Living Wage

[BillyStubbsTears]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

[SydneyRover]

This is the article the graph is from with the text which is straightforward, can you explain how the graph works for a non stat' person Billy?

''In April, the main hourly rate of the statutory national living wage will rise 9.8 per cent to £11.44 — the sharpest increase since 2001, following a similar upwards move last year. Younger workers and apprentices will get an even bigger increase of up to 21 per cent in their hourly pay.

The UK’s statutory wage floor is already one of the highest in the rich world. But economists said the effects of further increases on falling price growth were increasingly unpredictable, and could be one reason the BoE may wait longer than other central banks before cutting rates.

“The fear is that the rise this year will contribute to stickier wage growth and inflation,” said Ashley Webb, UK economist at consultancy Capital Economics, noting that last year’s pay boost had coincided with the biggest monthly jump in consumer prices since 1991 ................''

https://www.ft.com/content/43d9b345-f9ca-41e2-9d25-cf1c851a9034

[BillyStubbsTears]

The graph shows how annual pay rises have gone for workers on different salaries. The right side of the graph shows the richest workers, while the left hand side shows the poorest workers.

The height of the line shows how high annual pay rises were, after taking inflation into account.

Basically, if the line goes downwards from left to right, it means poorer workers were getting higher rises than richer ones, and vice versa if the line goes up from left to right.

There are three lines, representing:

1) Dark blue - The Thatcher-Major years. Richer people got high rises, poorer people got much lower rises.

2) Purple line - Blair/Brown/Cameron years after Min Wage was introduced. Pretty consistent wages across the different pay grades, with poorest doing a bit better.

3) Light blue line - Tories since Living Wage introduced. Poorest are doing much better and richest have seen pay cuts after inflation.

We need a lot more of this.

I wouldn't pay any attention to those comments by Ashley Webb. Right wing economists have preached disaster for every economy that introduced or increased a minimum wage. It's never happened

[SydneyRover]

Thanks muchly for that Billy, it only worked for me if I rotated it 180.

It is good, and as I repeat often those on low wages tend to spend it all.

[bpoolrover]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

it does not help the poorest thou as most are on some sort of benefits to top up there wages, once you get a pay rise you get the same pretty much taken off you In benefits so your no better off, it does help people who are out of the benefits bracket thou

[danumdon]

The comments section from the article makes for some interesting reading, especially when you consider the centre left demographic of the FT.

" So reality check on income inequality. Actually as this graph shows in powerful detail income inequality is shrinking in the UK just as the IFS Deaton report with the LSE shows. And it's been shrinking more quickly under a Tory government isn the last decade than at any other time in the last 35 years.

And this IS BEFORE factoring in the massive tax hikes on the top 10% and massive tax decreases on the other 90%. A literal doubling of the tax paid by those in the top 10% of the income distribution since 1980 from 30% of all income tax to 60% while the 90% share has gone from 70% to 40%, What a very peculiar world we live in. ( data HMRC)

Inequality is in rapid decline in the UK under the Tories is the real message. It's combined with very poor economic growth and a massive rise in handouts and NHS funding but the actual hard facts are in remarkable disagreement with the popular narrative that always gets the top votes in the FT on this subject these days."

[BillyStubbsTears]

The...errr...did you say the "centre left demographic of the FT".

[Bristol Red Rover]

The top ten percent does include the very rich but also just the rich. The issue with wealth inequality is the very rich. They are the tories friends, they have increased their wealth massively.

I doubt very much that with tax band thresholds being held that the assessment is accurate. The recent budget was for the wealthy, no doubt at all.

Food banks have mushroomed under the Tories. Many people are far poorer in real terms. Not only that but services such as the police are literally a hairs breadth from breaking. Much much worse under the tories. Such crumbling services seriously affect the poorer more.

[danumdon]

The...errr...did you say the "centre left demographic of the FT".

As far as the comments sections are, yes i did.

The FT has always had a centre left sway when you read the comments section.

I'd say i'm surprised that you wasn't aware but then nothing these days surprises me.

[danumdon]

The top ten percent does include the very rich but also just the rich. The issue with wealth inequality is the very rich. They are the tories friends, they have increased their wealth massively.

I doubt very much that with tax band thresholds being held that the assessment is accurate. The recent budget was for the wealthy, no doubt at all.

Food banks have mushroomed under the Tories. Many people are far poorer in real terms. Not only that but services such as the police are literally a hairs breadth from breaking. Much much worse under the tories. Such crumbling services seriously affect the poorer more.

The issue many make (in the comments)is that the middle are being squeezed dry, many agreed that the 30/50K cohort were no better off than the ones on just a high enough level who maintain state benefits, when you factor in the benefits that get covered then the former cohort are left with very similar disposable incomes when they have paid all their bills and commitments.

When you look around at people who are affected i can well believe it.

[turnbull for england]

We are on a week  away Anglesey , beautiful place. Been into Holyhead today, jesus h Christ. I've never seen a place with such little hope. Chip  shops , pubs and plywood are about all thats there and folk that looked like the cast of little Britain . We left after about mins . Worked in every area of Donny over last 30odd years and never seen anywhere like that , left you feeling genuinely sorry for those that live there

[SydneyRover]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

it does not help the poorest thou as most are on some sort of benefits to top up there wages, once you get a pay rise you get the same pretty much taken off you In benefits so your no better off, it does help people who are out of the benefits bracket thou

Will it mean that that businesses that pay low wages will have to pay more themselves rather than have their employees wages subsidised by government (taxes)

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

it does not help the poorest thou as most are on some sort of benefits to top up there wages, once you get a pay rise you get the same pretty much taken off you In benefits so your no better off, it does help people who are out of the benefits bracket thou

Will it mean that that businesses that pay low wages will have to pay more themselves rather than have their employees wages subsidised by government (taxes)

No, it will mean the businesses pass it on to their customers this an inflationary pressure, that's something the boe are concerned about now.

When I worked with the public sector a council I worked with were adamant we needed to pay living wage to the staff and a big rise. We decided we'd do that and invoke the contract clause that meant we could pass that on (with profit on top), said councillors were not happy! Can't have it all ways.

[SydneyRover]

If you can't pay a 'living wage' to your employees you don't really have a working business model, you have a business being supported by taxes, pud.

[bpoolrover]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

it does not help the poorest thou as most are on some sort of benefits to top up there wages, once you get a pay rise you get the same pretty much taken off you In benefits so your no better off, it does help people who are out of the benefits bracket thou

Will it mean that that businesses that pay low wages will have to pay more themselves rather than have their employees wages subsidised by government (taxes)

the businesses will pay it then the government will lower the amount they pay the person as they do now, whatever the said poorest will be no better off even if 15 pound a hour

[SydneyRover]

It may just quieten down those crying about the welfare bill and stop businesses that pay low wages paying dividends out of taxes.

I would think that those receiving a low wage would rather get a living wage than rely on welfare.

[bpoolrover]

It may just quieten down those crying about the welfare bill and stop businesses that pay low wages paying dividends out of taxes.

I would think that those receiving a low wage would rather get a living wage than rely on welfare.

it wont help them with bills or putting food on the table thou

[SydneyRover]

It may just quieten down those crying about the welfare bill and stop businesses that pay low wages paying dividends out of taxes.

I would think that those receiving a low wage would rather get a living wage than rely on welfare.

it wont help them with bills or putting food on the table thou

Yep, it probably requires a new forward looking government that focuses less on itself and more on the majority. You wouldn't vote for another 5 years of tory government would you bp?

[Colemans Left Hook]

Fair play to the Tories. This has been one thing that they have massively got right.

This graph shows the way pay rises have been much higher for the poorest workers since they brought this in. The exact opposite of what happened under Thatcher.

Labour made the first step in bringing in the Minimum Wage, but that wasn't enough. The Tories raised the game and they deserve a lot of credit for this policy.

and here is "Fair Play "mark II

https://www.standard.co.uk/business/money/pension-funds-to-publicly-disclose-how-much-is-invested-in-uk-versus-overseas-b1142718.html#:~:text=The%20plans%20are%20subject%20to%20a%20consultation%20by,least%205%25%20of%20their%20assets%20in%20unlisted%20equity.

Pension funds will be required to publicly compare their performance data against competitors and disclose their levels of investment in British businesses under Government plans.

The Government said the reforms will help employers and savers to compare schemes and make informed choices.

The rollout of automatic enrolment has driven a huge growth in the amount of investment entering UK pension funds, from less than £90 billion in 2012 to around £116 billion in 2022, the Government said.

But it added that disclosure requirements for defined contribution (DC) pension funds are currently inconsistent across the market and do not require a breakdown of UK investments, sometimes making it difficult for policymakers and savers to understand where this money is invested. etc etc


Inflation figure out today 3.5% presumably

[SydneyRover]

This is how it's done clh, basically if a fund doesn't perform it cannot take on any new members, all performance data for each fund is published including what % of the fund (fees) are used to run the fund.

Implemented in 1992

The super guarantee (SG) is the minimum amount of super you must pay to your employees to avoid the super guarantee charge. The SG is currently 11% of your employee’s base earnings (ordinary time earnings), and is planned to progressively increase to 12% by 2025.

https://business.gov.au/finance/superannuation#:~:text=The%20super%20guarantee%20(SG)%20is,increase%20to%2012%25%20by%202025.

https://www.finder.com.au/super-funds/best-performing-super-funds?futm_medium=cpc&futm_source=google&futm_campaign=17784239650~137693310423&futm_term=super%20funds~p~g&futm_content=~~EAIaIQobChMI7Jbd-IuChQMVu-sWBR0Kcw9hEAAYASAAEgL7hPD_BwE~&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7Jbd-IuChQMVu-sWBR0Kcw9hEAAYASAAEgL7hPD_BwE

This is the gov body that oversees the super industry

https://www.apra.gov.au/annual-superannuation-performance-test

This is the equivalent of 'Which' with more info on super funds

https://www.choice.com.au/money/financial-planning-and-investing/superannuation/articles/mergers-2022

[ravenrover]

We are on a week  away Anglesey , beautiful place. Been into Holyhead today, jesus h Christ. I've never seen a place with such little hope. Chip  shops , pubs and plywood are about all thats there and folk that looked like the cast of little Britain . We left after about mins . Worked in every area of Donny over last 30odd years and never seen anywhere like that , left you feeling genuinely sorry for those that live there

Bet you never worked in Highfields then :-]]

ps I used to live there as a an early teenager in the mid 60s

[bpoolrover]

It may just quieten down those crying about the welfare bill and stop businesses that pay low wages paying dividends out of taxes.

I would think that those receiving a low wage would rather get a living wage than rely on welfare.

it wont help them with bills or putting food on the table thou

Yep, it probably requires a new forward looking government that focuses less on itself and more on the majority. You wouldn't vote for another 5 years of tory government would you bp?

i wont vote the tories this time, and yes lets see what labour can bring to the table

[Sprotyrover]

We are on a week  away Anglesey , beautiful place. Been into Holyhead today, jesus h Christ. I've never seen a place with such little hope. Chip  shops , pubs and plywood are about all thats there and folk that looked like the cast of little Britain . We left after about mins . Worked in every area of Donny over last 30odd years and never seen anywhere like that , left you feeling genuinely sorry for those that live there

Bet you never worked in Highfields then :-]]

ps I used to live there as a an early teenager in the mid 60s

Highfields got worse when the council acquired the Pit houses and started using it as a sink hole estate!

[idler]

We are on a week  away Anglesey , beautiful place. Been into Holyhead today, jesus h Christ. I've never seen a place with such little hope. Chip  shops , pubs and plywood are about all thats there and folk that looked like the cast of little Britain . We left after about mins . Worked in every area of Donny over last 30odd years and never seen anywhere like that , left you feeling genuinely sorry for those that live there

Bet you never worked in Highfields then :-]]

ps I used to live there as a an early teenager in the mid 60s

I worked for Coop dairies briefly in the mid 1970s and my round ended in Highfields. I used to stop for a cup of tea with an old lady every morning. I don’t think that I ever had any milk pinched while on my break. Mrs Khymes used to keep bobbing into the from romm and tell me if anybody was waiting for milk and I’d nip out again.
I once went to watch a mate play for Balby against Highfield one Saturday. Highfield were really struggling for players so me and Ray Thomas said we’d help them out so we went home for our kit. When we got back they had been in the club and had some volunteers so we weren’t needed. One of the volunteers was a tall, thin bald bloke probably in his 50s playing in y fronts and no shorts. It was like ripping yarns but Highfield got hammered that day.

[Colemans Left Hook]

This is how it's done clh, basically if a fund doesn't perform it cannot take on any new members, all performance data for each fund is published including what % of the fund (fees) are used to run the fund.

Implemented in 1992

The super guarantee (SG) is the minimum amount of super you must pay to your employees to avoid the super guarantee charge. The SG is currently 11% of your employee’s base earnings (ordinary time earnings), and is planned to progressively increase to 12% by 2025.

https://business.gov.au/finance/superannuation#:~:text=The%20super%20guarantee%20(SG)%20is,increase%20to%2012%25%20by%202025.

https://www.finder.com.au/super-funds/best-performing-super-funds?futm_medium=cpc&futm_source=google&futm_campaign=17784239650~137693310423&futm_term=super%20funds~p~g&futm_content=~~EAIaIQobChMI7Jbd-IuChQMVu-sWBR0Kcw9hEAAYASAAEgL7hPD_BwE~&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7Jbd-IuChQMVu-sWBR0Kcw9hEAAYASAAEgL7hPD_BwE

This is the gov body that oversees the super industry

https://www.apra.gov.au/annual-superannuation-performance-test

This is the equivalent of 'Which' with more info on super funds

https://www.choice.com.au/money/financial-planning-and-investing/superannuation/articles/mergers-2022

F.F.S sydney stop digging or you will come up in Coleman Towers

what I posted has SOD ALL to what you are rambling on about (anyhow rambling on is my job)

[turnbull for england]

We are on a week  away Anglesey , beautiful place. Been into Holyhead today, jesus h Christ. I've never seen a place with such little hope. Chip  shops , pubs and plywood are about all thats there and folk that looked like the cast of little Britain . We left after about mins . Worked in every area of Donny over last 30odd years and never seen anywhere like that , left you feeling genuinely sorry for those that live there

Bet you never worked in Highfields then :-]]

ps I used to live there as a an early teenager in the mid 60s

Highfields got worse when the council acquired the Pit houses and started using it as a sink hole estate!

I have indeed , after strike and before SRB improvements built the walls back in place of the fencing burnt to keep warm .

[Bristol Red Rover]

Said it many times on here,  the solution is Universal Basic Income. Deals with poverty, doesn't waste money on the crazy admin costs of benefits,  and encourages people to work - at worst it encourages more than the benefits system does.

[River Don]

As Gary Stevenson explains very simply

The BoE has a remit to keep inflation to 2%. This mainly involves setting interest rates to keep CPI and wages rises within the bounds of this margin.

But asset prices are a whole different measure of inflation that aren't controlled. So whilst interest rates are kept low, assets like house prices boom.

It seems the current system is designed to steadily impoverish the majority as wages are held down whilst property prices run ever further ahead.