Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: keepmoatfaithful on July 18, 2014, 10:27:36 am
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http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/football/doncaster/doncaster-takeover-blocked-to-leave-ryan-fuming-1-6736408
"I asked the League if we had any chance of passing the test and they simply said ‘no’. I find that ridiculous. Basically, they (the League) are taking into account nothing but pure cash. But what about assets?
I have assets, Louis certainly has assets. What we don’t have is £5m in cash sitting there, which is what the League seems to want.
Who has that amount of cash? People have assets and that should be taken into account. How is anyone going to pass in the future?"
:facepalm:
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Who has £5 million in cash? I imagine a lot of football owners, John.
Deary me. I've always thought his attempts to pawn off blame for his failings on other people as a bit daft but this one really takes the cake. If you have to sell/use your assets to make up £5 million what hope have you of running a professional football club?
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I don't think its a case of not having the money, surely between them they have. 5 million to fund the "Business Plan", shouldn't have troubled the two.
The problem seemed to be they simply couldn't provide evidence of this "Liquid funding", which came as no surprise to me . Lets face it, majority of JR and LT wealth will be in investment accounts, not current or saving accounts.
Assuming both had a couple of "Current" and a couple of "Saving" accounts, I doubt more than 140K is in the accounts, as legislation only "Guarantees" 35K "Refund" if bank goes "Tits UP" ala Northern Rock, so both would be a little foolish to have millions in these type of accounts.
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http://www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk/sport/doncaster-rovers/explained-why-john-ryan-and-louis-tomlinson-s-takeover-bid-failed-1-6736659#.U8jcpWammRA.twitter
In this article it says the same rules have operated in the Championship for the last four years and is now in operation in league one and league two. So anybody who wanted to takeover a club must have known the rules, especially when you have been a co-owner in the Championship. So yet again we have had upheaval in preseason and I am sorry John, although you are a fan and Co-owner and believe you are doing the best for the club, you have not.
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Since this came to light JR has given an interview to BBC radio Sheffield and the Yorkshire post. Before the takeover was even announced by the club JR had given interviews to 3 official sources. He's really taking the wrong approach by conducting his affairs through the media - bypassin people who are important and creating things that can only come to bite him in the arse.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
I agree with this Ryan would of put us millions in debt chasing his prem dream, it's good news all round he's not taking us over
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
It will only be a good day for us if we can sign players that will progress the club. Loosing contracted players who have release clauses will not be good day for our club. It's only a community club when the majority of the community come and support it, we do not have that.
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Don't think there's any need for the phrase 'egotistical individuals', personally. Not really constructive.
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why did the vsc not halp jr
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why did the vsc not halp jr
How much cash do you think they have lying about??
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If he didn't have the cash, where was it coming from? And where was any future monies coming from? And who was going to pay for this "better team than we had last season" that I believe he said we'd have?
If JR was found wanting on that front, it's no wonder he was turned down. Maybe it was a good thing, after all...
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
It will only be a good day for us if we can sign players that will progress the club. Loosing contracted players who have release clauses will not be good day for our club. It's only a community club when the majority of the community come and support it, we do not have that.
You're mixing up the argument though Steve. I was talking in general how the FL regulations, which have worked perfectly well in the Championship for the last four years, are accepted by all 72 clubs as appropriate. And I agree.
Football clubs are centred in the community in which they serve, they've become a community institution over the years. They're not a toy for rich (sic) individuals. Just because our club isn't well supported doesn't stop it being a community club.
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why did the vsc not halp jr
We asked to meet him, he didn't have the time. Apparently.
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why did the vsc not halp jr
We asked to meet him, he didn't have the time. Apparently.
He seemed to find the time to talk to Radio Sheffield at short notice
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Don't think there's any need for the phrase 'egotistical individuals', personally. Not really constructive.
Amazing isn't it. I've seen people have a dig at SM and he often flies off the hook, yet he come's on here doing the same thing to JR.
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It's always the same people that stick the knife in - just ignore it.
However, it's a forum. It's allowed.
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Don't think there's any need for the phrase 'egotistical individuals', personally. Not really constructive.
Amazing isn't it. I've seen people have a dig at SM and he often flies off the hook, yet he come's on here doing the same thing to JR.
You need to read that again,it doesn't make any sense.
But, in my defence, I've been the subject of legal action and a smear campaign that's lasted over 12 months, and only because I've questioned the motives of an individual who wasn't being very open about his intentions.
But if having a pop at me makes your day, go ahead.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
"It's not about personalities."
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
"It's not about personalities."
It's not. And highlighting that doesn't make it so.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
"It's not about personalities."
It's not. And highlighting that doesn't make it so.
I don't think it is either.
I do think that throwing around the term 'egotistical individuals' rubs against the grain of what you've been saying to people for weeks - "it's not about personalities" "I have nothing against JR". It does in my opinion anyway. Not that that matters.
Obviously you'll deny that was about JR because you didn't explicitly say it was, but I think we all know.
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Was John's biggest mistake selling Transform for £20m!? I think 12 years or so on it looks like that was a mistake. Selling a successful business then 5 years later trying to start up another similar business and losing money on it isn't the best plan is it.
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In the accounting world there is a clear distinction between assets and liquidity. Jr would know that and the importance of it.
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In the accounting world there is a clear distinction between assets and liquidity. Jr would know that and the importance of it.
I'm not so sure he would.
In my opinion he's not the great businessman everyone makes him out to be, he just got lucky with Transform.
(And no, I'm not a millionaire therefore I'm not entitled to pass any opinion).
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Ryan is successful for the same reason many successful people are, his single mindedness, never contemplating failure and the positivity he has towards anything he does (however daft). Confidence and enthusiasm usually gets you further than brains.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
looks like you have finally let your thoughts on JR come out into the open then. I dont understand why you did not make your opinions clear before and then at least say to JR, prove me wrong
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Sad as it may seem, given our history, I hope we never hear from Mr Ryan again. It's time to move on. Rovers will always be here as long as we have real supporters. Let's get behind the lads on the field.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
looks like you have finally let your thoughts on JR come out into the open then. I dont understand why you did not make your opinions clear before and then at least say to JR, prove me wrong
Not sure what part you feel is incorrect?
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
looks like you have finally let your thoughts on JR come out into the open then. I dont understand why you did not make your opinions clear before and then at least say to JR, prove me wrong
Well they did offer to meet with him...
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
looks like you have finally let your thoughts on JR come out into the open then. I dont understand why you did not make your opinions clear before and then at least say to JR, prove me wrong
You'll have to excuse me for being ignorant, but where in this post do I mention John?
I've made my thoughts clear on more than one occasion that I've never been happy with the governance of football and how easy it's been for people without the right intentions to take control of football clubs for the wrong reasons.
Head to the main page of this website and read what I wrote about the VSC meeting with Clive Efford MP.
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'A black day for football'?
No, it's a good day for football when egotistical individuals without sufficient funds are blocked from taking over a community club.
looks like you have finally let your thoughts on JR come out into the open then. I dont understand why you did not make your opinions clear before and then at least say to JR, prove me wrong
You'll have to excuse me for being ignorant, but where in this post do I mention John?
I've made my thoughts clear on more than one occasion that I've never been happy with the governance of football and how easy it's been for people without the right intentions to take control of football clubs for the wrong reasons.
Head to the main page of this website and read what I wrote about the VSC meeting with Clive Efford MP.
There we have it.
You are being a bit ignorant. You don't always have to spell it out for people to know exactly who you mean.
Here you go then... If you weren't referring to JR, then who were you referring to? And if you were referring to someone else, why would you use a quote from JR to make your point?
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
So you think everybody who tries to take over a football club without having millions in liquid assets to do so is an 'egotistical indivudal'?
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
So you think everybody who tries to take over a football club without having millions in liquid assets to do so is an 'egotistical indivudal'?
Quite a few are. Cellino for example.
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
Sorry SM but it looks more like a "Im desperate to points finger's at individuals but I say Im not and will not name names because I've been warned I will face legal action and will have to prove claims I make about them" :unsure:
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Such a boring discussion developing, drop it ffs :cool:
For JR to have failed at the first hurdle like this shows very little nouse. To claim confidence and enthusiasm trumps that kind of mistaken sense of reality is equally native. So many businesses fail when the bubble bursts
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
Sorry SM but it looks more like a "Im desperate to points finger's at individuals but I say Im not and will not name names because I've been warned I will face legal action and will have to prove claims I make about them" :unsure:
That's not a coincidence, many of Martin's posts are sly digs.
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
So you think everybody who tries to take over a football club without having millions in liquid assets to do so is an 'egotistical indivudal'?
Quite a few are. Cellino for example.
Ah but he DOES have the cash reportedly but will he spend much of it or watch the Weeds be demoted ?
What is his aim at Bellend ?
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
Sorry SM but it looks more like a "Im desperate to points finger's at individuals but I say Im not and will not name names because I've been warned I will face legal action and will have to prove claims I make about them" :unsure:
That's not a coincidence, many of Martin's posts are sly digs.
As are yours Gaz this is a forum. A talking shop, where folk can air their views.
Martin also has that right as an individual..,...hasn't he ?
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
Sorry SM but it looks more like a "Im desperate to points finger's at individuals but I say Im not and will not name names because I've been warned I will face legal action and will have to prove claims I make about them" :unsure:
That's not a coincidence, many of Martin's posts are sly digs.
As are yours Gaz this is a forum. A talking shop, where folk can air their views.
Martin also has that right as an individual..,...hasn't he ?
Course he does, everyone does. It's the way he does it though that grates on me.
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
So you think everybody who tries to take over a football club without having millions in liquid assets to do so is an 'egotistical indivudal'?
Quite a few are. Cellino for example.
Ah but he DOES have the cash reportedly but will he spend much of it or watch the Weeds be demoted ?
What is his aim at Bellend ?
Haven't a clue to be honest, was just giving one example of an egotistical personality in charge of an English club. :laugh:
Tan is probably the best example actually.
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The guy at hull, and the previous owner at man city also come into that category and the guy that tried to be involved with brum a few years back would I imagine fulfill the criteria!
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It's general statement based on the governance issues within football. Simple.
Sorry SM but it looks more like a "Im desperate to points finger's at individuals but I say Im not and will not name names because I've been warned I will face legal action and will have to prove claims I make about them" :unsure:
That's not a coincidence, many of Martin's posts are sly digs.
As are yours Gaz this is a forum. A talking shop, where folk can air their views.
Martin also has that right as an individual..,...hasn't he ?
Course he does, everyone does. It's the way he does it though that grates on me.
Strangely enough Gaz I don't like the way that you write either, but I don't do personal insults, unlike something you wrote earlier;
Martin is a prick. He is a massive reason people are against the VSC.
Ring any bells?
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That's just my opinion. Everyone's entitled to an opinion.
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I never thought I'd see the day when the vsc - or maybe just one of them with his nose out of joint and an axe to grind because he can't sit with the big boys at the club any more - takes great satisfaction at the demise of John Ryan. It's a sad, sad day indeed.
Love how you did the whole "Rich (sic)" thing. He might not have five million pounds in cash sitting in his bank account but if you think he's not rich then maybe you own more than two bentleys and a huge house in Cheshire - in addition to businesses and investments?
Like I said, a sad, sad day for drfc. This isn't about money or any "fit and proper" tests, this whole reaction from the vsc is about gleefully enjoying paying someone back for excluding them. I find that really childish in the scheme of things.
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I don't think its a case of not having the money, surely between them they have. 5 million to fund the "Business Plan", shouldn't have troubled the two.
The problem seemed to be they simply couldn't provide evidence of this "Liquid funding", which came as no surprise to me . Lets face it, majority of JR and LT wealth will be in investment accounts, not current or saving accounts.
Assuming both had a couple of "Current" and a couple of "Saving" accounts, I doubt more than 140K is in the accounts, as legislation only "Guarantees" 35K "Refund" if bank goes "Tits UP" ala Northern Rock, so both would be a little foolish to have millions in these type of accounts.
I'd be very surprised if JR has any money in UK high street banks. More likely offshored somewhere that is tax favourable.
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That's just my opinion. Everyone's entitled to an opinion.
Sure, but it doesn't mean you're entitled to air it wherever you like in whatever tone or language you want to.
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I think jr is an egotistical person who puts his image above all else. I have stated it before and stand by it.
Thing is I have never courted a seat at the top table or fear losing one so why do I think along the same lines as SM?
I'll tell you why - because in my opinion he has demonstrated the traits of an egotistical self absorbed individual.
There's nothing to be gained by raking up all of the facts again so why don't we accept that some of us have not bought the JR is god stance and instead of stirring up more division unite behind what we have left.
I'm looking forward to the season more now than I was a week ago.
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Like I said, a sad, sad day for drfc. This isn't about money or any "fit and proper" tests, this whole reaction from the vsc is about gleefully enjoying paying someone back for excluding them. I find that really childish in the scheme of things.
Your entitled to your opinion based on what you have been told but the opposite is nearer the truth. JR chose to make it personal not S_M.
After the last 12 months or more I can understand why Martin feels he's entitled to make strong comments. I wouldn't have liked to be threatened in the way he was in a childish act of retribution for something Martin wasn't even responsible for.
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I never thought I'd see the day when the vsc - or maybe just one of them with his nose out of joint and an axe to grind because he can't sit with the big boys at the club any more - takes great satisfaction at the demise of John Ryan. It's a sad, sad day indeed.
Love how you did the whole "Rich (sic)" thing. He might not have five million pounds in cash sitting in his bank account but if you think he's not rich then maybe you own more than two bentleys and a huge house in Cheshire - in addition to businesses and investments?
Like I said, a sad, sad day for drfc. This isn't about money or any "fit and proper" tests, this whole reaction from the vsc is about gleefully enjoying paying someone back for excluding them. I find that really childish in the scheme of things.
:that:
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Sense of humour on hold boys? Personally, I found that (sic) a sharp witticism given what happened yesterday. This place used to have that sort of sense of humour as a requirement for signing on.
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Craigyboy/Tokyo etc,
It's nothing to do with having my nose 'out of joint' or not sitting with the big boys. If you had done a modicum of research you may have realised what my aims and objectives have been for the last 15 years, but you choose not too. That's OK.
But all the people involved in the supporters movements have been working for some time to have the FA, PL and FL tighten up their rules to ensure that clubs are not at the mercy of owners who have alternative motives or objectives that don't suit the supporters of those clubs. There's far too many examples to list, but the pretty common ones are Ken Bates, John Batchelor, Vincent Tan, Dave Allen, Milan Mandaric, and our very own Ken Richardson etc etc.
So when I said it was a good day for football that's exactly what I meant. It's not a black day, in the supporters movements it's a bloody good one. It means yet again that a football club is not being used as a toy for someone's amusement; it means a community still has a football club to be proud of.
It's not about me, it's about doing what's best for the club. It's certainly not about paying anyone back, anybody who thinks that couldn't possibly understand how I think and what I do. I think you guys need to grow up and accept that this is a good day for football.
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The guy at hull, and the previous owner at man city also come into that category and the guy that tried to be involved with brum a few years back would I imagine fulfill the criteria!
I'd agree with that list of people fulfilling that criteria
Not JR though, I think his dreams for a successful rovers have lead him to be misguided at times
The fact that he has tried defending himself in public to those who disagree with his thoughts does not make him egotistical though hence why SM's sly dig at him (although he will never admit this) to me was uncalled for a lack any form of class
I know one thing which is that we all just need to move on now and hope TB & DW are able to give PD a budget to help him challenge at the top of the league. I have my doubts based on the sustainable strategy & but I hope I'm wrong and hope to have a season where we win far more games than loose
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Ok, so your opinion is that JR isn't egotistical whilst SM's opinion is that he is. Glad we got to the bottom of that.
Like you say, it's time to move on.
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Ok, so your opinion is that JR isn't egotistical whilst SM's opinion is that he is. Glad we got to the bottom of that.
Like you say, it's time to move on.
Yup .................................not quite sure why you needed to clarify that, admittedly my grammer/spelling was not great but I blame my phone for that.
It is time to move on I agree because the whole zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzz...........................................:-)
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Why is it, do you think, that the Tomlinson tweet that he has been misled has had hardly a mention on here? Is Tommo making it up? Or was he misled? If he was, by whom? Hmmm. Who would have a reason to do that then?
Today is a good day for footer in this country. You may believe it to be a bad day for DRFC, but for footy generally, the action of the FL, FA, whoever, signals quite a major turning point. We should all, everyone across the land, be grateful for it too.
BobG
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I'm not quite sure what to think,on 1 hand if jr does not have the money/assets to run the club then the right descion has been made,if he has the money/assets and the fl have made a bad descion then it's not a good day for football,it will be interesting the next guy who is dodgy at best comes to by a bigger club than ours if the fl veto them
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Ok, so your opinion is that JR isn't egotistical whilst SM's opinion is that he is. Glad we got to the bottom of that.
Like you say, it's time to move on.
Yup .................................not quite sure why you needed to clarify that, admittedly my grammer/spelling was not great but I blame my phone for that.
It is time to move on I agree because the whole zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzz...........................................:-)
My point is that it doesnt really mater one way or the other - the club goes on. I've always said football club owners dont really own the club. They are merely the lucky custodians, transiently steering it forward on behalf of the true owners, the fans.
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Given what has happened to us I've just had a thought that it will be interesting to see what happens in the owls takeover
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Like I said, a sad, sad day for drfc. This isn't about money or any "fit and proper" tests, this whole reaction from the vsc is about gleefully enjoying paying someone back for excluding them. I find that really childish in the scheme of things.
Your entitled to your opinion based on what you have been told but the opposite is nearer the truth. JR chose to make it personal not S_M.
After the last 12 months or more I can understand why Martin feels he's entitled to make strong comments. I wouldn't have liked to be threatened in the way he was in a childish act of retribution for something Martin wasn't even responsible for.
What you talking about DBR?I thought Martin was warned about legal action for things he posted about certain people,you and other VSC members prefer to use the term threatened,thats your choice,but in a childish act of retribution for something was not responsible for?Is there more to this that the rest do not know about?
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Sick to death of the lets have a pop at JR comments such as the ego one above on this forum. What has happened has happened move on. Support TB and keep going to games and cheering the teams on. We need to be united and stop having needless digs at others who also love the club RTID.
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My sentiments entirely, Dave. What has gone has gone.
Even though a number of people saw the VSC as fair game over the past 18 months for doing what the Trust was set up to do and ask the questions no need else was prepared to do, the recriminations have to end and as supporters we need to return to our core purpose.
There will be a team formulated over the next three to seven weeks to carry our standard into a 9 month battle. If we expend half the energy on supporting them that we've all done over the past 18 month then they have every chance of success.
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What I find worrying is that Kevin Phelan/Sequentia were part of the backers waiting in the wings apparently on this latest TO.
Seems to me like they failed last year, they went away, got their heads together and came up with another plan to have a local celeb, LT, as the face of the campaign, to get SC in through the back door if you like?
For whatever reason, the backers apparently pulled the rug from under JR and the money wasn't there, which would explain the lack of a business plan and LT tweeting he was misled?
Maybe LT was told that JR was putting the money up, although really it was coming from SC. Maybe it was Phelan who couldn't raise the funds and so pulled the rug out from under JR?
All conjecture of course but it would make sense of the farce.
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What I find worrying is that Kevin Phelan/Sequentia were part of the backers waiting in the wings apparently on this latest TO.
Seems to me like they failed last year, they went away, got their heads together and came up with another plan to have a local celeb, LT, as the face of the campaign, to get SC in through the back door if you like?
For whatever reason, the backers apparently pulled the rug from under JR and the money wasn't there, which would explain the lack of a business plan and LT tweeting he was misled?
Maybe LT was told that JR was putting the money up, although really it was coming from SC. Maybe it was Phelan who couldn't raise the funds and so pulled the rug out from under JR?
All conjecture of course but it would make sense of the farce.
Can I ask do you know this as fact? Or is it more conjecture but from a different poster?
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What I find worrying is that Kevin Phelan/Sequentia were part of the backers waiting in the wings apparently on this latest TO.
Seems to me like they failed last year, they went away, got their heads together and came up with another plan to have a local celeb, LT, as the face of the campaign, to get SC in through the back door if you like?
For whatever reason, the backers apparently pulled the rug from under JR and the money wasn't there, which would explain the lack of a business plan and LT tweeting he was misled?
Maybe LT was told that JR was putting the money up, although really it was coming from SC. Maybe it was Phelan who couldn't raise the funds and so pulled the rug out from under JR?
All conjecture of course but it would make sense of the farce.
Can I ask do you know this as fact? Or is it more conjecture but from a different poster?
I think the giveaway is the bit where he says
All conjecture of course
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What I find worrying is that Kevin Phelan/Sequentia were part of the backers waiting in the wings apparently on this latest TO.
Seems to me like they failed last year, they went away, got their heads together and came up with another plan to have a local celeb, LT, as the face of the campaign, to get SC in through the back door if you like?
For whatever reason, the backers apparently pulled the rug from under JR and the money wasn't there, which would explain the lack of a business plan and LT tweeting he was misled?
Maybe LT was told that JR was putting the money up, although really it was coming from SC. Maybe it was Phelan who couldn't raise the funds and so pulled the rug out from under JR?
All conjecture of course but it would make sense of the farce.
Can I ask do you know this as fact? Or is it more conjecture but from a different poster?
I think the giveaway is the bit where he says
All conjecture of course
Fair point
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Like I said, a sad, sad day for drfc. This isn't about money or any "fit and proper" tests, this whole reaction from the vsc is about gleefully enjoying paying someone back for excluding them. I find that really childish in the scheme of things.
Your entitled to your opinion based on what you have been told but the opposite is nearer the truth. JR chose to make it personal not S_M.
After the last 12 months or more I can understand why Martin feels he's entitled to make strong comments. I wouldn't have liked to be threatened in the way he was in a childish act of retribution for something Martin wasn't even responsible for.
What you talking about DBR?I thought Martin was warned about legal action for things he posted about certain people,you and other VSC members prefer to use the term threatened,thats your choice,but in a childish act of retribution for something was not responsible for?Is there more to this that the rest do not know about?
There's a lot more that people don't know about. However what DBR states is true, I wasn't threatened for something I wrote. I've also said on a few occasions that one of these days the truth will come out.
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Why hasn't it already come out Martin? SC are long gone surely... or are they?
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Well it's been confirmed from several people that SC/Phelan were behind JR, so go figure... Just trying to join the dots up, in a conjectural way...
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Long gone Gaz? Hmmm.
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Long gone Gaz? Hmmm.
Says quite a lot that SM
in fact helluva lot
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So it was John Ryan issuing the legal threats?
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I doubt Sequentia's solicitor is based in Wakefield.... Ahem.
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It's why I am so God almighty grateful to the FL. And I never, ever thought I'd hear myself ever say that again! They may have saved our bacon for once.
BobG