Grant McCann's most natural league?

[DRNaith]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

[Plumbster]

Hard to say but I hope so. I do think Grant has struggled to get to grips with L2 and that the squad hasn’t been effective as he anticipated. His track record in L1 is obviously better but I not sure he has ever had so much work to do on the squad as he would do if we do manage to go up. Last time he struck gold with his loans and he would probably have to do the same next season.  One thing for sure he would definitely be up for the challenge.

[Chris Black come back]

Hull City mega money when in League One. His 2018/19 season with is in League One had superb set of players. Peterborough also had good relative budget when he was there in League One. If we go up we are not quite bargain basement relatively but not too far off. He will need to recruit very well this summer, if we get promoted.

[DonnyOsmond]

Only reason he would be more suited to League One than League Two would be that it's easier to find good players that fit in your way of playing in a higher league.

[Jonathan]

Interesting debate. The negative judgements on the performance of McCann can only be based on the fact that we haven't totally obliterated the league this season. I’ll admit I’ve felt frustrated by what’s felt like our stuttering form of late. Then all of a sudden you look at the table and start questioning your own assertions. No team has won more games than us this season, only two teams have scored more goals than us. Whilst our own fans point towards our big budget (and I don’t doubt it’s been generous) there are undoubtedly teams in this division with bigger budgets than ours. One of them, MK Dons, is languishing in the lower reaches of the table. Others are in there competing with us for the top places, but none are demonstrably better than us. Port Vale have backed Darren Moore with huge money that I suspect dwarfs ours and we’re one point behind them debating why McCann can’t perform in this division. Yes, he’s had backing, but he’s massively turned the curve from the downward trajectory the club was on. We were a slither away from the play off final last year. And now we’re in a position where if we can win our last two home games (which I acknowledge are tough) then we’re up. Are we sure we wouldn’t have taken that at the start of the season?

[GazLaz]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

I personally don’t think you can be good in L1 but not in L2. I’ve been a bit critical of GM at times this season but we are where we are because of him. The players (which he’s recruited) have made it a grind IMO. Not the manager.

[DRNaith]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

I personally don’t think you can be good in L1 but not in L2. I’ve been a bit critical of GM at times this season but we are where we are because of him. The players (which he’s recruited) have made it a grind IMO. Not the manager.

I haven't said he's not a good League Two manager, just wondered if he could be better suited to League One.

[Upton Rover]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

bigger budget in L1 , hopefully

[DonnyBazR0ver]

I wouldn't have thought the league really matters. The main competences remain the same don't they?  Of course recruitment will be a big factor in assembling a squad capable of competing with the slightly better quality in League One, but after that, there's no reason to think his coaching, man management, his tactics, his selections and just overall decision making will be any different. He's already got us to a League One play off semi final afterall.

[sedwardsdrfc]

The bigger budget is relative to the standard though so I’m not sure that’s a reason Grant is better suited to L1.

He’s obviously a good fit for the club. This season been a bit strange performance wise as we are used to much more attacking flowing football from his teams. It’s been more of a grind for sure. However other than Street and the Keeper our loan players have barely contributed. They are often the difference in teams at this level. So if we can do it with underperforming loans it’s a good result from him.

[streathamdave]

The bottom half of League 1 is not massively different from top 8 or so in League 2. The top half however tend to be very good teams. I think I agree however that our style of play is better suited to L1. I also agree that a good transfer window and good pre season will be important.

[Chris Black come back]

It is a blunt metric but broadly correct in that resources largely equals success. Managers can be terrible users of resources but broadly bigger budgets equals more success. Similarly larger attendances not always but usually means bigger budgets especially at League Two and League One levels. There are exceptions.

Looking at who will definitely be in League One next season, aside from the sides going up from League Two (who we don’t have an outstanding record against this season), you would say only Stevenage and Exeter are likely to have resources around or less than Rovers would if we went up.

As a guide, looking at the sides in League One who are neither going up or down this season, it is a strong group - Peterborough, Wigan, Barnsley, Rotherham, Lincoln, Blackpool, Bolton and Huddersfield. They will all have bigger budgets and better players as a rule.

You can see by the sides likely going down from League One, how hard it is for smaller sides to compete - Shrewsbury, Crawley, Cambridge, Burton and Bristol Rovers. You would say Rovers were probably a touch financially stronger than all those. 

[Nudga]

It is a blunt metric but broadly correct in that resources largely equals success. Managers can be terrible users of resources but broadly bigger budgets equals more success. Similarly larger attendances not always but usually means bigger budgets especially at League Two and League One levels. There are exceptions.

Looking at who will definitely be in League One next season, aside from the sides going up from League Two (who we don’t have an outstanding record against this season), you would say only Stevenage and Exeter are likely to have resources around or less than Rovers would if we went up.

As a guide, looking at the sides in League One who are neither going up or down this season, it is a strong group - Peterborough, Wigan, Barnsley, Rotherham, Lincoln, Blackpool, Bolton and Huddersfield. They will all have bigger budgets and better players as a rule.

You can see by the sides likely going down from League One, how hard it is for smaller sides to compete - Shrewsbury, Crawley, Cambridge, Burton and Bristol Rovers. You would say Rovers were probably a touch financially stronger than all those. 

There would be quite a few 10k plus crowds in there boosting our budget surely? And with it being a mini Yorkshire league or Division 3 North, season ticket sales should rocket.
Budget wise I think we'll be OK, just need to spend it wisely.

[Chris Black come back]

What matters is the relative position. Our income would definitely rise if we are in League One, certainly. But for every large crowd a local derby brings to our place for instance, we would do the same in return. There are lots of revenue increases we could expect in League One, but these would not be over and above what other sides in League One get. The way to be competitive is either to have a relatively larger budget than others in the league, or to use a relatively modest budget better. We will have a larger budget should we go up, but it will be relatively among the lower budgets in League One. The cash increase is largely not relevant.

[Nudga]

Good point well put. Other clubs don't have a Terry Bramall though, and he has come out and said he wants to get to the championship. So is he willing to bank roll it some more?

[DonnyOsmond]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

I personally don’t think you can be good in L1 but not in L2. I’ve been a bit critical of GM at times this season but we are where we are because of him. The players (which he’s recruited) have made it a grind IMO. Not the manager.

I haven't said he's not a good League Two manager, just wondered if he could be better suited to League One.

How so? How is a manager more suited to one domestic league compared with another?

[Chris Black come back]

There are lots of external investors in League One and I don't know the numbers but would suspect that a Terry-type generous local owner is the minority model. He already clears £3m each year with us and for us to progress to the Championship this would probably have to double as a minimum, all things being equal.

It is no slight on anyone but we saw that the Watson family decided after putting huge sums into the club that there comes a point where there are other things to do in life. Would Terry and his family want to start committing several millions each season to try and get to the Championship and then even more to stay there?

Times have changed and I think staying and being competitive in League One is about what we can reasonably hope for. It is a good quality league.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Good point well put. Other clubs don't have a Terry Bramall though, and he has come out and said he wants to get to the championship. So is he willing to bank roll it some more?

From what he's said, I get the impression he needs the support of the fans. If the City turns up in greater numbers to show support for the club he'll be encouraged with that. It's a two way process so he won't be throwing disproportionate sums of money at it.

Going forward, any potential new ownership out there will need to see healthy average attendances before taking any risks.

[ncRover]

There are lots of external investors in League One and I don't know the numbers but would suspect that a Terry-type generous local owner is the minority model. He already clears £3m each year with us and for us to progress to the Championship this would probably have to double as a minimum, all things being equal.

It is no slight on anyone but we saw that the Watson family decided after putting huge sums into the club that there comes a point where there are other things to do in life. Would Terry and his family want to start committing several millions each season to try and get to the Championship and then even more to stay there?

Times have changed and I think staying and being competitive in League One is about what we can reasonably hope for. It is a good quality league.

I agree that being a championship club is highly optimistic. But that’s not me being negative either, I like League One as a level to be a supporter at. It’s fine.

Look here at the transfers and fees paid by Derby and Cardiff this season for example, who are fighting for their lives to stay up in the championship.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/derby-county/transfers/verein/22

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/cardiff-city/transfers/verein/603

[RoversInSpain]

One thing Grant is, is that he is a ‘can do’ manager.
Last season when we were floundering near the bottom, he always said a playoff was the aim. I didn’t really believe it, but look what happened.
This season he stated he wants to win the league way before it started. When Walsall flew ahead and then Port Vale had a great run he still insisted this was the team goal. I didn’t believe it. Well, let’s say it’s possible.
The other huge achievement is the turnaround he has instigated, from performances that were reminiscent of the 98 season, totally shocking.
He has also brought on potential, from players around the National league, Molly, Bailey have just got better under him. Broadbent was getting pelters, look at his improvement now. Sterry…..! What a class act he has become. If he keeps doing this with these types of players then the only budget we need is the salary, and save on any buy fee.
We are very lucky to have him and personally I hope he’s still here 5 years from now.

[dknward2]

Think grant knows he is working under one of the best chairman in the football leagues, yes I’m sure he’d love a 10 million pound chest to go and spend who wouldn’t in the lower leagues, however the money being invested at the training ground should hopefully convince players to join also look at the success and improvement rate of players under Grant and the coaching staff.

Hopefully all this added together should help keep him with us for as long as we both want him to be here

[DRNaith]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

I personally don’t think you can be good in L1 but not in L2. I’ve been a bit critical of GM at times this season but we are where we are because of him. The players (which he’s recruited) have made it a grind IMO. Not the manager.

I haven't said he's not a good League Two manager, just wondered if he could be better suited to League One.

How so? How is a manager more suited to one domestic league compared with another?

That was kind of my question, but could McCann's desired way of playing be (even) more successful in league one.

Are players generally given more or less time on the ball?  how does that suit a McCann team.

The core of my question is around whether league one could better suit a McCann team

[ncRover]

Ok, so a little bit of personal background, before you expect too much technical knowledge from me. I began supporting Rovers, as a teenager, when my dad started taking me, during the Richardson era. He was born in 1942 and fondly recalled the times when we had half the Northern Ireland squad playing for us, as an example.

Now in my forties, I'm not hugely up on technical footballing knowledge, but I've formed the opinion that McCann is a better League One manager, than League Two. His approach and preferred style of play, etc... Is this something that is generally felt, or have I just made it up in my head? 

I personally don’t think you can be good in L1 but not in L2. I’ve been a bit critical of GM at times this season but we are where we are because of him. The players (which he’s recruited) have made it a grind IMO. Not the manager.

I haven't said he's not a good League Two manager, just wondered if he could be better suited to League One.

How so? How is a manager more suited to one domestic league compared with another?

That was kind of my question, but could McCann's desired way of playing be (even) more successful in league one.

Are players generally given more or less time on the ball?  how does that suit a McCann team.

The core of my question is around whether league one could better suit a McCann team

As a general rule, as you go up the leagues and players get quicker, fitter and stronger and you get less time you the ball.
What might benefit us is that teams will be more attacking and open against a newly promoted side. At first at least.
As we have seen this year, we have struggled against solid, defensive minded teams.