Richie Wellens

[i_ateallthepies]

Yes TRB, what happens at a football club is likely to be in the public eye, and for that reason, if they don't want to paint somebody into a corner the club has to work very hard to manage the release of information to guard against making a tricky situation worse.

[drfchound]

I don't know Richie Wellens but he comes across as a kid in a man's body. He has, over the years at the Rovers, had a tendency to take his ball home or throw out his dummy if he doesn't get what he wants.  It maybe in this case that what he wanted was for the team to play differently, and if there was a difference between him and PD, it was about the game and not personal feelings.

 I get the impression that Corporal Jones is very much stronger and will not let Wellens  have an individual attitude, be part of the team, take the good with the bad or get out. He has told Richie that he has to prove he wants to be here, that's a good start.

I dont believe for one minute that Richie is a kid in a mans body.
He has the respect of the other players ( another player has told me this) and he expects them all to give 100%.
Fans of other clubs that know all hold Wellens in the highest regard.
We were crying out for Richie to be on the pitch in the Burton game to get and keep the ball because it kept on coming back at our back four for most of the second half.
None of us know for sure what has gone on but if Rob Jones is prepared to give him another chance then he must hold him in high regard too.

[The Red Baron]

Yes TRB, what happens at a football club is likely to be in the public eye, and for that reason, if they don't want to paint somebody into a corner the club has to work very hard to manage the release of information to guard against making a tricky situation worse.

You have misunderstood what I said. Of course I don't expect the club to comment on the situation with Wellens. You seemed to be saying that people shouldn't speculate about what is going on. My point was that such speculation is inevitable.

[newyankee]

The point is Hound that he seems to act like a kid rather than the Senior pro which he is. 

[drfchound]

No, he has high standards and as a senior player he has the right to air his views.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

There's a difference between airing your views and throwing your dummy out of the pram even if you have a valid argument.

[IDM]

There's a difference between airing your views and throwing your dummy out of the pram even if you have a valid argument.

Something many forum users could take note of...

[drfchound]

To be honest, none of us know what has gone off do we so how do we know whether "he has thrown the dummy out" so to speak.

[The Red Baron]

Interesting to read that Wellens has not been training for about two weeks. Ok, there may be a family problem, but if there is it hasn't been alluded to.

[wing commander]

  Not even training with the kids just sat at home by the sounds..Jones said Richie rang him up asking to play in the development game..So I think that pretty much confirms theres much more to this than driving... I did like the fact that Jones said, he told him what he expects on and OFF the pitch and it would appear he's back in full training...It doesn't sound like theres anything imminent on the loan front for him...While Dickov was here I didn't see a way back for him and I didn't really want one but Dickovs gone and theres a new man at the healm for now so I guess it's up to Jonesy what happens next...If he thinks his attitude is right and he's commited (that's words been used a lot) he will play but I think the days are gone that he's first on the team sheet...

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hound.

It's obvious that whatever the issue was, Jones has not been happy with Wellens and requires a change in Wellens's attitude. It looks like it's gone WAY beyond a senior pro's "right" to speak out and to set standards. If Wellens has been attempting to get his "high standards" taken on by everyone else, then he's clearly done it on a way that the club captain doesn't approve of.

[The Red Baron]

Agreed, BST. I was inclined to take the story about Wellens wanting to move closer to home at face value. I understood why he wouldn't play against Fleetwood or Burton because an injury might scupper a possible move.

I was a bit surprised he wasn't considered for Gillingham, but I reasoned again that he might be moving as soon as the loan window opened. The statement from RJ that Wellens only returned to training this week after a 2 week absence cast everything in a different light for me. If he was set on moving to another club and had the manager's blessing I'd still expect him to train with us. After all, another club doesn't want to sign a player who isn't fit, do they?

[mugnapper]

Red Baron - We've signed plenty 

[The Red Baron]

Red Baron - We've signed plenty 

True, but usually because we don't have much choice. I would think Wellens would be a  "nice to have" at any club he was joining at this stage

[drfchound]

Hound.

It's obvious that whatever the issue was, Jones has not been happy with Wellens and requires a change in Wellens's attitude. It looks like it's gone WAY beyond a senior pro's "right" to speak out and to set standards. If Wellens has been attempting to get his "high standards" taken on by everyone else, then he's clearly done it on a way that the club captain doesn't approve of.

Billy, With respect, as i said, none of us really know what has gone off and because Jones has welcomed him back to the fold it would appear that the damage is not irrepearable.
We dont know whether the club captain (Jones of course) didnt approve or otherwise do we.
Jones has possibly recognised that Wellens is a valuable member of the squad so has seen the opportunity to have a chat and smooth things over.
I guess that one day it will all come out and someone on here will come out and say "I told you so" but until then will can only have our stabs at it.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Only 3 reasons I can think why he wouldn't have been training.
1) he's been banned
2) he's absented himself
3) for some personal reason, the club gave him a dispensation.

No chance of it being 3, going on Jones's interview. So something has gone off. And Jones's comments about Wellens needing to decide if he's prepared to commit suggests that Wellens is not blameless.

EDIT: I guess there could be some combination of 1&2 - an agreement that it has been in everyone's best interests if he doesn't train with the club. That doesn't change the thrust of the argument. Barring personal problems, you don't not train when you are fit unless there is some reason why you are not welcome at the training ground.

[IDM]

I really don't give a flying fart what Wellens has done or said, or why.

If Rob Jones or the new manager, decides Wellens is fit to play and is part of their plans, then he'll get my support when wearing the shirt.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hound

I'm just applying a bit of logic given what we do know. I can't see any logical argument that either it's all been amicable, or Wellens was picked on by Dickov. So that's two of the theories that were floating around put to bed for me.

[BillyStubbsTears]

IDM

Agreed. And vice versa.

[drfchound]

Yep BST, that is fair enough.
As IDM said, i will back him.
I like Wellens and i hope the silly Black Bank song is dropped from the song list.

[Jonathan]

Isn't Jones just regurgitating what Dickov said? When Wellens was first left out, Dickov said he'd had an offer from elsewhere and he'd need to know that Wellens was committed and wanted to stay here before picking him. What's changed? There could still be personal factors involved or otherwise. We know no more.

[The Red Baron]

Isn't Jones just regurgitating what Dickov said? When Wellens was first left out, Dickov said he'd had an offer from elsewhere and he'd need to know that Wellens was committed and wanted to stay here before picking him. What's changed? There could still be personal factors involved or otherwise. We know no more.

It's the business about him not training for 2 weeks that bothers me.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

The danger is, if he does play, and he performs badly, people will be on his case quicker than ever, rightly or wrongly.

Just hope he shows what we know he can but we can't afford more instability in the team if he's in and out.

[ravenrover]

Strange how people remember things all I seem to remember PD saying was that RW was talking, with permission from DRFC, to another club nearer home and wouldn't go into anymore detail apart from if RW left then it would be on PD's/DRFC terms, this is now Wellens demands transfer, Wellens is Transfer listed, it was an argument between PD and RW that got PD the sack Wellens is a cry baby, he's not fit to wear the shirt again, the Titanic sank because of RW, WWII started because of RW, twin towers happened because of RW (it is 14 years today actually) etc etc
Please everybody let it go we are all speculating we know nothing and let see what eventually comes out with the dishwater.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Jonathan

Have you ever heard of a player not training simply because he is trying to broker a move away?

As I say, there are only three reasons why a fit, contracted player wouldn't be training. He has personal problems, he doesn't want to train or the club doesn't want him at training.

If he had personal problems, I'd have expected a more sympathetic attitude from Jones. So, unless a Jones is a reall nasty Kitson, Wellens isn't training because he doesn't want to be at training, or because the club doesn't want him there.

But why would he not train if he's trying to broker a deal away. It means he'd be under-prepared and probably not immediately selectable when he got his move. At the very least that'd be foolishly unprofessional.

Leaves me concluding that either Wellens went off in a strop, or the club told him not to attend training. I can't see any other logical conclusions.

[Jonathan]

I thought Jones said he was now training? I may have misheard on that one.

Anyway, he hadn't trained previously, and both Jones and Dickov are on record as saying he'd only be considered for selection when he shows he's committed to the club (by definition, negotiating with another club calls that commitment into question - no matter what the root cause is, we can only speculate in the absence of any facts).

In any case, at the start of the week (prior to Dickov's departure) Wellens said he wanted to play in the development team, which he did. He now needs to continue to show that he wants to be here to play in the first eleven. We're not in any different position at all.

Not too dissimilar to the recent David De Gea escapade really. Or Berahino. He wanted to go elsewhere and was told to stay away for a short while before coming back.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Jonathan

I obviously didn't make myself clear.

Wellens HAFDN'T been training for two weeks. As I explained, I cannot see any explanation for that other than Wellens choosing not to train, or the club suspending him.

The training issue is totally separate from the selection issue. If a player wanted away and had the club's blessing (the story we were told) I would expect him not to be selected, but to train as usual.

As TRB says, it's the absence from training that is the really telling issue.

As for Berahinho and DeGea, I assume you're not saying that their behaviour is morally acceptable? I think the pair of them have acted like Kitsons and if I were a billionaire club owner, I'd tell players like those that they can sit on their arses and see out their contracts.

[The Red Baron]

He is training now. He played in the stiffs on Tuesday and then trained today.

It strikes me that the players might have been told, in strict confidence, about the decision to remove Dickov on Monday night. That might have influenced Wellens willingness to play at Chesterfield. Of course he might have also realised if he did want a move he needed to maintain his fitness.

[Jonathan]

Berahino undoubtedly behaved poorly. De Gea, I'm not sure. Seemed to me like he kept his own counsel throughout and never said anything about his situation publicly.

(For personal reasons) De Gea may have wanted to move back to Madrid (I would if I was him!) and his manager ostracised him from the first team for that. We know nothing from De Gea himself as he said nothing. He's now signed a new deal and is staying.

The club have dealt with Wellens as they saw fit. I've no issue about it. All we know is that he wanted to talk to another club and presumably agree a move away. Both Dickov and Jones have dealt with it well, publicly and (presumably) privately which is precisely why we're in this situation - speculating.

[The Red Baron]

DeGea didn't refuse to play. Van Gaal decided not to pick him until the situation with Real was resolved.

As DeGea has signed a new contract I expect to see him playing again.