Another result of the vote

[BillyStubbsTears]

When you stole up and normalise hatred; when you consistently tell people that it's them bas**rds over there who are doing you down, you let a genie out of a bottle. And it is f**king hard to get it back in.

http://m.cambridge-news.co.uk/reports-of-no-more-polish-vermin-signs-distributed-in-huntingdon/story-29443411-detail/story.html

http://m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/uk_576fcc8fe4b0232d331e23b9?edition=uk&icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk-ttg%7Cdl3%7Csec3_lnk4%26pLid%3D473482

[BobG]

I'm re-reading Niall Ferguson's 'The War of the World'. A profoundly insightful book. One of his early conclusions is that blaming 'others' is more common not only when economic times are hard, but also when feelings of insecurity deepen. Just think of the impact of globalisation on a nations' ability to control anything at all, think of the power of the economic and political elites to feather their own nests. Both of those trends have been growing through most of my life. What we've seen this week, if Ferguson is right, is an inevitable consequence. The big question now is just how far does it go?  Are we going to bring back autarky? Are we going to overturn 200 years of history and destroy the welcome for the unfortunate? Political and international splendid isolation failed 100 years ago. It's not going to succeed now. So the question is what do we do in 20 years time? And how are we, and the rest of the world, going to behave? I think we are witnessing the time of the Little Englander.....

BobG

[BillyStubbsTears]

Bob

He is an excellent historian. It's a shame he moved out of that niche and into being a wider media celebrity who got every post-crash economic prediction wrong, and responded with some really nasty quips and character assassinations against those who point out his mistakes.

[BobG]

Yes. Happily this book was published in 2006 so it retains that essential element of integrity.

Bob

[BillyStubbsTears]

I'm astonished he kept his academic career after what he said about Keynes. Nasty, snide, stupid and factually wrong.

[RedJ]

Populist Kitson, as well.

Was it him that tried peddling that a French socialist whose name escapes me calling a Europe wide general strike would stop the war in 1914?

[Nudga]

Well my business has slumped dramatically these last two months. I'm not sure if it's had anything to do with the approaching referendum but my arse is twitching. July and August have always been quieter for me so I'm hoping  I can keep my head above water until the autumn which is when work usually picks up again.

[IDM]

Is this 'another effect of voting out' type rubbish going to be a daily occurrence?

It doesn't appear that you're accepting the result very well, bless your little cotton socks.

Accepting is one thing - dealing with the consequences is another..  You can understand that can't you?

Those consequences will become clear over the next weeks and months..

[Glyn_Wigley]

Is this 'another effect of voting out' type rubbish going to be a daily occurrence?

It doesn't appear that you're accepting the result very well, bless your little cotton socks.

Accepting is one thing - dealing with the consequences is another..  You can understand that can't you?

Those consequences will become clear over the next weeks and months..

Of course he can't understand, just like he can't understand the difference between accepting the result and disagreeing with the result - otherwise he wouldn't have so studious ignored me asking him whehther he could tell the difference.


PS 'First they came for the Polish migrants, but I wasn't a Polish migrant so I did nothing...'

[redwine]

Rigo. It certainly is not rubbish.

Don't you feel that the vote to leave has , in the eyes of the scum distributing these leaflets, legitimised their views in their eyes . So anything goes.

Because that's the way it seems to me.

I mean how would you feel if we said f off back to Mansfield.

[wilts rover]

Is this 'another effect of voting out' type rubbish going to be a daily occurrence?

It doesn't appear that you're accepting the result very well, bless your little cotton socks.

In recent months this forum has been full of people agruing with you and you defending yourself by saying you have a perfect right to discuss what you want.

Now you are telling people they cant discuss what they want.

You cant have it boths ways. Make your mind up, is it free speech or controlled? Or should we only discuss what you want?

[Padge_DRFC]

The way you go on and on you'd think the remain camp told the truth and nothing but the truth.

[RedJ]

Bit different from the very core of your argument comprising of outright, deliberate lies. 

[Dagenham Rover]

Bit different from the very core of your argument comprising of outright, deliberate lies. 

and remain was just the same, the whole campaign by both sides was total utter bullsh*t, however Americas and other countrys  threats of no "special status" seem to be disappearing

[wilts rover]

The way you go on and on you'd think the remain camp told the truth and nothing but the truth.

Is that aimed at me? I have consistantly said that both sides conducted a poor campaign and after the result my biggest disappointment is that Remain never at any stage came up with a policy of stating the positive benefits of being in Europe.

Which doesn't detract from the fact that Leave consistently lied and they dont have a plan of what to do now the vote has gone their way. Perhaps you can enlighten us?

[glosterred]

Another result of the Brexit vote, the Labour Party is in turmoil

[Filo]

If Corbyn doesn't go the Labour party is finished

[IDM]

Been listening to 5live after the football tonight.  Labour is falling apart yet the leader remains..

A labour mp leave supporter again admitted the 350mil wouldn't go to the NHS and that the leave campaign argument was exaggerated.  Yet this had been in big letters on the campaign bus - how many folks voted leave because of that?

That's just one example, and I expect there were exaggerations and scare mongering in the remain campaign too..

Either way, the electorate may have been wrongly influenced..

How is that right?

[BobG]

Filo - the Labour Party has been finished for 2 years now.It's not just Corbyn: he's the icing on the cake so to speak. No. It's lost 50 seats in Scotland that not only don't look like coming back but won't even exist before very much longer. And then there's the 20 seats they're going to lose next time around as a result of the Boundary Commission review. Labour's a busted flush. A top quality leader might slow the decline, but Corbyn? He's not a leader at all. The death of Labour started with Mrs Thatcher - why do you think she encouraged people to buy their Council houses? Why did she encourage share ownership? It's continued ever since - the emasculation of labour (small 'l'); the planned death of industry as a source of employment; the growth of small employers and owner employers. Every one of these has attacked the roots of Labour's support. I can't conceive of any circumstance bad enough for the Tories to lose the vast number of English seats they would need to lose for the Labour party to form a government again.

The Tories must be laughing like fury that it was a Labour government that set up the referendum on whether or not to have a Scottish parliament. It may have been the right thing to do, but politically, it was suicide. Now, the Tories can wave goodbye to Scotland losing almost nothing in terms of seats whilst at the same time killing off forever any chance of another Labour government.

BobG

[bpoolrover]

Been listening to 5live after the football tonight.  Labour is falling apart yet the leader remains..

A labour mp leave supporter again admitted the 350mil wouldn't go to the NHS and that the leave campaign argument was exaggerated.  Yet this had been in big letters on the campaign bus - how many folks voted leave because of that?

That's just one example, and I expect there were exaggerations and scare mongering in the remain campaign too..

Either way, the electorate may have been wrongly influenced..

How is that right?everyone is wrongly influenced every time they vote it's nothing different this time

[IDM]

Nothing different this time - correct.

But this time there is no chance to change - in a general election you get another choice a few years later...

[Padge_DRFC]

The way you go on and on you'd think the remain camp told the truth and nothing but the truth.

Is that aimed at me? I have consistantly said that both sides conducted a poor campaign and after the result my biggest disappointment is that Remain never at any stage came up with a policy of stating the positive benefits of being in Europe.

Which doesn't detract from the fact that Leave consistently lied and they dont have a plan of what to do now the vote has gone their way. Perhaps you can enlighten us?

No BST who by July will have be on his 837th post on why it was wrong to vote leave

[Donnywolf]

Filo - the Labour Party has been finished for 2 years now.It's not just Corbyn: he's the icing on the cake so to speak. No. It's lost 50 seats in Scotland that not only don't look like coming back but won't even exist before very much longer. And then there's the 20 seats they're going to lose next time around as a result of the Boundary Commission review. Labour's a busted flush. A top quality leader might slow the decline, but Corbyn? He's not a leader at all. The death of Labour started with Mrs Thatcher - why do you think she encouraged people to buy their Council houses? Why did she encourage share ownership? It's continued ever since - the emasculation of labour (small 'l'); the planned death of industry as a source of employment; the growth of small employers and owner employers. Every one of these has attacked the roots of Labour's support. I can't conceive of any circumstance bad enough for the Tories to lose the vast number of English seats they would need to lose for the Labour party to form a government again.

The Tories must be laughing like fury that it was a Labour government that set up the referendum on whether or not to have a Scottish parliament. It may have been the right thing to do, but politically, it was suicide. Now, the Tories can wave goodbye to Scotland losing almost nothing in terms of seats whilst at the same time killing off forever any chance of another Labour government.

BobG

Finished for all the reasons you say PLUS the corrupt way we vote in General Elections where unlike the Referendum each vote cast was equal !

We can have big, small , metro and rural (all well defined constituencies) but should award each Party a number of seats based on their proportional share of the Vote they got .

The Serfs like me would then truly feel that my vote counted as much as the next man / woman amongst the electorate !

[IDM]

I doubt the petition will have any effect but what's going to be done about the unsubstantiated claims that are now being backtracked?

The £350 million is often used as an example because that campaign bus kind of gives the game away - no one can claim this wasn't an argument the leave campaign didn't make!

[Colemans Left Hook]

Just seen an interview on BBC News with some goon claiming the petition will have an effect and apparently it's not fair 'because my gran voted and she'll be dead in a few years'.

Everyone knew the day of the referendum so if they wanted to stay in and didn't turn up, they've only got themselves to blame.

i'm going to invent a term "ageist racism"

the true meaning of any word can be hijacked today so let's tag the r word on

[Filo]

Just seen an interview on BBC News with some goon claiming the petition will have an effect and apparently it's not fair 'because my gran voted and she'll be dead in a few years'.

Everyone knew the day of the referendum so if they wanted to stay in and didn't turn up, they've only got themselves to blame.

i'm going to invent a term "ageist racism"

the true meaning of any word can be hijacked today so let's tag the r word on

Would that be ageism?

I bet his Gran is pleased to know she's only got a couple of years left

[IDM]

I doubt the petition will have any effect but what's going to be done about the unsubstantiated claims that are now being backtracked?

The £350 million is often used as an example because that campaign bus kind of gives the game away - no one can claim this wasn't an argument the leave campaign didn't make!

Politicians in 'bending the truth' shocker.

That said, I'm sure our NHS will be better off following the vote in any case.

It's not about whether the NHS gets extra money or not - it's more about the backtracking since the referendum, compared to the claims made beforehand - which may have influenced the voting.

That's the issue here..

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, if they can cheat to gain an advantage without the ref seeing it, that's what football politics is all about isn't it?

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, if they can cheat to gain an advantage without the ref seeing it, that's what football politics is all about isn't it?

Precisely.

It's all about results.

I hope Parliament ignore the Referendum then. That'd be a result.

[Colemans Left Hook]

Yeah, if they can cheat to gain an advantage without the ref seeing it, that's what football politics is all about isn't it?

nice little league table here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index