Todays officials

[EasyforDennis]

Overall I thought the referee had a decent game but what is the point of the two clowns supposedly “assistants” who run up and down the line waiting for the referee to tell them what to do.
The goal given by the referee in the 1st half had to be a bit of a guess and he could have possibly been unsighted. There was no excuse whatsoever for the linesman assistant not seeing it. Luckily for us we had the 4th official acting as a VAR to tell the ref he had made a mistake.
It is very rare that you see a 4th official actually making decisions but well done for that today.

[Ian Nimmo]

Overall I thought the referee had a decent game but what is the point of the two clowns supposedly “assistants” who run up and down the line waiting for the referee to tell them what to do.
The goal given by the referee in the 1st half had to be a bit of a guess and he could have possibly been unsighted. There was no excuse whatsoever for the linesman assistant not seeing it. Luckily for us we had the 4th official acting as a VAR to tell the ref he had made a mistake.
It is very rare that you see a 4th official actually making decisions but well done for that today.

Yeah if it’s true that the 4th official looked at the incident on the drfc tablet, then it’s remarkable and can’t believe he would have done so. Unlikely he would have had a clear view from his position, best view would have been seen from the line assistance.
So did he look at our tablet? If so then is he allowed to do so, never heard of this before.

[Donnywolf]

I reckon he got a good view of it , let's face it had their player not stuck his arm out it would have gone straight past him .

After I questioned the abilities of 4th Officials to see nothing at all it was great to see him spot that and make the Homer Hicks*** change his decision

A pity the 4th didn't keep it up especially after the "lunge" on Sterry

*** Taken from Lee Turnbulls commentary

[Padge_DRFC]

Incredible it got missed in the first place. Most blatant handball ever

[DrewSouthStand]

Bad thing if that's true can't have coaches running after 4th official with an ipad showing a replay regardless of right or wrong very dangerous precedent the ref has set there if true

[drfchound]

Incredible it got missed in the first place. Most blatant handball ever

My first look at it live said handball to me.
The right decision was reached.
The big one they got wrong was when Sharp got the better of Tilt early on and the defender fell over, nothing more, and a foul was given.
Had play continued  (at 0-0) then Sharp was through on goal with another of our players (Mols?) free in the middle waiting for a square ball to tap into the net.
That would probably have made a different outcome to the game.

[Pancho Regan]

I’ve been watching football for 60 years and I can’t ever remember a ref changing his decision in such circumstances.

Well done 4th official.

[adamtherover]

The last min penno call was shocking, the still is doing the rounds on social media,  its a shameful miss by the ref..

[drfchound]

Have you got any clips of it Adam?

[BillyStubbsTears]

The last min penno call was shocking, the still is doing the rounds on social media,  its a shameful miss by the ref..

Dear God, I wasn't watching at the time but that's a shocking miss by the officials.

If decisions even out over a season, we are due some pearlers in the run in. That's 4-5 stuck on penalties we've been denied this season.

[Donnywolf]

I’ve been watching football for 60 years and I can’t ever remember a ref changing his decision in such circumstances.

Well done 4th official.

I would say "yes" a Ref HAS changed his mind before after intervention by 4th Official

I offer Tom Anderson v Chesterfield where Tom ( on a Yellow ) was up for a Corner and as play continued and he was already back in our half the Ref stopped play ( or ball may have gone dead ) and produced a Red for him

So the Ref had seen the corner , and the breakdown in play and decided no offences , but the Chessie player fell to the floor with having been hit or feigning a hit and it was the 4th Official who told the Ref what he thought he saw and Tom was off

I still don't see how the 4th Official saw that on the far side of the South Stand area , nor since how they DONT see fouls such as on Jamie Sterry against Orient which let's face it are literally under their noses.

Maybe they do and the Refs tell them to say nothing

[adamtherover]

Have you got any clips of it Adam?

sorry I've no idea how to upload a pic?

[Bentley Bullet]

Not sure if this is the incident......

https://youtu.be/LoQR-ncsw0s?si=JjIU-kZ2taCTey0c&t=604

[Filo]

This one

[adamtherover]

https://youtu.be/X7zNxeB0258?si=758wcK4POSL7cisi

2 mins exactly on the clock is the distance camera, ive got a zoomed in freeze frame still, its like maradonna in 86 ffs

[adamtherover]

This one

thats the boy..

[DearneValleyRover]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

[GazLaz]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

Completely obvious that’s what was happening at the time. If that had happened against us we would be going mad. The officials on the pitch should have got to the correct decision admittedly but we got a bit fortunate there. The hand ball in the last minute was another terrible decision by the officials.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

Completely obvious that’s what was happening at the time. If that had happened against us we would be going mad. The officials on the pitch should have got to the correct decision admittedly but we got a bit fortunate there. The hand ball in the last minute was another terrible decision by the officials.

The 4th official has the right (in fact, the responsibility) to inform the ref if he (4th official) has spotted something that the ref hasn't.

There's a poster on the Bradford City forum saying he was directly behind the 4th official and had an unobstructed line of sight and saw the handball clear as day.

There's no evidence that the Rovers bench showed the 4th official a video. And even if they did, there's no evidence that that influenced the 4th official's decision to speak to the ref.

Classic example of people making rock solid conclusions from zero evidence.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

"Apparently".

In other words "Lots of people are guessing but there's zero evidence"

[GazLaz]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

Completely obvious that’s what was happening at the time. If that had happened against us we would be going mad. The officials on the pitch should have got to the correct decision admittedly but we got a bit fortunate there. The hand ball in the last minute was another terrible decision by the officials.

The 4th official has the right (in fact, the responsibility) to inform the ref if he (4th official) has spotted something that the ref hasn't.

There's a poster on the Bradford City forum saying he was directly behind the 4th official and had an unobstructed line of sight and saw the handball clear as day.

There's no evidence that the Rovers bench showed the 4th official a video. And even if they did, there's no evidence that that influenced the 4th official's decision to speak to the ref.

Classic example of people making rock solid conclusions from zero evidence.

Are the 4th officials mic’s up? The thing that didn’t feel right to me is the amount of time it took to make the decision if the 4th saw it straight away real time.

Too much other stuff going on to make referees decisions relevant. On to Burton, it’s a big one.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

Completely obvious that’s what was happening at the time. If that had happened against us we would be going mad. The officials on the pitch should have got to the correct decision admittedly but we got a bit fortunate there. The hand ball in the last minute was another terrible decision by the officials.

The 4th official has the right (in fact, the responsibility) to inform the ref if he (4th official) has spotted something that the ref hasn't.

There's a poster on the Bradford City forum saying he was directly behind the 4th official and had an unobstructed line of sight and saw the handball clear as day.

There's no evidence that the Rovers bench showed the 4th official a video. And even if they did, there's no evidence that that influenced the 4th official's decision to speak to the ref.

Classic example of people making rock solid conclusions from zero evidence.

Are the 4th officials mic’s up? The thing that didn’t feel right to me is the amount of time it took to make the decision if the 4th saw it straight away real time.

Too much other stuff going on to make referees decisions relevant. On to Burton, it’s a big one.

It was strange but there's nothing but guesses going on.

Watching the replay again, you only see the ref for literally 2 seconds after the ball hits the net. He looks like he's questioning the validity  from the off. He looks across at the linesman immediately (as you would, for offside). He sees no flag, and if he has no other suspicions, you expect him to immediately award the goal.

But he doesn't.

He stands there looking pensive.

And then the footage goes to replays, so you don't see him again until the goal is disallowed.

So unless I was at pitch side and heard exactly what went off, I couldn't possibly speculate on what happened.

[EasyforDennis]

Apparently the 4th official did look at the iPad then tell the ref, right decision but wrong way of getting to it

Completely obvious that’s what was happening at the time. If that had happened against us we would be going mad. The officials on the pitch should have got to the correct decision admittedly but we got a bit fortunate there. The hand ball in the last minute was another terrible decision by the officials.

The 4th official has the right (in fact, the responsibility) to inform the ref if he (4th official) has spotted something that the ref hasn't.

There's a poster on the Bradford City forum saying he was directly behind the 4th official and had an unobstructed line of sight and saw the handball clear as day.

There's no evidence that the Rovers bench showed the 4th official a video. And even if they did, there's no evidence that that influenced the 4th official's decision to speak to the ref.

Classic example of people making rock solid conclusions from zero evidence.

Are the 4th officials mic’s up? The thing that didn’t feel right to me is the amount of time it took to make the decision if the 4th saw it straight away real time.

Too much other stuff going on to make referees decisions relevant. On to Burton, it’s a big one.

It should be obvious that 4th officials have a mic to the referee. How else would referees know of anything being said from managers or coaches on the touchline.

[bobbymax]

This one

That is shocking!

[Pancho Regan]

I’ve been watching football for 60 years and I can’t ever remember a ref changing his decision in such circumstances.

Well done 4th official.

I would say "yes" a Ref HAS changed his mind before after intervention by 4th Official

I offer Tom Anderson v Chesterfield where Tom ( on a Yellow ) was up for a Corner and as play continued and he was already back in our half the Ref stopped play ( or ball may have gone dead ) and produced a Red for him

So the Ref had seen the corner , and the breakdown in play and decided no offences , but the Chessie player fell to the floor with having been hit or feigning a hit and it was the 4th Official who told the Ref what he thought he saw and Tom was off

I still don't see how the 4th Official saw that on the far side of the South Stand area , nor since how they DONT see fouls such as on Jamie Sterry against Orient which let's face it are literally under their noses.

Maybe they do and the Refs tell them to say nothing

Well remembered Wolfie and I recall that incident.
I didn’t explain myself properly but I was specifically referring to a ref allowing a goal and then ‘disallowing’ it after intervention from the 4th official.

Can’t ever remember seeing that.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I’ve been watching football for 60 years and I can’t ever remember a ref changing his decision in such circumstances.

Well done 4th official.

I would say "yes" a Ref HAS changed his mind before after intervention by 4th Official

I offer Tom Anderson v Chesterfield where Tom ( on a Yellow ) was up for a Corner and as play continued and he was already back in our half the Ref stopped play ( or ball may have gone dead ) and produced a Red for him

So the Ref had seen the corner , and the breakdown in play and decided no offences , but the Chessie player fell to the floor with having been hit or feigning a hit and it was the 4th Official who told the Ref what he thought he saw and Tom was off

I still don't see how the 4th Official saw that on the far side of the South Stand area , nor since how they DONT see fouls such as on Jamie Sterry against Orient which let's face it are literally under their noses.

Maybe they do and the Refs tell them to say nothing

Well remembered Wolfie and I recall that incident.
I didn’t explain myself properly but I was specifically referring to a ref allowing a goal and then ‘disallowing’ it after intervention from the 4th official.

Can’t ever remember seeing that.

Guidance from the FA.

Guidelines for Referees
Referees should ensure that, like assistant referees, the Fourth Official ‘assists’ with their match control. The primary responsibility for controlling the match remains with the referee who makes the final decision at all times. In discharging this responsibility it is expected that referees will only seek assistance from the Fourth Official in respect of significant match changing incidents which have been missed by the other three match officials and which are clearly visible to the Fourth Official. Such incidents are:
- red card offences
- yellow card offences (as these could lead to a player been dismissed for a second yellow card)
- penalty area offences (e.g. handball on the goal line to prevent or illegally score a goal)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.thefa.com/-/media/cfa/global/files/referees/fourth-official-guidance.ashx&ved=2ahUKEwjAt_S06riSAxXMUEEAHYBpOQUQFnoECB0QAQ&sqi=2&usg=AOvVaw1p8XMR6zmULQIy7Q5VuiIQ

[BillyStubbsTears]

Given that clear guidance, I assume the ref had to:

- First have a think about whether he had suspicions of there being an offence. It's clear from his immediate response that he did indeed have some suspicion.

- Then check with each of the linesmen.

- Then and ONLY then, check with the 4th Official.

- Then make a decision.

In that light, taking about 60 seconds to make the decision is not ridiculous.

[The Red Baron]

Given that clear guidance, I assume the ref had to:

- First have a think about whether he had suspicions of there being an offence. It's clear from his immediate response that he did indeed have some suspicion.

- Then check with each of the linesmen.

- Then and ONLY then, check with the 4th Official.

- Then make a decision.

In that light, taking about 60 seconds to make the decision is not ridiculous.

Where the officials have comms systems (as yesterday) it isn't necessary for the Assistant to raise the flag, or for the referee to go over and talk to the assistant. The same is true for comms between the referee and 4th official.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Given that clear guidance, I assume the ref had to:

- First have a think about whether he had suspicions of there being an offence. It's clear from his immediate response that he did indeed have some suspicion.

- Then check with each of the linesmen.

- Then and ONLY then, check with the 4th Official.

- Then make a decision.

In that light, taking about 60 seconds to make the decision is not ridiculous.

Where the officials have comms systems (as yesterday) it isn't necessary for the Assistant to raise the flag, or for the referee to go over and talk to the assistant. The same is true for comms between the referee and 4th official.

Agreed it's not "necessary". But it might be "advisable" if the 4th official is getting mobbed by one or both benches. Have the ref taken him to one side for a private discussion.

Might be wrong but I think the commentators yesterday saidxthe ref had gone over to speak to the 4th official.

Point is that there seems to be a general acceptance that the Rovers bench showed him a replay and that led to the change of decision. When, to the best of my knowledge there's absolutely no evidence that happened.

[drfchound]

This one

Well that is as clear as anything.