Schofield

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Doesn't matter what formation we play if our players have defensive calamities like today.

Already been said, but Seaman's abhoration running away from the ball and allowing their man a free run onto the ball was criminal. I thought he was improving but that is unforgivable.

Anderson had a mare too by the looks and as a coach, you can’t anticipate mistakes like that. It's basic football.

I think DS knows what he's doing and the players know individual errors cost us big time.

Sacking Schofield is definitely the wrong thing to do.

[Cramby10]

I actually think there's something there with him. Despite today's defensive shambles there's areas we've improved and it's clear what he wants to do. The issue is the backing he's gotten from the board.

The team is playing, if anything, worse now than when McCsheffrey was in charge.

Definitely not
The football we’re playing currently is miles better, the manager has just made his first signings for the club and people are saying we should sack him.
Need to learn to be patient, sod showed us that

Before Schofield our record was:

P15 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.4

Since he came it has been:

P11 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.45

Marginal improvement on points (equivalent to 2.3 points over a season, so almost lost in the noise).

What is really worrying is that we are conceding goals at a frightening rate - averaging nearly 2 per game under Schofield. Whatever improvements there might arguably be in the overall play is being drowned by a simply shocking defensive record. It doesn't go matter in the long run if you play a bit more positively if your side shites itself every time a ball is put into the box.

I have to query your figures. I think Gm managed 14 league games winning 21 points which makes it 1.5 ppg.
And DS has managed 12 games winning 16 points at 1.3 ppg. Therefore no improvement to be had.

[ncRover]

We don’t keep the ball well, or in the opposition half, enough to let the wing backs get high enough up the pitch. So it becomes 541 which is a depressing way to play and not even keep clean sheets.

I like that DS has a way he wants to play but I hate this stubbornness to play it when we haven’t got the players to make it work. It’s like it’s the coaching mantra that you have a “philosophy” and have to die by it. Like playing short goal kicks no matter what or sticking to a formation no matter how isolated your forwards are.

McSheffery was a PE teacher I don’t think he knew what he wanted to do. DS does but we probably don’t have the players to do it justice.

Think we should go 442 or 433 keep it simple everyone knows where they stand get some good performances under our belts.

I bet in his rigid “philosophy” there’s no room for a striker above 6 foot who can hold the ball up effectively either. A lower league must that is also needed in the next window.

[Chris Black come back]

I actually think there's something there with him. Despite today's defensive shambles there's areas we've improved and it's clear what he wants to do. The issue is the backing he's gotten from the board.

The team is playing, if anything, worse now than when McCsheffrey was in charge.

Definitely not
The football we’re playing currently is miles better, the manager has just made his first signings for the club and people are saying we should sack him.
Need to learn to be patient, sod showed us that

Before Schofield our record was:

P15 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.4

Since he came it has been:

P11 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.45

Marginal improvement on points (equivalent to 2.3 points over a season, so almost lost in the noise).

What is really worrying is that we are conceding goals at a frightening rate - averaging nearly 2 per game under Schofield. Whatever improvements there might arguably be in the overall play is being drowned by a simply shocking defensive record. It doesn't go matter in the long run if you play a bit more positively if your side shites itself every time a ball is put into the box.

I have to query your figures. I think Gm managed 14 league games winning 21 points which makes it 1.5 ppg.
And DS has managed 12 games winning 16 points at 1.3 ppg. Therefore no improvement to be had.

I worked these out on a separate thread yesterday. I also think in terms of league games at this early stage Schofield has a worse ppg record.

It is quite neat to do as McSheffrey was fired after the Carlisle game and Schofield was in charge for the next game, Crewe away. Only counting league games, which is all that matters. Although the FA Cup humiliation is worth remembering.

[dickos1]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

[Chris Black come back]

First paragraph, second line “at this early stage”.

[ravenrover]

The big difference fot me 2nd half was that Miller was supported by Lavery, Hurst was given licence to roam and finally we startrd playing balls into feet rather than a long hopefull punt over the top for Miller to chase. He won very few high balls against the 2 CBs  but was turning them when he or Lavery got balls into feet.

[andyst79]

The big difference fot me 2nd half was that Miller was supported by Lavery, Hurst was given licence to roam and finally we startrd playing balls into feet rather than a long hopefull punt over the top for Miller to chase. He won very few high balls against the 2 CBs  but was turning them when he or Lavery got balls into feet.

There's a player in Hurst and he was more threatening playing more central. Would like to see him and Molyneux swap flanks during games. Helps having a decent fullback in Maxwell supporting on the left

[Filo]

Molyneux needs to stop thinking it’s all about him, and its a team game, he’s been a massive disappointment for me, looses the ball loads of times during a game

[Campsall rover]

I just don't get what we are supposed to be doing with the way we line up at 5-4-1.

We play with 2 wing-backs and 2 wingers. What in God's name is that formation supposed to achieve.

We looked far more potent for a while at 5-3-2 in the second half with two sitting midfielders, Hurst behind the front 2 and only the wing backs wide.

It's not bleeding rocket science. If you are going to play 5-4-1 with a wide 4, you're going to get overrun in central midfield. And if you're going to play that with Seaman and Molyneux on one wing, you might as well give up before you start.

Let’s see if he learns BST.   I see it exactly as you obviously do.
2nd half worked brilliantly. It was just that 3rd goal calamity that killed it.  We could seriously have won that game daft as it seems having lost 4-1.
DS needs to learn very quickly now  from this game. If he can’t see what we can see then there is a serious problem.

[Cramby10]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

talking of daft comparisons, you’re comparing 3 outstanding managers with previous success, experience and with money to spend and decent players already in the team with this chap of 9 games of bang average league experience, no money to spend and players not up to it?

[BillyStubbsTears]

I actually think there's something there with him. Despite today's defensive shambles there's areas we've improved and it's clear what he wants to do. The issue is the backing he's gotten from the board.

The team is playing, if anything, worse now than when McCsheffrey was in charge.

Definitely not
The football we’re playing currently is miles better, the manager has just made his first signings for the club and people are saying we should sack him.
Need to learn to be patient, sod showed us that

Before Schofield our record was:

P15 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.4

Since he came it has been:

P11 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.45

Marginal improvement on points (equivalent to 2.3 points over a season, so almost lost in the noise).

What is really worrying is that we are conceding goals at a frightening rate - averaging nearly 2 per game under Schofield. Whatever improvements there might arguably be in the overall play is being drowned by a simply shocking defensive record. It doesn't go matter in the long run if you play a bit more positively if your side shites itself every time a ball is put into the box.

I have to query your figures. I think Gm managed 14 league games winning 21 points which makes it 1.5 ppg.
And DS has managed 12 games winning 16 points at 1.3 ppg. Therefore no improvement to be had.

Absolutely right Cramby. My mistake. It was late and I thought 5+1+6=11.

Correct numbers are:

Before Schofield our record was:

P14 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.5

Since he came it has been:

P12 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.33

Dickos.

You can argue all you want. The numbers are what the numbers are.

For the record, I agree with you that we are generally playing better ATTACKING football. But you saying we are playing better FOOTBALL, while conceding over 2 goals per game is, like many of your claims, a bit of a stretch.

[Spud]

Molyneux needs to stop thinking it’s all about him, and its a team game, he’s been a massive disappointment for me, looses the ball loads of times during a game

Most frustrating player we have, where's the guy who tore Stevenage to bits?
Would love him to come good, there's a great player in there,, like you say he needs to knuckle down first though.

[dickos1]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

talking of daft comparisons, you’re comparing 3 outstanding managers with previous success, experience and with money to spend and decent players already in the team with this chap of 9 games of bang average league experience, no money to spend and players not up to it?

No!
I’m comparing the fact that we had many fans moaning and complaining about sod in the first few months of his tenure.
If the moaners had got their wish we would’ve missed out on the most success we’ve ever had.
The managers aren’t being compared at all

[bpoolrover]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

talking of daft comparisons, you’re comparing 3 outstanding managers with previous success, experience and with money to spend and decent players already in the team with this chap of 9 games of bang average league experience, no money to spend and players not up to it?

the problem you have is we are told he has money to spend, if that is true then some of his signings are suspect to say the least, if he has hardly any money then I doubt it matters to much who the manager is as we will be stuck with bang average  players

[Cramby10]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

talking of daft comparisons, you’re comparing 3 outstanding managers with previous success, experience and with money to spend and decent players already in the team with this chap of 9 games of bang average league experience, no money to spend and players not up to it?

the problem you have is we are told he has money to spend, if that is true then some of his signings are suspect to say the least, if he has hardly any money then I doubt it matters to much who the manager is as we will be stuck with bang average  players

I think it’s obvious we have no money to spend, so we should’ve employed a manager proven to work on said budget and not set our sights on playing a totally unrealistic style with inferior players.

[dickos1]

The comparison is daft though
We’ve a new manager who’s trying to completely change how we play using players that we’re all signed by someone else.
The previous manager had signed almost all the players to fit the way he wanted to play,
That’s why sod struggled at the beginning, and why arteta, pep struggled.
We’re completely. Hanging out style of football and that can’t happen overnight and certainly not when a lot of the players aren’t able to do it

talking of daft comparisons, you’re comparing 3 outstanding managers with previous success, experience and with money to spend and decent players already in the team with this chap of 9 games of bang average league experience, no money to spend and players not up to it?

the problem you have is we are told he has money to spend, if that is true then some of his signings are suspect to say the least, if he has hardly any money then I doubt it matters to much who the manager is as we will be stuck with bang average  players

Why are they suspect?
Youve decided that after a few mins of football?

[dickos1]

I actually think there's something there with him. Despite today's defensive shambles there's areas we've improved and it's clear what he wants to do. The issue is the backing he's gotten from the board.

The team is playing, if anything, worse now than when McCsheffrey was in charge.

Definitely not
The football we’re playing currently is miles better, the manager has just made his first signings for the club and people are saying we should sack him.
Need to learn to be patient, sod showed us that

Before Schofield our record was:

P15 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.4

Since he came it has been:

P11 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.45

Marginal improvement on points (equivalent to 2.3 points over a season, so almost lost in the noise).

What is really worrying is that we are conceding goals at a frightening rate - averaging nearly 2 per game under Schofield. Whatever improvements there might arguably be in the overall play is being drowned by a simply shocking defensive record. It doesn't go matter in the long run if you play a bit more positively if your side shites itself every time a ball is put into the box.

I have to query your figures. I think Gm managed 14 league games winning 21 points which makes it 1.5 ppg.
And DS has managed 12 games winning 16 points at 1.3 ppg. Therefore no improvement to be had.

Absolutely right Cramby. My mistake. It was late and I thought 5+1+6=11.

Correct numbers are:

Before Schofield our record was:

P14 W6 D3 L5 GF18 GA19 Pts21 PPG 1.5

Since he came it has been:

P12 W5 D1 L6 GF13 GA20 Pts16 PPG 1.33

Dickos.

You can argue all you want. The numbers are what the numbers are.

For the record, I agree with you that we are generally playing better ATTACKING football. But you saying we are playing better FOOTBALL, while conceding over 2 goals per game is, like many of your claims, a bit of a stretch.

They are numbers that don’t make any sense
You’re comparing a managers record who had a team full of players he signed with a managers record who has managed a team with not one signing of his.
Not even taking into account that he’s trying to completely overhaul the style of football we play

[Silkscarf]

How about compare Schofield’s 12 with the 12 before him? Then 13, 14 etc as the season wears on. Maybe no difference to the stats I don’t know?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Dickos.

The numbers are what the numbers are.

Dress it up however you like, it's really hard to justify your claim that "the football we are playing is miles better than before."

I'd accept "Some of the attacking intent is better than what went before, but overall performances and results are worse and there an no obvious signs of clear significant improvement."

[GazLaz]

I just don't get what we are supposed to be doing with the way we line up at 5-4-1.

We play with 2 wing-backs and 2 wingers. What in God's name is that formation supposed to achieve.

We looked far more potent for a while at 5-3-2 in the second half with two sitting midfielders, Hurst behind the front 2 and only the wing backs wide.

It's not bleeding rocket science. If you are going to play 5-4-1 with a wide 4, you're going to get overrun in central midfield. And if you're going to play that with Seaman and Molyneux on one wing, you might as well give up before you start.

It’s meant to be 343 isn’t it. That’s a difficult system to play and probably a more difficult system to coach. Especially to 4th division players that can by nature, not handle multiple pieces of caching and tactical info within games. 

[Lesonthewest]

Molyneux needs to stop thinking it’s all about him, and its a team game, he’s been a massive disappointment for me, looses the ball loads of times during a game

Looks like he can't be ar-ed to me, he's a passenger & offers nothing.

[sedwardsdrfc]

I just don't get what we are supposed to be doing with the way we line up at 5-4-1.

We play with 2 wing-backs and 2 wingers. What in God's name is that formation supposed to achieve.

We looked far more potent for a while at 5-3-2 in the second half with two sitting midfielders, Hurst behind the front 2 and only the wing backs wide.

It's not bleeding rocket science. If you are going to play 5-4-1 with a wide 4, you're going to get overrun in central midfield. And if you're going to play that with Seaman and Molyneux on one wing, you might as well give up before you start.

It’s meant to be 343 isn’t it. That’s a difficult system to play and probably a more difficult system to coach. Especially to 4th division players that can by nature, not handle multiple pieces of caching and tactical info within games. 

Agree with this. Looks nice on the coaching video but without smart players, particularly in defence, it’s hard.

That said a lot of clubs play 3 at the back now in the EFL so maybe we just have a bunch of particularly unintelligent players

[BillyStubbsTears]

3-4-3/5-4-1 are two sides of the same coin. The former is the attacking formation, the latter the defensive one.

Doesn't change the basic issue that, the way we set up, Hurst and in particular Molyneux are usually very wide. So we effectively play with 4 wide players, and we invariably lose the central midfield battle.

The difference for the first 20 minutes of the second half yesterday when we went to 5-3-2/3-5-2 was like black and white.

[sedwardsdrfc]

3-4-3/5-4-1 are two sides of the same coin. The former is the attacking formation, the latter the defensive one.

Doesn't change the basic issue that, the way we set up, Hurst and in particular Molyneux are usually very wide. So we effectively play with 4 wide players, and we invariably lose the central midfield battle.

The difference for the first 20 minutes of the second half yesterday when we went to 5-3-2/3-5-2 was like black and white.

That’s the point. Some tactical nuisance for the wide players in the 3 as well as the defenders in the 343 which we don’t have the intelligence to do

[Campsall rover]

3-4-3/5-4-1 are two sides of the same coin. The former is the attacking formation, the latter the defensive one.

Doesn't change the basic issue that, the way we set up, Hurst and in particular Molyneux are usually very wide. So we effectively play with 4 wide players, and we invariably lose the central midfield battle.

The difference for the first 20 minutes of the second half yesterday when we went to 5-3-2/3-5-2 was like black and white.

Agree.
Also Brown is a better player than Seaman and Miller becomes a player when he has Lavery up front with him.
Must stick with that set up we had beginning of the 2nd half v Hartlepool.  If he doesn’t i despair.
Just a pity about the finishing. Almost as bad as the defending. In fact it was as bad.

[dickos1]

Dickos.

The numbers are what the numbers are.

Dress it up however you like, it's really hard to justify your claim that "the football we are playing is miles better than before."

I'd accept "Some of the attacking intent is better than what went before, but overall performances and results are worse and there an no obvious signs of clear significant improvement."

It’s a fact that the results haven’t improved but performances is down to opinion.
I think we’ve played much better under schofield, plenty of games under Gary where we stole points, we’ve not done that under Danny yet

[danumdon]

Molyneux needs to stop thinking it’s all about him, and its a team game, he’s been a massive disappointment for me, looses the ball loads of times during a game

That lackadaisical loss of the ball after 25secs yesterday really made our afternoon!

[Metalmicky]

As disappointing as it was - the goals conceded were terrible and all preventable. 

The defence need to know what their roles are and 5 at the back doesn't work...... the shape and organisation isn't there.
We need to work out the system that the players are comfortable with and play to it.

As I said, we directly contributed to every one of Mansfield's goals and missed opportunities to get back into the game - Miller had to score when he had the goal at his mercy - and if he had it may have spurred on the team.

[Sammy Chung was King]

He needs to do better, if he can’t organise them defensively then he needs an expert in to do it.
We are wide open.