Charlie Lakin

[Campsall rover]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

[Barmby Rover]

I don't mind loans, but I do worry about the quality of signings, a permanent striker who has been playing for a side 1 from bottom of the National league. The last time we came from Conference to LG 2 we came into the league with a striker who had been in the team of the season. He couldn't get in the team and left us soon after promotion (Paul Barnes) it doesn't bode well, but I will love being proved wrong. And now, a loan of a player that is leaving because he can't get in the team which is next to bottom in LG.1. These players are where they are for a reason, the same as teams are, Rovers are mid table LG.2 with unreliable form.

[knockers]

Signing reserve players from Burton. Wow how far we have fallen

Wasn’t our keeper who most seem happy with from Hartlepool reserves-just saying!

[Spud]

Signing reserve players from Burton. Wow how far we have fallen

Wasn’t our keeper who most seem happy with from Hartlepool reserves-just saying!

Ssshhh, don't mention the hartlepool keeper !

[Filo]

Signing reserve players from Burton. Wow how far we have fallen

Burton are a league above Rovers


Rashford wasn’t available!

[Campsall rover]

They have just signed a 3rd keeper at Pools.

They let Mitchell go because he will have wanted 1st team football.
Far too good to be 2nd choice at League 2 level.

Killip their 1st choice is a very good keeper.

There are plenty of players who didn’t get regular starts at their club who when transferred to another club that have flourished.

I give you Alfie May.   Yes him.  There are a huge number of others.

[eastender]

Brace yourselves for the rush when no doubt the early bird season tickets are released next month.

Club need to employ the greatest sales person in the world. They're not going to sell well at all. January statement and this window has ruined that.

The Club don't need to employ any sales person , the results over the next 3 months will determine whether ST sales are good or bad ,simple.

[roversdude]

Is there a website that tells you who every player has as an agent ?
Is it only certain agents we don’t deal with ?

[RugbyRover]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

Unless we get promoted we're going to have the same problem in the summer as we do now.

Which is that a mid table L2 side is not attractive to the better players, unless the wages are significantly higher than the going rate.
Players are competitive animals, they want to be in a winning side, they want medals, but above all else they want cash.
With our business model we are going to struggle to over any of that.

We are told that there is cash available this window. It could well be that we tried to sign some quality permie players but have been forced into the short term loan market. Unless we get promoted it'll be the same all over again next summer.

[Glyn_Wigley]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

Unless we get promoted we're going to have the same problem in the summer as we do now.

Which is that a mid table L2 side is not attractive to the better players, unless the wages are significantly higher than the going rate.
Players are competitive animals, they want to be in a winning side, they want medals, but above all else they want cash.
With our business model we are going to struggle to over any of that.

We are told that there is cash available this window. It could well be that we tried to sign some quality permie players but have been forced into the short term loan market. Unless we get promoted it'll be the same all over again next summer.

But it's the same for every other L2 club. All we have to do is sign better players than them.

[Branton Red]

We needed another central midfielder with some experience in league football.

23 is a good age. Some experience but still potential to improve.

On a (loan) contract till the end of the season so Rovers are not committing to him if he turns out not to be up to standard.

Local(ish) and out of favour at his current club so likely to be motivated to perform to earn a move.

Left footed I think so offers a bit of balance potentially.

Let's see how he performs.

[Sammy Chung was King]

We are in reduced market at the minute for players. We can’t afford massive wages or fees. The club has to be creative in who they sign. One of these signings could turn out to be a gem of a signing. It’s not always the one who cost the most that get’s on. Sometimes players just need opportunities to play regularly to bring out their potential . Any human being does better if valued.

[pib]

Another player who shares the same agent as DS. Probably not a sustainable approach to transfer business!

If he’s an improvement on those that have left, does it really matter?

Kind of, because then when DS goes what do we do? The same as we’ve done in recent years and dismantle the squad again and rebuild it in another manager’s image?

Or would we be better off having a recruitment process and a structure that isn’t reliant on the Head Coach or manager, so that when the HC/manager changes we can find someone else to work with those players, rather than starting again every time?

In a roundabout way I’m trying to say, the reliance on the manager/HC’s own recruitment preferences rather than having a club-centric focus is partly what has got us into the position we’re in, in my opinion. And madness would be to keep repeating that and expecting different results.

So to me, and it seems others, it is a bit of a concern that we seem to be recruiting in this way.

Edit - I’d just like to add that this hasn’t all come from me and my fantasy land of how I’d like the club to be run. Baldwin and the board themselves have talked about trying to create an identity and recruit managers and players around that.

Been thinking about this a bit more, and what epitomises the need for this to improve better than the curious case of Adam Long?

Signed in the summer for a fee by the previous manager, took him a while to get fit and up-to-speed, by which point another manager comes in and now he's seemingly somewhere around 5th/6th in the pecking order. By all accounts not injured, but not even featuring in the match day squad at Mansfield, and wouldn't be surprised to see him shipped out today if there's any interest.

If you want to be sustainable, and not make things even worse by pissing needless money away, this is exactly the kind of shit that needs to be avoided.

People push back at those of us who criticise the board and say "they provided an adequate budget, what more can they do?" .... Well one place to start would be to make sure the people making the decisions don't make glaring errors like this one!

If it was just one, it wouldn't be an issue, but look at our transfers over the past few windows and there are a lot of stories of similar wastage. Look at Agard and Griffiths as well.

[sedwardsdrfc]

Copps would was HoF when long was brought it. It’s his job to ensure the players signed aren’t just going to end up on a scrap heap when a manager changes.

If not we might as well carry on where the manager does everything and the whole club is turned upside down when one leaves. The plan was that having a HoF does that.

[normal rules]

Is there a website that tells you who every player has as an agent ?
Is it only certain agents we don’t deal with ?

The board have made no secret of the fact that certain agents they would never deal with due to excessive fees.
And yes, there is a website for plAyers/ managers/ agents. It’s called Transfermarkt.
I’ve flagged this concern before. Danny Schofield now shares the same agent as Todd Miller and Charlie Larkin. Co-incidence? I think not.
This isn’t talent spotting and proper recruitment. It’s wheels within wheels. Nepotism. Helping out your agent mates. Looking no further than the end of your nose for players. DM did this and look where it ended up.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, having principles is such a drag.

[normal rules]

Yeah, having principles is such a drag.

Firstly, I’m not anti board. Far from it.
But I do think they may be guilty of cutting their nose off to spite their face so to speak about being principled in regards to agents fees.
Rovers are potentially missing out on a huge pool of potential. For increased fees perhaps. I don’t know the detail around this principle. Is there a cash threshold per agent?

[sedwardsdrfc]

I wonder if our recruitment council or whatever they are called identified a potential player for the 1st team would they rule them out because of their agent?

Certain agent fees might make a unaffordable anyway but if they can be fitted into the budget surely we wouldn’t turn our nose up.

The poor quality of players we’ve had recently does suggest their agents won’t be asking for much.

I also worry if we have a policy of staying away from certain agents that we get a reputation in the game for been tight. It’s a small industry and that reputation would make it harder to attract players for sure.

[Campsall rover]

But it is a fact that we don’t pay excessive agents fees.

Is that a bad thing?  Well it might mean we miss out on some decent players so that’s not good.
It also means we are not lining the pockets of some vultures.
People who take money out of te game for their own greed.
So that’s a good thing.

Now before some of you jump on me, yes there are some very good agents who do a very good job for their clients and are not greedy.

[sedwardsdrfc]

But it is a fact that we don’t pay excessive agents fees.

Is that a bad thing?  Well it might mean we miss out on some decent players so that’s not good.
It also means we are not lining the pockets of some vultures.
People who take money out of te game for their own greed.
So that’s a good thing.

Now before some of you jump on me, yes there are some very good agents who do a very good job for their clients and are not greedy.

No I agree with not paying excessive fees. I’m more concerned that it sounds like we outright won’t speak to certain agents. At least find out the score. An excessive fee also depends on what the opportunity is, it can’t just be a set fee. Agents will know if their player has a big future and will charge accordingly.

Whatever fee we paid to sign Hiwula, Dodoo etc was excessive. Rather pay an agent a bit and end up with a competent player.

[danumdon]

Very much a cut throat business these days, Agents are in the game because they enable a players to get the maximum gain out of every deal they are involved in, remember its a very short career being a pro footballer and they have to make the best of their potential, it could also be that their very next game is there last one with serious injury always a big risk.

Regarding the agents we will or will not work with , i would of thought it should all be worked out in the overall price for the player, the package that it will cost the club in total.

We need to be more ruthless, it seems like our very amiable nature on the field is a taster of our business dealings, we must try to get the best players available to a club of our size, why would we reduce the options available to us?

[ncRover]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

I agree. Do we reckon the club proactively have some targets lined up for the summer based on solid scouting, squad planning and data?

[Barmby Rover]

Signing reserve players from Burton. Wow how far we have fallen

Wasn’t our keeper who most seem happy with from Hartlepool reserves-just saying!

What are you saying after his performance last weekend? We are where we are because of the second rate players we sign for small fees/wages. But after all we are "sustainable" !! Happy to avoid relegation from the football league.

[sedwardsdrfc]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

I agree. Do we reckon the club proactively have some targets lined up for the summer based on solid scouting, squad planning and data?

Last summer with Miller, Hurst, Maxwell, Molyenux and Biggins all fitted a similar profile. Young to mid twenties mostly played a fair bit but could push on. all on 2-3 year deals.

Don’t know what methods were used to identify but it feels like they were properly planned signings. Most of these are our better players this season.

What’s telling is we signed Maxwell and Long in defence in the summer. That’s it. After the shocking season we had we’ve got the same defence. This is what holds us back. This summer if we get similar quality to above in defence in on permanent deals we’ll be a much better side.

We were so poor in all positions last season it’s hard to prioritise signings but the reality is we had defenders on contract that no one in their right mind would take. So last summer naturally we spent the money where we had available space which wasn’t centre half

[ncRover]

I really don’t understand who some people expected us to sign in this window.
The only players available are ones who are surplus at other clubs who are available either to sign permanently or on loan until the end of the season.
The only others are the Premier league U21 players on loan.

I seriously don’t know how many times I have said this.  It is the same every January.
Why is that so difficult for some to understand.

The summer is the time to do most of the long term recruitment when players are out of contract.

I agree. Do we reckon the club proactively have some targets lined up for the summer based on solid scouting, squad planning and data?

Last summer with Miller, Hurst, Maxwell, Molyenux and Biggins all fitted a similar profile. Young to mid twenties mostly played a fair bit but could push on. all on 2-3 year deals.

Don’t know what methods were used to identify but it feels like they were properly planned signings. Most of these are our better players this season.

What’s telling is we signed Maxwell and Long in defence in the summer. That’s it. After the shocking season we had we’ve got the same defence. This is what holds us back. This summer if we get similar quality to above in defence in on permanent deals we’ll be a much better side.

We were so poor in all positions last season it’s hard to prioritise signings but the reality is we had defenders on contract that no one in their right mind would take. So last summer naturally we spent the money where we had available space which wasn’t centre half

Yep good ages but was there any tactical foresight?

Maxwell was signed last minute when it was obvious we needed a left back all summer and all the other free agents had gone. Don’t get me wrong I like him but he is defensively weak in a back 4, which he was signed to play in.

Miller. Walsall fans themselves on Twitter said he isn’t a lone striker. Yet he was deployed there and long balls were (and still are to some degree) pumped up to him when he’s not big, strong, quick or particularly clinical.

Biggins. Has been ok, a bit inconsistent. His late runs in to the box and eye for goal were highlighted when he signed him. He was stuck next to Clayton and spent his time covering defensively.

Hurst a brilliant find.

Molyneux good on paper but isn’t working out at present. Hopefully he kicks on.

Anderson extension seemed more sentimental than logical. Can’t build a consistent defence around someone injury prone.

[Chris Black come back]

It’s really difficult to avoid any conclusion than we are going to have another major turnover of players this summer. Then it’s more disruption again. Probably unavoidable though as the side is just nowhere near good enough to go up automatically next season. Defence and midfield is all over the place, and there is not any kind of numbers upfront.

[sedwardsdrfc]

How much of that would you put down to McSheffery. There has to be a plan in the 1st place. any combination of player wouldn’t have looked great.

[Sammy Chung was King]

We miss a core of good solid experience to go alongside those young players. That would help bring out the best in them. To develop properly the team needs to have the right balance, it hasn’t at the minute.

[MachoMadness]

Frankly it seems like this season is being written off, which is probably the right decision in the long term. No point lumbering us with overpriced mediocre players for 18 months to achieve possibly slightly better results, but still end the season in failure. There is no way we spent the extra funds promised, in fact I imagine the wage bill is a bit lower than it was when the window opened, so hopefully they're rolled over to the summer.

We'll just have to get used to mediocrity for a bit longer, the occasional hiding mixed in with the occasional good performance and win, and hope that next season they finally get it right.

[steve@dcfd]

Start of this season Bounce Back Decisively now the season is being written off. That can’t be the case GMC said top 3 were in 15th.
Either the Chairman and manager must have had expectations above the reality. We can only hope that the players we’ve brought in are better than perceived. We’ve heard nothing from Copps is he still at the club.