Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: jmt23 on September 06, 2025, 06:51:10 pm
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I thought it was pretty poor today given our form and who we were playing. Around 8000 home fans.
I’ve been a supporter just short of 40 years so I suppose it’s good considering what we were getting at Belle Vue during the 80’s and 90’s, I just expected at least 10000 today.
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I can’t make every game or my son and his friend. We are all season ticket holders. There are probably plenty more like us.
Don’t get the worry or concern about home support. We are massively up from only a few season ago.
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I thought it was pretty poor today given our form and who we were playing. Around 8000 home fans.
I’ve been a supporter just short of 40 years so I suppose it’s good considering what we were getting at Belle Vue during the 80’s and 90’s, I just expected at least 10000 today.
you expeced 10k homes fans plus 3k away = 13,000? Your exectations are way off jmt. But attedances are up.
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One thing I will say, for any neutral attendee today, if that doesn’t bring you back nothing will
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One thing I will say, for any neutral attendee today, if that doesn’t bring you back nothing will
Isn’t many neutrals that go. Most are Donny fans that can’t commit to going every week
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There was a Sheff Wed supporter sat not far from me today. It was his first visit time at a Rovers match and he loved it. Absolutely loved the style of play. Sounded like he will be coming to more of our matches.
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McCann has mentioned the empty seats.
I hope it isn’t starting to bother him.
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I couldn’t make it today, I have an ongoing spinal problem so I’m sure there will be other games I won’t make because of it. I’m sure there are others out there who have issues wether it be work or family too.
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I know we’ve done this to death, but surely we could do complimentary tickets for schools, get them hooked while they’re young and all that ! Seems a no brainer to me!
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I can’t make every game or my son and his friend. We are all season ticket holders. There are probably plenty more like us.
Don’t get the worry or concern about home support. We are massively up from only a few season ago.
As a season ticket holder you are counted as being at the game so your absence doesn’t take away from the attendance.
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More and more good performances and being near the top of the table will bring the fans in.
It's been a big month of home games people saving and picking going to spurs over Bradford. Others saving for Leger next week. As the weeks go on the stands will get busier hopefully soon get to selling out more and more sections of the home ends
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Forget the stats , we mastered the art of picking up the 2nd ball today , especially in dangerous areas. We were hungrier and more committed in vital areas and clinical when we needed to be. That's the type of stuff that wins football matches, Huddersfield away our best performance of the season is a typical example.
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Prior to today’s game
Average Home Attendances
#bwfc 20,378
#CardiffCity 19,661
#BCAFC 19,638
#htafc 17,360
#pafc 15,742
#BarnsleyFC 13,802
#ReadingFC 12,973
#LTFC 11,314
#UTMP 10,864
#wafc 9,766
#StockportCounty 9,487
#DRFC 9,410
#WeAreImps 9,061
#rufc 9,042
#pufc 8,950
#AFCW 8,293
#pvfc 8,057
#Stags 7,970
#OneOrient 7,924
#ecfc 6,419
#ShoeArmy 6,254
#Chairboys 5,630
#BAFC 4,687
#StevenageFC 3,533
https://x.com/LeagueOne25/status/1963638686806859829
https://x.com/LeagueOne25/status/1963638665873105318
COYR
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We shouldn't be grumpy, when did we last get crowds of this size? We weren't getting anything like this even in league 1 and probably not under McCann first time round.
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Mid table of attendance is not bad especially with ex premiership teams in the league.
If we can get 9,000 home fans by the end of the season on average think will do great especially when you add in Tuesday night games
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We shouldn't be grumpy, when did we last get crowds of this size?
Last Saturday against Rotherham
COYR
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McCann has mentioned the empty seats.
I hope it isn’t starting to bother him.
Whete has he said this? I've not seen it but heard it mention elsewhere
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He mentioned it in his interview on RS with Adam Oxley after the match
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This is probably my last season as a season ticket holder due to my terminal brain tumour. I have put money into my club. Can’t get to every game. But there in spirit. People need to realise not everyone can get to a game. Wish I could, had to surrender my driving licence. Coming on the train adds 3 hours either way. That just knackers me out.
Let’s not make attendance the issue as many can’t attend for certain reasons
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Seeing a 15% ISH rise on last season. Which is okay, expected I'd say. Got to keep at the kids. I know people who didnt use to care one bit about football at all now attend every week because their kids love it.
As mentioned above get in the schools and some will come.
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I must admit i thought we would have at least the same number of home fans as the Rotherham game. We have played a few games though of late, including the away games at Boro, udders, and Mansfield, and also the trip to Spurs coming up.
Money is tight for a lot of people.
Some of us forget you could stand on popside with loads of room either side of you.
We have come on loads since those days. I still believe we will continue to grow. Free tickets to schools is a must, get them in before they support weeds.
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Club I think could look to a deal with on the day payers for the Saturday Tuesday games. Get your Tuesday game for £15 with your Saturday ticket. They will be the really low crowds back in the 6000s
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All good points and no need to be so defensive on here - I know we're all fans who attend when we can, and that includes me. Also season tickets are included even if you do not attend.
It was an article I read in the Yorkshire Post where Grant is saying we need more bums on seats, again it was mentioned in his post game report. I just thought after our run and the local derby aspect would bring more in.
Spilsby - i am so sorry to hear this and wish you well, and if you can't attend I hope you know someone with the means to watch the games in the comfort of your home.
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Yeah I don't go as much as I'd like. Didn't go today as the guys I go with were either working or away so decided I'd watch it on the box. Considering getting one of those 10 game flexi tickets though.
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.. I would say though I don't think as many people see Bradford as as big a derby as Rotherham or Barnsley, obviously, or even the likes of Lincoln. So maybe that explains a dip. And with it being on sky you can't really blame people
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Grant and the players are doing their bit, terry and gavin are doing their bit.
What can we as fans do to get more bums on seats?
The black bank are doing great things and it's selling out most weeks, can we get the corners filling out more in some way?
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Grant and the players are doing their bit, terry and gavin are doing their bit.
What can we as fans do to get more bums on seats?
The black bank are doing great things and it's selling out most weeks, can we get the corners filling out more in some way?
Sounds like it's time for the Donny Bob challenge everyone brings a friend/family member that hasn't been for a while and lets show them what they are missing
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I don't understand how anyone could see today's match live and think attendance was poor.. the stadium was rocking, great attendance from home and away, what's not to like. Maybe set your expectations a bit better tbh..
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I had a leak at home and had to call an emergency plumber to come out. There will be loads of reasons why, yet the attendances are fine for where we are at remembering we can only fit another 3k ish in the whole ground
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I don't understand how anyone could see today's match live and think attendance was poor.. the stadium was rocking, great attendance from home and away, what's not to like. Maybe set your expectations a bit better tbh..
It's more about Grant wanting/needing more people in the stadium to be able to get to where he/we want to be.
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I'm on nights so that's 2 down, not mentioned but with the games coming thick n fast and away games pushing 30 quid each time...the cost of living issue has not gone away and I'd worse if owt...theres not alot of spare cash about..
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I think Dougie hit the nail on the head, affordability is the key issue, people have to make difficult decisions with their limited income, paying for food and bills versus going to see Rovers. Those able to afford do go. Have a family day game when it’s £5 for adults and £1 for kids.This will bring to the Eco families who can’t afford the regular ticket prices. This is not a criticism of the club’s ticket pricing.
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Average will be up to just shy of 10k after today.
I reckon we will probably average 9.5k if we slip towards midtable. But if we stay as competitive as we have started off, given the number of big away followings still to come, I'd think we could push 11k average.
Compare to previous times we've been in this division since 4 tiers were introduced.
21/22 6.9k
20/21 COVID
19/20 8.2k
18/19 8.1k
17/18 8.2k
15/16 6.6k
14/15 6.9k
12/13 7.2k
07/08 8.0k
06/07 7.7k
05/06 6.1k
04/05 6.9k
87/88 1.9k
86/87 2.4k
85/86 2.8k
84/85 4.1k
82/83 3.5k
81/82 5.2k
70/71 4.5k
69/70 8.6k
66/67 7.9k
58/59 6.7k
So I can't see any way this season won't be the highest attendances we've ever had in Div 3 out of 4.
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It’s still holiday season for some. Either way, it’s not a massive issue as the stadium looks full, except for the east stand towards the away end - we are only talking about adding another 1000 or so. It’s definitely achievable.
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I couldn’t make it today, I have an ongoing spinal problem so I’m sure there will be other games I won’t make because of it. I’m sure there are others out there who have issues wether it be work or family too.
I'm in the same position and haven't been able to watch a match for 2 seasons - I guess I'm going tk bite the bullet shortly and will join the disabled supporters group. Soon I promise
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Looks worse on telly because there’s the big empty parts on the east/west stand near the away end.
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This is historically, a very good time to be supporting Rovers. I suspect we are performing better relatively than we did in 2007/08 when our spending was likely higher compared to other sides in League One, than it is today. Our wage bill must surely be bottom half this season. Doubt it was in 2007/08.
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Why is there always a need to moan about attendance, the attendance generally reflects your league position.
As we climb the league, more people come. We are joint top, and hopefully we can stay in and around the mixer.
That will cement a consistent attendance and stop the grumbling!
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I missed yesterday due attending a friend’s wedding, but my season ticket means I will have been counted (I was there half the time anyway via my Phone).
Well done the lads.
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I don’t think we should be getting too concerned about attendance fluctuations between individual matches. On the whole, spectator numbers are increasing over a period of time, which is great isn’t it.?
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Why is there always a need to moan about attendance, the attendance generally reflects your league position.
As we climb the league, more people come. We are joint top, and hopefully we can stay in and around the mixer.
That will cement a consistent attendance and stop the grumbling!
It’s not moaning. At least it isn’t from me. It’s just a well meant desire to see the club we all support progress. If we want to progress we have to grow our support. We are riding the crest of a wave at the moment and this presents us with a real opportunity to attract new fans.
I actually think it’s looking fairly good and that our fan base is growing slowly but sustainably. We all have a role to play by spreading the word. I like the idea of DonnyBob challenge and other supporter led initiatives to get the numbers up. It’s been shown to work previously.
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Just checked for our next home game vs Wimbledon obviously not a glamorous tie or a derby but south stand has already sold out, and a quick count shows 2,480 seats left, (in open areas)
If we get another win vs Wigan then I can see it being another well attended game from the home side anyway.
Should this be a game we and the rovers target in getting as many home fans in as possible i.e school ticket giveaway etc
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I think the Wimbledon game is indeed a good one to target for an extra push!
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I think the Wimbledon game is indeed a good one to target for an extra push!
And make it flag day or scarf day as a visual for the kids, keep them coming back.
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Rotherham last week Bradford yesterday and Tottenham and bus and transport tickets are on sale it was live on Sky sports plus I believe something had to give and it was the extra support.
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Back to back home games will always impact on attendances, pure economics.
So why are the fixtures scheduled like this?
This, to me, is a question the Club should be contacting the Football League with.
It is a real issue, I appreciate organising fixtures is not easy, however this has become an increasing trend in recent years. It wasn’t like this years ago
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I couldn't make it to the game along with my mate due to financial constraints, So that's another 3 off the Attendance.
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I couldn't make it to the game along with my mate due to financial constraints, So that's another 3 off the Attendance.
He must be a big lad.
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I couldn't make it to the game along with my mate due to financial constraints, So that's another 3 off the Attendance.
He must be a big lad.
Haha the third is either his son, or I take the Mrs. if she's not working.
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We’ve done a sharp handbrake from being really bad. Will take time to build support back up again.
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I still think making the north stand unallocated seating is incorrect. This lowers capacity by 10 percent and the club loses out on revenue of 300 plus more tickets. Look how the centre areas looked so densily packed out in the north yesterday and the outer areas were sparse. Huddersfield has this well organised and made sure everyone sat at there seats....taking advantage selling each seat in turn.
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South Stand.
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A good number of empty seats will have been paid for by Sesason tickets holders who could not attend but who will have been accounted for in the attendance figure. Moreover undoubtedly others who have to travel long distances and are regulars would have opted for live Sky viewing .Finally those of us who live abroad pay a season pass of £ 180 to view and these numbers appear nowhere but I bet they amount to several hundred especially if you were to add the fans on holiday abroad who pay for the match streaming on Rovers Plus .Grant .. don’t fret .. the crowds will grow at least another 1250 this season from the 8150 counted at todays match .
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We're not losing out financially though by not selling out the south stand when there's 3000 empty seats in the whole home end.
To go back to allocated seating would destroy all the good work. Our ground used to be the quietest ground in the country and now one of the better ones
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We're not losing out financially though by not selling out the south stand when there's 3000 empty seats in the whole home end.
To go back to allocated seating would destroy all the good work. Our ground used to be the quietest ground in the country and now one of the better ones
That’s assuming that people would rather not go at all if they can’t sit in the south stand. Or maybe settle for watching it on tv rather than sit in east or west. I’m not saying we should abandon unallocated seating but I do think the club should have another look at how the south stand is working. To see so many empty seats when there is so much demand just seems wrong!
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I do think it’s a shame that we can’t sell the other 10% agreed. But, make the south stand allocated seating and watch the atmosphere nose dive. The only reason there is an atmosphere at all is because a group of like minded people stand together and generate one. Namely the top four or five rows of the south stand who sing and encourage others to sing the entire game. If you allocate people who create the atmosphere all over the place then it dilutes and puts an end to it. People who don’t want or even can’t stand through a match, and I totally understand this as it’s everyone’s right to choose, could end up sat at the back then you get the arguments over that. We can’t afford to lose the atmosphere the south stand generates. The player buzz off of it and respond to it. They have said as much themselves. Have you ever heard the east or west stand start chants or create any real noise. No . Again, whoever pays for a ticket has the right to enjoy a game any way they see fit, I’m all for that. But let’s not turn the south stand the same way.
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Seems overly cautious reducing the capacity by 10%.
5%would be about right.
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Yeah, I wonder where the 10% figure comes from . The police, Rovers?
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Yeah, I wonder where the 10% figure comes from . The police, Rovers?
Safety officer i’d presume. Making the SS reserved seating would make sense to me next season. Singers can locate in the areas they are currently as they are majority season ticket holders anyway.
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I missed yesterday due attending a friend’s wedding, but my season ticket means I will have been counted (I was there half the time anyway via my Phone).
Well done the lads.
I wondered where you were.
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There's too much football ultimately and not enough pennies to go around.
Rovers played 56 games last season and 59 the year before that. They'll be on for somewhere around that mark again.
Merge the two struggling cup competitions (EFL Cup & Trophy) for a start.
As for yesterday in isolation, it was on TV and folk were clinging to the fag end of summer / holidays etc.
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Yeah, I wonder where the 10% figure comes from . The police, Rovers?
Safety officer i’d presume. Making the SS reserved seating would make sense to me next season. Singers can locate in the areas they are currently as they are majority season ticket holders anyway.
The SAG. Council run but consists of all the safety authorities and a club rep.
It was a requirement of the Justice Taylor report, and I’ve met with the Chair on previous occasions and asked for them to implement the other requirements in that report which includes, and specifically mentions a supporter rep.
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It's really not a big issue until there's people locked out the ground and that's going to happen if we get a good cup draw or the last home game if something is riding on it.
One thing the club could do is promote ST holders who can't go to individual games to tell the club so they can resell their tickets. Already at 10% not being sold + those who can't make it.
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I think we do need to look at maximising the number of seats without compromising safety but keeping the benefits of unallocated seating, as well as potentially expanding into the corners.
If we can find a way to be smarter by looking back and assessing, on average how many seats or people remain short of the allowed capacity (I.e less the 10%) with a view to reducing the wasted spots.
As it stands, unless folk let the club know they won't be attending, then the seats can't be resold. I understand this is getting better but maybe more can be done to formalise the process.
Obviously we can't oversubscribe and sell more tickets than the allowed capacity, but once we get some data together, it might be worth challenging SAG to find say another 100 spaces that we can sell.
For example. Say the 10% is about 300 but on average 100 ST holders aren't turning up, then we have 400 empty places. So, if we reduce the buffer by 100, can we then assume we would still meeting the safety and comfort requirement ?
As others have said, and S_M maybe alludes to , can that 10% be reduced to say 7.5% or 5%??
Probably an item for the Shadow Board and SAG to gather evidence and examine.
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I think we do need to look at maximising the number of seats without compromising safety but keeping the benefits of unallocated seating, as well as potentially expanding into the corners.
If we can find a way to be smarter by looking back and assessing, on average how many seats or people remain short of the allowed capacity (I.e less the 10%) with a view to reducing the wasted spots.
As it stands, unless folk let the club know they won't be attending, then the seats can't be resold. I understand this is getting better but maybe more can be done to formalise the process.
Obviously we can't oversubscribe and sell more tickets than the allowed capacity, but once we get some data together, it might be worth challenging SAG to find say another 100 spaces that we can sell.
For example. Say the 10% is about 300 but on average 100 ST holders aren't turning up, then we have 400 empty places. So, if we reduce the buffer by 100, can we then assume we would still meeting the safety and comfort requirement ?
As others have said, and S_M maybe alludes to , can that 10% be reduced to say 7.5% or 5%??
Probably an item for the Shadow Board and SAG to gather evidence and examine.
That’s exactly the sort of thing we need to be looking at.
I’m pretty sure for some it’s south stand or not at all so we need to maximise availability there.
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Thinking about it. Another possibility is to put the away fans in a side area and replicate the south in the north. Perhaps one to hi k about next season? Might be advantages for our players to attack towards home fans both halves.
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I think we do need to look at maximising the number of seats without compromising safety but keeping the benefits of unallocated seating, as well as potentially expanding into the corners.
If we can find a way to be smarter by looking back and assessing, on average how many seats or people remain short of the allowed capacity (I.e less the 10%) with a view to reducing the wasted spots.
As it stands, unless folk let the club know they won't be attending, then the seats can't be resold. I understand this is getting better but maybe more can be done to formalise the process.
Obviously we can't oversubscribe and sell more tickets than the allowed capacity, but once we get some data together, it might be worth challenging SAG to find say another 100 spaces that we can sell.
For example. Say the 10% is about 300 but on average 100 ST holders aren't turning up, then we have 400 empty places. So, if we reduce the buffer by 100, can we then assume we would still meeting the safety and comfort requirement ?
As others have said, and S_M maybe alludes to , can that 10% be reduced to say 7.5% or 5%??
Probably an item for the Shadow Board and SAG to gather evidence and examine.
That’s exactly the sort of thing we need to be looking at.
I’m pretty sure for some it’s south stand or not at all so we need to maximise availability there.
I would think most folk would choose West or East as an alternative but there are those friends, family etc, who we've discussed going to a match, but then find out they can't sit with you, so it becomes a deal breaker. This happened to our group in the West before. The advantage with the South is that isn't a problem.
I'd be shocked if many folk aren't turning up at all if the South Stands sold out, but let us know if you know different.
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Thinking about it. Another possibility is to put the away fans in a side area and replicate the south in the north. Perhaps one to hi k about next season? Might be advantages for our players to attack towards home fans both halves.
Great idea. I wonder what the logistics are to give half the often under populated East Stand to away fans selling block by block from the corner flag along to the middle. Home fans behind each goal would be a smart move.
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I think we do need to look at maximising the number of seats without compromising safety but keeping the benefits of unallocated seating, as well as potentially expanding into the corners.
If we can find a way to be smarter by looking back and assessing, on average how many seats or people remain short of the allowed capacity (I.e less the 10%) with a view to reducing the wasted spots.
As it stands, unless folk let the club know they won't be attending, then the seats can't be resold. I understand this is getting better but maybe more can be done to formalise the process.
Obviously we can't oversubscribe and sell more tickets than the allowed capacity, but once we get some data together, it might be worth challenging SAG to find say another 100 spaces that we can sell.
For example. Say the 10% is about 300 but on average 100 ST holders aren't turning up, then we have 400 empty places. So, if we reduce the buffer by 100, can we then assume we would still meeting the safety and comfort requirement ?
As others have said, and S_M maybe alludes to , can that 10% be reduced to say 7.5% or 5%??
Probably an item for the Shadow Board and SAG to gather evidence and examine.
That’s exactly the sort of thing we need to be looking at.
I’m pretty sure for some it’s south stand or not at all so we need to maximise availability there.
I would think most folk would choose West or East as an alternative but there are those friends, family etc, who we've discussed going to a match, but then find out they can't sit with you, so it becomes a deal breaker. This happened to our group in the West before. The advantage with the South is that isn't a problem.
I'd be shocked if many folk aren't turning up at all if the South Stands sold out, but let us know if you know different.
Choice of stand certainly wouldn’t stop me attending but I’ve no idea if it stops others. I should think a bit of research could answer the question and then it would be information to feed into the sort of review you are suggesting and which I think is a good idea.
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Didn’t really come into play as we didn’t sell out, but the sterile area in the NW corner seemed a bit OTT especially as they shut off entrance from the concourse
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Didn’t really come into play as we didn’t sell out, but the sterile area in the NW corner seemed a bit OTT especially as they shut off entrance from the concourse
Not really. I noticed from the Bradford vlogs there were a number plained clothed Rovers fans who'd positioned themselves as near to the NW corner as poss who were baiting the Bradford fans throughout.
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Those two corners need serious thought ..they look awful on Tv and the empty home seats represent
at least 15 % of stadium potential income.The North stand needs to give full allocation rights to the away fans.It is nonsensical to refuse business .
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I think the stadium should have been built with a stand alone away end, the corners could have been used for office blocks that could have been rented out.
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Those two corners need serious thought ..they look awful on Tv and the empty home seats represent
at least 15 % of stadium potential income.The North stand needs to give full allocation rights to the away fans.It is nonsensical to refuse business .
I agree Brian. Bradford were allowed to bring more fans than they did last season and we beat them more easily!
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I would love to see safe standing barriers in the top 1/3 of the south, S/E and S/W
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I would love to see safe standing barriers in the top 1/3 of the south, S/E and S/W
Make that the top 2/3 of the south and it's corners
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The black bank selling out regularly, and the boxes are sold out.
Wonder in the club have any plans for expansion?
The black bank could be extended into the corners, and im sure a few seats could be put back in in front of the screen, and like I said 10% reduced capacity is a bit too cautious.
As far as the boxes, that's a bit more tricky, not like we can fit some portacabins like at belle Vue :laugh:
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Thinking about it. Another possibility is to put the away fans in a side area and replicate the south in the north. Perhaps one to hi k about next season? Might be advantages for our players to attack towards home fans both halves.
Great idea. I wonder what the logistics are to give half the often under populated East Stand to away fans selling block by block from the corner flag along to the middle. Home fans behind each goal would be a smart move.
Well obviously the the capability is there, as we’ve had away fans in the east stand before and the north can be segregated into two. Doubt the police would like it though if the other half was shared with home fans as the away coaches park outside the north/west corner.
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We’ve sold it that way before, and it does make far better sense all around to have away fans in the East. Also from a TV perspective it would look better.
I wonder if the club could afford to have another lower priced ticket stand like the South?
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We’ve sold it that way before, and it does make far better sense all around to have away fans in the East. Also from a TV perspective it would look better.
I wonder if the club could afford to have another lower priced ticket stand like the South?
Problem is, there’s no evidence of the demand for it.
It’s also a lot of years since this type of configuration was done. They’ve always put away fans in the north west part of the north stand on the rare few occasions it’s been needed.
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Our stadium is flexible so we can accommodate various sizes of sway followings so we shouldn’t be doing anything to compromise that, particularly, as said above, when we don't have the regular demand on capacity yet.
We should of course, be refining what we do have where necessary to optimise the demand for home fans. Whether that be expand to meet the demand for hospitality or the demand for the South Stand, or the family stand for that matter. If we are genuinely growing the fanbase, we need to cater for everyone.
The club are already making some small steps towards that. The advent of the Fan Cave hospitality room for example.
Once again though, going back to basics, the best promoter to bring new or returning fans back, is us. We can reach people alot easier than the club can. The Donnybob challenge principle of bringing a friend etc is the most likely way we get results.
In our old season ticket books, we had vouchers which could be used to get a small discount to incentivise bringing a friend. We also had the scheme when if ST holders could sell to a new ST holder, we'd get a substantial discount off our own ticket price.
Now we know through experience, these schemes could be abused, but the net result was an increase in numbers which was the object of the exercise.
These sort of initiatives can be modernised and refined to provide us with a little bit of something extra to sell when we try to cajole and encourage others to come.
On a positive note, we should remind ourselves and McCann, our average home support is up by @1000 since he was last here in League One.
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We’ve sold it that way before, and it does make far better sense all around to have away fans in the East. Also from a TV perspective it would look better.
I wonder if the club could afford to have another lower priced ticket stand like the South?
Problem is, there’s no evidence of the demand for it.
It’s also a lot of years since this type of configuration was done. They’ve always put away fans in the north west part of the north stand on the rare few occasions it’s been needed.
There wont be demand for it in L1... In the Championship though...
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I don’t really disagree with anything that’s been said and I think it’s a good debate for us all to have. We, as loyal fans and customers have a lot to offer to that debate.
Demand is an interesting issue and it might be worth a bit of market research. Whilst the demand might not be there yet it would be as well for the club to be one step ahead in terms of planning for when it is. I concede that they probably are by the way.
I agree we should look towards evolution rather than revolution as we (hopefully) continue to increase supporter numbers. Also that more supporter led initiatives to get new fans in is very important. Where’s Donnybob at?
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I don’t really disagree with anything that’s been said and I think it’s a good debate for us all to have. We, as loyal fans and customers have a lot to offer to that debate.
Demand is an interesting issue and it might be worth a bit of market research. Whilst the demand might not be there yet it would be as well for the club to be one step ahead in terms of planning for when it is. I concede that they probably are by the way.
I agree we should look towards evolution rather than revolution as we (hopefully) continue to increase supporter numbers. Also that more supporter led initiatives to get new fans in is very important. Where’s Donnybob at?
Exactly. Evolution. Just to add, as we have had nearly 12k home fans in the stadium in recent times, the task isn't that daunting and just by the teams performance alone, we should gain more of those on a more regular basis.
It's a good healthy debate to have to ensure we don't get complacent and keep being proactive.
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If all of the South stand brought an extra, fan where would they sit?
It often sells out now so there is no extra room for fans. Would they be prepared to move to east or west stands to sit with their friends?
There would be a lot of disappointed regular fans unless they have a season ticket.
Would it be possible to start a crowd funder effort to raise money for rail seating/safe standing? I would chip in and if we raised a decent sum the club might match it or expand on the area used.
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If all of the South stand brought an extra, fan where would they sit?
It often sells out now so there is no extra room for fans. Would they be prepared to move to east or west stands to sit with their friends?
There would be a lot of disappointed regular fans unless they have a season ticket.
Would it be possible to start a crowd funder effort to raise money for rail seating/safe standing? I would chip in and if we raised a decent sum the club might match it or expand on the area used.
Well they are some of the questions we raised earlier in the thread. We're not going to gain much if anything from rail seating anyway, except alot of extra cost so we have to look at maximising what we've got. Research is required and the involvement of fans including the Black Bank and shadow board to address these issues.
One of the things we need to establish is how many tickets we are selling in the South compared to how many are going through the turnstiles and actually attending...for every game over a relevant period.
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If all of the South stand brought an extra, fan where would they sit?
It often sells out now so there is no extra room for fans. Would they be prepared to move to east or west stands to sit with their friends?
There would be a lot of disappointed regular fans unless they have a season ticket.
Would it be possible to start a crowd funder effort to raise money for rail seating/safe standing? I would chip in and if we raised a decent sum the club might match it or expand on the area used.
Well they are some of the questions we raised earlier in the thread. We're not going to gain much if anything from rail seating anyway, except alot of extra cost so we have to look at maximising what we've got. Research is required and the involvement of fans including the Black Bank and shadow board to address these issues.
One of the things we need to establish is how many tickets we are selling in the South compared to how many are going through the turnstiles and actually attending...for every game over a relevant period.
Be interesting to see that as from the West Stand there looks to be quite a few empty seats in the South although it’s difficult to judge as people bunch together towards the back of the stand
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Rail seating would increase the capacity would it?
I've also heard the north stand is even further back from the pitch than the south stand. Leave away fans in the crap part.
Shame we can't also bring that stand closer to the pitch. Probably only West Ham that has their first row so far from the pitch in modern stadiums
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Rail seating would increase the capacity would it?
I've also heard the north stand is even further back from the pitch than the south stand. Leave away fans in the crap part.
Shame we can't also bring that stand closer to the pitch. Probably only West Ham that has their first row so far from the pitch in modern stadiums
Rail seating when folded back to enable safe standing does increase the number of fans that can use the same space
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In an ideal world I would like to install rail seating and I'm looking forward to Spurs when we'll get a flavour of it. However, this isn't the answer to growing our attendances. The club having weighed up the cost benefits have already said, it's not on the agenda for now and I can understand that.
Our season ticket sales, just shy of 6000 represent just over a third of capacity. Until we get to a point where we're exceeding ar least half of capacity in ST sales and attendances are constantly getting towards sell outs, there's littl3 point in considering any engineering solutions to alter the fabric of the stadium.
We all know this current bubble could burst at any time.
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I'm pretty sure rail seating doesn't increase capacity as it's still one person per seat or standing space.
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I'm pretty sure rail seating doesn't increase capacity as it's still one person per seat or standing space.
AI Overview
+7
The Many Benefits of Safe Standing | Stadium Seating | Stadia ...
Yes, rail seating can increase stadium capacity by allowing for more fans to stand in the space currently occupied by seats, as the seats can be folded upright to create a standing area with a handrail. The amount of increase varies depending on the specific regulations, the depth of the rows, and the allowed fan-to-seat ratio, but it can lead to significant capacity increases, sometimes up to 60-80% in converted areas.
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The old adage, be careful what you wish for, is in play here for a number of reasons.
We, when we first introduced unreserved seating the South Stand, did so with the help of the Safety Advisory Group and it was with their assistance. Cutting back the number of supporters that could be admitted to the South Stand is the least price the club had to pay. What I mean by that is that the SAG could have been a lot harder on the club than they have been. Allowing the club to ignore the all seater rule is a major benefit to the atmosphere that the SS brings to the stadium. If you push for more people to be admitted then you run the risk of the SAG insisting that the club stick to the legislation. It wouldn’t be the first time!
Personally I think its imperative that you keep the SAG onside and not start requesting a relaxation of the rules. Going back to one spectator per seat would increase attendance in the SS but at the risk of losing everything that you currently have. Its a fact that people standing take up more space than those sat down, which is why you get overspill at the ends of rows, so careful stewarding is a requirement.
Rail seating, safe standing, is expensive and brings no benefits to a club like ours. The club would have to provide the away fans with the same accommodation as the home fans, so rail seating in the South would also mean rail seating in the north and no benefit to the club over the current arrangements. You can increase the attendance in the rail seating areas, but to do that you would have to include an intermediate step on top of the existing steps so that additional supporters could be included, but that hasn't been allowed for under current legislation.
Personally I wouldn’t be letting the Shadow Board anywhere near this, if you do intend to start talking to the SAG about what you would like to see changed in the SS then you need people who understand what the legislation entails and can understand the different arguments for and against. You definitely need to understand the subject matter inside out. When we (The FSF) discussed safe standing with the SGSA, and author of the Green Guide, we had to know as much as they did, we also had to have a major understanding of the different forms and technical requirements of the systems that operated around the World so that we could meet with them regularly and be held to a standard that meant you would be taken seriously.
I'm off topic a little here, but my initial message is the same, be careful what you wish for. Yes, some loosening of the regulations may be possible, but you need the SAG with you on this, not against. And at the end of the day they will be held responsible for anything that may occur. I always remember when we pushed for Safe Standing at Scunthorpe there was an incident where an away supporter had fallen from the seated area over the wall at the exit vomitory and suffered severe head injuries, that killed off that campaign at that stadium!
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I'm pretty sure rail seating doesn't increase capacity as it's still one person per seat or standing space.
AI Overview
+7
The Many Benefits of Safe Standing | Stadium Seating | Stadia ...
Yes, rail seating can increase stadium capacity by allowing for more fans to stand in the space currently occupied by seats, as the seats can be folded upright to create a standing area with a handrail. The amount of increase varies depending on the specific regulations, the depth of the rows, and the allowed fan-to-seat ratio, but it can lead to significant capacity increases, sometimes up to 60-80% in converted areas.
And legislation in this country is still one supporter per rail seat.
I should have mentioned in my post above that standing in seated areas requires a rail to be inserted to stop those standing from falling forwards. This is in play at quite a few stadiums, it again does not have the ability to increase attendance.
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The old adage, be careful what you wish for, is in play here for a number of reasons.
We, when we first introduced unreserved seating the South Stand, did so with the help of the Safety Advisory Group and it was with their assistance. Cutting back the number of supporters that could be admitted to the South Stand is the least price the club had to pay. What I mean by that is that the SAG could have been a lot harder on the club than they have been. Allowing the club to ignore the all seater rule is a major benefit to the atmosphere that the SS brings to the stadium. If you push for more people to be admitted then you run the risk of the SAG insisting that the club stick to the legislation. It wouldn’t be the first time!
Personally I think its imperative that you keep the SAG onside and not start requesting a relaxation of the rules. Going back to one spectator per seat would increase attendance in the SS but at the risk of losing everything that you currently have. Its a fact that people standing take up more space than those sat down, which is why you get overspill at the ends of rows, so careful stewarding is a requirement.
Rail seating, safe standing, is expensive and brings no benefits to a club like ours. The club would have to provide the away fans with the same accommodation as the home fans, so rail seating in the South would also mean rail seating in the north and no benefit to the club over the current arrangements. You can increase the attendance in the rail seating areas, but to do that you would have to include an intermediate step on top of the existing steps so that additional supporters could be included, but that hasn't been allowed for under current legislation.
Personally I wouldn’t be letting the Shadow Board anywhere near this, if you do intend to start talking to the SAG about what you would like to see changed in the SS then you need people who understand what the legislation entails and can understand the different arguments for and against. You definitely need to understand the subject matter inside out. When we (The FSF) discussed safe standing with the SGSA, and author of the Green Guide, we had to know as much as they did, we also had to have a major understanding of the different forms and technical requirements of the systems that operated around the World so that we could meet with them regularly and be held to a standard that meant you would be taken seriously.
I'm off topic a little here, but my initial message is the same, be careful what you wish for. Yes, some loosening of the regulations may be possible, but you need the SAG with you on this, not against. And at the end of the day they will be held responsible for anything that may occur. I always remember when we pushed for Safe Standing at Scunthorpe there was an incident where an away supporter had fallen from the seated area over the wall at the exit vomitory and suffered severe head injuries, that killed off that campaign at that stadium!
Exactly S_M, keeping SAG onside is imperative. As said earlier, before we even think about anything, we need to establish some facts and figures.
1. Is the South stand being sold out, preventing fans attending altogether or are they finding seats elsewhere.
2. Establish on a game on game basis how many seats remain unoccupied v seats sold. I.e how many more than the agreed 10% or whatever it is, remain unaccounted for? If these are very small numbers then the only option is looking at the no shows. Some fans clearly do inform the club if they are unable to attend which allows the club to release their seats, but how many on average aren't? Again, if these are small numbers then we stock to the status quo.
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Big fuss over nothing 250-300 unsold seats in SS. 3000 seats elsewhere. Return to this when there's 12000 home fans coming every week. We can't even get anywhere near for Yorkshire derbies.