Should he be sacked?

[Mike_F]

I'm only going off what the man himself said at the event.

If "What he said and what actually happened are different" what's the point in having these events?

Let's say he got a bit mixed up when he said Dick and he actually meant the Watson family.  He said they'd put in a total of £25m between them which was near as damn it 50/50. If that's the case and he genuinely made a mistake I take the point regarding the best part of a decade being a stretch.

Andrew Watson and Sarah Flower left the club in June 2020 so it would appear that TB hasn't supported the club financially for the best part of three years which coincides with our dramatic downward spiral.

If he has lost interest (and that's entirely up to him, he's not a young man and no doubt has plenty of other priorities) it's not unreasonable for those of us who do care about this club, spend a significant amount of our disposable income on it and have ambitions to see some sort of success returning to ask him to be more pro-active in trying to sell.

EDIT: In reference to your third point, I would suggest that several million pounds of net transfer fee income from Ben Whiteman, John Marquis, Ben Blythe and the youngsters sold to Man Utd & Leeds kept us afloat. but without that money being reinvested into the next group of saleable players that wasn't going to last forever so when it ran out we were doomed to decline.

[lee.j09]

To put it bluntly..

The current regime and model isn’t working. If they aren’t interested in changing it. Then put the club up for sale publicly. And let’s get back to being a football club with ambition!

[Chris Black come back]

I am one who thinks Terry and Dick were more than generous and we need to start getting serious about spending the money we have properly rather than asking for more.

However, all these types of arguments come from the decision of the owners several years ago to stop disclosing information about the financial health and well-being of our club in the format that nigh on all other league clubs do. Until that happens, people quite rightly will grasp any public statements from club owners. We’re not been given the full picture about what is happening at our club. And that’s not to say we are being short changed or need more ‘investment’ (unfunded spending) but that we deserve the basic level of financial transparency that pretty much every club provides.

[Mike_F]

I'm not trying to come over as bitter or ungrateful in the slightest here. John Ryan ran out of cash chasing a dream and needed to bring in other investors to help us sustain that dream in the Championship. If only JR had been able to put in a little bit more we could've signed the likes of Jason Shackell and one or two others needed to get us into the playoffs then who knows we may just have had a season in the top flight. But that's all a fantasy and feels like a million miles from where we are now.

Dick and his family were Rovers fans and no doubt their enthusiasm and gentle persuasion rubbed off on their good friend, Terry to dip into his pocket but once Dick was gone that influence probably waned. The Andy pulled out and Terry decided not to pour any more of his own money into the club. Which is absolutely fair enough and completely his decision. But as above if he has lost interest it's hardly fair to let the club continue its moribund existence. I'm realistic enough to know that there aren't hoardes of wealthy football nuts banging down the door to take over but I genuinely believe that as an investment prospect for that sort of person there isn't a better club in the bottom two divisions.

[jamesrover17]

He definitely said at the MTO event that he and Dick had each put in £12.5m. We know that they were equal contributors.

If Andrew & Claire subsequently invested that money can't have been matched by Terry (otherwise he would've spent more than the £12.5m to match Dick) so no wonder they got fed up.

In which case, the current owners have not invested/spent a penny for seven years. Ok I'm being a bit liberal with the  best part of a decade as technically 70% is a significant majority but I'm not making things up here.

What he said, and what actually happened are different. I should know, I've seen the accounts for all of the last 10 years and discuss things like this with the CEO.

Firstly, he was being literal about them both putting in exactly the same, it was close but not exact as I believe TB put in slightly more.

And secondly, when he talked about DW he actually meant the family, as I know that Andy carried on his fathers legacy after he'd gone. Either way, you're just using a casual comment made at the MTO to confirm whatever it is you want to pursue.

And thirdly, if they hadn't put any money in for the last 7 years where did the funds come from to keep us in LG1 from 2017 to 2022? In those earlier years we didn't have Club Doncaster generating what it does today so what kept us afloat?

To be fair, if the owner is saying one thing when the truth is completely different then that's an issue in itself.

I don't have an issue with the current ownership per say, the footballing side of the operation is a complete shambles but that's for Copps to sort out.

But could do with been given the facts at a supposed Q&A with the owners.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Can anyone really deny that we need more funds to be successful? It doesn't to me feel like we have a big enough budget at all.

Second point to add to my previous, maybe (I'm very sceptical), Schofield could achieve with better players available.  Are these managers suffering because they're being asked to play a style and identify that doesn't befit the budget? Ie with a smaller budget which we seemingly have shouldn't we get more physical players who suit the level we are playing at?

[Mike_F]

My guess is that we've been playing a long game in the hope that our model will bear fruit when the looming financial chickens come home to roost at other clubs who've been kicking a can down the road since covid and will be in serious danger of insolvency as interest rates have risen.

We were quick to pay off our covid loan and have focused on ensuring we don't need external investment to survive. We know that a lot of other clubs are nowhere near as healthy as us in that regard so not only will their debts be a burden but also their owners may feel less inclined to chuck cash at them when their other business interests are feeling the pinch.

No football fan takes any pleasure from seeing a community's club going under but if several clubs fail that'll lead to a lot of players needing to find new jobs with competition for places at sustainable clubs leading to a deflation of wage demands. With a cold, hard business head on this absolutely makes sense. Of course none of it is guaranteed as we know a lot of club owners don't think this rationally when indulging in their hobby of playing at football ownership.

[Prez]

Its his style/tactics whats the problem

Even with better players, asking lower league defenders to play out from the back is suicide.

Tell me one chance we have created with this tactic?

[Bentley Bullet]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

[danumdon]

Can anyone really deny that we need more funds to be successful? It doesn't to me feel like we have a big enough budget at all.

Second point to add to my previous, maybe (I'm very sceptical), Schofield could achieve with better players available.  Are these managers suffering because they're being asked to play a style and identify that doesn't befit the budget? Ie with a smaller budget which we seemingly have shouldn't we get more physical players who suit the level we are playing at?

I think this has been the case for a few years now. All well and good brining in players who have skill and can play a controlled and managed way but unfortunately for us we have fallen between two stools.

The players we have are not good enough to play this structured and controlled setup that the head coach is attempting to impose on us all. When SOD was here he had a nucleus of good skilful payers who could fit the style and also had enough about them to be savvy on the pitch when it cam to having to roll your sleeves up.

Things then get even more difficult for us because our supposedly "technical players" are not good enough and also they don't have the grit and determination to compete in games when it starts to break up and become unstructured.

We see this every week., we don't complain enough, we accept decisions that other teams bleat on about for ages, we don't get in the face of players when they have committed a bad foul and we don't partake in the dark arts when it may get you something from nothing, we even had a penalty appeal not given because the payer tried to keep his feet, how many other clubs players would have gone down like the titanic as soon as contact was made.

Its almost as if we play in  manner that's exactly the same as the head coaches personality? you don't win anything in football by being nice and accommodating, the fair play league winners are never near the top of any leagues, come what may.

All the above cannot happen at our club because of the remit sent down from above that we play an "attractive and attacking style of football" when did this last happen, i'd say the season we had McCann as manager was the last time, and why did he leave, because he was attracted to what was supposedly a bigger club with a better budget.

If we are not in a position to give any decent perspective manager a good enough budget to have a proper go in this league then its pretty pointless getting rid of the current one, the next one would only end up in the same problems.

We will not attract a manager who has the experience to get us on the right road AND give him a budget that he can compete with, its not happening  any time soon under the present regime.

We need a complete reset.

[ncRover]

Who is currently available that is experienced and successful at this level?

[danumdon]

Who is currently available that is experienced and successful at this level?

Regardless of who is available , we wont be getting them as we currently don't do "experience and successful"

Cheap and cheerful, maybe.

[Butchers Red]

Who is currently available that is experienced and successful at this level?

The answer to that is - Plenty !

I am sorry but getting a side out of this league is not rocket science, basics are a Manager who understands that winning is simply everything, and far more important than "getting our message into them", and then 11 players all sporting a proper pair of gonads who aren't as happy as our current lot are with failure.

Some of the comments being made by various players and after defeat after defeat makes me despair.

How the hell can this idiot be making them better players when demonstrably they are ALL become less effective with each passing game.

[Alan Southstand]

No news at all?

Amazing!

[Campsall rover]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

I honestly think you could treble our playing budget and we wouldn’t see any success.
I think he has shown himself to be clueless tactically, unbelievably stubborn, arrogant, disingenuous and lacks motivational skills.
Don’t trust him  so to waste another years budget would be unbelievably reckless.

[Bentley Bullet]

You are probably right, CR, but Wellens was described similarly when he was here, and what's the common denominator now?

[BillyStubbsTears]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

I honestly think you could treble our playing budget and we wouldn’t see any success.
I think he has shown himself to be clueless tactically, unbelievably stubborn, arrogant, disingenuous and lacks motivational skills.
Don’t trust him  so to waste another years budget would be unbelievably reckless.

Wellens comment didn't mean that at all.

https://www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/football/richie-wellens-will-cut-his-nose-off-to-spite-his-face-chasing-long-term-vision-for-doncaster-rovers-3358697

He was alluding to his feud with Bogle. Nothing more, nothing less.

[oggycompton]

100%. Doesn't have a clue. More faith in McSheffrey and I wouldn't trust him with my over-35 team.

[Bentley Bullet]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

I honestly think you could treble our playing budget and we wouldn’t see any success.
I think he has shown himself to be clueless tactically, unbelievably stubborn, arrogant, disingenuous and lacks motivational skills.
Don’t trust him  so to waste another years budget would be unbelievably reckless.

Wellens comment didn't mean that at all.

https://www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/football/richie-wellens-will-cut-his-nose-off-to-spite-his-face-chasing-long-term-vision-for-doncaster-rovers-3358697

He was alluding to his feud with Bogle. Nothing more, nothing less.

“My remit at this club is to get an identity back,” Wellens said.

“I looked at a team on Tuesday that was well-coached and with a clear identity over what they have been told to do.

“I will continue to make decisions for the long term benefit of this club because my plan is to be here long term."

“I can make decisions that in the short term might be better for me. And sometimes I’m cutting my nose off to spite my face, and I get that.

“But I make long term decisions for the benefit of the club, to get its identity back and bring us long term, sustainable success.

Do keep up.

[Sammy Chung was King]

When you continually play short passes out to your full backs, teams will just press you straight away. You have to vary what you do. The element of surprise wins you games. We predictable and easy to play against.

[Bentley Bullet]

When you continually play short passes out to your full backs, teams will just press you straight away. You have to vary what you do. The element of surprise wins you games. We predictable and easy to play against.

Totally agree.

[BillyStubbsTears]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

I honestly think you could treble our playing budget and we wouldn’t see any success.
I think he has shown himself to be clueless tactically, unbelievably stubborn, arrogant, disingenuous and lacks motivational skills.
Don’t trust him  so to waste another years budget would be unbelievably reckless.

Wellens comment didn't mean that at all.

https://www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/football/richie-wellens-will-cut-his-nose-off-to-spite-his-face-chasing-long-term-vision-for-doncaster-rovers-3358697

He was alluding to his feud with Bogle. Nothing more, nothing less.

“My remit at this club is to get an identity back,” Wellens said.

“I looked at a team on Tuesday that was well-coached and with a clear identity over what they have been told to do.

“I will continue to make decisions for the long term benefit of this club because my plan is to be here long term."

“I can make decisions that in the short term might be better for me. And sometimes I’m cutting my nose off to spite my face, and I get that.

“But I make long term decisions for the benefit of the club, to get its identity back and bring us long term, sustainable success.

Do keep up.

You ignored the three paragraphs immediately preceding those.

[Chris Black come back]

Don’t we just do what every other club does? You look at the best manager in the league below and offer them a step up? Probably couldn’t tempt a few but there must be some highly capable managers in the National League who have a good track record, who would jump at chance of coming to stable league club.

[Sammy Chung was King]

Unfortunately yes, and get a proper manager in that knows what he’s doing.

[Bentley Bullet]

As I understood it, Richie Wellens was given the manager's job with the remit to bring back the style of football that was our identity under SOD. Wellens said in frustration on one occasion that he was cutting his nose off to spite his face in team and tactics selection. This made me wonder if he meant he was finding it nigh on impossible to carry out that instruction on a much lower budget than SOD had, and is Schofield finding the task equally as impossible?

I honestly think you could treble our playing budget and we wouldn’t see any success.
I think he has shown himself to be clueless tactically, unbelievably stubborn, arrogant, disingenuous and lacks motivational skills.
Don’t trust him  so to waste another years budget would be unbelievably reckless.

Wellens comment didn't mean that at all.

https://www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/football/richie-wellens-will-cut-his-nose-off-to-spite-his-face-chasing-long-term-vision-for-doncaster-rovers-3358697

He was alluding to his feud with Bogle. Nothing more, nothing less.

“My remit at this club is to get an identity back,” Wellens said.

“I looked at a team on Tuesday that was well-coached and with a clear identity over what they have been told to do.

“I will continue to make decisions for the long term benefit of this club because my plan is to be here long term."

“I can make decisions that in the short term might be better for me. And sometimes I’m cutting my nose off to spite my face, and I get that.

“But I make long term decisions for the benefit of the club, to get its identity back and bring us long term, sustainable success.

Do keep up.

You ignored the three paragraphs immediately preceding those.

You ignored the paragraphs that followed.

[Lesonthewest]

Sack him now,don't let the rot set in anymore,his style did'nt work with Huddersfield in championship with their players either,get a manager who don't except lack of effort and usually gets the best out of players,there was a time I would not want him because he left us,but would love McCann back,doubt we could persuade him to drop to league two now or we are willing to pay what it would take,but I wish we would try our best.

Agreed, but we don't seem to have anything like that kind of ambition anymore.

[ncRover]

Who is currently available that is experienced and successful at this level?

The answer to that is - Plenty !

I am sorry but getting a side out of this league is not rocket science, basics are a Manager who understands that winning is simply everything, and far more important than "getting our message into them", and then 11 players all sporting a proper pair of gonads who aren't as happy as our current lot are with failure.

Some of the comments being made by various players and after defeat after defeat makes me despair.

How the hell can this idiot be making them better players when demonstrably they are ALL become less effective with each passing game.

I’m just curious as to who people have in mind to replace DS if we sacked him. You all must have at least someone in mind?

[NickDRFC]

Who is currently available that is experienced and successful at this level?

The answer to that is - Plenty !

I am sorry but getting a side out of this league is not rocket science, basics are a Manager who understands that winning is simply everything, and far more important than "getting our message into them", and then 11 players all sporting a proper pair of gonads who aren't as happy as our current lot are with failure.

Some of the comments being made by various players and after defeat after defeat makes me despair.

How the hell can this idiot be making them better players when demonstrably they are ALL become less effective with each passing game.

I’m just curious as to who people have in mind to replace DS if we sacked him. You all must have at least someone in mind?

Why? No-one on this forum will have any influence in picking the manager. Right now I’d say literally anyone with a bit of experience could do a better job than Schofield.

[BillyStubbsTears]

No BB.

I didn't.

I simply didn't see how anyone would read that and conclude that Wellens was starved of funds.

Also, I struggle to see why a manager would take on a job in June and complain about funding in August. I'd have thought the very basic due diligence you'd do during the recruitment process is to ask what budget you'd be working with.

[Bentley Bullet]

Who said he was starved of funds? I suggested he didn't have the same funds as SOD did to achieve what SOD achieved.

What's up, have you no one to argue with on your forum?