Sent home

[Filo]

Silent Iv thrown the paper work away but they took my name and address etc and gave me a disorder clearence out of town

Surely there are people you are with that still have the paperwork to follow this up

[anton123]

There will be loads with the paper work as there is about 100 given them not all from same group

[DonnyOsmond]

So there was no trouble which led to this?

[silent majority]

Silent Iv thrown the paper work away but they took my name and address etc and gave me a disorder clearence out of town

Can you get somebody else with the paperwork? Make sure everybody holds on to what they have, individual assesments have to be carried out
 They can't treat everybody the same as one group.

[Filo]

Failure to comply with the direction to leave is a criminal offence.  Failure to surrender items is also a criminal offence.

The Court of Appeal in Carter v CPS [2009] EWHC 2197 (Admin) considered the conduct of proceedings involving the breach of directions given under a dispersal order.  The effect of the judgment is that all relevant documents should be made available to the court at the first hearing to enable it to ascertain whether the authorisation was admitted by the defence.

At the first hearing, the court will ask whether or not the validity of the authorisation is admitted.  If it is not admitted, the case should be put back for a short time on the same day to enable the defendant to consider the relevant documents.  If the defence seeks to challenge the authorisation, the question will arise whether the validity of the authorisation is a matter to be determined by the magistrates or by challenge to the High Court.  The Divisional Court in Carter v CPS [2009] EWHC 2197 (Admin) did not give guidance on the factors to consider in making this determination.

The Crown must prove all elements of the offence:

The authorisation was in effect and was valid
The officer was in uniform
The direction was given inside the relevant locality
The defendant knew that he was being given a direction under the authorisation
The direction given was lawful
The defendant failed to comply with the direction.
It is essential that a copy of the authorisation and the written notice are submitted to the CPS as part of the initial file provided by the police.  The CPS must have these documents in order to prove the validity as an element of the offence.

In order to prove that the officer acted lawfully, the validity of the authorisation must be proved.  It is suggested that the officer of the rank of inspector or above who gave the authorisation makes a s9 Criminal Justice Act 1967 (CJA) statement at the time he signs the authorisation confirming that he made it, setting out the brief grounds for his decisions and exhibiting the authorisation.  A copy of this statement can be used in all subsequent prosecutions.

A police officer seeking to give a direction pursuant to the authorisation and written notice should ensure that the terms of the direction are clear, for example, when the person must leave the area and the manner in which the person must do so (including the route).

The word 'disperse' is not defined in the Act.  The dictionary definition is 'to scatter, to go or drive or send in different directions'.  It is submitted that when an officer tells a group to disperse, this means they should all leave the area.

Sentencing
A person given a direction under s35 who fails without reasonable excuse to comply with it commits an offence and is liable on summary conviction -

(a) To imprisonment for a period not exceeding 3 months, or

(b) To a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.

A person given a direction under s37 who fails without reasonable excuse to comply with it commits an offence.  A person guilty of an offence under s37(3) is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 2 on the standard scale.

[wesisback]

Is there a process if these disorder clearances are false to claim compensation from the Police? If there is I hope every single one of them claims even though it still won't make up for the loss of the day.

[Friendly Miller]

Stinks! Why does it being a free country go out the window when it comes to football fans?

I was once sent home from Scunthorpe train station with 2 of my kids just for being in a train station when other fans started chanting.

[raggytash]

The copper in charge sounds a right t**t.... I think it would be a good idea if syp had the football intelligence officer at meet the owners meetings.... how can you justify a 41 year old and 2 daughters getting a dispersal order?? Absolutely disgusting especially when you think back Rotherham walked around town .....

[normal rules]

The Anti-Social Behaviour Act 2003 gives the police powers in designated areas to disperse groups of two or more where their presence or behaviour has resulted, or is likely to result, in a member of the public being harassed, intimidated, alarmed or distressed. The powers are controversial due to the discretion they accord to police and the infringements of individual's rights they entail.

In theory, then, if they 'disperse' they can go back to the game - bus/train/car.

a dispersal order will usually encompass a town centre and lasts for 24hrs. This would mean going to the game would be a breach of the order and therefore liable to arrest.

[RobTheRover]

I'm with Martin now.

If anyone has the dispersal order notice please keep hold of it. We will put up more info later today. The notices have to be individually served upon you and have a reason why they have been served. It is not acceptable to issue "block" dispersal notices.

To answer the question regarding whether you can refuse to sign one, the answer is no you can't. You have to comply and then deal with it later through a different process.

[Padge_DRFC]

5% of the away end empty. Stand where you wanna.

Not selfish are you Padge. Does’nt matter a jot about anyone else. What a considerate person yo are.
NOT. 

Where’s your - ? Poor from a vsc regular poster.

[Padge_DRFC]

I think the other 70 kicked a few kids in knew they’d get threw out of Rotherham when the real misters arrived and claimed a victory

[Filo]

I'm with Martin now.

If anyone has the dispersal order notice please keep hold of it. We will put up more info later today. The notices have to be individually served upon you and have a reason why they have been served. It is not acceptable to issue "block" dispersal notices.

To answer the question regarding whether you can refuse to sign one, the answer is no you can't. You have to comply and then deal with it later through a different process.

For any on here that use the FB group, it would be useful to post this up there, this is not about VSC v FB group or individual disagreements, it's about infringing the rights of football fans in general

[wesisback]

I've asked Crofty to do it as I'm not in the group anymore.

[Copps is Magic]

Going off the facebook group it seems a good percentage of those dispersed have been successful in selling their tickets.

[bobjimwilly]

its disgusting they can do this. I'm sure there were many innocent fans in that pub at the time who had no intention of causing trouble or even any history of doing so.

[colincramb]

Going off the facebook group it seems a good percentage of those dispersed have been successful in selling their tickets.

Hopefully not to Rotherham fans

[raggytash]

I’d love to hear the reason why Rotherham fans can casually go to donny market areas with no escort or problem but donny youth mob yes I agree 70 plus is stopped straight away and sent back? Donny police are a bunch of fkg jobsworths and are shite at there job.

[Glyn_Wigley]

I’d love to hear the reason why Rotherham fans can casually go to donny market areas with no escort or problem but donny youth mob yes I agree 70 plus is stopped straight away and sent back? Donny police are a bunch of fkg jobsworths and are shite at there job.

I suppose you think that Donny police should have indiscriminately chucked dispersal orders about left, right and centre too in order to have made you think they were doing their job properly then.

[PDX_Rover]

There has to be legal recourse to this for fans with tickets. Appalling.

[raggytash]

Tell me one fan fan who got one then???? Either side???

[The Beast]

Think the problem is Rotherham is such a poxy little place the town centre just can't accommodate big numbers. The police were useless letting Rotherham fans up above us spit on us while hitting my mate with a baton who is registered disabled.

[Padge_DRFC]

South Yorkshire police are terrible at everything

[StocktonRover]

Disgraceful policing today.
All the focus was on the Donny fans with Rotherham fans left to do largely as they like.

Why on earth were all the police on the lower level leaving the ground looking for Donny fans to breathe out of turn while the Rotherham fans above us were not policed and free to hurl abuse and spit at us.

[Chris Black come back]

Going to be very difficult for South Yorkshire Police to take the mantle for Worst Derby Day Policing from reigning heavyweight champions 'Humberside' Police.

[Dn11]

Not just me who was spat on then disgusting

[Jim Dobbin]

The underpant gang.

[silent majority]

To be fair, this is rapidly becoming a SY Police tactic when policing derby games. They did the same thing to large numbers of Scunthorpe fans when we played them at the Keepmoat just prior to Christmas.

On that occasion we couldn't get any Scunthorpe fans to allow us to pursue legal action on their behalf, I'm hoping that there will be some DRFC fans who won't mind being the subject of a legal case. Whilst ever football supporters allow this to happen it will continue.

The cynic in me would suggest that SY Police are using this as an argument to pursue financial gain from SY football clubs.

[Mark Wills]

I got spit on and my elder father was punched and I got a head but on he way to the car !

[Donnywolf]

Disgraceful policing today.
All the focus was on the Donny fans with Rotherham fans left to do largely as they like.

Why on earth were all the police on the lower level leaving the ground looking for Donny fans to breathe out of turn while the Rotherham fans above us were not policed and free to hurl abuse and spit at us.

... and whose bright idea was Parking the Coaches there thus making the road even narrower - and most people having to clamber over a wall  due to being "pushed off the road"