General Election 2019 - 12th December

[SydneyRover]

Exactly

[BillyStubbsTears]

Bpool.

Opinions don't work like that though. If you give them and you can't support them, they are worthless. And folk pointing out that they are worthless aren't bullying. They are providing a social service by stopping shite from getting traction.

[Donnywolf]

Another cynical "gift"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50278634

[SydneyRover]

ayup george give us a hand with the buntin' luv.

[SydneyRover]

Does anyone think this report will see the light of day before election day?

''Dominic Grieve calls for release of report on Russian meddling

Intelligence and security committee chair says dossier has facts ‘germane’ to voters''

Dominic Grieve has called for the publication of a report on Russian meddling in the democratic process to be published before the general election, saying it contains knowledge “germane” to voters.

''Boris Johnson had been expected to approve publication of the 50-page dossier, compiled by the cross-party intelligence and security committee, by Thursday. His failure to do so sparked calls for its release amid speculation that it could potentially be damaging to the government.''

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/02/dominic-grieve-calls-for-release-of-report-on-russian-meddling-in-uk

[BillyStubbsTears]

This.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50294569

An utter, utter disgrace.

This is a genuine affront to democracy.

I wonder if Grieve is tempted to leak it?

[SydneyRover]

I'm beginning to think you may be right for once bp about politicians in high office and their connections to the Kremlin.

''Fresh evidence has also emerged of attempts by the Kremlin to infiltrate the Conservatives by a senior Russian diplomat suspected of espionage, who spent five years in London cultivating leading Tories including Johnson himself.

It can now be revealed that Sergey Nalobin – who once described the future prime minister as “our good friend” – lives in a Moscow apartment block known as the “FSB house” because it houses so many employees from the Kremlin’s main spy agency.''

CONSERVATIVE FRIENDS OF RUSSIA just a selection: Johnson, Cummings, Symonds, Elliot ...

''In 2014, Lubov Chernukhin – the wife of the former Russian deputy finance minister – paid £160,000 to play tennis with Johnson and David Cameron. The match was the star lot at a Conservative summer party auction. Another guest at the 2013 fundraiser was Vasily Shestakov, Vladimir Putin’s judo partner.

Committee members were also briefed on an extraordinary – and for a while an apparently successful – attempt to penetrate Conservative circles by Nalobin, who instigated a pro-Kremlin parliamentary group, the Conservative Friends of Russia.''

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/04/no-10-blocks-russia-eu-referendum-report-until-after-election

ere Marge wot's all this abart a party and ruskies ? nothin innit George jus a tory game where they roll over and have their tummies tickled is all 😊

[BillyStubbsTears]

As ever, bang on the head from Simon Wren-Lewis.

https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/2019/11/libdem-fantasies-about-december-election.html?m=1

tl:dr.

Very simple. If you lean left and you vote LD or Green YOU will be responsible for Johnson having a majority for 5 years. No-one else. YOU.

General Elections are not the time to indulge yourselves. You have to be hard-headed. It was the self-righteous self-indulgence of those on the left who couldn't bring themselves to vote for Brown in 2010 ("because he's a Red Tory and there's no difference between him and Cameron". b*llocks. Self-indulgent b*llocks.) that has given us this car crash of a decade.

Don't be the ones who make that same mistake this time.

[bpoolrover]

Out of interest could labour voters not vote for Lib Dem’s rather than the other way?

[bpoolrover]

Can’t believe how much crap I’m getting on fb from tories and labour I’m not even signed up to anything and there both bombarding me lol

[MachoMadness]

Dominic Cummings and his Vote Leave chums up to their old tricks doctoring footage again:
https://twitter.com/BBCDanielS/status/1191732381306277890

[BillyStubbsTears]

And look at the response of that smug Kitson, Toby Young.

https://twitter.com/toadmeister/status/1191748173800165377

Not. "Yes, you are right. This is very bad and it destroys faith in the honesty and integrity of politics. It should not and must not be allowed and I think whoever authorised this should be sacked".

None of that. Just a suggestion that they are all at it. Without any evidence of that.

t**t. Utter t**t.

[BillyStubbsTears]

This of course, is the same Tory party HQ that faked that BBC website a few weeks ago to give the clear (and lying ) impression that they were putting twice as much new money into schools as they actually were.

The Tories think you are so f**king thick that you can be lied to and you'll just lap it up. I challenge you. Find ANY example of Labour doing something similar in this election. If you can't, do not ever use that "Oh they're all as bad as each other" bone idle phrase. And have some self-respect when you genuinely DO see a political party lying to you through its teeth. 

[wilts rover]

Good news for the Tories in that part of the business community have come out in support of Johnson. Bad news for the rest pf us though as it is the Hedge Funds and currency speculators who reportedly stand to gain billions on a hard Brexit when the pound and remainder of the economy crash:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-11-05/hedge-funds-flock-to-support-johnson-fueled-by-fears-of-corbyn

[bpoolrover]

You could say every election for the last 30 years labour have said vote us as tories want to privatise the nhs, and then gone and done exactly what the tories gave is that a lie or bending the truth

[scawsby steve]

You could say every election for the last 30 years labour have said vote us as tories want to privatise the nhs, and then gone and done exactly what the tories gave is that a lie or bending the truth

Watch it BR, you'll be accused of lazy thinking.

[drfchound]

I thought I had accidentally logged into a Labour Party political broadcast script when I came on here.

[scawsby steve]

This of course, is the same Tory party HQ that faked that BBC website a few weeks ago to give the clear (and lying ) impression that they were putting twice as much new money into schools as they actually were.

The Tories think you are so f**king thick that you can be lied to and you'll just lap it up. I challenge you. Find ANY example of Labour doing something similar in this election. If you can't, do not ever use that "Oh they're all as bad as each other" bone idle phrase. And have some self-respect when you genuinely DO see a political party lying to you through its teeth.

I take it then that you didn't see BB's compilation of Labour MPs peddling the line "We will definitely respect the result of the Referendum"?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Oh I saw it SS. There wasn't a lie in there. We went through it at the time.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hound.

Haven't you heard? There's going to be an election. Don't you think it's a social duty to discuss (robustly) the issues associated with that?

Issues like one Tory minister today effectively telling the Grenfell victims they didn't use common sense? And another Tory minister demonstrably lying about the fact that him shooting his mouth off screwed up a rape trial?

These people are supposed to be the ones we trust to use their judgement to run the country. Not very encouraging is it?

[drfchound]

Sadly I don’t trust any of the lot of them (all parties) to run a piss up in a brewery.
They are all as bad as each other.

[DonnyOsmond]

Sadly I don’t trust any of the lot of them (all parties) to run a piss up in a brewery.
They are all as bad as each other.

Blackpool?

[wilts rover]

Sadly I don’t trust any of the lot of them (all parties) to run a piss up in a brewery.
They are all as bad as each other.

Today - that's just today before the election campaign has officially started;

Boris Johnson has been accused of deliberately misleading ministers and the viewing public by stating 3 policies that were clearly untrue at a cabinet meeting filmed for tv

The leader of the HoC has been forced to apologise to the survivors and families of the victims who burnt to death in Grenfell Tower for insinuating they burnt to death because they didn't use 'common sense' in a live radio phone-in

A senior ERG member was been condemned for attempting to support Mr Rees-Mogg by saying he was cleverer than the people running the fire brigade at Grenfell Tower.

A further cabinet minister has been condemned for endorsing a candidate who deliberately crashed a rape trial

The Tory Party have been banned from releasing an assessment of Labour spending plans by Treasury officials because this was an inapproriate use of taxpayers money

An advert was removed from facebook because it was misleading and the people who put it there forgot to say they were run by a former Johnson advisor

An report into Russian meddling into public elections and the 2016 referendum was blocked from release by Johnson - a move that the head of the commons security committee and two former heads of MI5 said was surprising and the government's ex terrorism watchdog said 'invited suspicion'.

An interview by Keir Starmer on tv was doctored to pretend he did not answer a question that he did answer and then sent out as an advert by the Tory Party

No Tory representative would go on Channel 4 to discuss the appalling rise in the use of foodbanks and its link to benefit changes in the Trussell Trust report released to today.

All these things happened today. If anyone wants to list what the Labour Party or Labour members did today for balance that would be useful.

Then we could see if 'they are all as bad as one another'?

[bpoolrover]

Oh I saw it SS. There wasn't a lie in there. We went through it at the time.

Labour say boris lied about leaving on 31st on that video they all said once in a lifetime vote we will be leaving, if boris is lying so are they, if you agree he didn’t lie then fair enough

[Filo]

Sadly I don’t trust any of the lot of them (all parties) to run a piss up in a brewery.
They are all as bad as each other.

Today - that's just today before the election campaign has officially started;

Boris Johnson has been accused of deliberately misleading ministers and the viewing public by stating 3 policies that were clearly untrue at a cabinet meeting filmed for tv

The leader of the HoC has been forced to apologise to the survivors and families of the victims who burnt to death in Grenfell Tower for insinuating they burnt to death because they didn't use 'common sense' in a live radio phone-in

A senior ERG member was been condemned for attempting to support Mr Rees-Mogg by saying he was cleverer than the people running the fire brigade at Grenfell Tower.

A further cabinet minister has been condemned for endorsing a candidate who deliberately crashed a rape trial

The Tory Party have been banned from releasing an assessment of Labour spending plans by Treasury officials because this was an inapproriate use of taxpayers money

An advert was removed from facebook because it was misleading and the people who put it there forgot to say they were run by a former Johnson advisor

An report into Russian meddling into public elections and the 2016 referendum was blocked from release by Johnson - a move that the head of the commons security committee and two former heads of MI5 said was surprising and the government's ex terrorism watchdog said 'invited suspicion'.

An interview by Keir Starmer on tv was doctored to pretend he did not answer a question that he did answer and then sent out as an advert by the Tory Party

No Tory representative would go on Channel 4 to discuss the appalling rise in the use of foodbanks and its link to benefit changes in the Trussell Trust report released to today.

All these things happened today. If anyone wants to list what the Labour Party or Labour members did today for balance that would be useful.

Then we could see if 'they are all as bad as one another'?

You forgot the Tory Party memo to all candidates instructing them not to sign any pledges to stop the NHS being sold off

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/05/dont-sign-pledges-on-nhs-or-climate-tory-hq-tells-candidates

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wilts.

Goebbels said, something to the effect of, don't lie small. If you're going to lie, go all in and eviscerate the concept of objective truth.

That list you gave there. 30 years ago, you wouldn't have had so many outrageous, outright lies and deceptions in 5 years from a governing party. Now we get that tsunami in one day.

And folk on the other side insist on saying "yeah but..." while the entire concept of objective truth in politics is being eviscerated. And ALL from the Right, on both sides of the Atlantic.

It is truly frightening.

[BillyStubbsTears]

The problem as I see it is that people are (understandably) reluctant to accept that the people they want to win are simply lying to them. So they want to see equal nefariousness on the other side.

But on key points, there is no equality. Yes, no politician or political party is flawless, but on the big points, in recent years, the Left simply has not systematically lied, like the Right has.

What folk are doing here is equating a change of policy in response to changing circumstances (e.g. Labour now supporting Ref2) to simple, outright lying (e.g. Tory Central Office fabricating that BBC web page or this morning's GMB video) or Leave.EU doctoring that video of EU negotiators to make it look as though they were plotting to cheat the UK.

They are simply not comparable. One is re-positioining of policy. The other is deliberately and systematically lying about objective facts.

[bpoolrover]

Sadly I don’t trust any of the lot of them (all parties) to run a piss up in a brewery.
They are all as bad as each other.

Blackpool?that is a lot of people’s opinion of them or do you know different?

[bpoolrover]

https://apple.news/AcHdQUdIwRiyPBgxeMcmKIQ of course that’s not lying it’s making a point lol

[DonnyOsmond]

https://apple.news/AcHdQUdIwRiyPBgxeMcmKIQ of course that’s not lying it’s making a point lol

https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1191632354567172096?s=19

US standards allow for one maggot per 250ml. Obviously you might not get any maggots and hopefully you don't but they do have standards which are lesser than our own.