Manager selection update part 2

[drfchound]

Can’t fault the thoroughness of that at all, I’m sure as usual some will not like the appointment, some will be indifferent and some will be pleased

You don’t say.

For someone who whinges like hell when someone jumps on your posts, you don’t do a bad job yourself, I’ve started to ignore your posts that serve no purpose than to pour petrol on the fire, this post is an exception ofcourse

Of course it is.

Every cloud has a silver lining I suppose.
Maybe now I won’t be wondering what negative responses you will be making whenever I write something that you don’t like.

[Dagenham Rover]

Pretty thorough to say the least, still some will moan saying we should have appointed any old name within 5 minutes of DM sodding off
The appointment of Andy was a natural progression and logical to try and keep the continuity and totally understandable.  For whatever reason (although in this case it appears fairly obvious) it didn't pay off       

[godlike1]

Following further conversations with Gavin, this is how the Manager search now stands.

Since the initial applications, which numbered about 120, were whittled down to about 80, Gavin and David Blunt have met and reduced that even further to approx. 16.

As mentioned before the process will then include a period where the club attempts to get behind the statistics and endeavours to get a better idea of the capabilities of the applicants by speaking to known colleagues and acquaintances, in some ways a very wide group of references that would support an application. That process involved Gavin making over 500 telephone calls to friends, players, managers, associates, owners and even supporters who could give their view on the applicant’s successes so far and how they feel they would be good for this role.

That then enabled DRFC to select 8 applicants that they want to see in an initial interview situation. 3 will be interviewed this Friday, and then a further 5 on Tuesday of next week.

However, before those interviews take place each of the interviewees will receive a pack of information from the club. The pack will contain information about Club Doncaster which will detail the club structure, the resources that will be made available to the successful candidate, information covering the clubs’ objectives (finish in the top 6 for example) and the club philosophy and desire to be constantly competing as well as we can. The idea is to be totally transparent about what will be expected of them once in position, and the interview process will focus on how they see themselves meeting those expectations with the resources that will be made available.

After the initial interview, the board will select 2/3 who will be invited back for a final interview on Thursday. However, the selection process does not get any easier as they will have to undergo Psychometric testing carried out by a company who specialise in this procedure. This of course is designed to identify how the individual reacts to pressure, whether they are resilient, and essentially details their personality once in post. Some slight changes this time around will be to focus on how the individual feels about undertaking projects and the level of their commitment to seeing those projects completed.

After this second round of interviews and the result of the Psychometric testing is known and evaluated, the successful applicant will engage in contract negotiations on Thursday afternoon with a view to being appointed that day. Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed, or compensation payments agreed that suit DRFC better.
I think what we can all see in the above is that the very through process is designed to find someone that suits DRFC, and that the slight changes made to this process reflect our recent experience with managers who view us as an excellent career path.

My thanks to Gavin for all the above detail, and his patience in answering my questions!

Cheers SM interesting and privileged reading please pass supporters thanks onto GB as well.

Despite all of this though, if a bigger club comes calling in desperate need to try and stay up even if run by the mad hatter it seems we can't stop our manager jumping ship, just get more compensation. It's life but at least they have seemingly tried to make it harder to jump ship this time and to get someone committed

[roversdude]

Just my opinion but I feel that the process may not shine people like RW in the best light, assuming he applied and assuming he got far enough to undergo psychometric testing if he did apply.
Exciting times
Thanks for the update SM just goes to show we have a thorough process in place

[Lincoln Rover]

SM thank you as always

[Darren]

A good update, cheers SM.

[Jonathan]

Appreciate the update. The process sounds thorough, those attacking the use of psychometric testing surely have to recognise that’s only one factor. It could split two evenly matched candidates, which is fair enough, it won’t define the whole process. Let’s not pretend we’re appointing based solely on the test output, we’re not.

As for appointing from the left-field and following the process that got us Grant McCann, I’m all for a process that finds a young, dynamic, enthusiastic coach like McCann was irrespective of a past failure. Good young managers will reflect on and learn from that as McCann did.

For the record I’d not class Danny Wilson as left-field. I’d class that as stuck in a different generation. I honestly can’t believe that he’ll have made the shortlist. We’re more forward thinking than that.

[normal rules]

Young, dynamic, enthusiastic. Add smart to that list and a proven ability to develop youth which is just what rovers need.

I give you Des Buckingham.

[dickos1]

I don’t understand the clammer for for Buckingham. I think he’d be a good appointment as a coach but not as our manager.

[GazLaz]

I watch pretty much every game in Australia, Buckingham is at Melbourne City and they have been spectacular at times this season. Their fitness and intensity is second to none out their. I kind of put that down to their head coach, Patrick Kisnorbo, but maybe it’s a lot to do with his right hand man.

One thing I would say is that Mel City are owned by the owner of Man City, if he is highly rated there he may not want to leave that company due to the possibility of progressing on to one of their other more high profile clubs.

I wouldn’t be disappointed if he took over. 

[Metalmicky]

I underwent psychometric testing when I left the military to see what sort of employment i should be looking at in my next employment............. it told me I should consider joining the forces...

The process that the club is going through to appoint our new man (or woman) is extremely thorough and has been successful previously.  I'm glad that they are looking to insert some kind of release clause into the new contract - which may dissuade potential pursuiters; however, if a manager's head is turned, then would there be any point in keeping him on board...? 

I'm hoping for someone who is young and committed.  Not that bothered about a manager of the merry-go-round, so would be happy with someone from left field who can inject some energy into the club.   

[selby]

  We need a manager of the whole club, Moore never left the building at Cantley to watch the U23s/ 18s and was not interested in the academy just went out and got a loan.
  The first thing Butler did was go to an U18s game at Peterborough. Whether him or another we need a leader of the whole club, not just someone who said what he thought you wanted to hear.

[DRNaith]

A fantastic process, psychometric testing, absolutely brilliant....... for a FTSE 100 CEO appointment.FFS. We need a top coach with innovative approach and a philosophy of playing offensive football. I’m guessing any manager/coach currently employed will not have applied if they knew what the interview process is

You obviously haven't been in many interviews these days then as testing is quite normal. The company I work for do it all the time.

As for identifying the type of coach you describe then this process served us well when appointing DF, GMcC and DM so why not now?

had it for my last interview in  local social housing

Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed

What does this mean exactly?

I would imagine it’s to prevent prospective managers from doing a “Moore”. But they too polite and professional to actually say it.

Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed

What does this mean exactly?

I would imagine it’s to prevent prospective managers from doing a “Moore”. But they too polite and professional to actually say it.

It's a very professional way of saying 'we won't stop you doing a Moore , but it'll cost you '

]

You obviously haven't been in many interviews these days then as testing is quite normal. The company I work for do it all the time.

As for identifying the type of coach you describe then this process served us well when appointing DF, GMcC and DM so why not now?




[/quote] had it for my last interview in  local social housing

Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed

What does this mean exactly?

I would imagine it’s to prevent prospective managers from doing a “Moore”. But they too polite and professional to actually say it.

Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed

What does this mean exactly?

I would imagine it’s to prevent prospective managers from doing a “Moore”. But they too polite and professional to actually say it.

It's a very professional way of saying 'we won't stop you doing a Moore , but it'll cost you '
[/quote]

Yeah, I would guess it's something along the lines of "some" of the manager's income being tied to them completing the season and other targets like that.

[roversdude]

Just a quick question
Are they face to face interviews or TEAMS/Zoom

[EasyforDennis]

I know I will be shot down in flames and some will no doubt say I'm mad BUT. I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave the job to AB.
He was handed a poisoned chalice as we were already in a bad run and whilst he hasn't been able to change it he has had to manage with someone else's players.
He knows the players we should be giving contracts to etc etc and he will be in a position to go after new signings from the word go.
It will be then HIS team.

[Filo]

I know I will be shot down in flames and some will no doubt say I'm mad BUT. I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave the job to AB.
He was handed a poisoned chalice as we were already in a bad run and whilst he hasn't been able to change it he has had to manage with someone else's players.
He knows the players we should be giving contracts to etc etc and he will be in a position to go after new signings from the word go.
It will be then HIS team.

You’re mad

[EasyforDennis]

I wondered who would be the first 

[jamesrover17]

The issue with letting AB build his own team... Does he have any contacts in the wider footballing world? Does he have a 'liitle black book' of contacts to call upon, I wouldn't like to think my first full step into management would be a complete squad rebuild

[Filo]

I wondered who would be the first 

I was probably odds on

[DonnyOsmond]

The issue with letting AB build his own team... Does he have any contacts in the wider footballing world? Does he have a 'liitle black book' of contacts to call upon, I wouldn't like to think my first full step into management would be a complete squad rebuild

But we're hiring a Talent Identification person?

[jamesrover17]

The issue with letting AB build his own team... Does he have any contacts in the wider footballing world? Does he have a 'liitle black book' of contacts to call upon, I wouldn't like to think my first full step into management would be a complete squad rebuild

But we're hiring a Talent Identification person?

In which case it wont be his team then? If the talent identification manager brought him a list of 4 or 5 players and asked him to pick two to sign, does he have the experience and the contacts to call in references and stuff?

Seems silly I know but its just something that concerned me

[NickDRFC]

I know I will be shot down in flames and some will no doubt say I'm mad BUT. I wouldn't be unhappy if we gave the job to AB.
He was handed a poisoned chalice as we were already in a bad run and whilst he hasn't been able to change it he has had to manage with someone else's players.
He knows the players we should be giving contracts to etc etc and he will be in a position to go after new signings from the word go.
It will be then HIS team.

I feel sorry for Butler and don’t particularly think he’s deserving of criticism but he hasn’t done anything in 2 months to me to suggest he’s deserving of the role. Maybe his qualities will shine through in an interview but they haven’t on a match day.

[DonnyOsmond]

The issue with letting AB build his own team... Does he have any contacts in the wider footballing world? Does he have a 'liitle black book' of contacts to call upon, I wouldn't like to think my first full step into management would be a complete squad rebuild

But we're hiring a Talent Identification person?

In which case it wont be his team then? If the talent identification manager brought him a list of 4 or 5 players and asked him to pick two to sign, does he have the experience and the contacts to call in references and stuff?

Seems silly I know but its just something that concerned me

Surely the manager and Talent Identification manager work together to work out the type of players that are required, the TI then creates a list, finding out the information as to whether they'll fit in the squad, then the manager signs off on the signing before passing on to people to complete?

Butler's had a lot of managers and coaches anyway so he'd probably have contacts too.

[EasyforDennis]

The issue with letting AB build his own team... Does he have any contacts in the wider footballing world? Does he have a 'liitle black book' of contacts to call upon, I wouldn't like to think my first full step into management would be a complete squad rebuild

Well the previous managers little black book wasn't a lot of use was it?

[SydneyRover]

Following further conversations with Gavin, this is how the Manager search now stands.

Since the initial applications, which numbered about 120, were whittled down to about 80, Gavin and David Blunt have met and reduced that even further to approx. 16.

As mentioned before the process will then include a period where the club attempts to get behind the statistics and endeavours to get a better idea of the capabilities of the applicants by speaking to known colleagues and acquaintances, in some ways a very wide group of references that would support an application. That process involved Gavin making over 500 telephone calls to friends, players, managers, associates, owners and even supporters who could give their view on the applicant’s successes so far and how they feel they would be good for this role.

That then enabled DRFC to select 8 applicants that they want to see in an initial interview situation. 3 will be interviewed this Friday, and then a further 5 on Tuesday of next week.

However, before those interviews take place each of the interviewees will receive a pack of information from the club. The pack will contain information about Club Doncaster which will detail the club structure, the resources that will be made available to the successful candidate, information covering the clubs’ objectives (finish in the top 6 for example) and the club philosophy and desire to be constantly competing as well as we can. The idea is to be totally transparent about what will be expected of them once in position, and the interview process will focus on how they see themselves meeting those expectations with the resources that will be made available.

After the initial interview, the board will select 2/3 who will be invited back for a final interview on Thursday. However, the selection process does not get any easier as they will have to undergo Psychometric testing carried out by a company who specialise in this procedure. This of course is designed to identify how the individual reacts to pressure, whether they are resilient, and essentially details their personality once in post. Some slight changes this time around will be to focus on how the individual feels about undertaking projects and the level of their commitment to seeing those projects completed.

After this second round of interviews and the result of the Psychometric testing is known and evaluated, the successful applicant will engage in contract negotiations on Thursday afternoon with a view to being appointed that day. Part of the contract negotiations will be altered slightly this time by inserting clauses into the contract with specific regard to the projects not being completed as agreed, or compensation payments agreed that suit DRFC better.
I think what we can all see in the above is that the very through process is designed to find someone that suits DRFC, and that the slight changes made to this process reflect our recent experience with managers who view us as an excellent career path.

My thanks to Gavin for all the above detail, and his patience in answering my questions!

Good things those MOUs, thank for the update SM

[selby]

  I think Butler would be the most qualified to judge players at our level of any, he will know who has given him trouble on the field for the last few years, and not all those players will be with the top sides or the names others would come up with, or even Filo.

[5 on Tour]

Have to do Psychometric testing for sales jobs all the time. In large parts it is a complete waste of time unless it is the first one someone has ever done. I knew what the questions were, pretty much, for the second one I did as they were identical to the first.

Hopefully ours has a way of detecting any snakes in the grass for our next appointment. After McTraitor and Darren “I like it here” Moore both ran off to get relegated.

[One_Matty_Lucas]

Have to do Psychometric testing for sales jobs all the time. In large parts it is a complete waste of time unless it is the first one someone has ever done. I knew what the questions were, pretty much, for the second one I did as they were identical to the first.

Hopefully ours has a way of detecting any snakes in the grass for our next appointment. After McTraitor and Darren “I like it here” Moore both ran off to get relegated.

Do you know what the right answer is though ?
They are subjective questions, not factual.

[GazLaz]

Have to do Psychometric testing for sales jobs all the time. In large parts it is a complete waste of time unless it is the first one someone has ever done. I knew what the questions were, pretty much, for the second one I did as they were identical to the first.

Hopefully ours has a way of detecting any snakes in the grass for our next appointment. After McTraitor and Darren “I like it here” Moore both ran off to get relegated.

Do you know what the right answer is though ?
They are subjective questions, not factual.

Exactly this.

[Campsall rover]

Thanks from me also SM.

Really interesting to know what the process is. It is good that supporters are given this information SM
Having you as our informant ( if that’s the right word, supporter liaison is much better i think ) does help to make supporters feel more involved.

Thanks for all your updates SM they are really appreciated.