Starmer descending into worrying authoritarian language

[SydneyRover]

And the bit about everyone would reduce tax if they could, not everyone. In Oz there is of course private health insurance and to incentivise uptake there is a government medicare levy surcharge which is a % of your wage if you don't have private insurance. I am opposed to private health care and have paid this levy rather than buy the cheap junk medical insurance policies designed solely for the purposes of avoiding tax.

the levy is not paid by low income earners and since retirement from full time work I think junk insurance has been banned

[selby]

Do they do free brain surgery Syd?

[albie]

After pissing off women with non disclosure agreements on sexual harassment, Keith has locked horns with his own staff again.

Starmer now on a collision course with trade unions over plans to reduce pension benefits, according to Sienna Rodgers of Labour List:
https://twitter.com/siennamarla/status/1512456428958666756

The fella is a slo-mo car crash.
Best to keep the unions onside, Keith!

[SydneyRover]

Do they do free brain surgery Syd?

did they charge you?

[albie]

Some of the Starmer financial backers are from the motor industry:
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/keir-starmers-donations-car-industry-motoring-revealed-oil-protests/

It does raise the issue of the position taken by Labour against the eco-protests in support of climate action.
Back in the old days this was a source of income for Labour....remember the Bernie Ecclestone affair?

[SydneyRover]

All donations to political parties and MPs should be declared within 7 days.

[drfchound]

Are you suggesting that the donations were not declared within seven days?

[Metalmicky]

Perhaps Starmer has grown a pair......

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61210585

[danumdon]

Lots of contributors on here do plenty of whingeing about right wing Tory factions but Corbyn was running a full on extreme left parasitic faction, hosting on the center left Labour carcass.

If they had got their way at the last election i dred to think where we would be now with regards to dealing with the despot in Russia.

I wonder how Keith would have squared his faux credentials in this instance?

[SydneyRover]

Lots of contributors on here do plenty of whingeing about right wing Tory factions but Corbyn was running a full on extreme left parasitic faction, hosting on the center left Labour carcass.

If they had got their way at the last election i dred to think where we would be now with regards to dealing with the despot in Russia.

I wonder how Keith would have squared his faux credentials in this instance?

You should read the Times story, it tells everyone exactly why we are here in this place right now.

[albie]

Labour have announced a plan to resolve the issue of non-doms;
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2022/apr/25/rachel-reeves-promises-labour-will-close-non-dom-tax-loophole#Echobox=1650862928

Trouble is the plan is simply to reduce the timeline from 15 years to 5 years.
The relevant bit from the Guardian report is here:
"Labour said it would consult widely on how its new “temporary resident tax regime” would work but that any tax advantages would be likely to expire after five years, compared with up to 15 years under the current system".

So basically keep non-dom status but restrict the period it is available.
The Labour manifesto promise was to abolish this form of tax evasion.

No substantive change to the money machine for the wealthy.

[SydneyRover]

Spoiler: McDonnell is not the shadow treasurer, following the worst defeat in living memory.

[albie]

Sorry Syd,

Are you saying keeping non-dom status is a good thing?
It seems a very bad idea indeed to me, I can't see how that fits with any intention to change the laundromat economy!

Do you really think that the super wealthy should have a legitimate route to avoid UK tax liabilities?

[drfchound]

Sorry Syd,

Are you saying keeping non-dom status is a good thing?
It seems a very bad idea indeed to me, I can't see how that fits with any intention to change the laundromat economy!

Do you really think that the super wealthy should have a legitimate route to evade UK tax liabilities?

Point of order albie, tax evasion (you mention it in your earlier post) is illegal and the non dom status doesn’t provide an illegal way to pay reduced tax.
Perhaps you meant tax avoidance which provides legal ways to reduce your tax liabilities.

[albie]

Point taken, Hound.
I have amended the post.

Now, what do you think about the plan to give a 5 year window?

[drfchound]

Point taken, Hound.
I have amended the post.

Now, what do you think about the plan to give a 5 year window?

I think it is fair to say that people who have the UK as their main residence should be required to pay UK taxes.
It isn’t just the super rich though who have been taking advantage of the non dom situation.
I know people who have worked abroad, kept a home in England but banked in tax havens.
It isn’t such a rare thing.
With regards to tax avoidance, there will be plenty of people on this site who are making a noise about the likes of the Sunak situation, who do the same thing (on a much lower scale of course) to pay as little income tax, CGT and unearned income tax as they can.

[SydneyRover]

Sorry Syd,

Are you saying keeping non-dom status is a good thing?
It seems a very bad idea indeed to me, I can't see how that fits with any intention to change the laundromat economy!

Do you really think that the super wealthy should have a legitimate route to avoid UK tax liabilities?

No apology required Albie, have you asked Rachel Reeves what she means by closing the non-dom loophole?

Found it ......

''Previous Labour leaders Ed Miliband and Jeremy Corbyn had vowed to scrap non-dom status altogether.

But Reeves said her proposed programme would be more in line with schemes in Canada, Germany and France. Labour would sort out the details in due course, she said.

“This would be a clear, simple and modern system, ending the 200-year-old rules we currently follow that mean domicile is passed down through people’s fathers,” she said.

The initiative is part of a wider review of tax breaks by Labour that was promised by Reeves at the party conference last autum''

https://www.ft.com/content/f22035ed-f357-45a2-89dd-492649973e30

Maybe it would be easier for you to say what you want from the party you don't vote for, do you want them to be more like the tories or more like the corbyn brand, out of office?

[SydneyRover]

Albie, I may be incorrect about this but if you look at the very recent election in France you can see that Melenchon came in a credible third by all accounts and narrowly missed out getting through to the next round.

''Melenchon has called on his supporters not to vote for Le Pen, repeating the injunction four times in a speech to supporters after the first round. But he has stopped short of advocating Macron and said his La France insoumise (France Unbowed) party would hold a public consultation to help guide those who backed him.

''According to results published on Sunday from about 215,000 people who took part, more than 66% said they would abstain, leave their ballot paper blank or spoil it. Just over 33% said they would vote for Macron. The option of voting for Le Pen was not given to respondents.''

https://www.france24.com/en/france/20220417-leftist-party-consultation-shows-majority-will-abstain-vote-blank-in-macron-le-pen-run-off

This appears to be how to do it, ensure the right don't get in and live to fight another day.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Melenchon was playing a very high risk game in not calling on his supporters to vote for Macron.

I don't like Macron and he wouldn't have been my first choice. But politics is often about dealing with a less than perfect choice, rather than being in the world you'd like to inhabit. Not voting for Macron in a straight run-off between him and LePen ran the risk of allowing a far-right leader to become President. At the very least it gave LePen a higher percentage of the vote, strengthening the far right for the future. I simply do not understand how anyone who purports to be on the Left can do that and then be able to look at themselves in the mirror.

[SydneyRover]

Melenchon was playing a very high risk game in not calling on his supporters to vote for Macron.

I don't like Macron and he wouldn't have been my first choice. But politics is often about dealing with a less than perfect choice, rather than being in the world you'd like to inhabit. Not voting for Macron in a straight run-off between him and LePen ran the risk of allowing a far-right leader to become President. At the very least it gave LePen a higher percentage of the vote, strengthening the far right for the future. I simply do not understand how anyone who purports to be on the Left can do that and then be able to look at themselves in the mirror.

I agree billy but I would think that many of Melenchon's voters wouldn't have taken kindly to be asked to vote for Macron, so yes a great risk but it leaves him in a secure position. I would also think that he had some internal polling done to see what his supporters would do.

[albie]

Point taken, Hound.
I have amended the post.

Now, what do you think about the plan to give a 5 year window?

I think it is fair to say that people who have the UK as their main residence should be required to pay UK taxes.
It isn’t just the super rich though who have been taking advantage of the non dom situation.
I know people who have worked abroad, kept a home in England but banked in tax havens.
It isn’t such a rare thing.
With regards to tax avoidance, there will be plenty of people on this site who are making a noise about the likes of the Sunak situation, who do the same thing (on a much lower scale of course) to pay as little income tax, CGT and unearned income tax as they can.

Hound,

I don't disagree with that, but there is a big difference in scale between the super wealthy sidestepping tax via off shore havens and small scale tax avoidance.

This is an industry of avoidance which limits the ability of states to properly provide help to those who will be on the sharp end of the cost of living crisis.

The problem with Labour simply renaming non-dom and allowing a 5 year window is that it does nothing to prevent the laundromat economy.

All that will happen is that the accountants and lawyers making a good living out of advising will have another business model involving transferring assets on a 5 year cycle.

It is about pretending to act, while doing nothing to prevent the oligarchs continuing business as usual.

This is Reeves signalling to the financially corrupt that their interests are safe under Labour.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I wonder who Hound thinks these "plenty of people" in here are?

[danumdon]

Melenchon was playing a very high risk game in not calling on his supporters to vote for Macron.

I don't like Macron and he wouldn't have been my first choice. But politics is often about dealing with a less than perfect choice, rather than being in the world you'd like to inhabit. Not voting for Macron in a straight run-off between him and LePen ran the risk of allowing a far-right leader to become President. At the very least it gave LePen a higher percentage of the vote, strengthening the far right for the future. I simply do not understand how anyone who purports to be on the Left can do that and then be able to look at themselves in the mirror.

I agree billy but I would think that many of Melenchon's voters wouldn't have taken kindly to be asked to vote for Macron, so yes a great risk but it leaves him in a secure position. I would also think that he had some internal polling done to see what his supporters would do.

I think Melenchon would have also had an ear to the upcoming parliamentary elections where his party will expect to do well and nab some high profile positions there.

There is a good possibility of Macron's party disappearing as fast as they arrived and in some respects it could be back to something that is similar to previous parliamentary governance.

Testing times for the minute frog, and not before time, if anything this bloke will destroy the EU hegemony by trying to bulldozer the rest into his crazed ideas for Europe(the part that partake in it)

[SydneyRover]

Point taken, Hound.
I have amended the post.

Now, what do you think about the plan to give a 5 year window?

I think it is fair to say that people who have the UK as their main residence should be required to pay UK taxes.
It isn’t just the super rich though who have been taking advantage of the non dom situation.
I know people who have worked abroad, kept a home in England but banked in tax havens.
It isn’t such a rare thing.
With regards to tax avoidance, there will be plenty of people on this site who are making a noise about the likes of the Sunak situation, who do the same thing (on a much lower scale of course) to pay as little income tax, CGT and unearned income tax as they can.

Fabric*nt

[drfchound]

Point taken, Hound.
I have amended the post.

Now, what do you think about the plan to give a 5 year window?

I think it is fair to say that people who have the UK as their main residence should be required to pay UK taxes.
It isn’t just the super rich though who have been taking advantage of the non dom situation.
I know people who have worked abroad, kept a home in England but banked in tax havens.
It isn’t such a rare thing.
With regards to tax avoidance, there will be plenty of people on this site who are making a noise about the likes of the Sunak situation, who do the same thing (on a much lower scale of course) to pay as little income tax, CGT and unearned income tax as they can.

Fabric*nt

Is that your educated way of saying I am wrong?
Or is it your usual way of not adding anything of interest to the debate. 

[SydneyRover]

I just thought your whataboutery reply was on par with his is all hound, which I think you'd agree, casting a slur on good members of the forum.

[drfchound]

I just thought your whataboutery reply was on par with his is all hound, which I think you'd agree, casting a slur on good members of the forum.

No whataboutery involved at all and certainly no slur on anyone of the forum.
I think it is beyond any doubt that even good people have accountants who keep the tax bills down.
Even people who do their own tax returns find a way to manipulate the figures to save a few shillings.
Why do you suggest I am casting a slur on anyone when this is legal.
And I certainly don’t resort to insults, as you do.

[SydneyRover]

I think you should support you allegations with some proof hound, you have some I take it? Or is this going to be another if your never ending conversations where you absolve yourself.

[drfchound]

I think you should support you allegations with some proof hound, you have some I take it? Or is this going to be another if your never ending conversations where you absolve yourself.

You do say some silly things SR.
How do you think I can provide proof?
Oh hang on a minute …… you want me to ask others to send me their private details.
You really are deluded.
Or maybe you have never done a tax return or had an accountant so haven’t a clue what happens in the real world.

[SydneyRover]

No proof that would mean you don't know what you are talking about then.

fabric*nt did it with his slur on nurses and teachers ........