2012. It was Labour's policy to extend it, but they lost the 2010 election. Cameron killed it and we've done next to nothing since (although the Tories do like to claim credit for the doubling of insulated homes between the early 2000s and now).

All that is established fact. I could post the figures but I know some people go all Neanderthal when we start dealing with graphs.

[tyke1962]

For as long as I can remember and I go back to starting work in 1978 so I can only really comment on the time I've lived and work in .

The problem with this country and now more than any other time all we've ever done is stick plasters on big open wounds , short termism and gets us to the next election mandates without ever getting to the root cause of anything , kicking the can down the road and let future generations pick up the tab and the consequences .

Thatcher trashing industry and making up the shortfall by selling off everything we owned .

Blair getting the taxpayer to pay people a living wage and not touch profits too much are just two examples .

And here we are again today with my grandkids aged 3 and 1 picking up the tab for my and your energy bill whilst the energy companies profit at £170bn pa .

Truss joins Thatcher and Blair in the Short Term Club , what did they care at the time ? , they wouldn't be around when the chickens came home to roost would they ?

This country and its electorate who are just as culpable including myself need to have a good fecking word with themselves and start treating the future generations with some thought and respect .