What's more important?

[BobG]

Sorry. Thought I'd keep this .

BobG

Gloster.

You can't answer the question of whether you'd have given someone asylum from the gas chambers?

We, as I said are living in different times, the Jewish asylum question was a European problem and I support a European answer to that question. This is an African problem an Asian problem which will only be solved by the African and Asian nations sorting out their own problem.
Let's face it why let anyone into this country of ours, irrespective out their colour, race or creed, the NHS is creaking at its seems and there is not enough money to fun it properly, there are not enough school places to allow children to go to schools they want to and we have a housing shortage.

[IC1967]

Should Europe be solving Africa's problems?

I would argue that, on a human level, we shouldn't just ignore the plights of thousands upon thousands of people. I just believe that we have a responsibility to all the citizens who share the same rock we spin around on. We can and should do better.

However, another way of looking at it is that the reason why Libya is in such a state now is that we cruised in there to topple Gaddafi (*cough* OIL *cough*) and then left the whole country in such a state that many of its inhabitants are trying to flee the country to avoid certain death. So I kind of think that, given that we helped make this mess, we ought to try our best to fix it.

More airy fairy platitudes. Where are the answers to my questions? Gloster is the only one that has made a reasonable stab at it. No one is saying we should ignore the plights of thousands of people (millions more like). We should do better! Tell us what we should be doing then.

No we didn't cause this mess. We had a very small part to play in what happened. The population of Libya wanted him gone. We helped them achieve this goal. It was up to them to sort their own country out. They didn't. So you then heap all the blame on us. You couldn't make it up.

Now I'd be grateful if you lefties would just come clean and admit that you think as many of these people that want to come to our country should be allowed in. You think we should have the Royal Navy patrolling around the clock rescuing millions of people that should then be brought to the UK. You couldn't care less that the country is already full and is already creaking under the weight of EU immigration. To you anyone in the world who wants to come should be welcomed with open arms no matter what the consequences.

I think I've covered what all you lefties really think.  If not please explain where I'm going wrong.

[IC1967]

Can you hear it? Hear what I hear you say? The deafening silence from the nice lefties.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Nige hasn't been silent: he said he'd welcome them. I didn't have him down as such a card-carrying leftie.

[IC1967]

Nige hasn't been silent: he said he'd welcome them. I didn't have him down as such a card-carrying leftie.

Who is 'them'? No way has Nige said he would welcome them all.

Look. Stop prevaricating and answer my questions. We all know you're a 'nice' person. Now back up this 'niceness' with some proper answers will you?

[Glyn_Wigley]

They should be put into the proper asylum process of whichever country rescues them. If that's us, fine.

[IC1967]

They should be put into the proper asylum process of whichever country rescues them. If that's us, fine.

That's not very fair on Italy and Greece is it? I think you'll find that most people that land in Italy and Greece don't want to stay there. A lot of them quite like the idea of coming to the UK. Italy and Greece seem quite keen on helping them with that objective. What say you to that?

[wilts rover]

If refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave earlier. 'We' that is the richer nations of the UN sort the problem out at source. If we don't, then there will always be a refugee/migrant problem. If only you was clever like wot I is.

[IC1967]

If refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave earlier. 'We' that is the richer nations of the UN sort the problem out at source. If we don't, then there will always be a refugee/migrant problem. If only you was clever like wot I is.

Not good enough. Totally airy fairy and shows you are not living in the real world.

It's a good job I've got the solution.

We should fly over the affected countries and drop leaflets stating that anyone that attempts to leave their own country will not be allowed into the EU. We should gain access to any media that is still working and put out the same message. Once we are sure that everyone knows that they will not be allowed into the EU we put up the shutters.

We make it plain that any ships that still try and make the journey will be sunk. Now I know this may seem a tad harsh but it is the only way to make sure they get the message. It would only take a few sunk ships for the flood of immigrants to stop.

Now, I expect howls of outrage from all you 'nice' lefties. How can you possibly countenance such a thing? It's because I have done a cost benefit calculation. I have calculated that by being firm there will be less loss of life than there would otherwise be. I would feel very sorry for the 2,000 but would feel very happy at the countless thousands of lives I would save.

For example, let's say we sink 5 ships and the loss of life is 2,000. That seems unbelievably harsh. However when you then realise that this is the total loss of life over the next say 10 years it's only 200 deaths per year. Look at what we've just had in the last week or so. Many hundreds have died. Unless these people get the message then over 10 years there will probably be hundreds of thousands of deaths.

Then there is the serious implications of accommodating millions of refugees to consider.

What's it to be? Wishy washy liberal socialism or hard nosed right minded thinking that sorts the problem out with minimal loss of life. 2,000 deaths or hundreds of thousands of deaths?

These are the sorts of decisions the likes of Winston Churchill had to make. If no one has the stomach for such things then I am quite happy to step forward and implement the plan.

Sorted.

[Glyn_Wigley]

They should be put into the proper asylum process of whichever country rescues them. If that's us, fine.

That's not very fair on Italy and Greece is it? I think you'll find that most people that land in Italy and Greece don't want to stay there. A lot of them quite like the idea of coming to the UK. Italy and Greece seem quite keen on helping them with that objective. What say you to that?

I've given my answer. Your answer to your own question is conspicuous by its absence.

[IC1967]

They should be put into the proper asylum process of whichever country rescues them. If that's us, fine.

That's not very fair on Italy and Greece is it? I think you'll find that most people that land in Italy and Greece don't want to stay there. A lot of them quite like the idea of coming to the UK. Italy and Greece seem quite keen on helping them with that objective. What say you to that?

I've given my answer. Your answer to your own question is conspicuous by its absence.

I beg your pardon. Have you not read my previous post?

Look. Your answer needs fleshing out a bit more. For example do you think the Royal Navy should be patrolling 24/7? What should our level of involvement be?

[Glyn_Wigley]

They should be put into the proper asylum process of whichever country rescues them. If that's us, fine.

That's not very fair on Italy and Greece is it? I think you'll find that most people that land in Italy and Greece don't want to stay there. A lot of them quite like the idea of coming to the UK. Italy and Greece seem quite keen on helping them with that objective. What say you to that?

I've given my answer. Your answer to your own question is conspicuous by its absence.

I beg your pardon. Have you not read my previous post?

Look. Your answer needs fleshing out a bit more. For example do you think the Royal Navy should be patrolling 24/7? What should our level of involvement be?

That doesn't answer the question of what you do about those that need rescuing here and now. You know, the question that you've asked the rest of us.

[wilts rover]

Adolph, as you believe it will take 2000 deaths to stop migrants coming across the Mediterranean - how many people died crossing it last year? And how many so far this?

[BobG]

Oh! Wasn't 1,750 so far this year was it Wilts? Plus the 800 or 900 this week of course.

Is that yet another research failure then Mick? Soft sod. I really cannot comprehend anyone being as unintelligent as you Mick. The repeated and boringly repetitively failures can only point to one conclusion: you are irretrievably stupid. You must be. You've bitten several hands that have made well meaning offers to help you. Well, it's your loss - and, for you, it's a big loss too.

BobG

[IC1967]

Adolph, as you believe it will take 2000 deaths to stop migrants coming across the Mediterranean - how many people died crossing it last year? And how many so far this?

You are twisting my words. What a surprise. I'm not saying it will take 2,000 deaths to stop them coming. Can't you read properly? How about you try and put what I say in context.

You totally ignore the excellent first part of my policy. At the moment the immigrants are aware that if they manage to get to Europe they will be taken in. That is why they take the risk to come. Under my policy they would be under no illusion that they wouldn't be taken in. You conveniently ignore this crucial part of the policy.

Before they attempt to come they would know that they wouldn't be able to get in. If they did try then the ultimate sanction would be employed of sinking their boats. It would be nice if they would believe that we were serious but unfortunately I think they would think we were bluffing. A few sunk boats would soon change that illusion.

Unfortunately this would lead to a loss of life. I've estimated 2,000. It may be more, it may be less. However the bigger picture is that they would soon stop trying to come. This would save many more lives than it would cost.

You lefties haven't come up with anything that would discourage them from coming. You lefties are so politically correct that you would rather let hundreds of thousands of people attempt to get to Europe than give a seconds thought to my excellent plan. You would be responsible for many more deaths than me.

However you would feel this was worth it as long as people still thought you were a nice person. How ludicrous is that.

I am the nice person because under my plan there would be many more lives saved than if we carry on with this washy washy liberal socialist way of doing things.

Sometimes you need to be tough to be kind. It's a shame Churchill is still not around. He had to make decisions such as this. I'm sure he would have backed me up.

So it's time for you lefties to get a grip. If you don't like my plan then please explain how you would manage to keep the loss of life lower than I would. If we carry on as we are my figure will be surpassed in weeks. (That's ignoring what's just happened).

[IC1967]

Oh! Wasn't 1,750 so far this year was it Wilts? Plus the 800 or 900 this week of course.

Is that yet another research failure then Mick? Soft sod. I really cannot comprehend anyone being as unintelligent as you Mick. The repeated and boringly repetitively failures can only point to one conclusion: you are irretrievably stupid. You must be. You've bitten several hands that have made well meaning offers to help you. Well, it's your loss - and, for you, it's a big loss too.

BobG

Hahaha! I thought you'd blocked me. If you have and didn't read my excellent plan then I need to offer you some advice. Don't take what Wilts says at face value. He has wilfully misrepresented what I said.

There you go again attacking the man. You really can't help yourself. Look, get over the fact that I'm more intelligent and better looking than you. Stop attacking the man. Discuss the issue at hand. Come up with a plan to sort the problem out.

Why is it always me that has to solve everything? I'd have thought all you lefties combined would have been able to come up with at least one good idea.

IC1967

[Snods Shinpad 2]

How about scrapping trident and ploughing 80 billion into foreign aid, thus making poorer countries more appealing to its citizens.

With an SNP\ Labour coalition, featuring naughty Nicola and cuddly Ed calling the shots, this is a distinct possibility.

Get in.

[IC1967]

How about scrapping trident and ploughing 80 billion into foreign aid, thus making poorer countries more appealing to their citizens.

With an SNP\ Labour coalition, featuring naughty Nicola and cuddly Ed calling the shots, this is a distinct possibility.

Get in.

I'd rather we spent the money on reducing our deficit and national debt. It makes no sense to me at all that we borrow billions to give to other countries. I've nothing against helping out people worse off than ourselves but this should only be when we've got our own house in order.

If I was in a lot of debt I wouldn't dream of borrowing money to give to charity. Why do governments think it's OK?

[Snods Shinpad 2]

We'd just waste the money on over-priced houses and imported plastic Chinese tat, so best give it away to our brothers and sisters in need.

As for repaying the deficit, why bother? It's all just numbers on a fictional balance sheet.

We should splash a bit of cash on foreign aid, bump up unemployment benefits, invest in community arts projects and then default on our bond repayments and just chill for a bit.

You only live once Mick.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

We'd just waste the money on over-priced houses and imported plastic Chinese tat, so best give it away to our brothers and sisters in need.

As for repaying the deficit, why bother? It's all just numbers on a fictional balance sheet.

We should splash a bit of cash on foreign aid, bump up unemployment benefits, invest in community arts projects and then default on our bond repayments and just chill for a bit.

You only live once Mick.

Fictional?  I'm sure the Greeks think it's fictional or the Russians, as did the Germans in the 20th century....

[IC1967]

We'd just waste the money on over-priced houses and imported plastic Chinese tat, so best give it away to our brothers and sisters in need.

As for repaying the deficit, why bother? It's all just numbers on a fictional balance sheet.

We should splash a bit of cash on foreign aid, bump up unemployment benefits, invest in community arts projects and then default on our bond repayments and just chill for a bit.

You only live once Mick.

If you don't already live there may I suggest a move to Scotland. I feel the policies of the SNP are more in keeping with your philosophy. Hang on a minute. I just realised that you may not have to move after all. Wait until after the election and if Labour win the SNP will make them put your policies into operation.

Sorted.

[BobG]

It's just SO relaxing to read these threads yet not see all the shite that, no doubt, our witless friend is pouring out. I see he can't keep his hands off the keyboard again! Lol. Bloke's a w**ker.

BobG

[IC1967]

It's just SO relaxing to read these threads yet not see all the shite that, no doubt, our witless friend is pouring out. I see he can't keep his hands off the keyboard again! Lol. Bloke's a w**ker.

BobG

Hahaha! I know you're still reading. So is silly Billy. You can't keep away.

Thank you for your compliments. Much appreciated.

IC1967

[Snods Shinpad 2]

We'd just waste the money on over-priced houses and imported plastic Chinese tat, so best give it away to our brothers and sisters in need.

As for repaying the deficit, why bother? It's all just numbers on a fictional balance sheet.

We should splash a bit of cash on foreign aid, bump up unemployment benefits, invest in community arts projects and then default on our bond repayments and just chill for a bit.

You only live once Mick.

If you don't already live there may I suggest a move to Scotland. I feel the policies of the SNP are more in keeping with your philosophy. Hang on a minute. I just realised that you may not have to move after all. Wait until after the election and if Labour win the SNP will make them put your policies into operation.

Sorted.

I'm quite happy where I am thanks.

As you so sagely point out Mick we are about to experience a tidal wave of no-nonsense, common sense, hardcore leftie policies.

This is in reaction to the failed extreme right experiment of the past few years and the realisation by the public that Ukip and their ilk appeal only to the uneducated and those with deeply entrenched personal issues.

That we are about to swept away in a joyous tide of hardcore socialist policies is inevitable.

Embrace the change Mick.

Got it? Get it?

Get in.

[IC1967]

We'd just waste the money on over-priced houses and imported plastic Chinese tat, so best give it away to our brothers and sisters in need.

As for repaying the deficit, why bother? It's all just numbers on a fictional balance sheet.

We should splash a bit of cash on foreign aid, bump up unemployment benefits, invest in community arts projects and then default on our bond repayments and just chill for a bit.

You only live once Mick.

If you don't already live there may I suggest a move to Scotland. I feel the policies of the SNP are more in keeping with your philosophy. Hang on a minute. I just realised that you may not have to move after all. Wait until after the election and if Labour win the SNP will make them put your policies into operation.

Sorted.

I'm quite happy where I am thanks.

As you so sagely point out Mick we are about to experience a tidal wave of no-nonsense, common sense, hardcore leftie policies.

This is in reaction to the failed extreme right experiment of the past few years and the realisation by the public that Ukip and their ilk appeal only to the uneducated and those with deeply entrenched personal issues.

That we are about to swept away in a joyous tide of hardcore socialist policies is inevitable.

Embrace the change Mick.

Got it? Get it?

Get in.

I'm with you. I hope you are 'right'. It will ruin the country short term, but in the long term hard core leftie socialism will die a death. I'd give it 2 years before the country comes to it's senses and we then vote in a hard right alternative.

I really don't think you lefties get it. If you do win the election you will (no ifs and buts) have to make a lot of very unpopular cuts. This will destroy your support in the medium to long term. Just look at what's happened in Scotland in such a short space of time. Why do you think I now want Labour and the SNP to rule?

I'm playing a long game. I want to see Labour finished in England like it is in Scotland. The best way to achieve this is to let them rule with the SNP for a couple of years. That should do the job.

Get in.

[BobG]

I'm just loving this! Seeing Mick writing post after post after post after post - yet not having to read a single one of them! It's quite amazing though looking at just how 'You are ignoring this user' lines I'm seeing. He never stops! He can't have a job poor duck. Pergaps this is his only gorm of enjoyment? You'd do better to get out a bit more Mick. Give you a bit of perspective on the world. You clearly need it. In Spades. Redoubled.

Cheers

BobG

BobG

[IC1967]

Nige hasn't been silent: he said he'd welcome them. I didn't have him down as such a card-carrying leftie.

Unlike you lefties and establishment politicians Nige answers the question head on. He doesn't mess about. I'm broadly in agreement with him. He's not quite as tough as me but his idea could be workable.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32409901

What's who will hopefully soon be our future leader got to say. Not a lot. Just like you lefties. Here it is 'Labour leader Ed Miliband has called for the rescue patrol operations to be restarted'. Right. Brilliant. That's really going to sort things out.

[wilts rover]

Eh, Nige has said we can let thousands of migrants into the UK - you say shoot anyone who tries to come! How is that agreeing?

And on your blow 'em out of the water plan, you failed to answer my question. The answer was just short of 4000 deaths last year - so if 4000 people dying didnt put others off trying to escape how many will you need to kill before it does?

[IC1967]

I've come to the conclusion that you are irredeemably stupid. You don't seem able to understand perfectly straightforward statements.

I said I was broadly in agreement with Nige and that he isn't as tough as I would be. What is so hard to understand?

The number of deaths we've already seen is irrelevant that's why I ignored it. You stupidly state that I think if we kill 2000 they'll stop coming. You say I'm wrong because more than this number have already died. Unbelievable crass stupidity.

Stop ignoring the first part of the excellent strategy - the leaflet drop. This would be a game changer. After reading what I'd put in the leaflet I guarantee many of them would be scared to death to try and come.

There will of course be a hardcore that don't think the plan would be implemented. These are the ones that get sunk without trace.

Sorted.

[Lipsy]

After reading what I'd put in the leaflet I guarantee many of them would be scared to death to try and come.

What would it say? "Come over to the UK and I promise to be your best friend"?