Sometimes I despair

[Iberian Red]

If she got violent I would have protected myself by punching her very hard in the face.

Hopefully she would have then learned her lesson and would be nice to her daughter in future.

That sounds horrific. Armed with a tupperware and guitar, the full force of 6 stone behind a punch might have made her feel it.

[IC1967]

Trust me. I'd be up for manslaughter if I connected properly.

[IDM]

Trust me. I'd be up for manslaughter if I connected properly.

So you t**tting this woman, for all her faults, seems more important to you (whether you mean to or not you do give that impression) than the protection of the child?

What are you trying to do, prove how hard you are, or just trying to look like a stupid Kitson?

And yes, I use strong language at you on this occasion, why? because you AGAIN are detracting from the REAL ISSUE of this one particular child and her mother's actions, by going on about how you would act. 

Who the f**k do you think you are? Batman?  Trying to make yourself out as a hero of child protection in some perverted way that by encouraging a fight, with a woman, that some how her following incarceration would help protect the child.

Stop making this all about YOU with all this hypothetical stuff about what you would have done etc.  You have no idea about child protection, so I suggest you leave this well alone and go post on other threads instead.

I really honestly hope you are not like this in real life, and this is just for effect on the forum.

[IC1967]

I'm merely giving advice as to how someone should carry on if they came across a similar situation in future.

[IDM]

I'm merely giving advice as to how someone should carry on if they came across a similar situation in future.

Inappropriate advice too, to encourage violence in an already tense situation.  Such acts would get laughed out of court.  You are advocating vigilante action, which won't help.

Oh, and detracting from the actual issues.

[Donnywolf]

Another good advert for compulsory sterilisation

It made me chuckle !

[RedJ]

You have no idea

Doesn't usually stop him wading into a thread and ruining it by making it all about him.

[jonnydog]

I'm sure IC1967 is really my wife in disguise.

She has a knack of making everything about her, and ruining anything that isn't!!

[IC1967]

Inappropriate advice too, to encourage violence in an already tense situation.  Such acts would get laughed out of court.  You are advocating vigilante action, which won't help.

Oh, and detracting from the actual issues.

Look, it's very simple. That woman is not a fit mother. She needs to be out of that child's life before she does more damage. Reporting her to the Social Services is not going to achieve anything. In these situations you need to use creative thinking. If I 'persuaded' her to attack me I could then get her done for GBH. She would then go to prison and problem sorted.

[IDM]

No it isn't, you WEREN'T there.  The witness to this REAL incident is the only one who can take action, and report it to the social services or police.

Your suggestions of how to react in the same scenario are ludicrous to the extreme.  To try and goad someone into committing GBH is going to help her defence, and may result in her not going to prison, you spanner!  Also you have forgotten you said you would also use extreme violence back to her, so where does that put you?  I would guess in court if not for assault then certainly for affray?

In another thread you claimed to be acting gentlemanly when addressing a female poster, then on here you claim you would hit a woman "very hard", and said "Trust me. I'd be up for manslaughter if I connected properly."  How gentlemanly is that?  You arrogant prick.

Back to the real issue of the OP, who are YOU to judge that this woman is an unfit mother, you weren't there!  She may be unfit, but that is NOT for you nor I to judge.  This may have been a one off isolated (although very disturbing) incident. 

And yes, the social services ARE the correct authorities to deal with this, regardless of your opinion, and would bring the mother to court if necessary, as part of their child protection procedures.

If you think that is wrong and ineffective, then stand for council or parliament and campaign for policy and law changes yourself.  Suggesting vigilante action is not the answer, you must have watched too many films I think.

And one final thought to leave you with - you would goad a woman into assaulting you, and then you would be violent back to her, IN FRONT OF A CHILD!!!!!  How would that help the child?

Jesus H Christ you are a f**king idiot!  I have no problem with you being controversial on here to stimulate debate but this is a real incident with real people we are talking about.

[IC1967]

I was only putting a hypothetical case for the benefit of others if they were involved in a similar situation in future. 'Persuading' her to attack me then gives me grounds for self defence. If I stuck one on her I'd only be guilty of defending myself. No way would I go down for that.  However she would be guilty of launching the attack (which I would make a right meal of) and in all likelihood go to jail.

Social services are a waste of time in Donny. Given this is the case it is incumbent on us all to take the law into our own hands when faced with such a situation.

I know enough of this incident to know that this woman is not a fit mother. I don't think the young girl would be traumatised if I laid her mother out. She'd probably be very glad given the abuse she has obviously had to put up with.

[IDM]

OK enough is enough.  You know f**k all, only what's on this thread.  Persuading her to attack you would go against YOU in her case should it go to court.  How could you argue self defence against an attack you provoked?  You really are a complete fool.

I've pointed out the blatantly obvious to you several times, and if you think that a 9 year old child would be glad to witness first hand violence of any kind, then you are more of a stupid Kitson than I thought.

Are you getting off on this?  You need to take a long hard look at what you write because believe me, it is total bullshit.

[IC1967]

I stand by what I said. Self defence would mean I wouldn't get into trouble. She would not be justified in attacking me just because of what I said to her.

[IDM]

Then you are a f**kwit.  Self defence wouldn't apply where you provoke the violence, or at least her actioons would be mitigated.

So in your scenario, when another bloke appears on the scene who hasn't witnessed the original verbal abuse of the child, sees you assaulting a woman, then comes to her defence by beating seven shades of shite out of you, then by your logic he would be as "innocent" as you.

I have pointed out the flaws in your logic at least 4 times now, and highlighted that this is bad for the child - it isn't about you.

Now it is about time for you to f**k off, I mean, really, just f**k off and spread your bullshit elsewhere.

[jucyberry]

There isn't a child on earth who would enjoy seeing a stranger causing a scene then thumping their mother, even if she is abusive... Children aren't wired that way and if you had any understanding of them you wouldn't even be suggesting it.. She would blame herself for getting her mother thumped.. Even in sexual abuse cases more often than not the child will blame themselves instead of the true criminal, the real monster, the abuser.

The incident is over. Nothing can be done about this little girl because we nothing about her or her family, as a specific case there is nothing to identify either of them. all that could be done as others have said is report what was seen in case they are already in the system.

Sadly child services will be over worked and probably under staffed and the odds are stacked against this woman ever being pulled up.

[IC1967]

Sadly child services will be over worked and probably under staffed and the odds are stacked against this woman ever being pulled up.

Exactly. That's why I would take the law into my own hands. I'm not a one for standing by and letting a cruel mother get away with it.

[redwine]

Trust me. I'd be up for manslaughter if I connected properly.

More likely mans  laughter, you pussy !!

Six stone wet through

[IDM]

Sadly child services will be over worked and probably under staffed and the odds are stacked against this woman ever being pulled up.

I would take the law into my own hands

clueless....

[IC1967]

I'm sorry you feel that you don't have a clue.  Leave it to me. I have all the answers.

[redwine]

I'm sorry you feel that you don't have a clue.  Leave it to me. I have all the answers.

But to the wrong questions.

You really do leave yourself open

[IDM]

You are clueless about child protection.  You knew that's what I meant, so stop trying to twist things.

[IC1967]

I know enough about Donny Social Services to know they would do nothing about this type of incident. You are naive if you think otherwise. 

[IDM]

You may make assumptions about the social services, and you may be right - but that does not justify taking the law into your own hands, especially in the way you suggest.

[IC1967]

Yes it does. If I see a young person in trouble and I know the authorities will do nothing I will not walk away and leave the poor child to take the consequences. It is a sad reflection on our society that most people these days won't get involved.

Just like you they think it's not their problem and the authorities will sort things out. That's where you are completely wrong. It may make you sleep easier in your bed at night but you are derogating your responsibilities to someone else even though deep down inside you know this 'someone else' will do nothing to sort the problem out.

Why do you think this woman behaved as she did? Because she assumed from previous experience that she could get away with it because people like you leave everything to the authorities. She knows the authorities won't do anything and is laughing in your face. Well she wouldn't laugh in my face I can tell you. 

[IDM]

Why do you think this woman behaved as she did? Because she assumed from previous experience that she could get away with it because people like you leave everything to the authorities. She knows the authorities won't do anything and is laughing in your face. Well she wouldn't laugh in my face I can tell you. 

No, you are making all the assumptions here, based on entirely what the OP wrote.  Unless you are working in doncaster social services you cannot predict how they would react, even if they do have a poor reputation.  Anyway, if you don't trust them you report the incident to the police, who you clearly trust.  So if you trust the police as much as you say you do on the other thread, you let them get on with upholding the law, and avoid potentially breaking the law yourself by being a vigilante.

You are a f**king hypocrite.  I say again, you know nothing of child protection.

[IC1967]

I know plenty as I've already demonstrated. Who do you think the police get involved after their initial involvement in an incident like this? I'll tell you. The useless social services. Well not on my watch.

You may sleep easier in your bed thinking you've done all you could, when you really know you have done nothing to help the poor child. I on the other hand would have made a difference. It is such a shame that most people these days are like you and won't stand up and be counted. There is no way this pathetic excuse of a mother would have got away with this behaviour in my parent's day. Unfortunately because people like you won't get involved anymore the bitch thinks it's OK to behave as she does.

Just let her try it again if I'm nearby.

[BillyStubbsTears]

What about in your other parent's day Mick?

[IDM]

I know plenty as I've already demonstrated. Who do you think the police get involved after their initial involvement in an incident like this? I'll tell you. The useless social services. Well not on my watch.

You may sleep easier in your bed thinking you've done all you could, when you really know you have done nothing to help the poor child. I on the other hand would have made a difference. It is such a shame that most people these days are like you and won't stand up and be counted. There is no way this pathetic excuse of a mother would have got away with this behaviour in my parent's day. Unfortunately because people like you won't get involved anymore the bitch thinks it's OK to behave as she does.

Just let her try it again if I'm nearby.

Demonstrated, where? show me, prove it.  All you have done is spout your ill-thought opinions based on what others have written here.

All you have demonstrated is that you are a total clown, you know f**k all about child protection and what the authorities are expected to do.

For what it is worth my partner and I are registered as foster parents and have been for several years, with certified training in child protection, OK maybe not to the levels of fully qualified social workers but enough to know that you are talking out of your arse.

Fair enough you may have a bad opinion of the social services, but you clearly trust the police.  Yet you advocate breaking the law.  I have a mind to report your last post given the threatening tone you show to a person you don't know, for a situation you didn't witness.  Anything you claim actually happened is only hearsay.
 
People like me?  I'd rather be like me with all my failings, because believe me I know I have them, than a complete fool like you.  As I have said several times, I really hope that this idiotic persona is something you only exhibit virtually?

[IC1967]

Credit to you for being foster parents. You are a credit to society.

I'm baffled though. Given that you have a lot of experience of social services, then you should know they are useless. You should know that they would do nothing with an incident like this.

I really am at a loss to understand the way your mind works but take back my 'people like you comment'. You have already done more than 99% of the population to help these poor children that have crap parents and are to be commended.

[BigColSutherland]

Mick, does Caroline ever read this forum? I wonder what she'd think if she did.