Viking Supporters Co-operative
Viking Chat => Viking Chat => Topic started by: donnydogk9 on January 28, 2023, 05:24:57 pm
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
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f**king hell when Donny Dog is weighing in you know time's up
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I'd keep Baldwin, the operations side of things has done pretty well under his watch. Blunt needs to go though.
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I'd keep Baldwin, the operations side of things has done pretty well under his watch. Blunt needs to go though.
Agreed. Sadly Coppinger has had little/no positive impact too.
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Think you’re right about copps. If he wasn’t who he is a lot would be asking questions. I think those questions unfortunately need to start being asked
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Why don’t some of you contact the Everton fans for hints. Morons isn’t the word. Be very very careful what some of you wish for
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Why don’t some of you contact the Everton fans for hints. Morons isn’t the word. Be very very careful what some of you wish for
So are you happy accepting what we are having to put up with and have had to put up with for the last 2 years?
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It’s not easy but look at what they have done too
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Have you presented your business plan to the owners.
It’s one thing wanting them to sell but another getting someone to buy
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It’s not easy but look at what they have done too
You mean like managing to take us to league 2 mid table mediocrity with no signs of any improvement in the near future?
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Have you presented your business plan to the owners.
It’s one thing wanting them to sell but another getting someone to buy
It’s hard to attract new owners when know one knows the club is available
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It’s not easy but look at what they have done too
Just what successes have they achieved?
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Have you presented your business plan to the owners.
It’s one thing wanting them to sell but another getting someone to buy
Unless the club is put up for sale no one will put an offer up.
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Baldwin - Keep
Blunt - sack now!!!
Copps - give him a bit more time, but his wicket is quickly starting to look a bit shoddy
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Baldwin - Keep
Blunt - sack now!!!
Copps - give him a bit more time, but his wicket is quickly starting to look a bit shoddy
There is only one person who could sack Blunt and he is never going to do that.
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I'd keep Baldwin, the operations side of things has done pretty well under his watch. Blunt needs to go though.
Bang on.
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Wasn't JR pressured into getting rid of his mate Dave Morris because he was incompetent. Time to get rid of your incompetent mate, Terry.
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I’d agree about blunt.
Today though at 2-1 to them I was certain we would at least draw we were all over them and the best 15-20 mins we’ve played this season but again mistakes cost us.
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Wasn't JR pressured into getting rid of his mate Dave Morris because he was incompetent. Time to get rid of your incompetent mate, Terry.
Dave Morris was the CEO though, an employee.
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Agree with that Dickos - individual errors cost us today hindered by the ref
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Thinking at the Hartlepool we could do a protest banner against the board! All stand outside the east stand with it before the game and don’t enter the stadium until 3:15pm
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Think you’re right about copps. If he wasn’t who he is a lot would be asking questions. I think those questions unfortunately need to start being asked
Loved Copps as a player but i suspected he was given this role to keep fans on side. Little progress seen as yet.
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Agree with that Dickos - individual errors cost us today hindered by the ref
I believe today was his first appointment reffing a league 2 game. He missed a blatant penalty on Seaman in the 1st half but I thought he was equally bad for both sides.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
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Thinking at the Hartlepool we could do a protest banner against the board! All stand outside the east stand with it before the game and don’t enter the stadium until 3:15pm
Excuse me if I don’t join you
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
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Thinking at the Hartlepool we could do a protest banner against the board! All stand outside the east stand with it before the game and don’t enter the stadium until 3:15pm
No thanks
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A protest. Got to laugh. Protest at a board that have paid their own money into the club for years.
A protest what happened with Richardson yes. Reality and perspective people
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Agree with that Dickos - individual errors cost us today hindered by the ref
I believe today was his first appointment reffing a league 2 game. He missed a blatant penalty on Seaman in the 1st half but I thought he was equally bad for both sides.
He was definitely better for them, the throw in he gave them was just pathetic
Their bloke just kicked it out
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Think you’re right about copps. If he wasn’t who he is a lot would be asking questions. I think those questions unfortunately need to start being asked
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I won’t question coops as a player. But hof was a job he probably instigated for himself. And so far his influence and existence as hof is questionable
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
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A totally different league I know, but the Man Utd publicly announced they were seeking investment or sale. And they got loads of offers and are now down to the final 3.
Surely if the club announced the club was “seeking investment or sale” and did a massive press release on it, it would attract interest.
Different audiences I know, but you get my point.
The board need to make a statement, are they going to invest or seek investment and sell up.
There is simply two option, we cannot continue any longer like this.
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It wouldn't surprise me if TB is making the club self-sustaining as part of a long-term plan to give the club to the fans when he's no longer here.
It'd certainly be interesting to see what the 'sack the board' people would make of that.
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It wouldn't surprise me if TB is making the club self-sustaining as part of a long-term plan to give the club to the fans when he's no longer here.
It'd certainly be interesting to see what the 'sack the board' people would make of that.
An existential crisis?
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A totally different league I know, but the Man Utd publicly announced they were seeking investment or sale. And they got loads of offers and are now down to the final 3.
Surely if the club announced the club was “seeking investment or sale” and did a massive press release on it, it would attract interest.
Different audiences I know, but you get my point.
The board need to make a statement, are they going to invest or seek investment and sell up.
There is simply two option, we cannot continue any longer like this.
Completely different.
I don't see why our board need to make any statement.
Man Utd is a public company listed on the stock market, they have to make announcements like that.
And of course Man Utd are a sustainable club, but I don't see anybody rabbiting on about them in the same way.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
Maybe just sell to who ever and when you went up with a Scunthorpe or Bury situation either way the board can't win.
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Absolutely spot on. Can't just sell to any random person who might have a few quid for a season or two but then what?
For what the fans want it's a big ask funding wise and there aren't many around willing to do it if any at all. Footballs a mess, if you're the lucky ones great, but the other half get nowhere.
That doesn't excuse defeats like today though, the budget of ours is absolutely no issue compared to some of the clubs defeating us.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
Maybe just sell to who ever and when you went up with a Scunthorpe or Bury situation either way the board can't win.
Yep.
Peter Swann was meant to be the shining white knight coming in to rescue Scunthorpe from a 'lack of investment' during the Steve Wharton days!!
Interesting to note that the new owners at Scunthorpe when making their first statement said that the priority is to make the club sustainable!
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
Maybe just sell to who ever and when you went up with a Scunthorpe or Bury situation either way the board can't win.
Yep.
Peter Swann was meant to be the shining white knight coming in to rescue Scunthorpe from a 'lack of investment' during the Steve Wharton days!!
Interesting to note that the new owners at Scunthorpe when making their first statement said that the priority is to make the club sustainable!
The bas**rds!!
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The banners will be ordered tomorrow happy to self fund.
Time to make our feelings know!
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The simple fact is we gifted them their 1st 3 goals with atrocious defending.
We also missed 3 absolute sitters which either of my grandmothers should have scored ( if they were still here )
If we can’t do the basic job of defending and scoring then we will not win a football match.
1st half we were insipid, putting it politely. We gave them a heads up after what was it 50 secs. Mansfield were pretty poor and we made it easy for them.
DS should have changed it after 25/30 mins as it wasn’t working.
Close and Biggins were over run in midfield. Outnumbered basically.
Tactically naive. He needs to be much more reactive to what’s happening on the pitch.
H/T 2-0 down due to not defending properly. 2nd goal was a joke we gave them the ball back 3 times.
DS puts something in the players tea and makes 2 correct substitutions
Seaman simply is not good enough imo. He can’t cross a ball and if you are a wing back you have to be able to do that.
Molyneux is just not firing. Has ability but confidence doesn’t see to be there with him at present. So right 2 players went off.
Replaced by Brown at RWB and Lavery goes up front with George Miller.
We come out firing on all cylinders and look like a football team.
George Hurst who had a free role 2nd half puts us back in the game with a great piece of skill and accomplished finish.
We are all over them like a rash and only one team going to score the next goal.
But oh no we self destruct again with a total mix up at the back between Anderson and Williams. ( Sorry how anyone can blame Mitchell is beyond me ) he was where he should have been. He didn’t know the defenders were going to mess up did he.
So now 3-1 down and our momentum is flattened. We huff and puff and then due to throwing players forward concede the 4th goal.
At 2-1 we miss a sitter and at 3-1 miss 2 sitters. Why are we trying to walk the ball into the net or dribble around the keeper when in clear sight of goal. Pull the trigger and shoot.
So even with that appalling defending we could and should have won that game.
Mansfield are very average and we gave them 3 points.
There were sign in that 2nd half of the makings of a team.
We were ripping them to shreds for 15/20 mins.
So because we lost it is the boards fault. Sack the lot other them.
I don’t remember Bramall, Blunt & Baldwin being on the pitch this afternoon or in any other game we have played.
Without them we have no football club. There is no queue at the door to take over.
Bramall has said that if there was someone who wanted the club he would sell. Providing they had serious funds and had the best interests of the club at heart.
No one knocking on the door.
Do some of you understand that. It’s not rocket science.
There needs to be some perspective after a defeat, especially one like today. This was not a similar performance to the Tranmere Rovers Boxing Day defeat.
We don’t need this pathetic posturing, ranting and raving. It really is quite embarrassing reading some of the posts on this forum this eve.
There are a few that need to grow up.
Too early to make an assessment on DS. He needs the Summer to build his squad as he wants.
But what I would say is please DS play Lavery up with Miller because if you can’t grasp the fact that Miller can’t play the lone striker role then I do have serious concerns you are not the right man being the manager/ head coach.
George Miller is not physically capable being a lone target man.
Let’s get the best out of him and use his strengths.
Yes massive disappointment today but I saw a few green shoots.
Olowu must come back into the team asap.
We have to stop conceding really bad goals. Today they were more than bad.
Onwards and upwards. :)
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
Maybe just sell to who ever and when you went up with a Scunthorpe or Bury situation either way the board can't win.
Yep.
Peter Swann was meant to be the shining white knight coming in to rescue Scunthorpe from a 'lack of investment' during the Steve Wharton days!!
Interesting to note that the new owners at Scunthorpe when making their first statement said that the priority is to make the club sustainable!
The bas**rds!!
they'll do like all the other owners do. The new owners are supposedly property developers.
Only my opinion but they may possibly do as York and other clubs have done. Sell the ground that they OWN and then push for the local authority to build a ground that they RENT and then sell of the land of Glandford Park no doubt.
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Are Fleetwood, Burton Albion, Accrington Stanley, Cheltenham, to name a few, sustainable. All doing better than us on gates of less than 3500/4000. Maybe they're better run & switched on more than ourselves.
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Think you might be out of pocket with those banners
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Well said Campsall
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The simple fact is we gifted them their 1st 3 goals with atrocious defending.
We also missed 3 absolute sitters which either of my grandmothers should have scored ( if they were still here )
If we can’t do the basic job of defending and scoring then we will not win a football match.
1st half we were insipid, putting it politely. We gave them a heads up after what was it 50 secs. Mansfield were pretty poor and we made it easy for them.
DS should have changed it after 25/30 mins as it wasn’t working.
Close and Biggins were over run in midfield. Outnumbered basically.
Tactically naive. He needs to be much more reactive to what’s happening on the pitch.
H/T 2-0 down due to not defending properly. 2nd goal was a joke we gave them the ball back 3 times.
DS puts something in the players tea and makes 2 correct substitutions
Seaman simply is not good enough imo. He can’t cross a ball and if you are a wing back you have to be able to do that.
Molyneux is just not firing. Has ability but confidence doesn’t see to be there with him at present. So right 2 players went off.
Replaced by Brown at RWB and Lavery goes up front with George Miller.
We come out firing on all cylinders and look like a football team.
George Hurst who had a free role 2nd half puts us back in the game with a great piece of skill and accomplished finish.
We are all over them like a rash and only one team going to score the next goal.
But oh no we self destruct again with a total mix up at the back between Anderson and Williams. ( Sorry how anyone can blame Mitchell is beyond me ) he was where he should have been. He didn’t know the defenders were going to mess up did he.
So now 3-1 down and our momentum is flattened. We huff and puff and then due to throwing players forward concede the 4th goal.
At 2-1 we miss a sitter and at 3-1 miss 2 sitters. Why are we trying to walk the ball into the net or dribble around the keeper when in clear sight of goal. Pull the trigger and shoot.
So even with that appalling defending we could and should have won that game.
Mansfield are very average and we gave them 3 points.
There were sign in that 2nd half of the makings of a team.
We were ripping them to shreds for 15/20 mins.
So because we lost it is the boards fault. Sack the lot other them.
I don’t remember Bramall, Blunt & Baldwin being on the pitch this afternoon or in any other game we have played.
Without them we have no football club. There is no queue at the door to take over.
Bramall has said that if there was someone who wanted the club he would sell. Providing they had serious funds and had the best interests of the club at heart.
No one knocking on the door.
Do some of you understand that. It’s not rocket science.
There needs to be some perspective after a defeat, especially one like today. This was not a similar performance to the Tranmere Rovers Boxing Day defeat.
We don’t need this pathetic posturing, ranting and raving. It really is quite embarrassing reading some of the posts on this forum this eve.
There are a few that need to grow up.
Too early to make an assessment on DS. He needs the Summer to build his squad as he wants.
But what I would say is please DS play Lavery up with Miller because if you can’t grasp the fact that Miller can’t play the lone striker role then I do have serious concerns you are not the right man being the manager/ head coach.
George Miller is not physically capable being a lone target man.
Let’s get the best out of him and use his strengths.
Yes massive disappointment today but I saw a few green shoots.
Olowu must come back into the team asap.
We have to stop conceding really bad goals. Today they were more than bad.
Onwards and upwards. :)
this
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Well said Campsall
Thanks. Some one needed to say it.
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Yep got to agree with all that CR
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Well said campsall rover I wonder how long the banner wavers have been supporting rovers through the good and bad days?
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The board own the club.
They dont sack themselves unless a big trusted money person comes forward to buy the club.
Which ain’t happening anytime soon.
Unless of course you entertain the likes of eco power.
Which is a sure fire route one to oblivion.
Be very careful what you wish for.
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I totally agree Campsall.
I had the misfortune to be sat near loads of idiots standing throughout and chanting sack the board. Some were the daft brown checkered scarf mob who spent the whole game gesturing at the home fans like they do in the playground. Some were older blokes who should know better. All were boys or blokes though. It’s never females.
I’m embarrassed by these silly little boys and men. They are the reason I made no effort to bring the wife and kids. I knew it would be like that and it’s horrible. The scab chants are still slightly funny but I know these characters probably aren’t in unions these days and don’t have a clue about any of the history and politics, or care about it. ‘Hope lies in the proles’. So unfortunately there is still very little hope.
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Be careful what you wish for guys .
Whilst I understand things aren't brilliant right now and many Rovers fans are understandably frustrated at least the present ownership are Doncaster people and fans .
It goes a long way does that and I speak from experience with the ownership who took over at Oakwell from the late Patrick Cryne .
Local people and fans running your club are gold dust in this day and age .
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I totally agree Campsall.
I had the misfortune to be sat near loads of idiots standing throughout and chanting sack the board. Some were the daft brown checkered scarf mob who spent the whole game gesturing at the home fans like they do in the playground. Some were older blokes who should know better. All were boys or blokes though. It’s never females.
I’m embarrassed by these silly little boys and men. They are the reason I made no effort to bring the wife and kids. I knew it would be like that and it’s horrible. The scab chants are still slightly funny but I know these characters probably aren’t in unions these days and don’t have a clue about any of the history and politics, or care about it. ‘Hope lies in the proles’. So unfortunately there is still very little hope.
I moved because my seat was amongst thise you mention. This post supports my feeling for not attending more away games
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Pretty clear they’d sell to the right person as far as I can see. We should be fairly attractive to buy really. Starting at a low point which lets the new owner enjoy hopefully a bounce.
Then as self sustaining club any cash they want to put in will go on the fun stuff, new players, instead of keeping the lights on. That said multi millionaires don’t grow on trees.
In the meantime Blunt should take a step back (if possible to get any further away). Give copps the coming summer window to implement recruitment and see how we’re looking (think the summer window wasn’t that bad). If Copps doesn’t work out you’d again argue Blunt is guilty of lazy decisions. Hire someone outside the club with some sort of record please
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Thinking at the Hartlepool we could do a protest banner against the board! All stand outside the east stand with it before the game and don’t enter the stadium until 3:15pm
As said previously on this topic be careful what you wish for and as for standing outside until 3.15 I personally think that you’ll be lucky to muster 20 people and they won’t stand there for 15 minutes. I see you doing it on Saturday not the Tuesday verse’s Tranmere because that’s a school night
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Be careful what you wish for guys .
Whilst I understand things aren't brilliant right now and many Rovers fans are understandably frustrated at least the present ownership are Doncaster people and fans .
It goes a long way does that and I speak from experience with the ownership who took over at Oakwell from the late Patrick Cryne .
Local people and fans running your club are gold dust in this day and age .
Absolutely Tyke.
The thing is Bramall isn’t a fan though in the true sense of the word.
John Ryan was a fan.
That’s the difference. The problem was JR did not have enough money to do what he wanted to do. Hence bringing in Bramall and Watson to help him.
Watson has since passed away and he was a Rovers fan.
If JR had the wealth that TB has then spending 50 million getting Rovers up to the top end of the Championship I am sure would not be prohibitive.
It is TB’s money and he has the right to spend it as he sees fit.
The fact is he has spent upwards of 20 million of his personal wealth over the last 16/17 years.
The goal was to make the club financially stable so that he didn’t need to keep putting in money each season to balance the books.
That has now been achieved thanks to both Blunt and Baldwin.
Now does TB want to spend more to help the club get back to the Championship or even League 1 ?
The fact is unless there is a very very wealthy JR knocking on the door to buy the club then there is absolutely nothing any one of us can do or moan about.
At least we know we won’t end up in meltdown like so many other clubs have under this ownership.
We do have a competitive budget to get out of this league. It’s now all about clever recruitment and good coaching and player management.
Is DS the right man? The jury is out. We have to give him the summer for further recruitment and let’s see where we are at end of November 2023.
From where we were at the end of last season maybe our expectations of promotion this season were unrealistic. Personally I think we should be capable of top 7
This is not a great League. Far from it imo.
If we don’t achieve it this season then so be it.
Next season we should be competing for a top 3 place. If we are not comfortably in the top 7 by November then we are underachieving big time and DS’s time probably is up.
We would then need to look at an experienced manager as the current strategy will not have achieved its goals.
But some of our fans are behaving like spoilt children Some are living in cloud cookoo land. Some both of those.
Get real, smell the coffee and live in the real world.
All Rovers fans want DRFC to be successful. Fortunately there are some of us that can see the big picture.
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The banners will be ordered tomorrow happy to self fund.
Time to make our feelings know!
Might be an idea to decide what you want rather than what you don't want, or who as the case may be.
The amount of sh*te we've seen being thrown in all directions, hoping it sticks is just ridiculous!
It boils down to protesting because we lose football matches and you're not quite sure who to blame!
Instead of wasting money on banners, why not take out an advert in the Financial Times..."Debt free Community Football club seeks Multi Millionaire willing to invest to achieve succes for it's downtrodden, hard done by fans"
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Who's going to buy us and take us over though? The fans?
I suppose if you don't put a "For Sale" sign up you will never know?
It doesn't work like that. Most sales are instigated by the EFL, or I should say that they act as intermediaries.
Selling the club is not a problem, its a sustainable club after all, but selling to someone with the right intentions is the issue.
Maybe just sell to who ever and when you went up with a Scunthorpe or Bury situation either way the board can't win.
Yep.
Peter Swann was meant to be the shining white knight coming in to rescue Scunthorpe from a 'lack of investment' during the Steve Wharton days!!
Interesting to note that the new owners at Scunthorpe when making their first statement said that the priority is to make the club sustainable!
Sustainable at what level of football?, I initially thought the Board meant Championship Level, can you clarify which level of football they intend taking the club down to?
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The banners will be ordered tomorrow happy to self fund.
Time to make our feelings know!
You might want to wait until Monday so that your English teacher can help with your spelling lol!
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It wouldn't surprise me if TB is making the club self-sustaining as part of a long-term plan to give the club to the fans when he's no longer here.
It'd certainly be interesting to see what the 'sack the board' people would make of that.
I said this years ago.
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If that WAS TB’s intention to give the club back to the supporters,then perhaps he would have made more effort of supporter inclusion. A voice of reason at times when defeats seem the last straw . Too many changes of players and managers with no obvious direction or ambition being talked about by Bramall. We’ve become another per annual L2 club who’s supporters are more ambitious than its owners !
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Well said Camps fully agree with your comments. Remember back in the 50s the local Pork Butcher used to stick a few quid in each year to top up the money taken on the gates (eg Bob Lord at Burnley ). Mind you back in those days no television to get your football fix so we could'nt see how the other half lived. Times have changed.
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Be careful what you wish for guys .
Whilst I understand things aren't brilliant right now and many Rovers fans are understandably frustrated at least the present ownership are Doncaster people and fans .
It goes a long way does that and I speak from experience with the ownership who took over at Oakwell from the late Patrick Cryne .
Local people and fans running your club are gold dust in this day and age .
Absolutely Tyke.
The thing is Bramall isn’t a fan though in the true sense of the word.
John Ryan was a fan.
That’s the difference. The problem was JR did not have enough money to do what he wanted to do. Hence bringing in Bramall and Watson to help him.
Watson has since passed away and he was a Rovers fan.
If JR had the wealth that TB has then spending 50 million getting Rovers up to the top end of the Championship I am sure would not be prohibitive.
It is TB’s money and he has the right to spend it as he sees fit.
The fact is he has spent upwards of 20 million of his personal wealth over the last 16/17 years.
The goal was to make the club financially stable so that he didn’t need to keep putting in money each season to balance the books.
That has now been achieved thanks to both Blunt and Baldwin.
Now does TB want to spend more to help the club get back to the Championship or even League 1 ?
The fact is unless there is a very very wealthy JR knocking on the door to buy the club then there is absolutely nothing any one of us can do or moan about.
At least we know we won’t end up in meltdown like so many other clubs have under this ownership.
We do have a competitive budget to get out of this league. It’s now all about clever recruitment and good coaching and player management.
Is DS the right man? The jury is out. We have to give him the summer for further recruitment and let’s see where we are at end of November 2023.
From where we were at the end of last season maybe our expectations of promotion this season were unrealistic. Personally I think we should be capable of top 7
This is not a great League. Far from it imo.
If we don’t achieve it this season then so be it.
Next season we should be competing for a top 3 place. If we are not comfortably in the top 7 by November then we are underachieving big time and DS’s time probably is up.
We would then need to look at an experienced manager as the current strategy will not have achieved its goals.
But some of our fans are behaving like spoilt children Some are living in cloud cookoo land. Some both of those.
Get real, smell the coffee and live in the real world.
All Rovers fans want DRFC to be successful. Fortunately there are some of us that can see the big picture.
whoa.....another sensible post
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Be careful what you wish for guys .
Whilst I understand things aren't brilliant right now and many Rovers fans are understandably frustrated at least the present ownership are Doncaster people and fans .
It goes a long way does that and I speak from experience with the ownership who took over at Oakwell from the late Patrick Cryne .
Local people and fans running your club are gold dust in this day and age .
Absolutely Tyke.
The thing is Bramall isn’t a fan though in the true sense of the word.
John Ryan was a fan.
That’s the difference. The problem was JR did not have enough money to do what he wanted to do. Hence bringing in Bramall and Watson to help him.
Watson has since passed away and he was a Rovers fan.
If JR had the wealth that TB has then spending 50 million getting Rovers up to the top end of the Championship I am sure would not be prohibitive.
It is TB’s money and he has the right to spend it as he sees fit.
The fact is he has spent upwards of 20 million of his personal wealth over the last 16/17 years.
The goal was to make the club financially stable so that he didn’t need to keep putting in money each season to balance the books.
That has now been achieved thanks to both Blunt and Baldwin.
Now does TB want to spend more to help the club get back to the Championship or even League 1 ?
The fact is unless there is a very very wealthy JR knocking on the door to buy the club then there is absolutely nothing any one of us can do or moan about.
At least we know we won’t end up in meltdown like so many other clubs have under this ownership.
We do have a competitive budget to get out of this league. It’s now all about clever recruitment and good coaching and player management.
Is DS the right man? The jury is out. We have to give him the summer for further recruitment and let’s see where we are at end of November 2023.
From where we were at the end of last season maybe our expectations of promotion this season were unrealistic. Personally I think we should be capable of top 7
This is not a great League. Far from it imo.
If we don’t achieve it this season then so be it.
Next season we should be competing for a top 3 place. If we are not comfortably in the top 7 by November then we are underachieving big time and DS’s time probably is up.
We would then need to look at an experienced manager as the current strategy will not have achieved its goals.
But some of our fans are behaving like spoilt children Some are living in cloud cookoo land. Some both of those.
Get real, smell the coffee and live in the real world.
All Rovers fans want DRFC to be successful. Fortunately there are some of us that can see the big picture.
That last paragraph has hit the nail on the head. To some being successful is its being in the championship competing on a sloping g pitch with teams coming down from the Premier league.
To others its having a club to pass onto our kids and grandkids.
We will win trophies in the future but having a club at the end of the day is much more important than lumping everything on red.
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The banners will be ordered tomorrow happy to self fund.
“Time to make our feelings know!“
Hope the spelling and grammar are ok, that would be quite embarrassing. :laugh:
I can just image “Bramill git out ov r club”
:facepalm: For the record I think our owners have done a great job, and to still be placing 1-2 million in each year of their own money, with no wish for it back!
Really hope you people do not succeed in this, but do hope the club starts to look at itself and how it is performing. We are right on the edge here and it could go either way.
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I really get fed up of reading comments from some of the rose tinted glasses brigade on here.
We have been told the the club is now running sustainably and TB no longer needs to put in any money to keep the club going.
Why do some people have a problem believing this????
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Don’t read them then simple
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Be careful what you wish for guys .
Whilst I understand things aren't brilliant right now and many Rovers fans are understandably frustrated at least the present ownership are Doncaster people and fans .
It goes a long way does that and I speak from experience with the ownership who took over at Oakwell from the late Patrick Cryne .
Local people and fans running your club are gold dust in this day and age .
Absolutely Tyke.
The thing is Bramall isn’t a fan though in the true sense of the word.
John Ryan was a fan.
That’s the difference. The problem was JR did not have enough money to do what he wanted to do. Hence bringing in Bramall and Watson to help him.
Watson has since passed away and he was a Rovers fan.
If JR had the wealth that TB has then spending 50 million getting Rovers up to the top end of the Championship I am sure would not be prohibitive.
It is TB’s money and he has the right to spend it as he sees fit.
The fact is he has spent upwards of 20 million of his personal wealth over the last 16/17 years.
The goal was to make the club financially stable so that he didn’t need to keep putting in money each season to balance the books.
That has now been achieved thanks to both Blunt and Baldwin.
Now does TB want to spend more to help the club get back to the Championship or even League 1 ?
The fact is unless there is a very very wealthy JR knocking on the door to buy the club then there is absolutely nothing any one of us can do or moan about.
At least we know we won’t end up in meltdown like so many other clubs have under this ownership.
We do have a competitive budget to get out of this league. It’s now all about clever recruitment and good coaching and player management.
Is DS the right man? The jury is out. We have to give him the summer for further recruitment and let’s see where we are at end of November 2023.
From where we were at the end of last season maybe our expectations of promotion this season were unrealistic. Personally I think we should be capable of top 7
This is not a great League. Far from it imo.
If we don’t achieve it this season then so be it.
Next season we should be competing for a top 3 place. If we are not comfortably in the top 7 by November then we are underachieving big time and DS’s time probably is up.
We would then need to look at an experienced manager as the current strategy will not have achieved its goals.
But some of our fans are behaving like spoilt children Some are living in cloud cookoo land. Some both of those.
Get real, smell the coffee and live in the real world.
All Rovers fans want DRFC to be successful. Fortunately there are some of us that can see the big picture.
That last paragraph has hit the nail on the head. To some being successful is its being in the championship competing on a sloping g pitch with teams coming down from the Premier league.
To others its having a club to pass onto our kids and grandkids.
We will win trophies in the future but having a club at the end of the day is much more important than lumping everything on red.
I echo this, good post CR. We had proper Rovers fans at heart owning the club but unfortunately whilst the Board may have the Doncaster community as a driver, not the Rovers per se. The jury is out with DS, i hope he will succeed given his Donny roots etc and he is going to need time to implement his style of play, players that fit this, but as well as the longer term, we are crying out for more quality now, particularly for me in the final third to supplement Miller and be able to play two up top.
Lavery looked lively when he came on, but Agard and Griffiths are clearly surplus to requirements and neither looks to be able to do 90 minutes consistently so we do need another forward at least, and for me someone with some physical presence as an alternative option. Can we do some much needed further business before the window shuts, we shall see. Won't even start on the defensive frailties, at least the new right back looked better second half. Seaman' was poor though should have been awarded a penalty and Molyneux yet again coasting with zero end product.
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I totally agree Campsall.
I had the misfortune to be sat near loads of idiots standing throughout and chanting sack the board. Some were the daft brown checkered scarf mob who spent the whole game gesturing at the home fans like they do in the playground. Some were older blokes who should know better. All were boys or blokes though. It’s never females.
I’m embarrassed by these silly little boys and men. They are the reason I made no effort to bring the wife and kids. I knew it would be like that and it’s horrible. The scab chants are still slightly funny but I know these characters probably aren’t in unions these days and don’t have a clue about any of the history and politics, or care about it. ‘Hope lies in the proles’. So unfortunately there is still very little hope.
I moved because my seat was amongst thise you mention. This post supports my feeling for not attending more away games
My feelings as well Raven.
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I totally agree Campsall.
I had the misfortune to be sat near loads of idiots standing throughout and chanting sack the board. Some were the daft brown checkered scarf mob who spent the whole game gesturing at the home fans like they do in the playground. Some were older blokes who should know better. All were boys or blokes though. It’s never females.
I’m embarrassed by these silly little boys and men. They are the reason I made no effort to bring the wife and kids. I knew it would be like that and it’s horrible. The scab chants are still slightly funny but I know these characters probably aren’t in unions these days and don’t have a clue about any of the history and politics, or care about it. ‘Hope lies in the proles’. So unfortunately there is still very little hope.
I moved because my seat was amongst thise you mention. This post supports my feeling for not attending more away games
They are absolute pond life. A complete embarrassment. Not a scooby how the world works. Unfortunately some them can type a bit and shout. Self entitled narcissistic fools the lot of them.
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Don’t read them then simple
Just the kind of reply I would expect from you.
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Thank you sir
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The banners will be ordered tomorrow happy to self fund.
“Time to make our feelings know!“
Hope the spelling and grammar are ok, that would be quite embarrassing. :laugh:
I can just image “Bramill git out ov r club”
:facepalm: For the record I think our owners have done a great job, and to still be placing 1-2 million in each year of their own money, with no wish for it back!
Really hope you people do not succeed in this, but do hope the club starts to look at itself and how it is performing. We are right on the edge here and it could go either way.
they have done a good job yes in previous years, but are we not sustainable now? So they won’t be putting a million or 2 in?
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It’s a good question bpoolrover- I often thought when it’s been said “we are sustainable” - just how sustainable, if an owner is putting money in.
I am sure they can say the club could run, if needed, without the added funds - but makes you wonder where we would be, as a truly sustainable club!
The truth is, I don’t care about the money side, I am happy we have a stable owner, and a club to watch. It’s not been great to watch for a couple of years, but it’s been a lot worse over the years, and these newer fans, and some older ones need to be careful what they wish for.
We’ve had bad owners/custodians and in no way is TB one of those - I can only see that he has done good to the club.
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I totally agree Campsall.
I had the misfortune to be sat near loads of idiots standing throughout and chanting sack the board. Some were the daft brown checkered scarf mob who spent the whole game gesturing at the home fans like they do in the playground. Some were older blokes who should know better. All were boys or blokes though. It’s never females.
I’m embarrassed by these silly little boys and men. They are the reason I made no effort to bring the wife and kids. I knew it would be like that and it’s horrible. The scab chants are still slightly funny but I know these characters probably aren’t in unions these days and don’t have a clue about any of the history and politics, or care about it. ‘Hope lies in the proles’. So unfortunately there is still very little hope.
I moved because my seat was amongst thise you mention. This post supports my feeling for not attending more away games
They are absolute pond life. A complete embarrassment. Not a scooby how the world works. Unfortunately some them can type a bit and shout. Self entitled narcissistic fools the lot of them.
Games like Mansfield away will always attract the pond life. Those who seek confrontation with supporters of other teams and even within their own club.
They weren’t at Colchester, or Orient. And I suspect they won’t be at Crawley or Sutton.
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With their little checked scarves ready to pull up so they can't be recognised
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With their little checked scarves ready to pull up so they can't be recognised
And would run a mile if anyone even looked like going toe to toe with them.
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We all know that multi-millionaire prospective football club owners don't grow on trees and nobody seems to be beating our door down to buy the club. That said, these people do exist and from time to time you get a club like Gillingham being taken over and made competitive with numerous quality signings.
If someone wants to buy a club in the football league and take it on an upward journey I can't think of a better prospect than Donny.
We've got a business that currently breaks even, no debt to pay off on takeover, a good stadium for the level we're at and the two above, good training facilities and the potential of a large catchment area.
In the Bulbshare survey following Gavin's statement I asked how pro-active the owners are in seeking co-investors/a sale seeing as Gavin mentioned any additional investment going straight into the playing budget. It would be good to hear some sort of a response to this from the owners/directors.
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With their little checked scarves ready to pull up so they can't be recognised
I saw young man wearing a scarf like that and I thought it was a Stags supporter
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Just facts, the board have put enough money into the club to be a reasonable success at Division1 and 2 level of football.
Get this some of the players we have are not as good as some players playing in the football pyramids below the level we play at.
The so called professional people on the playing and player identification side of the club have not done their job as well as clubs like Accrington and Morecambe, and have brought in players from higher levels than they have in the game, or so called higher levels like u23s from Manchester United, that is not particularly the boards fault in my opinion. and is the result of basically the modern way of taking that responsibility away from the manager, and to be honest I see little improvement, in fact we have gone backwards.
Every successful team we have put together has been by the man at the helm and experienced men around him who could recognise talent that suited the way he wanted to play, the team we have no way suit the way our manager wants to play the game, they are not of a sufficient standard, one or the other has to give and that will take time unless the manager plays a system that starts to suit the players we have in house.
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At the minute due to the football side failing, they are sustaining failure.
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I really get fed up of reading comments from some of the rose tinted glasses brigade on here.
We have been told the the club is now running sustainably and TB no longer needs to put in any money to keep the club going.
Why do some people have a problem believing this????
If I may, the club make noises on budgets and their size, yet the results, players past, and ex-managers all say very differently. With that, can you be surprised fans questions statements when they are hearing differently from people ITK?
In terms of the board they have done a lot of good and thats to be commended. Made the club a more professional operation, made us more sustainable, and during 2017-2020 ran a very successful, entertaining ship.
But lets face the situation we're now in. We've had 2 rather rubbish horrendous years from the end of Moore through to now. Times are hard, budgets are tight and the Rovers like a lot of things have to justify that season ticket.
Yes we won't spend our money on other comparable clubs because we support and love Rovers, but if you pay your hard earned cash on a club getting trounced every other week - you are going to question if you should keep putting in. Especially if you hear noises on money and transfers, and see utter dross entering instead.
I'm in 2 minds. I see Scunthorpe and York and think thank god we haven't got that on our doorstep - but I also feel like we're settling at a level that maybe historically is roughly where we belong ; but is also only ever one bad year from non-league again.
One other factor to add/ask: The owner is getting on a bit, and I do think he should look to sell - if so we have time to prepare a succession for the good of the club. Should the worst happen whilst he still owns the club - what would happen / who'd own his shares? and would they look to sell quick or responsibly?
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Good post, commenting on your comments that we are historically roughly where we belong, basically I agree, but we have also built up a very decent fan base since the dark days, & that should at least have us sustaining (there's that word again) league 1 status, don't think there are many, if any that have our attendances & are mid/lower table in league 2.
I know we are where we are, but surely we should be better than this. Won't be long if we carry on that our attendances dwindle back down.
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If we were top of the league the board would be seen as doing a great job. How can you judge people upstairs by how well the teams centre forward takes his chances.
Yes I would like to see them push the boat out a bit with a couple of quality signings.
They won’t do that because they are very careful owners not wanting to get to the stage where we owe far too much money out.
There needs to be a balancing act between the ways of doing things.
If a player becomes available and he costs a fee we need to be able to get that player if it’s a good deal. The manager must be given a decent chance of succeeding while also keeping an eye on club finances.
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If we were top of the league the board would be seen as doing a great job. How can you judge people upstairs by how well the teams centre forward takes his chances.
Yes I would like to see them push the boat out a bit with a couple of quality signings.
They won’t do that because they are very careful owners not wanting to get to the stage where we owe far too much money out.
There needs to be a balancing act between the ways of doing things.
If a player becomes available and he costs a fee we need to be able to get that player if it’s a good deal. The manager must be given a decent chance of succeeding while also keeping an eye on club finances.
Look at the calibre of players other teams in our league have brought in that are wanting promotion. What we have brought in doesnt even come close to them and them clubs wont go into financial shit yet our budget is suppose to be one of biggest? What a load of shite that is.
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If we were top of the league the board would be seen as doing a great job. How can you judge people upstairs by how well the teams centre forward takes his chances.
Yes I would like to see them push the boat out a bit with a couple of quality signings.
They won’t do that because they are very careful owners not wanting to get to the stage where we owe far too much money out.
There needs to be a balancing act between the ways of doing things.
If a player becomes available and he costs a fee we need to be able to get that player if it’s a good deal. The manager must be given a decent chance of succeeding while also keeping an eye on club finances.
Look at the calibre of players other teams in our league have brought in that are wanting promotion. What we have brought in doesnt even come close to them and them clubs wont go into financial shit yet our budget is suppose to be one of biggest? What a load of shite that is.
Agreed, these clubs seem to have drive & ambition, even with smaller fanbases & budgets, that ambition just doesn't seem to be at our club anymore.
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Be careful of what you wish for certainly springs to mind. Whilst I am not privy to the intracacies of how the club has been funded presumably much of the money going in from the board has been in the form of loans. I believe when JR walked away he generously wrote off his loans. But if our current doners were to recall theirs on exit presumably they would have the right to sell off club assets to fund the payback, the club training ground for example which might make good money as a development site. We rely upon their largesse and screaming for their demise could all go wrong very badly.
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If we were top of the league the board would be seen as doing a great job. How can you judge people upstairs by how well the teams centre forward takes his chances.
Yes I would like to see them push the boat out a bit with a couple of quality signings.
They won’t do that because they are very careful owners not wanting to get to the stage where we owe far too much money out.
There needs to be a balancing act between the ways of doing things.
If a player becomes available and he costs a fee we need to be able to get that player if it’s a good deal. The manager must be given a decent chance of succeeding while also keeping an eye on club finances.
We’re not top of the league though, and we aren’t going in the right direction, we rely too much on sentimental appointments that aren’t working
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
Good idea, I hear Peel Holdings are looking for more land!
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Sack the board? Be very careful for what you wish for!
COYR
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Be careful of what you wish for certainly springs to mind. Whilst I am not privy to the intracacies of how the club has been funded presumably much of the money going in from the board has been in the form of loans. I believe when JR walked away he generously wrote off his loans. But if our current doners were to recall theirs on exit presumably they would have the right to sell off club assets to fund the payback, the club training ground for example which might make good money as a development site. We rely upon their largesse and screaming for their demise could all go wrong very badly.
There are no loans on the club finances at all. TB and others have always converted their loans into equity leaving DRFC in a good financial situation at all times.
The Watson family generously wrote off everything that they invested in the club when they took a step backwards in recent years. That dwarfed anything anybody else had done in living memory.
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Sack the board? Be very careful for what you wish for!
COYR
Totally correct
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Be careful of what you wish for certainly springs to mind. Whilst I am not privy to the intracacies of how the club has been funded presumably much of the money going in from the board has been in the form of loans. I believe when JR walked away he generously wrote off his loans. But if our current doners were to recall theirs on exit presumably they would have the right to sell off club assets to fund the payback, the club training ground for example which might make good money as a development site. We rely upon their largesse and screaming for their demise could all go wrong very badly.
There are no loans on the club finances at all. TB and others have always converted their loans into equity leaving DRFC in a good financial situation at all times.
The Watson family generously wrote off everything that they invested in the club when they took a step backwards in recent years. That dwarfed anything anybody else had done in living memory.
In terms of ownership post Richardson we've been truly blessed.
I do as many others do question the future ambition.
More so the communication from the board. The sustainable funds, the bounce back have all led to expectations and rightly so. The whole we aren't in a relegation battle statement - I mean come on.
We all make mistakes though; but let's see further transparent communication. Copps is now the expected face of communication from the board prospective fan wise and that seems to have disappeared. I'm not saying he's not working - that's all that lad knows if work, effort and commitment (especially to our club) we are fortunate to have him.
Maybe just maybe the board have written this season off expectation wise and we will see improvement in the summer.
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What do people think they could get, the team? the structure all the other things Lease to the Stadium the training ground all the leases are to Club Doncaster, things most supporters are not interested in.
The majority of the people at the moment wanting to force the owners out have not got two half pennies to scratch their arse with on a Thursday night, and would be hard pushed to fund Rag Arse Rovers in the Sunday League and would lose interest in them after a couple of defeats.
Its the tail trying to wag the dog, and time the Board and management if they are serious about running the club going forward turned around on these people and told them to bog off and watch Manchester City who will feed their idea of how important they are.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
You must realise donniedog that you and your pals have absolutely no power what so ever to carry out your wishes so sit down and be a good lad.
Sorry if I’ve missed the postings echoing this.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
You must realise donniedog that you and your pals have absolutely no power what so ever to carry out your wishes so sit down and be a good lad.
Sorry if I’ve missed the postings echoing this.
I'm sure Donniedog and his pals realise they have no power to change anything to do with the club. However I think you need to cut them a bit of slack. They are no doubt as frustrated as many of us (brown nosers excluded) with how our club is being slowly dragged lower and lower and will be around a lot longer than you or I to support the team.
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When do we say enough is enough, it’s time to force the owners to put the club for sale officially. Time to sack the board.
We need to start the wheels in motion and some protests.
You must realise donniedog that you and your pals have absolutely no power what so ever to carry out your wishes so sit down and be a good lad.
Sorry if I’ve missed the postings echoing this.
I'm sure Donniedog and his pals realise they have no power to change anything to do with the club. However I think you need to cut them a bit of slack. They are no doubt as frustrated as many of us (brown nosers excluded) with how our club is being slowly dragged lower and lower and will be around a lot longer than you or I to support the team.
There was absolutely no need to add the (brown noses excluded) part to your post! Who are these people? Have you ever asked them how frustrated they are? How can you judge any of them the way you've done if you don't know them|?
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Easy for Dennis They won't be around five minutes if their ego isn't fed, no marks.
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I guess none of you ever did daft things when you were kids.
It's not just the young kids who are frustrated it is many of the older fans as well. Have you ever asked them why they are frustrated?
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Of course I did daft things when I was a kid, but most of the time until someone sensible told me I was being daft I didn't realise it.
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Who identified our players when Ferguson was in charge? Now that was good and didn't involve fees hardly. We've just got to get better at that we really have.
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Of course I did daft things when I was a kid, but most of the time until someone sensible told me I was being daft I didn't realise it.
You're lucky then, because when I started coming the Rovers there was nobody 'sensible' to tell me I was being daft!
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Of course I did daft things when I was a kid, but most of the time until someone sensible told me I was being daft I didn't realise it.
You're lucky then, because when I started coming the Rovers there was nobody 'sensible' to tell me I was being daft!
I'm the only one in my family that doesn't support Sheffield United so you can imagine how it was for me...
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I would imagine we all did a lot of things tha the safety brigade now would faint at, but we all knew the repercussions of a crack behind the ear of the local bobby or your parents, and didn't think we had the entitlement of everything in life thrown at us, it had to be worked for and paid for not given, nor did we expect to tell other people what to do and how to spend their money, which seems to be the main aim of this little band of no marks.
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I would imagine we all did a lot of things tha the safety brigade now would faint at, but we all knew the repercussions of a crack behind the ear of the local bobby or your parents, and didn't think we had the entitlement of everything in life thrown at us, it had to be worked for and paid for not given, nor did we expect to tell other people what to do and how to spend their money, which seems to be the main aim of this little band of no marks.
Yeah and I suppose when we did something stupid, we fortunately didn't have the opportunity to publicise it on social media, even if we might have been daft enough to do so.
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We're currently in the lowest half of the lowest league in English football. This is a failure of ownership.
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As far as I'm concerned, it's simple. I back the current owners and generally support initiatives such as Club Doncaster. However, I think they need advice when it comes to the football side of things. Creating a HoF was a step in the right direction, however giving the job to Copps was, I'm afraid to say, a woeful yet predictable mistake.
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As far as I'm concerned, it's simple. I back the current owners and generally support initiatives such as Club Doncaster. However, I think they need advice when it comes to the football side of things. Creating a HoF was a step in the right direction, however giving the job to Copps was, I'm afraid to say, a woeful yet predictable mistake.
And there you go, why appoint a HoF, so fans have somebody to blame instead of the owners. Well done for falling into the trap.
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We're currently in the lowest half of the lowest league in English football. This is a failure of ownership.
Nope, it’s a failure of the players.
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I thought when Hoden was recruited into the club, that communications with the fans would improve, that hasn’t happened.
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Be careful of what you wish for certainly springs to mind. Whilst I am not privy to the intracacies of how the club has been funded presumably much of the money going in from the board has been in the form of loans. I believe when JR walked away he generously wrote off his loans. But if our current doners were to recall theirs on exit presumably they would have the right to sell off club assets to fund the payback, the club training ground for example which might make good money as a development site. We rely upon their largesse and screaming for their demise could all go wrong very badly.
There are no loans on the club finances at all. TB and others have always converted their loans into equity leaving DRFC in a good financial situation at all times.
The Watson family generously wrote off everything that they invested in the club when they took a step backwards in recent years. That dwarfed anything anybody else had done in living memory.
Didn't JR write off his loans as well?
What do fans want exactly they've invested THEIR money and haven't asked for it back.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
Don't forget the supporters in all this. Many have had season tickets or paid to watch over the last 20 years. We have also contributed to the clubs existence.
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We're currently in the lowest half of the lowest league in English football. This is a failure of ownership.
Look again, I think you might find that League 2 is not the lowest league in English football
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
Don't forget the supporters in all this. Many have had season tickets or paid to watch over the last 20 years. We have also contributed to the clubs existence.
But we the supporters have been paying comparatively little and getting something back for it, whereas the owners have been paying comparatively great amounts whilst knowing there will be nothing back for them.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
Don't forget the supporters in all this. Many have had season tickets or paid to watch over the last 20 years. We have also contributed to the clubs existence.
Bloody hell, now you're trying to claim a season ticket is a financial investment in the club and that it somehow entitles you to more than admission into the ground on match day.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
Don't forget the supporters in all this. Many have had season tickets or paid to watch over the last 20 years. We have also contributed to the clubs existence.
Bloody hell, now you're trying to claim a season ticket is a financial investment in the club and that it somehow entitles you to more than admission into the ground on match day.
Can you point out where I have said buying a season ticket is an investment?
Can you also point out where I have said it entitles anyone to more than admission into the ground on match day?
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
Aren’t most teams ?
Don't forget the supporters in all this. Many have had season tickets or paid to watch over the last 20 years. We have also contributed to the clubs existence.
But we the supporters have been paying comparatively little and getting something back for it, whereas the owners have been paying comparatively great amounts whilst knowing there will be nothing back for them.
Comparatively. Depends what you mean by that. Someone paying for a season ticket who is living on a basic state pension compared to someone who is putting £2 million a year into the club whilst probably earning more than that each year in interest and investments? Who is hardest hit?
Do you really think we have been getting any kind of value for the cost of a season ticket for the last 2 seasons??
I am not telling the owners how to spend their money before anyone starts. I am just pointing out my view on comparative figures to yours.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
The last 20 years? Not so sure about that.
I'm convinced that JR was definitely acting out of instinct and a love for the club when he initially took on the ownership and control of DRFC. But I'm also convinced that as time went by he fell in love with being the Chairman of a football club and the status that comes with that. Much the same as our current Chairman I would suggest.
The one individual who has been spending his money without a selfish motive whatsoever is TB. He's also contributed more cash than any individual in my lifetime. And, he's always said that if a reasonable buyer came along he would sell up and let someone else have the club. He's also said that he wanted to get the club into a sustainable position so that it's future is assured. Being sustainable isn't about him saving money as some people seem to imply quite assertively, but is for the long term future of the club. The club is now in that position, which essentially means that the next phase of DRFC is probably not too far around the corner.
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That message hits home SM
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
The last 20 years? Not so sure about that.
I'm convinced that JR was definitely acting out of instinct and a love for the club when he initially took on the ownership and control of DRFC. But I'm also convinced that as time went by he fell in love with being the Chairman of a football club and the status that comes with that. Much the same as our current Chairman I would suggest.
The one individual who has been spending his money without a selfish motive whatsoever is TB. He's also contributed more cash than any individual in my lifetime. And, he's always said that if a reasonable buyer came along he would sell up and let someone else have the club. He's also said that he wanted to get the club into a sustainable position so that it's future is assured. Being sustainable isn't about him saving money as some people seem to imply quite assertively, but is for the long term future of the club. The club is now in that position, which essentially means that the next phase of DRFC is probably not too far around the corner.
Unfortunately there are some people that simply have deaf ears to the facts or are even don’t accept what you have said as fact.
They expect TB to keep ploughing in more of his money in to fund the playing budget.
Well it’s his choice and he obviously doesn’t want to do that anymore. We should all be very thankful for what he has done for the club.
We just have to hope there is someone out there who is prepared to bank roll the club to get us to where we all want to be. But we don’t want the wrong investor(s)
It is vital that TB sells to someone who is 100% genuine and wants to see the club achieve what we the supporters want.
I am sure he will do everything in his powers to make sure that happens.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
The last 20 years? Not so sure about that.
I'm convinced that JR was definitely acting out of instinct and a love for the club when he initially took on the ownership and control of DRFC. But I'm also convinced that as time went by he fell in love with being the Chairman of a football club and the status that comes with that. Much the same as our current Chairman I would suggest.
The one individual who has been spending his money without a selfish motive whatsoever is TB. He's also contributed more cash than any individual in my lifetime. And, he's always said that if a reasonable buyer came along he would sell up and let someone else have the club. He's also said that he wanted to get the club into a sustainable position so that it's future is assured. Being sustainable isn't about him saving money as some people seem to imply quite assertively, but is for the long term future of the club. The club is now in that position, which essentially means that the next phase of DRFC is probably not too far around the corner.
Unfortunately there are some people that simply have deaf ears to the facts or are even don’t accept what you have said as fact.
They expect TB to keep ploughing in more of his money in to fund the playing budget.
Well it’s his choice and he obviously doesn’t want to do that anymore. We should all be very thankful for what he has done for the club.
We just have to hope there is someone out there who is prepared to bank roll the club to get us to where we all want to be. But we don’t want the wrong investor(s)
It is vital that TB sells to someone who is 100% genuine and wants to see the club achieve what we the supporters want.
I am sure he will do everything in his powers to make sure that happens.
Excellent points.
It's perfectly fine to want more and a potential change whilst also praising actions from the past. Much the same as with JR, it needed a change in the end (time dictates it always will) but that should never over-ride the achievements of the past.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
The last 20 years? Not so sure about that.
I'm convinced that JR was definitely acting out of instinct and a love for the club when he initially took on the ownership and control of DRFC. But I'm also convinced that as time went by he fell in love with being the Chairman of a football club and the status that comes with that. Much the same as our current Chairman I would suggest.
The one individual who has been spending his money without a selfish motive whatsoever is TB. He's also contributed more cash than any individual in my lifetime. And, he's always said that if a reasonable buyer came along he would sell up and let someone else have the club. He's also said that he wanted to get the club into a sustainable position so that it's future is assured. Being sustainable isn't about him saving money as some people seem to imply quite assertively, but is for the long term future of the club. The club is now in that position, which essentially means that the next phase of DRFC is probably not too far around the corner.
Unfortunately there are some people that simply have deaf ears to the facts or are even don’t accept what you have said as fact.
They expect TB to keep ploughing in more of his money in to fund the playing budget.
Well it’s his choice and he obviously doesn’t want to do that anymore. We should all be very thankful for what he has done for the club.
We just have to hope there is someone out there who is prepared to bank roll the club to get us to where we all want to be. But we don’t want the wrong investor(s)
It is vital that TB sells to someone who is 100% genuine and wants to see the club achieve what we the supporters want.
I am sure he will do everything in his powers to make sure that happens.
So in a nutshell.
JR took us up to a level and then couldn't afford to continue putting more in.
TB has taken us down to a level where he no longer wishes to continue putting more in.
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Than you Mr. Silent Majority for clarifying the position.
It appears that for most of the last 20 years our club's existance has been sustained by altruism.
I strongly suspect that if the current owners could find acceptable buyers they would do so.
The last 20 years? Not so sure about that.
I'm convinced that JR was definitely acting out of instinct and a love for the club when he initially took on the ownership and control of DRFC. But I'm also convinced that as time went by he fell in love with being the Chairman of a football club and the status that comes with that. Much the same as our current Chairman I would suggest.
The one individual who has been spending his money without a selfish motive whatsoever is TB. He's also contributed more cash than any individual in my lifetime. And, he's always said that if a reasonable buyer came along he would sell up and let someone else have the club. He's also said that he wanted to get the club into a sustainable position so that it's future is assured. Being sustainable isn't about him saving money as some people seem to imply quite assertively, but is for the long term future of the club. The club is now in that position, which essentially means that the next phase of DRFC is probably not too far around the corner.
Unfortunately there are some people that simply have deaf ears to the facts or are even don’t accept what you have said as fact.
They expect TB to keep ploughing in more of his money in to fund the playing budget.
Well it’s his choice and he obviously doesn’t want to do that anymore. We should all be very thankful for what he has done for the club.
We just have to hope there is someone out there who is prepared to bank roll the club to get us to where we all want to be. But we don’t want the wrong investor(s)
It is vital that TB sells to someone who is 100% genuine and wants to see the club achieve what we the supporters want.
I am sure he will do everything in his powers to make sure that happens.
The start of the season and say this again, as you keep saying supporters wanting TB to put more money in, the Chairman said we would Bounce Back Decisively the funds were available.
So as I’ve said before do the regime know what funds are required to BBD. Funds were available in January yet we have found it challenging with loan fees and players wages as we don’t pay transfer fees.
The Chairman set the expectations and unless we get promoted didn’t know what he was talking about when comes to resources.
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SM, you repeat the opinion that the club is now in a position of being sustainable but as several posters on here have commented (without reply as far as I have seen) it cannot be taken that it gives the club an assured long-term future. There are many variables in the equation for a football club; attendances, gate receipts and sponsorships being particularly relevant. This season's club expenditure may well be equalled by it's income but given the product presently being served up (poor entertainment value and poor results) it cannot be assumed that attendances next season will continue at this season's level. Gate receipts and the value to sponsors could certainly decline further and may continue in a downward spiral.
It seems more than coincidental that the pursuit of the holy grail of sustainability has been achieved in parallel with a two-year long decline in our ability to compete on the field of play. That doesn't seem like a self sustaining club to me.
Let me be clear I wholeheartedly support the drive to maximise revenue streams in order to improve the club's prospects, who wouldn't? but for the reasons given above I don't see how it can ensure the club's future and to call it sustainability feels to me like someone trying to pull the wool over our eyes.
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But it's self sustainability with the backup of funds from TB as and when required, as I understand it
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As I understand what has been said, Raven, the example given to explain TB's input is that he would step in to ease cashflow issues if and when they arise.
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SM, you repeat the opinion that the club is now in a position of being sustainable but as several posters on here have commented (without reply as far as I have seen) it cannot be taken that it gives the club an assured long-term future. There are many variables in the equation for a football club; attendances, gate receipts and sponsorships being particularly relevant. This season's club expenditure may well be equalled by it's income but given the product presently being served up (poor entertainment value and poor results) it cannot be assumed that attendances next season will continue at this season's level. Gate receipts and the value to sponsors could certainly decline further and may continue in a downward spiral.
It seems more than coincidental that the pursuit of the holy grail of sustainability has been achieved in parallel with a two-year long decline in our ability to compete on the field of play. That doesn't seem like a self sustaining club to me.
Let me be clear I wholeheartedly support the drive to maximise revenue streams in order to improve the club's prospects, who wouldn't? but for the reasons given above I don't see how it can ensure the club's future and to call it sustainability feels to me like someone trying to pull the wool over our eyes.
Firstly, it's not an opinion, its a fact. And of course you're correct in that it cannot be taken as a given that we will remain sustainable for the foreseeable future, but all I'm doing is repeating what the owners have been telling us for the last few years. It was a goal for TB that he would continue to fund the club to a level until Club Doncaster achieved a position where it was no longer necessary.
But I'm struggling to understand a couple of things. One being that because sustainability isn't 100% a given then we shouldn't attempt to try? Or maybe because it's football then sustainability should be ignored because owners should be expected to fund the club out of their own pockets? Is that what fans want? I've seen it stated, even on this forum, that now TB and Co are the devil incarnate because they are no longer having to dip into their own pockets. And I state the words 'having to'. It doesn't mean they no longer will.
But lets be real here, if we aren't sustainable next season then we'll be pretty close to it and surely that still makes DRFC an attractive club to own? As I said to somebody on Saturday who tried to tell me that TB had been offered £20m for the club (he knew this for a fact) and that TB was holding out for £25m, why would he do that? He's never suggested that was the point of his ownership. And a further point I made was that if you wanted to buy a business and had the choice of two, one had debts of £xm and one had no debt which one would you buy?
But I fail to see how can it be that someone is trying to pull the wool over your eyes by claiming the club is sustainable. Why would you do that, it just doesn't make any sense. As a further point (one I've made a few times on here) our income streams are more diverse than most clubs in the lower leagues, our commercial revenue performance is stronger than most EFL clubs and our income structure looks more like an EPL club than an EFL club.
I also fail to see why sustainability is such a taboo subject. In industry sustainability is a common theme and so it should be. In football its also a common theme and was one of the drivers we had when putting the case for the Fan Led Review. The point is nobody want to lose their club and the more sustainable the football industry becomes the likelihood of that happening is greatly reduced.
Here's a link to a whole discussion on the sustainability of football clubs. Its currently only covering the top two divisions but the hope is that it covers the next two division soon;
https://www.fairgameuk.org/sustainability-index
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As I understand what has been said, Raven, the example given to explain TB's input is that he would step in to ease cashflow issues if and when they arise.
Do you know that looks just about what I said, but thanks for the clarification
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Why don’t some get it.
The budget last season was good enough to be mid table.
The budget this season was good enough for at least a play off finish.
So I say it again. Do the board do the player recruitment? No they don’t do they. So it’s the managers fault we are where we are.
DM left us in the mire. A squad full of loans who could care less.
Yes the board made mistakes with Butler, Wellens and GM but hindsight eh. Who would have expected Wellens to take us to the bottom 4.
The budget was not spent well.
So if people don’t understand that what goes on on the field I has very little to do with them. They don’t kick the ball.
The performance on the field has been way below the budgets provided should have achieved.
All this cheap skate stuff is just cheap jibes with no foundation.
Get a grip some of you.
It’s not us with so called rose tinted glasses, it’s those with a total lack of any grasp of reality that have a problem.
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Let’s stop going back to DM.
We are sustainable we been told.
We were told by the Chairman that we had the funds to get in the top three.
Which players that we signed this season were wrong signings for the money we had.
How much of the playoff budget was covering already contracted players we had.
The loan signings in the summer can’t have been big loan fees.
We haven’t paid transfer fees for a player.
Reality is there for all to see.
Did the Chairman have a good grasp of reality when he said we would BBD.
Did McSheffrey have a good grasp of reality when he said we would finish in the top three.
We will all see what is the reality in the next 3.5 months
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CR absolutely bang on - I’m quite happy with my rose tinted glasses, am I happy with the league position am I fck but we are very much work in progress
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There’s no point in reasoning with some people. They see it how they want to see it. SM gives good reasoning as he is close to the facts. Believe what he says. Why would he lie. But some people don’t want to see what’s in front of them.
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Why don’t some get it.
The budget last season was good enough to be mid table.
The budget this season was good enough for at least a play off finish.
So I say it again. Do the board do the player recruitment? No they don’t do they. So it’s the managers fault we are where we are.
DM left us in the mire. A squad full of loans who could care less.
Yes the board made mistakes with Butler, Wellens and GM but hindsight eh. Who would have expected Wellens to take us to the bottom 4.
The budget was not spent well.
So if people don’t understand that what goes on on the field I has very little to do with them. They don’t kick the ball.
The performance on the field has been way below the budgets provided should have achieved.
All this cheap skate stuff is just cheap jibes with no foundation.
Get a grip some of you.
It’s not us with so called rose tinted glasses, it’s those with a total lack of any grasp of reality that have a problem.
Campsall i am sorry but with all respect, and i have agreed with some of your sensible posts recently, but you are talking nonsense. Look at the squad, look at the quality in it. It is decreased significantly, to the point that before Lavery came in (and i am not commenting on his signing until he has had a run of games), we have had one striker really available and fit, to be expected to mount a serious promotion challenge? Get real. If anything had happened to Miller first half of the season we would have been stuffed, for our so called good budget. Agard doesn't look like he can do 45 minutes, never mind 90, and Griffiths must be so unfit that he can't even compete with Agard for 20 minutes on the pitch. And that's just the strikers!
And to sweep the appointments of Butler, Wellens and GM under the carpet as we all make mistakes, all in hindsight, we are where we (won't swear) are, cos of these HUGE mistakes, that and the awful mistakes in recruitment, Whiteman goes, we bring in Journeyman Bostock and Bogle. I said 2 years ago when we were on a bad run under Butler we needed a real statement of investment or we would be in BIG trouble, many on here sneered, ah no way will we get relegated, still aiming for league one play offs, couldn't see how bad our rot had commenced, so yes people did expect Wellens to land us in the bottom 4 given the previous half a season. It was clear where our direction of travel was taking us. Lots of spin on here at the time. Well now we are 15th in league two, so much for the bounce back decisively. I think players like Lakin and Miller might bode well with potential, but our squad depth, particularly up front is awful, no real pace or physical strength as an option, no consistency generally and awful mistakes at the back by even our most experienced defenders.
Clearly the Sustainability strategy is with a view to selling the club (let's hope so). But as others have posted on here, it can be a perpetual decline, sustainable to the level of revenue aligned to attendances, shirt sales etc. If performances are bad, results bad, season ticket sales will decline as will match day attendances generally, and therefore our sustainable budget is to a reduced quality again, and then next moment, we will be a good sustainable National League club, proud of how sustainable we are beating Maidenhead at home or the like. There is an old adage that i hope someone has reminded Bramall of recently, 'you can't take your money with you when you've gone'. Clearly there is no passion by our owners to the extent they are willing to invest in a successful football club, other than paper over cashflow requirements, so let's hope we do manage to find someone with the passion as a fan like a JR, a Tony Stewart dare i say at Rotherham, to bring some much needed pride back to the club and performances and results on the pitch where it actually matters!
I saw in another post Campsall you said something along the lines that after the next transfer window we weren't in the play offs by October you would be really angry. And i don't mean to pick you out, honestly, but i read it after the last two years and thought wow, unbeleivable, i applaud your patience of a saint attitude, but Rotherham 0-5 at home, 0-6 in the JPT or equivalent, 0-6 to Ipswich, 1-4 Wigan at home, 1-4 Peterborough at home, 0-4 at Cheltenham, 0-4 at Charlton, this season, the dire performances at Hartlepool, Colchester, Tranmere, Carlisle, Mansfield last week, when is it going to hit home that we are getting spanked and as fans pride crushed cos of the strategy of our Board?! When will some of you on here say wow we are crap, this isan't going well, our Board are not investing and performances are in consistent at best. Yes we are fans and support through thick and thin, but we have a right cos we are fans to challenge the status quo when things aren't going right, thats what fans should do! The last two years have been dire, and yes we've all been there, or the older fans amongst us under Richardson, also in the late 80s and early 90s, but the results above are as bad individually and collectively as at any time in 30 to 40 years, barring the 1997-98 season. So what next Autumn if we are 10th or 12th, yes all teams have bad times, but doesn't mean we should not be vocal or challenge the owners for what the set out as deliverable, 5 year plans, decisively bouncing back, and then getting spanked away from home on a consistent basis this season! or at home over the last two years.
I get fan loyalty, i'm a season ticket holder like most of you through thick and thin, we all love this great club of ours, but it doesn't mean i should support the club come what may when i think it is being managed badly. Look at the transfer fiasco of a year or so ago, how contrary that is to JR tapping up McIndoe to sign in the toilets of an Award ceremony back in the day, or when we prided ourselves we never do our business on the last day of the window, what a contrast to the mess desperate for the next Kwame Thomas or Rakiesh Bingham to sign on transfer deadline day, we missed out, so landed Joe Dodoo instead! Yes its been bad, and our owners have presided over it 100% of the time.
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Why don’t some get it.
The budget last season was good enough to be mid table.
The budget this season was good enough for at least a play off finish.
So I say it again. Do the board do the player recruitment? No they don’t do they. So it’s the managers fault we are where we are.
DM left us in the mire. A squad full of loans who could care less.
Yes the board made mistakes with Butler, Wellens and GM but hindsight eh. Who would have expected Wellens to take us to the bottom 4.
The budget was not spent well.
So if people don’t understand that what goes on on the field I has very little to do with them. They don’t kick the ball.
The performance on the field has been way below the budgets provided should have achieved.
All this cheap skate stuff is just cheap jibes with no foundation.
Get a grip some of you.
It’s not us with so called rose tinted glasses, it’s those with a total lack of any grasp of reality that have a problem.
Campsall i am sorry but with all respect, and i have agreed with some of your sensible posts recently, but you are talking nonsense. Look at the squad, look at the quality in it. It is decreased significantly, to the point that before Lavery came in (and i am not commenting on his signing until he has had a run of games), we have had one striker really available and fit, to be expected to mount a serious promotion challenge? Get real. If anything had happened to Miller first half of the season we would have been stuffed, for our so called good budget. Agard doesn't look like he can do 45 minutes, never mind 90, and Griffiths must be so unfit that he can't even compete with Agard for 20 minutes on the pitch. And that's just the strikers!
And to sweep the appointments of Butler, Wellens and GM under the carpet as we all make mistakes, all in hindsight, we are where we (won't swear) are, cos of these HUGE mistakes, that and the awful mistakes in recruitment, Whiteman goes, we bring in Journeyman Bostock and Bogle. I said 2 years ago when we were on a bad run under Butler we needed a real statement of investment or we would be in BIG trouble, many on here sneered, ah no way will we get relegated, still aiming for league one play offs, couldn't see how bad our rot had commenced, so yes people did expect Wellens to land us in the bottom 4 given the previous half a season. It was clear where our direction of travel was taking us. Lots of spin on here at the time. Well now we are 15th in league two, so much for the bounce back decisively. I think players like Lakin and Miller might bode well with potential, but our squad depth, particularly up front is awful, no real pace or physical strength as an option, no consistency generally and awful mistakes at the back.
Clearly the Sustainability strategy is with a view to selling the club (let's hope so). But as others have posted on here, it can be a perpetual decline, sustainable to the level of revenue aligned to attendances, shirt sales etc. If performances are bad, results bad, season ticket sales will decline as will match day attendances generally, and therefore our sustainable budget is to a reduced quality again, and then next moment, we will be a good sustainable National League club, proud of how sustainable we are beating Maidenhead at home or the like. There is an old adage that i hope someone has reminded Bramall of recently, 'you can't take your money with you when you've gone'. Clearly there is no passion by our owners to the extent they are willing to invest in a successful football club, other than paper over cashflow requirements, so let's hope we do manage to find someone with the passion as a fan like a JR, a Tony Stewart dare i say at Rotherham, to bring some much needed pride back to the club and performances and results on the pitch where it actually matters!
I saw in another post Campsall you said something along the lines that after the next transfer window we weren't in the play offs by October you would be really angry. And i don't mean to pick you out, honestly, but i read it after the last two years and thought wow, unbeleivable, i applaud your patience of a saint attitude, but Rotherham 0-5 at home, 0-6 in the JPT or equivalent, 0-6 to Ipswich, 1-4 Wigan at home, 1-4 Peterborough at home, 0-4 at Cheltenham, 0-4 at Charlton, this season, the dire performances at Hartlepool, Colchester, Tranmere, Carlisle, Mansfield last week, when is it going to hit home that we are getting spanked and as fans pride crushed cos of the strategy of our Board?! When will some of you on here say wow we are crap, this isan't going well, our Board are not investing and performances are in consistent at best. Yes we are fans and support through thick and thin, but we have a right cos we are fans to challenge the status quo when things aren't going right, thats what fans should do! The last two years have been dire, and yes we've all been there, or the older fans amongst us under Richardson, also in the late 80s and early 90s, but the results above are as bad individually and collectively as at any time in 30 to 40 years, barring the 1997-98 season. So what next Autumn if we are 10th or 12th, yes all teams have bad times, but doesn't mean we should not be vocal or challenge the owners for what the set out as deliverable, 5 year plans, decisively bouncing back, and then getting spanked away from home on a consistent basis!
Excellent post, totally agree.
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Why don’t some get it.
The budget last season was good enough to be mid table.
The budget this season was good enough for at least a play off finish.
So I say it again. Do the board do the player recruitment? No they don’t do they. So it’s the managers fault we are where we are.
DM left us in the mire. A squad full of loans who could care less.
Yes the board made mistakes with Butler, Wellens and GM but hindsight eh. Who would have expected Wellens to take us to the bottom 4.
The budget was not spent well.
So if people don’t understand that what goes on on the field I has very little to do with them. They don’t kick the ball.
The performance on the field has been way below the budgets provided should have achieved.
All this cheap skate stuff is just cheap jibes with no foundation.
Get a grip some of you.
It’s not us with so called rose tinted glasses, it’s those with a total lack of any grasp of reality that have a problem.
Campsall i am sorry but with all respect, and i have agreed with some of your sensible posts recently, but you are talking nonsense. Look at the squad, look at the quality in it. It is decreased significantly, to the point that before Lavery came in (and i am not commenting on his signing until he has had a run of games), we have had one striker really available and fit, to be expected to mount a serious promotion challenge? Get real. If anything had happened to Miller first half of the season we would have been stuffed, for our so called good budget. Agard doesn't look like he can do 45 minutes, never mind 90, and Griffiths must be so unfit that he can't even compete with Agard for 20 minutes on the pitch. And that's just the strikers!
And to sweep the appointments of Butler, Wellens and GM under the carpet as we all make mistakes, all in hindsight, we are where we (won't swear) are, cos of these HUGE mistakes, that and the awful mistakes in recruitment, Whiteman goes, we bring in Journeyman Bostock and Bogle. I said 2 years ago when we were on a bad run under Butler we needed a real statement of investment or we would be in BIG trouble, many on here sneered, ah no way will we get relegated, still aiming for league one play offs, couldn't see how bad our rot had commenced, so yes people did expect Wellens to land us in the bottom 4 given the previous half a season. It was clear where our direction of travel was taking us. Lots of spin on here at the time. Well now we are 15th in league two, so much for the bounce back decisively. I think players like Lakin and Miller might bode well with potential, but our squad depth, particularly up front is awful, no real pace or physical strength as an option, no consistency generally and awful mistakes at the back.
Clearly the Sustainability strategy is with a view to selling the club (let's hope so). But as others have posted on here, it can be a perpetual decline, sustainable to the level of revenue aligned to attendances, shirt sales etc. If performances are bad, results bad, season ticket sales will decline as will match day attendances generally, and therefore our sustainable budget is to a reduced quality again, and then next moment, we will be a good sustainable National League club, proud of how sustainable we are beating Maidenhead at home or the like. There is an old adage that i hope someone has reminded Bramall of recently, 'you can't take your money with you when you've gone'. Clearly there is no passion by our owners to the extent they are willing to invest in a successful football club, other than paper over cashflow requirements, so let's hope we do manage to find someone with the passion as a fan like a JR, a Tony Stewart dare i say at Rotherham, to bring some much needed pride back to the club and performances and results on the pitch where it actually matters!
I saw in another post Campsall you said something along the lines that after the next transfer window we weren't in the play offs by October you would be really angry. And i don't mean to pick you out, honestly, but i read it after the last two years and thought wow, unbeleivable, i applaud your patience of a saint attitude, but Rotherham 0-5 at home, 0-6 in the JPT or equivalent, 0-6 to Ipswich, 1-4 Wigan at home, 1-4 Peterborough at home, 0-4 at Cheltenham, 0-4 at Charlton, this season, the dire performances at Hartlepool, Colchester, Tranmere, Carlisle, Mansfield last week, when is it going to hit home that we are getting spanked and as fans pride crushed cos of the strategy of our Board?! When will some of you on here say wow we are crap, this isan't going well, our Board are not investing and performances are in consistent at best. Yes we are fans and support through thick and thin, but we have a right cos we are fans to challenge the status quo when things aren't going right, thats what fans should do! The last two years have been dire, and yes we've all been there, or the older fans amongst us under Richardson, also in the late 80s and early 90s, but the results above are as bad individually and collectively as at any time in 30 to 40 years, barring the 1997-98 season. So what next Autumn if we are 10th or 12th, yes all teams have bad times, but doesn't mean we should not be vocal or challenge the owners for what the set out as deliverable, 5 year plans, decisively bouncing back, and then getting spanked away from home on a consistent basis!
Excellent post, totally agree.
Me too.
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Whatever the cause, it is undeniable that we have been playing terrible football, recruiting abjectly, and dropping like a stone, for the last two years and matters are getting worse, not better.
We are in the bottom half of the lowest professional tier in the English game. Look at who we are playing against and we can’t string two passes together let alone two performances.
The last time we had such a bad season at this level was 1997/98 and what we knew then was that we had hit the very bottom and the dreadful situation could only improve. I really don’t know if we have hit the bottom yet.
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Whatever the cause, it is undeniable that we have been playing terrible football, recruiting abjectly, and dropping like a stone, for the last two years and matters are getting worse, not better.
We are in the bottom half of the lowest professional tier in the English game. Look at who we are playing against and we can’t string two passes together let alone two performances.
The last time we had such a bad season at this level was 1997/98 and what we knew then was that we had hit the very bottom and the dreadful situation could only improve. I really don’t know if we have hit the bottom yet.
It is so sad to see, this window just shows the direction we are going
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Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
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Why don’t some get it.
The budget last season was good enough to be mid table.
The budget this season was good enough for at least a play off finish.
So I say it again. Do the board do the player recruitment? No they don’t do they. So it’s the managers fault we are where we are.
DM left us in the mire. A squad full of loans who could care less.
Yes the board made mistakes with Butler, Wellens and GM but hindsight eh. Who would have expected Wellens to take us to the bottom 4.
The budget was not spent well.
So if people don’t understand that what goes on on the field I has very little to do with them. They don’t kick the ball.
The performance on the field has been way below the budgets provided should have achieved.
All this cheap skate stuff is just cheap jibes with no foundation.
Get a grip some of you.
It’s not us with so called rose tinted glasses, it’s those with a total lack of any grasp of reality that have a problem.
Campsall i am sorry but with all respect, and i have agreed with some of your sensible posts recently, but you are talking nonsense. Look at the squad, look at the quality in it. It is decreased significantly, to the point that before Lavery came in (and i am not commenting on his signing until he has had a run of games), we have had one striker really available and fit, to be expected to mount a serious promotion challenge? Get real. If anything had happened to Miller first half of the season we would have been stuffed, for our so called good budget. Agard doesn't look like he can do 45 minutes, never mind 90, and Griffiths must be so unfit that he can't even compete with Agard for 20 minutes on the pitch. And that's just the strikers!
And to sweep the appointments of Butler, Wellens and GM under the carpet as we all make mistakes, all in hindsight, we are where we (won't swear) are, cos of these HUGE mistakes, that and the awful mistakes in recruitment, Whiteman goes, we bring in Journeyman Bostock and Bogle. I said 2 years ago when we were on a bad run under Butler we needed a real statement of investment or we would be in BIG trouble, many on here sneered, ah no way will we get relegated, still aiming for league one play offs, couldn't see how bad our rot had commenced, so yes people did expect Wellens to land us in the bottom 4 given the previous half a season. It was clear where our direction of travel was taking us. Lots of spin on here at the time. Well now we are 15th in league two, so much for the bounce back decisively. I think players like Lakin and Miller might bode well with potential, but our squad depth, particularly up front is awful, no real pace or physical strength as an option, no consistency generally and awful mistakes at the back.
Clearly the Sustainability strategy is with a view to selling the club (let's hope so). But as others have posted on here, it can be a perpetual decline, sustainable to the level of revenue aligned to attendances, shirt sales etc. If performances are bad, results bad, season ticket sales will decline as will match day attendances generally, and therefore our sustainable budget is to a reduced quality again, and then next moment, we will be a good sustainable National League club, proud of how sustainable we are beating Maidenhead at home or the like. There is an old adage that i hope someone has reminded Bramall of recently, 'you can't take your money with you when you've gone'. Clearly there is no passion by our owners to the extent they are willing to invest in a successful football club, other than paper over cashflow requirements, so let's hope we do manage to find someone with the passion as a fan like a JR, a Tony Stewart dare i say at Rotherham, to bring some much needed pride back to the club and performances and results on the pitch where it actually matters!
I saw in another post Campsall you said something along the lines that after the next transfer window we weren't in the play offs by October you would be really angry. And i don't mean to pick you out, honestly, but i read it after the last two years and thought wow, unbeleivable, i applaud your patience of a saint attitude, but Rotherham 0-5 at home, 0-6 in the JPT or equivalent, 0-6 to Ipswich, 1-4 Wigan at home, 1-4 Peterborough at home, 0-4 at Cheltenham, 0-4 at Charlton, this season, the dire performances at Hartlepool, Colchester, Tranmere, Carlisle, Mansfield last week, when is it going to hit home that we are getting spanked and as fans pride crushed cos of the strategy of our Board?! When will some of you on here say wow we are crap, this isan't going well, our Board are not investing and performances are in consistent at best. Yes we are fans and support through thick and thin, but we have a right cos we are fans to challenge the status quo when things aren't going right, thats what fans should do! The last two years have been dire, and yes we've all been there, or the older fans amongst us under Richardson, also in the late 80s and early 90s, but the results above are as bad individually and collectively as at any time in 30 to 40 years, barring the 1997-98 season. So what next Autumn if we are 10th or 12th, yes all teams have bad times, but doesn't mean we should not be vocal or challenge the owners for what the set out as deliverable, 5 year plans, decisively bouncing back, and then getting spanked away from home on a consistent basis!
Excellent post, totally agree.
Me too.
Me too
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Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
All about opinions eh? Sorry but along with quite a few others I disagree.
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Now it's DSs fault is it. I am not the one criticising the manager, not this one. We have young inconsistent players. Maybe some will come good. And don't get me started on Molyneux. Never sign a player from Hartlepool, I remember us signing a lad highly rated from Hartlepool before called Halliday who flattered to deceive and everytime I watch Molyneux I grow more frustrated, weve seen very little end product and output just a Grealish wamma be.
I'm not saying that we don't have players capable and with potential. Hirst has been a good signing. But McCann, Moore, Ferguson, Dickov, Knoyle, and probably others have referred to our lack of ambition, clear signs that not all is right and supported by hard core fact of absolute dreadful slide over 3 seasons.
I actually think there is alot of inverse thinking on this forum. The happy clappers are deemed loyal and for the regime, the doom and gloom merchants negative in their outlook and too critical. Well I actually think the opposite is true. Alot on here deemed as happy clappers think 'it could be worse' 'be grateful we have a club' 'becareful what you wish for' mentality. Granted we only need ro look at Scunny or our own bad owner Uncle Ken for examples. But thar view is definitely glass half empty and seeing the worst.
The doom and gloom mongers I think criticise not because we are disloyal but cos we too love the club, care also, but I actually think alot see where we came from and where we got to, the 3 promotions, the new ground, going from.2000 gates to 12000 average and unbelievably a number of 13000+ attendances and the years in the championship from non league and saw the potential, the stadium, and believe that is achievable with the right support, Doncaster been a city, football being cyclical, why can't we compete with towns like Burnley, clubs like our rivals Rotherham and Barnsley. Now who is deemed over optimistic or a dreamer but our rise to the championship was a dream.back in the 80s and early 90s and we proved it achievable. So that's a positive view, the club could do much better than it is right now. And I know Campsall that you believe in our potential to rise again too.
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Stephen Halliday. We signed him from Motherwell. Had been at Hartlepool United at the start of his career though.
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Stephen Halliday. We signed him from Motherwell. Had been at Hartlepool United at the start of his career though.
Yeah he had been at Hartlepool until a year or so before and there for most of his career. Was absolutely garbage for all the hype. Would say same about signing players from Rochdale, dont tend to be great in general either. Accept there is always the exception that proves the rule.
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A sustainable club is a very decent achievement and something to be admired let me say that .
From the outside looking in as a Tyke financial sustainability is going to be massively difficult to negotiate if Rovers want to progress at the top end of league one and challenge for a place in the championship .
I'm not convinced by any means its possible to have a self sustaining model and the kind of success Rovers fans want to see again .
Just look at the size and budgets of the club's we are currently competing against at the top of league one , even if three make it to the championship this season they will be replaced by equally big clubs in Huddersfield Town , Wigan or Hull City plus those three other clubs who won't make it back up this season .
Of course this isn't the current Rovers owners fault but it is the way football is now and it's not changing anytime soon .
We've been away from League One for three seasons but I can tell you from what I've seen this season it's a much different kettle of fish than the one we left in 2019 .
The difference in class between the top six and to a lesser extent Peterborough and Wycombe and the rest of the league is extraordinary .
However that in itself is problematic because trying to get promoted and finishing above Bolton , Derby County , Wednesday , Ipswich Town and Plymouth Argyle is a nightmare .
With all due respect given the size of these clubs can Rovers realistically remain self sustainable and compete at the top end of league one in this climate ?
To put it in perspective we are just about clinging on to their coat-tails and there's five players in our team who all cost over a million quid and in the 8 to 10k per week wage bracket and what's more alarming is that they'd all or have struggled as championship players .
Football is absolutely mental where Rovers aspire to be .
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Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
All about opinions eh? Sorry but along with quite a few others I disagree.
And quite a few agree
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A sustainable club is a very decent achievement and something to be admired let me say that .
From the outside looking in as a Tyke financial sustainability is going to be massively difficult to negotiate if Rovers want to progress at the top end of league one and challenge for a place in the championship .
I'm not convinced by any means its possible to have a self sustaining model and the kind of success Rovers fans want to see again .
Just look at the size and budgets of the club's we are currently competing against at the top of league one , even if three make it to the championship this season they will be replaced by equally big clubs in Huddersfield Town , Wigan or Hull City plus those three other clubs who won't make it back up this season .
Of course this isn't the current Rovers owners fault but it is the way football is now and it's not changing anytime soon .
We've been away from League One for three seasons but I can tell you from what I've seen this season it's a much different kettle of fish than the one we left in 2019 .
The difference in class between the top six and to a lesser extent Peterborough and Wycombe and the rest of the league is extraordinary .
However that in itself is problematic because trying to get promoted and finishing above Bolton , Derby County , Wednesday , Ipswich Town and Plymouth Argyle is a nightmare .
With all due respect given the size of these clubs can Rovers realistically remain self sustainable and compete at the top end of league one in this climate ?
To put it in perspective we are just about clinging on to their coat-tails and there's five players in our team who all cost over a million quid and in the 8 to 10k per week wage bracket and what's more alarming is that they'd all or have struggled as championship players .
Football is absolutely mental where Rovers aspire to be .
Tyke, we are fans of lower league clubs. We don't aspire to be anywhere..... Just not on a boat without a rudder.
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Donny Exile, thanks for probably the best post I have ever read on this site.
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Tyke, only when your club is in the bottom of league two can you understand how so many fans feel.
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A sustainable club is a very decent achievement and something to be admired let me say that .
From the outside looking in as a Tyke financial sustainability is going to be massively difficult to negotiate if Rovers want to progress at the top end of league one and challenge for a place in the championship .
I'm not convinced by any means its possible to have a self sustaining model and the kind of success Rovers fans want to see again .
Just look at the size and budgets of the club's we are currently competing against at the top of league one , even if three make it to the championship this season they will be replaced by equally big clubs in Huddersfield Town , Wigan or Hull City plus those three other clubs who won't make it back up this season .
Of course this isn't the current Rovers owners fault but it is the way football is now and it's not changing anytime soon .
We've been away from League One for three seasons but I can tell you from what I've seen this season it's a much different kettle of fish than the one we left in 2019 .
The difference in class between the top six and to a lesser extent Peterborough and Wycombe and the rest of the league is extraordinary .
However that in itself is problematic because trying to get promoted and finishing above Bolton , Derby County , Wednesday , Ipswich Town and Plymouth Argyle is a nightmare .
With all due respect given the size of these clubs can Rovers realistically remain self sustainable and compete at the top end of league one in this climate ?
To put it in perspective we are just about clinging on to their coat-tails and there's five players in our team who all cost over a million quid and in the 8 to 10k per week wage bracket and what's more alarming is that they'd all or have struggled as championship players .
Football is absolutely mental where Rovers aspire to be .
Tyke, we are fans of lower league clubs. We don't aspire to be anywhere..... Just not on a boat without a rudder.
Surely you aspire to the Ryan era when you made it to the championship and held your own for a number of season's .
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Tyke, only when your club is in the bottom of league two can you understand how so many fans feel.
That's not necessarily right because it's all relative .
I've seen us have to win our last home game of the season to avoid dropping in to league two whilst in administration and that's this century by the way .
I cut my teeth on the terraces at Oakwell when 3k was a good gate at the lower end of the fourth division in the 70's .
I've seen as much shyte as any fan in relative terms .
Some Rovers fans who contribute to this board may want to consider how a change of ownership worked out at Oldham and Scunthorpe .
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A sustainable club is a very decent achievement and something to be admired let me say that .
From the outside looking in as a Tyke financial sustainability is going to be massively difficult to negotiate if Rovers want to progress at the top end of league one and challenge for a place in the championship .
I'm not convinced by any means its possible to have a self sustaining model and the kind of success Rovers fans want to see again .
Just look at the size and budgets of the club's we are currently competing against at the top of league one , even if three make it to the championship this season they will be replaced by equally big clubs in Huddersfield Town , Wigan or Hull City plus those three other clubs who won't make it back up this season .
Of course this isn't the current Rovers owners fault but it is the way football is now and it's not changing anytime soon .
We've been away from League One for three seasons but I can tell you from what I've seen this season it's a much different kettle of fish than the one we left in 2019 .
The difference in class between the top six and to a lesser extent Peterborough and Wycombe and the rest of the league is extraordinary .
However that in itself is problematic because trying to get promoted and finishing above Bolton , Derby County , Wednesday , Ipswich Town and Plymouth Argyle is a nightmare .
With all due respect given the size of these clubs can Rovers realistically remain self sustainable and compete at the top end of league one in this climate ?
To put it in perspective we are just about clinging on to their coat-tails and there's five players in our team who all cost over a million quid and in the 8 to 10k per week wage bracket and what's more alarming is that they'd all or have struggled as championship players .
Football is absolutely mental where Rovers aspire to be .
Tyke, we are fans of lower league clubs. We don't aspire to be anywhere..... Just not on a boat without a rudder.
Surely you aspire to the Ryan era when you made it to the championship and held your own for a number of season's .
Of course... but supporting this club we have our limits. And that I am fine with.
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Barring the cameo ( and quite wonderful might I add) signing of billy, we were blessed with a group of relatively unremarkable players that just clicked. John Ryan was a wonderfully vocal and positive ambassador for the club also. It was certainly a high point for the club.
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Barring the cameo ( and quite wonderful might I add) signing of billy, we were blessed with a group of relatively unremarkable players that just clicked. John Ryan was a wonderfully vocal and positive ambassador for the club also. It was certainly a high point for the club.
And we could and should be again
We have a great ground and fans, located well for Lomdon via train and the North, sporting heritage with the Ledger etc. Until.recently an airport. Wtf has Barnsley or Rotherham got to shout about. We should and could be aspiring for much better than our lot. The platform is there. Tyke no disrespect but under JR Barnsley started to become our whipping boys as akin to the 50s and can be again. I don't buy this is about just having a club brigade.. look at the stadium, locality the potential etc.
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Digging a bit deeper here on the subject of sustainability we need to consider and identify what are the true aims of the club ? Is it a private company seeking to sustain it's existance by making a profit, or at least not making a loss or is it a football club seeking success in the football league ? The Directors of a company have a duty to deliver the aims of the shareholders, whatever those aims may be. The shareholders i.e. the owners of a company are a seperate and superior authority to the Directors (in terms of the power they have to appoint or dismiss board Directors) but if the Directors are also shareholders the lines are somewhat blurred because they are unlikely to diismiss themselves for poor performance. This of course is all subject to the voting rights held by the shareholders which is normally comensurate with volume of shares held. If all of the talk on here about the owners having provided sufficient funds for us to be in a much higher position in the football league is true then surely the Directors should be held accountable for poor performance especialy the CEO who is the person who has the most executive responsibility and therefore the accountability that goes with it. Thus, logically, GB should be sacked for underperformance,
why has he not been ? Is it because the shareholders are in truth content with our steady fall down the ladder and potentially out of the football league altogether ? To me this seems unlikely but nonetheless the fans, who whilst they have no powers in terms of managing the club surely, given that they are the main revenue stream, have the moral right to be asking this question.
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Most fans come to be entertained and get away from everyday life, where being sustainable to live is part of everyday life. They don’t want to come and see no aim to improve. To always take the cheap way out. Never competing even with sides counted as smaller than ourselves.
Most fans want to see ambition to play higher up.
Playing good football and watching at a reasonable price- we have the latter not the former. We can’t get everyone we want but we need to be competing for the better players sometimes.
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Most fans come to be entertained and get away from everyday life, where being sustainable to live is part of everyday life. They don’t want to come and see no aim to improve. To always take the cheap way out. Never competing even with sides counted as smaller than ourselves.
Most fans want to see ambition to play higher up.
Playing good football and watching at a reasonable price- we have the latter not the former. We can’t get everyone we want but we need to be competing for the better players sometimes.
Many people living average working class lives, would love to be millionaires.
Ain’t going to happen. Statistically. But if their team win on a sat, for a split second , they feel like millionaires. I know I do.
Football, for clubs like rovers, goes in cycles. Up and down. Currently we are on a down.
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Will fans ever be happy with their owners when you've got clubs like Chelsea to compare to? Their squad tonight was something like £650m cost. Crazy.
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Will fans ever be happy with their owners when you've got clubs like Chelsea to compare to? Their squad tonight was something like £650m cost. Crazy.
If Newcastle were spending right now like Chelsea then the media would be having a firestorm. Anyway I liken our current predicament and lack of ambition to when Ashley owned Newcastle. We are looking to sell. Zero ambition zero achievement. Lots of angst and spin.
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Yes, NR and all clubs go through lulls, to me at our club it is worse than a lull and rebuilding. There seems no aim to go higher. I’m not seeing players signed, where they are scouting players in areas where the club can get them at a reasonable price and develop players.
You don’t see us getting players from Ireland, Scottish leagues even Wales. There seems to be no scouting around non league or foreign climes. In short there seems no organised thinking on anything, only on being sustainable.
It’s like asking someone to vote for a politician who is offering nothing but struggle. Basically surviving year after year. You have to have ambitions and aspirations otherwise at best you stand still and at worst plummet down the leagues, which we have.
Does anybody see us breaking into the playoffs?, because I don’t. The side is short of being able to do that. Many underperforming for their abilities. A lot injured as soon as they pull our shirt on.
The blame lies all over the place but the manager isn’t getting the best from what he has for a start. The board whatever you say can do more. The fans can do more by more turning up and backing the side, I admit it’s hard when you see what we see.
The head of football hasn’t really worked as organisation doesn’t seem improved. Do the board trust Danny with any funds, or are they not sure about him?
There seems a lot not right at the club. Meandering through season after season is no way to go, writing seasons off around Christmas every year. Surely we can do better than this?
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Digging a bit deeper here on the subject of sustainability we need to consider and identify what are the true aims of the club ? Is it a private company seeking to sustain it's existance by making a profit, or at least not making a loss or is it a football club seeking success in the football league ? The Directors of a company have a duty to deliver the aims of the shareholders, whatever those aims may be. The shareholders i.e. the owners of a company are a seperate and superior authority to the Directors (in terms of the power they have to appoint or dismiss board Directors) but if the Directors are also shareholders the lines are somewhat blurred because they are unlikely to diismiss themselves for poor performance. This of course is all subject to the voting rights held by the shareholders which is normally comensurate with volume of shares held. If all of the talk on here about the owners having provided sufficient funds for us to be in a much higher position in the football league is true then surely the Directors should be held accountable for poor performance especialy the CEO who is the person who has the most executive responsibility and therefore the accountability that goes with it. Thus, logically, GB should be sacked for underperformance,
why has he not been ? Is it because the shareholders are in truth content with our steady fall down the ladder and potentially out of the football league altogether ? To me this seems unlikely but nonetheless the fans, who whilst they have no powers in terms of managing the club surely, given that they are the main revenue stream, have the moral right to be asking this question.
I agree with you 100%
Of course we should aspire to be a Championship club.
No disrespect to Forest Green Rovers, Morecambe, Accrington and a few other but they simply would never get attendances of over 5.000 simply based on population, history etc.
Doncaster on the other hand is a City ( now ) with a Metropolitan Borough population of 309.000
With some history of 2nd tier football.
There is huge potential but as I said in a recent previous post unless we unearth another JR one who has 500 million at least and is prepared to invest 50 million minimum to get us up towards the top of the championship then we are going to be treading water in League 1 at best.
It is obvious TB isn’t prepared to spend vast sums to take us to the championship and keep us there or even better. That is his right and we have no right to demand that he does.
We have to be grateful for what we have because the alternative could be Bury or Scunny.
Yes it mighty frustrating because there is no one, and i mean no one who wants to see this club more than me playing Sheff Utd, Sunderland, Norwich, WBA, Middlesbrough, and other clubs of their ilk in the Championship season after season.
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
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Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
All about opinions eh? Sorry but along with quite a few others I disagree.
Yep I certainly disagree. Hope that's not too tiresome, & some don't have to keep repeating themselves.
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Well seriously how many do you think they would get in the Championship?
Example. Burton Albion their gates were not much higher in the Championship than when at top of League 1.
Morecambe have a very limited catchment ref population.
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Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
All about opinions eh? Sorry but along with quite a few others I disagree.
Yep I certainly disagree. Hope that's not too tiresome, & some don't have to keep repeating themselves.
What a sad response.
Thought you might have a bit more about you than to use sarcasm. No need is there for that.
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Most fans come to be entertained and get away from everyday life, where being sustainable to live is part of everyday life. They don’t want to come and see no aim to improve. To always take the cheap way out. Never competing even with sides counted as smaller than ourselves.
Most fans want to see ambition to play higher up.
Playing good football and watching at a reasonable price- we have the latter not the former. We can’t get everyone we want but we need to be competing for the better players sometimes.
Ok so Copps is a liar, GB is a liar, DB is a liar and TB is a liar.
The budget was bottom 4 last season and it’s about 12/15 this season.
Ok you lot have it your way.
If you can’t see that the budget’s in 2021 wasn’t spent effectively and that set the rot in. Players under contract that you can’t always ship out when you need to which allows funds to recruit new players.
Recruitment this last summer 2022 was much improved.
The players we have in our squad this season are without question imo good enough for a top 7 finish in this league.
They have under performed big time.
GM tactically and motivational was very poor hence our nose dive after a great start of 4 wins 2 draws.
DS is tinkering with personnel, formations and tactics to such a degree that we are very inconsistent. He hasn’t sorted out our defence hence we leak goals.
Now if anyone thinks that
Mitchell, Knoyle/Brown, Anderson, Olowu, Maxwell, Rowe, Close, Biggins, Hurst, Molyneux, Miller don’t all have enough ability to be a team that finishes top 7 in this very average league then you have a different opinion to me.
That doesn’t mean we will finish top 7 There is a difference obviously as we have W11 D4 L11 so bang in mid table.
So we have underachieved.
That’s not TB or DB or GB or Copps fault.
It is GM and DS’s fault. They were and are the coaches. It is up to them to get the team playing to their optimum.
Give DS time though.
Gosh this is getting tiresome, I am repeating myself day after day.
The board have done their bit now it up to the coach and players to produce.
All about opinions eh? Sorry but along with quite a few others I disagree.
Yep I certainly disagree. Hope that's not too tiresome, & some don't have to keep repeating themselves.
What a sad response.
Thought you might have a bit more about you than to use sarcasm. No need is there for that.
As there is no need for your condescending comments, swings & roundabouts & all that.
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Tyke, only when your club is in the bottom of league two can you understand how so many fans feel.
That's not necessarily right because it's all relative .
I've seen us have to win our last home game of the season to avoid dropping in to league two whilst in administration and that's this century by the way .
I cut my teeth on the terraces at Oakwell when 3k was a good gate at the lower end of the fourth division in the 70's .
I've seen as much shyte as any fan in relative terms .
Some Rovers fans who contribute to this board may want to consider how a change of ownership worked out at Oldham and Scunthorpe .
Let's face it.. none of this tlhis Tyke nonsense washes... (granted you sound personally like a really good guy) nearly dropped to the 4th tier.. wtf.. do us a favour.. with your moneyball money pushing for a return to the championship.. I just hear it as 100% patronising for a town and club we should be bigger than., history isant always right vs potential and I hope I'm proved right in the future with the likes of Barnsley and Rothrrham
. So thanks but no thanks from me for your comments on a Rovers forum.
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Tyke, only when your club is in the bottom of league two can you understand how so many fans feel.
That's not necessarily right because it's all relative .
I've seen us have to win our last home game of the season to avoid dropping in to league two whilst in administration and that's this century by the way .
I cut my teeth on the terraces at Oakwell when 3k was a good gate at the lower end of the fourth division in the 70's .
I've seen as much shyte as any fan in relative terms .
Some Rovers fans who contribute to this board may want to consider how a change of ownership worked out at Oldham and Scunthorpe .
Let's face it.. none of this tlhis Tyke nonsense washes... (granted you sound personally like a really good guy) nearly dropped to the 4th tier.. wtf.. do us a favour.. with your moneyball money pushing for a return to the championship.. I just hear it as 100% patronising for a town and club we should be bigger than., history isant always right vs potential and I hope I'm proved right in the future with the likes of Barnsley and Rothrrham
. So thanks but no thanks from me for your comments on a Rovers forum.
I'm not patronising Exile I'm simply quoting history and it's certainly not my fault the people of Doncaster don't back Rovers in the numbers they probably should .
The moneyball comment is sadly misplaced , it's an absolute failure and left us in huge financial jeopardy and led to three of the owners getting removed from the board .
Which is why I've warned against changes of ownership on this board at Rovers and highlighted the merits of local ownership .
As far as greater potential is concerned that may well be true given the population of Doncaster but just how long can you use the term potential before it evaporates ?
You were formed in 1879 .
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Digging a bit deeper here on the subject of sustainability we need to consider and identify what are the true aims of the club ? Is it a private company seeking to sustain it's existance by making a profit, or at least not making a loss or is it a football club seeking success in the football league ? The Directors of a company have a duty to deliver the aims of the shareholders, whatever those aims may be. The shareholders i.e. the owners of a company are a seperate and superior authority to the Directors (in terms of the power they have to appoint or dismiss board Directors) but if the Directors are also shareholders the lines are somewhat blurred because they are unlikely to diismiss themselves for poor performance. This of course is all subject to the voting rights held by the shareholders which is normally comensurate with volume of shares held. If all of the talk on here about the owners having provided sufficient funds for us to be in a much higher position in the football league is true then surely the Directors should be held accountable for poor performance especialy the CEO who is the person who has the most executive responsibility and therefore the accountability that goes with it. Thus, logically, GB should be sacked for underperformance,
why has he not been ? Is it because the shareholders are in truth content with our steady fall down the ladder and potentially out of the football league altogether ? To me this seems unlikely but nonetheless the fans, who whilst they have no powers in terms of managing the club surely, given that they are the main revenue stream, have the moral right to be asking this question.
You're aware GB owns effectively a third of the shares along with Blunt and Bramall each owning a third? I was surprised to learn this a while back as i dont recall there ever being much of an announcement that those two had become significant equity owners of Club Doncaster (which in turn controls about 98% of the Rovers) Presumably GB will receive a significant six figure salary for his role. I would imagine Blunt also. Seems to me that when you have two thirds of the shares in the hands of two extremely highly remunerated Directors of the club, with no requirement for any of them to put their hands in their pocket to run the club, where is the impetus for change actually going to come from? The boys have jobs for life and DRFC exists at no cost to them, first and foremost to pay Baldwin and Blunt their significant salaries.
I make no criticism of that. My own business exists purely to pay me my salary/dividends and that's how/why many companies exist. But the repeated narrative of Bramall selflessly funding us to the tune of millions a year no longer rings true. The club is a business that exists to remunerate Baldwin and Blunt and as long as TB doesn't have to put his hand in his pocket its all good. Anything after that (footballing concerns) is a secondary concern. Priorities are in this order 1. Sustainability so TB doesn't have to put anything in 2. Ability to hamsomely remunerate GB and DB and only after that do we get to considering the performance on the team and footballing matters.
That's the difference between a club being run as a business, compared to one being bankrolled by a true benefactor like JR. I'm sure he didn't take salary/remuneration. I'm sure Wetzel, Milton, Beresford etc etc didn't take salaries/remuneration. That's the difference.
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The financial self sustainability model is workable with success on the field if Rovers can start a process of finding talent at low cost and selling them on for a good profit .
I'm not talking about the odd Ben Whiteman here and there but a real emphasis to find this talent and develop it with contracts drawn up with players so that Rovers receive the absolute top end fees at the point of sale .
However and once again speaking from experience it isn't that easy either .
We ended up with £8m for John Stones once he moved from Everton to Man City and received £6.5m for Alfie Mawson when he went to Swansea .
You'd think you'd be able to sustain a decent period of championship football wouldn't you with that kind of money rolling in .
Alas it's not that simple seen as we've been relegated 3 times from the championship in 10 years .
Maybe Rovers could do better than ourselves with such a model .
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Digging a bit deeper here on the subject of sustainability we need to consider and identify what are the true aims of the club ? Is it a private company seeking to sustain it's existance by making a profit, or at least not making a loss or is it a football club seeking success in the football league ? The Directors of a company have a duty to deliver the aims of the shareholders, whatever those aims may be. The shareholders i.e. the owners of a company are a seperate and superior authority to the Directors (in terms of the power they have to appoint or dismiss board Directors) but if the Directors are also shareholders the lines are somewhat blurred because they are unlikely to diismiss themselves for poor performance. This of course is all subject to the voting rights held by the shareholders which is normally comensurate with volume of shares held. If all of the talk on here about the owners having provided sufficient funds for us to be in a much higher position in the football league is true then surely the Directors should be held accountable for poor performance especialy the CEO who is the person who has the most executive responsibility and therefore the accountability that goes with it. Thus, logically, GB should be sacked for underperformance,
why has he not been ? Is it because the shareholders are in truth content with our steady fall down the ladder and potentially out of the football league altogether ? To me this seems unlikely but nonetheless the fans, who whilst they have no powers in terms of managing the club surely, given that they are the main revenue stream, have the moral right to be asking this question.
You're aware GB owns effectively a third of the shares along with Blunt and Bramall each owning a third? I was surprised to learn this a while back as i dont recall there ever being much of an announcement that those two had become significant equity owners of Club Doncaster (which in turn controls about 98% of the Rovers) Presumably GB will receive a significant six figure salary for his role. I would imagine Blunt also. Seems to me that when you have two thirds of the shares in the hands of two extremely highly remunerated Directors of the club, with no requirement for any of them to put their hands in their pocket to run the club, where is the impetus for change actually going to come from? The boys have jobs for life and DRFC exists at no cost to them, first and foremost to pay Baldwin and Blunt their significant salaries.
I make no criticism of that. My own business exists purely to pay me my salary/dividends and that's how/why many companies exist. But the repeated narrative of Bramall selflessly funding us to the tune of millions a year no longer rings true. The club is a business that exists to remunerate Baldwin and Blunt and as long as TB doesn't have to put his hand in his pocket its all good. Anything after that (footballing concerns) is a secondary concern. Priorities are in this order 1. Sustainability so TB doesn't have to put anything in 2. Ability to hamsomely remunerate GB and DB and only after that do we get to considering the performance on the team and footballing matters.
That's the difference between a club being run as a business, compared to one being bankrolled by a true benefactor like JR. I'm sure he didn't take salary/remuneration. I'm sure Wetzel, Milton, Beresford etc etc didn't take salaries/remuneration. That's the difference.
Baldwin receives a salary because he is a full time employee. He is the CEO
Where has the information that Blunt receives a salary come from?
I wasn’t aware he was an employee on a salary. Just Chairman of the Club.
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A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
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Reading SM's post on the current state of the club along with Copps comment regarding resources, it does make me wonder. Did Andrew Watson see the writing on the wall when he decided to call it a day?
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Accrington Stanley have had 5 seasons in League 1 with around 3000.
Bradford City have had four seasons in League 2 with over 10000.
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A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Will they, who knew! How much did John Ryan get paid then btw?
I suggest you research how football clubs are financed before showing your ignorance on a public forum.
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A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Will they, who knew! How much did John Ryan get paid then btw?
I suggest you research how football clubs are financed before showing your ignorance on a public forum.
A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Will they, who knew! How much did John Ryan get paid then btw?
I suggest you research how football clubs are financed before showing your ignorance on a public forum.
Why bring Ryan into it. A chairman doesn’t fund the club the owner does. Sometimes it’s the same person sometimes they aren’t but as I said in business the role of chairman is paid.
Read what I said and count to 10 before you post on a public forum.
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A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Most Football league clubs and Premier league Chairmen as far as I am aware don’t receive a Salary.
Well that’s how it was in years gone by. They are not employees of the football club.
CEO’s of course whether they are shareholders or not are full time employees so receive a salary.
Now if David Blunt is receiving a salary it’s news to me and I find it somewhat alarming.
Yes due to performance of the Football operation on the field of play he then becomes much more accountable. He would possibly be sacked by most commercial companies for ineptitude.
As a major share holder he isn’t going to sack himself.
Who has the voting rights. Who is he accountable to?
This paints a completely different picture to the one I was aware of.
I always thought both Bramall & Blunt have taken not one penny out of the club.
They have only put money in. Bramall of course will not have taken any Salary. That I assume is a given.
Baldwin as a full time CEO obviously receives a salary and it may be performance related. I don’t know if it is or not.
He has done a fantastic job with Club Doncaster and thanks to his hard work and others in the marketing and commercial depts, the club has multiple revenue streams that brings in considerable funds.
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Daniel Levy, chairman of Tottenham, is the highest paid non footballing person in the game picking up 4m a year.
It is quite normal for chairman to be employed by the company, non executive chairmen aren’t and tend to be involved in many company’s so only part time really.
Obviously I don’t know the situation with Blunt but it’s very normal to get paid in business for the role and we seem to run more as a business than a football club
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Daniel Levy, chairman of Tottenham, is the highest paid non footballing person in the game picking up 4m a year.
It is quite normal for chairman to be employed by the company, non executive chairmen aren’t and tend to be involved in many company’s so only part time really.
Obviously I don’t know the situation with Blunt but it’s very normal to get paid in business for the role and we seem to run more as a business than a football club
Daniel Levy is a full time employee. So he takes remuneration.
Is David Blunt a full time employee at DRFC? I wasn’t aware he was. Gavin Baldwin runs the day to day business of the club.
If I am wrong then happy to be corrected.
Maybe SM you can clear this one up once and for all. Or Lincoln Rover ( Derek ) maybe you know?
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Accrington Stanley have had 5 seasons in League 1 with around 3000.
Bradford City have had four seasons in League 2 with over 10000.
Accrington Stanly have the best manager of all 92 Premier league and EFL clubs.
Based on the size of the club, attendances and budget Coleman should have had Manager of the season for 6 yrs running imo.
He has produced a miracle at that club.
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Barring the cameo ( and quite wonderful might I add) signing of billy, we were blessed with a group of relatively unremarkable players that just clicked. John Ryan was a wonderfully vocal and positive ambassador for the club also. It was certainly a high point for the club.
So nothing to do woth SoD or RK then, just clicked!!!
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
Thanks for that SM
As I thought. Amazing isn’t it how much rubbish is posted without any factual evidence.
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A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Will they, who knew! How much did John Ryan get paid then btw?
I suggest you research how football clubs are financed before showing your ignorance on a public forum.
A chairman of a company will normally get paid so wouldn’t be surprised if Blunt was getting a salary.
We should make his and others salary more performance related imo. They’d owe the club money right now
Will they, who knew! How much did John Ryan get paid then btw?
I suggest you research how football clubs are financed before showing your ignorance on a public forum.
Why bring Ryan into it. A chairman doesn’t fund the club the owner does. Sometimes it’s the same person sometimes they aren’t but as I said in business the role of chairman is paid.
Read what I said and count to 10 before you post on a public forum.
Because John Ryan was the chairman of Doncaster Rovers - just as David Blunt is - so the situation for him must be the same as for Blunt. You are happy to tell us Blunt takes money from Rovers so did John Ryan?
Shareholders fund the club. The owners of a business are the people who own the shares of that business - what else is it do you think they own?
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Accrington Stanley have had 5 seasons in League 1 with around 3000.
Bradford City have had four seasons in League 2 with over 10000.
Accrington Stanly have the best manager of all 92 Premier league and EFL clubs.
Based on the size of the club, attendances and budget Coleman should have had Manager of the season for 6 yrs running imo.
He has produced a miracle at that club.
My point exactly. It's not how much money you have - its how you use it. Same with any business.
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Accrington Stanley have had 5 seasons in League 1 with around 3000.
Bradford City have had four seasons in League 2 with over 10000.
Accrington Stanly have the best manager of all 92 Premier league and EFL clubs.
Based on the size of the club, attendances and budget Coleman should have had Manager of the season for 6 yrs running imo.
He has produced a miracle at that club.
My point exactly. It's not how much money you have - its how you use it. Same with any business.
Well said.
Banging our heads against a brick wall though because there are some that simply refuse to understand that fact.
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So why do football clubs have rich owners?
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Obviously I don’t know the situation with Blunt but it’s very normal to get paid in business for the role and we seem to run more as a business than a football club
Yet above you tell us you do know the situation?
How should football clubs be run if not as businesses?
Levy is the CEO at Spurs as well as Chairman.
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So why do football clubs have rich owners?
There's always a book about it:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Money-Football-Soccernomics-Unterhaching-Scunthorpe/dp/1568585268
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So why do football clubs have rich owners?
What do you mean BB? I will see you at the match probably. :)
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Look I think we are United in how we feel about the current league position (even if we are within touching distance of the play offs), however for all the the anti board posts I am yet to see anyone put forward an alternative. It’s all well and goodi saying sell it - but who to ? The first person who turns up ? Mr Hedge Fund ?
There are a lot of clubs over the last few years cursing their owners
In my honest opinion a couple of wins and the question of ownership will slip down the conversational order
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
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So why do football clubs have rich owners?
What do you mean BB? I will see you at the match probably. :)
I mean football clubs, in general, are barely profitable, therefore the richer the owners are the more cash can be injected into the team. Without enough cash being injected, teams will struggle against teams who have had enough cash injected.
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
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In my experience there are certain results which can define you successfully for a number of years and then there's the other side to that when a result kills you equally for a number of years .
That penalty shoot out defeat at The Valley set you back , that's not a flaw by the way that's just the way football goes .
You get through that semi final and beat Sunderland at Wembley which you were more than capable of doing it changes everything that's happened since .
That Play Off Final defeat to Ipswich Town in 2000 killed us , ended the golden era stone dead .
We win that game and return to the PL with Dave Bassett at the helm who knew a thing or two about PL survival and who knows where my club could be today .
We've never seen those days since or had the resources to buy the players we did back then and what's more we probably won't ever again .
23 years ago and it still haunts me .
Football is remarkably cruel when it goes against you .
All the present issues date back to that night at The Valley in 2019 .
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Noted regarding Blunt not taking anything out. Also news to me that he contributed millions to the club. That's news to me too. But thanks for the clarification SM.
Regarding Baldwin and his third share of Club Doncaster that he has somehow acquired....does his package incentivise him acheiving the board's overriding objective of sustainability?
Let's be honest here, sustainability is number one objective before anything else so it would seem obvious that the CEO is targeted to achieve that. Why would Baldwin prioritise success on the pitch if that meant failure to hit the sustainability target hit him in the pocket?
All supposition of course. And to my eyes nothing wrong with any of it from a business perspective. This is the result of us being run like a business rather than a football club relying on handouts from a benefactor. Great for the Shareholders....not so great for the fans. Balancing the books comes before everything else I'm afraid guys!
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
I agree CR, but it absolutely IS about how much money you put into the team. Would Rovers have reached the Championship without Ryan, Bramall & Watson's investment?
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
Or, looked at from a different perspective, they took control of a respected upper League 1/bottom Championship club. That club had a well respected reputation in the game, a clear identity and a clear style of football, in a nice stadium with a small but vociferous fanbase. We were a club that punched above our weight but garnered respect across the game as to how we go about things.
And over time due to a combination of incompetence and mismanagement of footballing matters they have presided over a decline in the clubs fortunes to the extent that we now find ourselves languishing in the arse end of League 2 with a poor squad, scruffy stadium, no identity and widespread apathy amongst the fan base. The principles and identity of the old Doncaster Rovers have been sacrificed at the expense of financial sustainability and being run as a proper business.
All this crap about how grateful we should be. Owning a football club means having to put your hand in your pocket shocker! Who knew?! What sanctimonious twaddle. There was a DRFC before Terry Bramall, Gavin Baldwin and David Blunt and there'll be one after they're gone. Give me a plucky little club run by footballing people with a sense of identity, even if that is in non league, over this corporate non-entity we currently have.
Hypothetical scenario.....John Ryan says he's happy to take over the club but realistically he can only bankroll us to achieve and sustain the status of a top end Conference club. Is it just me who would snap his hand off?!
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
I agree CR, but it absolutely IS about how much money you put into the team. Would Rovers have reached the Championship without Ryan, Bramall & Watson's investment?
No we would not almost certainly. But we also had a manger and coach in SoD & RoK who also made it possible.
You can throw as much money at it as you want but without an excellent Manager & or Coach you still will not have success.
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Of course, the manager has to sign the right players to be successful, but no matter how excellent a manager is he needs sufficient funds to do so.
Gary Coleman's doing a great job at Accrington, but they're lying 21st in League 1. I bet he'd have them higher than that if he had more funds. On the other hand, I wonder if Accrington would be higher if Pep Guardiola was the manager.
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
Or, looked at from a different perspective, they took control of a respected upper League 1/bottom Championship club. That club had a well respected reputation in the game, a clear identity and a clear style of football, in a nice stadium with a small but vociferous fanbase. We were a club that punched above our weight but garnered respect across the game as to how we go about things.
And over time due to a combination of incompetence and mismanagement of footballing matters they have presided over a decline in the clubs fortunes to the extent that we now find ourselves languishing in the arse end of League 2 with a poor squad, scruffy stadium, no identity and widespread apathy amongst the fan base. The principles and identity of the old Doncaster Rovers have been sacrificed at the expense of financial sustainability and being run as a proper business.
All this crap about how grateful we should be. Owning a football club means having to put your hand in your pocket shocker! Who knew?! What sanctimonious twaddle. There was a DRFC before Terry Bramall, Gavin Baldwin and David Blunt and there'll be one after they're gone. Give me a plucky little club run by footballing people with a sense of identity, even if that is in non league, over this corporate non-entity we currently have.
Hypothetical scenario.....John Ryan says he's happy to take over the club but realistically he can only bankroll us to achieve and sustain the status of a top end Conference club. Is it just me who would snap his hand off?!
I'm sure advocating a drop into the National League is likely to produce overwhelming popular support.
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
I agree CR, but it absolutely IS about how much money you put into the team. Would Rovers have reached the Championship without Ryan, Bramall & Watson's investment?
But for JR it was not sustainable. He would have run out of money.
So he brought in Bramall & Watson. They could see that the business model JR had was frought with long term danger.
JR left after a major disagreement. The strategy has been to make the club self sustainable and that has been achieved but unfortunately without that extra million or 2 each season the football team has declined.
Having said that if GM hadn’t left in summer of 2019 who knows where we would be now.
For me it’s been more about the managers and recruitment than the finances.
We should never have got relegated last season. Wellens messed up and GmS wasn’t the man to turn our season round. Hence where we are right now.
What we do need is stability not changing managers every 5 mins because we will be going round & round circles trying to find the exit door.
Eventually it might be the wrong exit. We have to give DS this summer and 4 months next season.
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
I agree CR, but it absolutely IS about how much money you put into the team. Would Rovers have reached the Championship without Ryan, Bramall & Watson's investment?
But for JR it was not sustainable. He would have run out of money.
So he brought in Bramall & Watson. They could see that the business model JR had was frought with long term danger.
JR left after a major disagreement. The strategy has been to make the club self sustainable and that has been achieved but unfortunately without that extra million or 2 each season the football team has declined.
Having said that if GM hadn’t left in summer of 2019 who knows where we would be now.
For me it’s been more about the managers and recruitment than the finances.
We should never have got relegated last season. Wellens messed up and GmS wasn’t the man to turn our season round. Hence where we are right now.
What we do need is stability not changing managers every 5 mins because we will be going round & round circles trying to find the exit door.
Eventually it might be the wrong exit. We have to give DS this summer and 4 months next season.
My point is it DOES matter how much money you have, and your post above confirms that.
I agree that pouring money into a team doesn't guarantee success, but on the other hand, not putting enough money in does guarantee failure.
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
Or, looked at from a different perspective, they took control of a respected upper League 1/bottom Championship club. That club had a well respected reputation in the game, a clear identity and a clear style of football, in a nice stadium with a small but vociferous fanbase. We were a club that punched above our weight but garnered respect across the game as to how we go about things.
And over time due to a combination of incompetence and mismanagement of footballing matters they have presided over a decline in the clubs fortunes to the extent that we now find ourselves languishing in the arse end of League 2 with a poor squad, scruffy stadium, no identity and widespread apathy amongst the fan base. The principles and identity of the old Doncaster Rovers have been sacrificed at the expense of financial sustainability and being run as a proper business.
All this crap about how grateful we should be. Owning a football club means having to put your hand in your pocket shocker! Who knew?! What sanctimonious twaddle. There was a DRFC before Terry Bramall, Gavin Baldwin and David Blunt and there'll be one after they're gone. Give me a plucky little club run by footballing people with a sense of identity, even if that is in non league, over this corporate non-entity we currently have.
Hypothetical scenario.....John Ryan says he's happy to take over the club but realistically he can only bankroll us to achieve and sustain the status of a top end Conference club. Is it just me who would snap his hand off?!
I'm sure advocating a drop into the National League is likely to produce overwhelming popular support.
I suggest you look up our attendances for the 98/99 season. It galvanised our support and rallied the town. It built a new generation fans (me included) who have been squandered. The drop into non-league was actually the step backwards we needed to reinvigorate the club, fresh energy, fresh buzz, new ownership, renewed optimism after decades of mismanagement. Sometimes you have to go backwards to go forwards.
I'm not saying I want non league football. What I'm saying is that I would take that in exchange for us having a football club that rediscovered a vision, some optimism and some ambition.
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
Or, looked at from a different perspective, they took control of a respected upper League 1/bottom Championship club. That club had a well respected reputation in the game, a clear identity and a clear style of football, in a nice stadium with a small but vociferous fanbase. We were a club that punched above our weight but garnered respect across the game as to how we go about things.
And over time due to a combination of incompetence and mismanagement of footballing matters they have presided over a decline in the clubs fortunes to the extent that we now find ourselves languishing in the arse end of League 2 with a poor squad, scruffy stadium, no identity and widespread apathy amongst the fan base. The principles and identity of the old Doncaster Rovers have been sacrificed at the expense of financial sustainability and being run as a proper business.
All this crap about how grateful we should be. Owning a football club means having to put your hand in your pocket shocker! Who knew?! What sanctimonious twaddle. There was a DRFC before Terry Bramall, Gavin Baldwin and David Blunt and there'll be one after they're gone. Give me a plucky little club run by footballing people with a sense of identity, even if that is in non league, over this corporate non-entity we currently have.
Hypothetical scenario.....John Ryan says he's happy to take over the club but realistically he can only bankroll us to achieve and sustain the status of a top end Conference club. Is it just me who would snap his hand off?!
I'm sure advocating a drop into the National League is likely to produce overwhelming popular support.
I suggest you look up our attendances for the 98/99 season. It galvanised our support and rallied the town. It built a new generation fans (me included) who have been squandered. The drop into non-league was actually the step backwards we needed to reinvigorate the club, fresh energy, fresh buzz, new ownership, renewed optimism after decades of mismanagement. Sometimes you have to go backwards to go forwards.
I'm not saying I want non league football. What I'm saying is that I would take that in exchange for us having a football club that rediscovered a vision, some optimism and some ambition.
Fine. Start a grassroots campaign arguing that relegation (and not promotion back into the League) is worth it, and see how far you get.
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At the end of the day, the business of a football club is to produce a winning team.
It is BB but throwing vast sums of personnel wealth is a choice not a pre requisite.
You or me if we had the funds might be prepared to lose it in the pursuit of glory. There are others who are only prepared to lose so much.
Unless that benefactor knocks on the door then what? We have to be thankful for owners who care and have made the club financially stable, debt free and therefore an attractive proposition for somebody to come in and buy the club.
I agree CR, but it absolutely IS about how much money you put into the team. Would Rovers have reached the Championship without Ryan, Bramall & Watson's investment?
But for JR it was not sustainable. He would have run out of money.
So he brought in Bramall & Watson. They could see that the business model JR had was frought with long term danger.
JR left after a major disagreement. The strategy has been to make the club self sustainable and that has been achieved but unfortunately without that extra million or 2 each season the football team has declined.
Having said that if GM hadn’t left in summer of 2019 who knows where we would be now.
For me it’s been more about the managers and recruitment than the finances.
We should never have got relegated last season. Wellens messed up and GmS wasn’t the man to turn our season round. Hence where we are right now.
What we do need is stability not changing managers every 5 mins because we will be going round & round circles trying to find the exit door.
Eventually it might be the wrong exit. We have to give DS this summer and 4 months next season.
My point is it DOES matter how much money you have, and your post above confirms that.
I agree that pouring money into a team doesn't guarantee success, but on the other hand, not putting enough money in does guarantee failure.
There is a fine line BB
It’s obviously both.
But look at Accrington. They should be in the National league.
But they have a manager who has been capable of mid table finishes for 5 seasons in League 1. He has hardly had a cent to spend.
So if we had the right managers over the last 3 yrs we wouldn’t be in League 2
As Tyke said if we had won at Charlton we might have gone on and beaten Sunderland and the whole picture would be very different.
The rot set in with McCann leaving and then DM doing the same. Serious errors have been made after that.
Anyway I believe we have bottomed out and the only way is up. Come on DS & Copps prove me right.
The budget is not the issue. It’s good enough and will also be next season.
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I'm becoming a little exasperated with all the simplistic comments which have been posted so far. Even some of my responses have made things look simpler than what they are, and for that I apologise.
I'm trying to strike a balance between what I know, what I think I know and at the same time retain the confidence of people who keep me informed and answer my questions when I ask them.
What I do know is that the ownership model at DRFC is not as simple as everybody seems to make it out to be. We've had people come and go over the years that has complicated the picture and they've come in at different levels and at different costs. The VSC for example was a major player at one point because of our shareholding but that £110,000 we paid for shares has been whittled away to nothing these days. I doubt anybody even acknowledges it these days which is a pity but understandable. DB bought into the business when asked by TB and DW, how much that cost I don't remember the exact figure but I'll go back and check my records and see if I can find it. I did say it was millions but it was probably not that high. JR exited the business and left his loans and so did the Watson family.
I can't understand how anybody on this forum can level any criticism at GB though. He, more than anyone else, has been the driving force behind the commercial success of the club in recent years. He is a shareholder, but there are different types of shares in any business and I'm suggesting that they are a burden rather than the financial benefit people claim them to be. Much like the VSC shares they come at a cost. And its the increasing commercial viability of the Club Doncaster model that will be the driver going forward, the more that makes the bigger the budget we have, that's been the model for a number of years now and GB is responsible for that.
But all this guff about incentivising GB to run a sustainable business rather than providing funds for the playing budget is exactly that, just guff. Some people on this forum seem to think that the playing budget was cut in order to make the club sustainable which again is a nonsense, the playing budget is set by the Chair, not by GB. The Chair sets the playing budget and then GB, along with Richard the FD, need to provide a business plan that gets them to where they need to be.
Those who also hark back to the good old days of JR have very short memories. We weren't the successful club that everybody remembers without the funding of the Watson and Bramall families. 2006/07 was the time period when they joined JR and we were still at a crumbling Belle Vue at the time. 2013 was the time that JR offered them the 'deal of the century' as he called it and wanted them to sell their shareholding in the club for peanuts to a hedge fund who didn't have two pennies to rub together. People forget how we were being sold down the river for one man. That was 10 years ago!! And since then it was about the Watson family who regrettably stepped down but wrote off their £14m, and the Bramall family who have also contributed many millions. But yet we don't have a Chairman who can bang the drum!
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I think there is a growing number of people completely despondent and bored with these tired old arguments about which owner did what, who gets enough credit and who gets too little. I appreciate what JR did for the club, as I appreciate what TB and the Watson family did and have done for the club.
We are concerned about the gradual decline since 18/19, seemingly corresponding to TB's rollback from investing substantial funds in the club.
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Gary Coleman's doing a great job at Accrington,
Whatch'you talking 'bout Willis?
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Gary Coleman's doing a great job at Accrington,
Whatch'you talking 'bout Willis?
John Coleman! Bloody predictive text!
:whistle:
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I'm becoming a little exasperated with all the simplistic comments which have been posted so far. Even some of my responses have made things look simpler than what they are, and for that I apologise.
I'm trying to strike a balance between what I know, what I think I know and at the same time retain the confidence of people who keep me informed and answer my questions when I ask them.
What I do know is that the ownership model at DRFC is not as simple as everybody seems to make it out to be. We've had people come and go over the years that has complicated the picture and they've come in at different levels and at different costs. The VSC for example was a major player at one point because of our shareholding but that £110,000 we paid for shares has been whittled away to nothing these days. I doubt anybody even acknowledges it these days which is a pity but understandable. DB bought into the business when asked by TB and DW, how much that cost I don't remember the exact figure but I'll go back and check my records and see if I can find it. I did say it was millions but it was probably not that high. JR exited the business and left his loans and so did the Watson family.
I can't understand how anybody on this forum can level any criticism at GB though. He, more than anyone else, has been the driving force behind the commercial success of the club in recent years. He is a shareholder, but there are different types of shares in any business and I'm suggesting that they are a burden rather than the financial benefit people claim them to be. Much like the VSC shares they come at a cost. And its the increasing commercial viability of the Club Doncaster model that will be the driver going forward, the more that makes the bigger the budget we have, that's been the model for a number of years now and GB is responsible for that.
But all this guff about incentivising GB to run a sustainable business rather than providing funds for the playing budget is exactly that, just guff. Some people on this forum seem to think that the playing budget was cut in order to make the club sustainable which again is a nonsense, the playing budget is set by the Chair, not by GB. The Chair sets the playing budget and then GB, along with Richard the FD, need to provide a business plan that gets them to where they need to be.
Those who also hark back to the good old days of JR have very short memories. We weren't the successful club that everybody remembers without the funding of the Watson and Bramall families. 2006/07 was the time period when they joined JR and we were still at a crumbling Belle Vue at the time. 2013 was the time that JR offered them the 'deal of the century' as he called it and wanted them to sell their shareholding in the club for peanuts to a hedge fund who didn't have two pennies to rub together. People forget how we were being sold down the river for one man. That was 10 years ago!! And since then it was about the Watson family who regrettably stepped down but wrote off their £14m, and the Bramall family who have also contributed many millions. But yet we don't have a Chairman who can bang the drum!
Well SM you seem to have successully derided a lot of posters on this thread who sadly lack your vast inside knowledge and evidently greater wisdom. Let us all.pity those of us with short memories who spout 'guff' and are guilty of being simplistic, moreover woe betide anyone who speaks highly of JR who in your view was willing to sell the club for peanuts (perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all) but may I suggest that even those of us who are less well informed have a right to express opinions and ask questions ? Also may I suggest that 'above crticism' Gavin Baldwin who certainly appears to be good at his job is probably paid a big fat salary for it, money which might otherwise go into the playing budget. Or, do you think that responsibility should not be accompanied by accountability ?
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
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Look I think we are United in how we feel about the current league position (even if we are within touching distance of the play offs), however for all the the anti board posts I am yet to see anyone put forward an alternative. It’s all well and goodi saying sell it - but who to ? The first person who turns up ? Mr Hedge Fund ?
There are a lot of clubs over the last few years cursing their owners
In my honest opinion a couple of wins and the question of ownership will slip down the conversational order
can you see us getting a couple of wins? Maybe 2 wins in 4 but not good enough, where do you see the wins coming from? I thought 1 would be today
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I think the admittedly dwindling numbers of those who still believe "it will all click soon' have missed what is happening here. This group of player is just rank bad. There is no sign whatsoever they can get their act together and go on a run.
We are not playing teams off the park here and just being unlucky. We are not a good side. In fact, we are consistently poor. We play poor football. We are laughable defensively, too slow in midfield, and ponderous in attack. All of this wrapped in a thick blanket of spinelessness.
There is no "click' going to happen here as this group of players have shown consistently all season that they are what they are - a lower mid table side in League Two. A few young lads coming in on loan isn't going to change that, neither is tinkering with the formation.
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Thanks for the enlightenment. Perhaps you could explain and quantify what the assets are ? There is value in the playing staff, also the training ground which i believe is owned by the club. What else ?
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Thanks for the enlightenment. Perhaps you could explain and quantify what the assets are ? There is value in the playing staff, also the training ground which i believe is owned by the club. What else ?
I'm not your mum, do your own homework.
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Btw, a bit off topic I know but Google paid 22 billion for WhatsApp who had never returned a profit, the reason being the potential.for growth. But its a bit hard to see where the growth for DRFC is coming from, especialy after being beaten at home by the monkey hangers
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Thanks for the enlightenment. Perhaps you could explain and quantify what the assets are ? There is value in the playing staff, also the training ground which i believe is owned by the club. What else ?
I'm not your mum, do your own homework.
I did but the dog ate it
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Btw, a bit off topic I know but Google paid 22 billion for WhatsApp who had never returned a profit, the reason being the potential.for growth. But its a bit hard to see where the growth for DRFC is coming from, especialy after being beaten at home by the monkey hangers
Am sure thats new to Google..........
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
there is no way blunt has put millions into this football club, that’s an exaggerated figure. From the outside he appears to be doing an absolutely horrific job as Chatman so in terms of valuing him he gets the stick he deserves. I actually think he deserves more flack as most of the abuse said/written about Baldwin should be directed at Blunt.
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Look I think we are United in how we feel about the current league position (even if we are within touching distance of the play offs), however for all the the anti board posts I am yet to see anyone put forward an alternative. It’s all well and goodi saying sell it - but who to ? The first person who turns up ? Mr Hedge Fund ?
There are a lot of clubs over the last few years cursing their owners
In my honest opinion a couple of wins and the question of ownership will slip down the conversational order
can you see us getting a couple of wins? Maybe 2 wins in 4 but not good enough, where do you see the wins coming from? I thought 1 would be today
Before today I was adamant we would go on a good run.
Today was the banker of all the games coming up. I had them in my acca.
Now I'm so deflated and cannot see any Light at the end of the tunnel. We have been beaten at home by the team with the worst away record in the football league.
My support I'm afraid is at an all time low. It's not gone yet but it's damn hard
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perhaps you would like to explain to us ignoramuses how a perenially loss making business has any value at all
If you can't understand that even a loss-making business still has assets then perhaps you're right to call yourself an ignoramus.
Btw, a bit off topic I know but Google paid 22 billion for WhatsApp who had never returned a profit, the reason being the potential.for growth. But its a bit hard to see where the growth for DRFC is coming from, especialy after being beaten at home by the monkey hangers
Very few Technology firms turn a profit. Some don't even have revenues before acquisition. The colossal valuations are down to an assessment of future success, or the ability to monopolise a nascent market from the outset. None of this applies to a football club that has been around since 1879 playing a sport that was formalised a few decades earlier.
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I think the admittedly dwindling numbers of those who still believe "it will all click soon' have missed what is happening here. This group of player is just rank bad. There is no sign whatsoever they can get their act together and go on a run.
We are not playing teams off the park here and just being unlucky. We are not a good side. In fact, we are consistently poor. We play poor football. We are laughable defensively, too slow in midfield, and ponderous in attack. All of this wrapped in a thick blanket of spinelessness.
There is no "click' going to happen here as this group of players have shown consistently all season that they are what they are - a lower mid table side in League Two. A few young lads coming in on loan isn't going to change that, neither is tinkering with the formation.
I disagree.
I think the manager is not getting them playing anywhere near what they are capable of.
Yes we need a proper mister at the back. A real leader on the park and off it.
We also need another midfielder a real enforcer. Ball winner but someone with legs.
Jury out on Lavery he may be ok for this league and Miller needs a goal asap to get his mojo back. He looks short of confidence.
Jury out on Anderson at present, he doesn’t seem the same confident player he was.
In the summer clear out Williams, Long, Seaman, Ravenhill, Barlow, Agard & Griffiths and replace with some quality.
Loan players will go no doubt. Maybe sign Brown if we can.
Olowu and Faulkner are our future but the big priority is a proper experienced centre back, a leader.
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I’ve been hoping it’ll click for ages now and honestly thought it would. Don’t believe it now.
So much time on the training ground and we’re worse. Have to give DS time the majority of this squad have had too much time.
Anyone left over from last season should never have worn the shirt again. We signed L2 players, ones who can improve but nonetheless L2 players, this summer. So we have half a team that are worse than L2 level and another half for who it is their level
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
there is no way blunt has put millions into this football club, that’s an exaggerated figure. From the outside he appears to be doing an absolutely horrific job as Chatman so in terms of valuing him he gets the stick he deserves. I actually think he deserves more flack as most of the abuse said/written about Baldwin should be directed at Blunt.
If you read further down the thread I did retract that to a point where I said I was unsure about his initial investment and I would check my records. I also meant to say that between them they'd invested millions, but it didn't read that way.
I’ve also defended GB for a number of years now because of his commercial acumen and the ability to generate the profits that CD does.
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
there is no way blunt has put millions into this football club, that’s an exaggerated figure. From the outside he appears to be doing an absolutely horrific job as Chatman so in terms of valuing him he gets the stick he deserves. I actually think he deserves more flack as most of the abuse said/written about Baldwin should be directed at Blunt.
If you read further down the thread I did retract that to a point where I said I was unsure about his initial investment and I would check my records.
I’ve also defended GB for a number of years now because of his commercial acumen and the ability to generate the profits that CD does.
Baldwin has done exactly what he was brought in to do - make Club Doncaster commercially successful, and done so during a nationwide economic downturn, which makes his success even more noteworthy.
I know he's been ruthless in his assessment of Rovers matchday spending. I do wonder if that sent the fear of god into the board on their assessment of how much money they should put into the playing squad though, and the board have adopted his frugal outlook. Just a theory.
Any ire towards GB is misplaced though.
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David Blunt has never taken a penny out of this club, nor has TB.
They have both contributed millions though into keeping this club going.
And this is how we value them?
there is no way blunt has put millions into this football club, that’s an exaggerated figure. From the outside he appears to be doing an absolutely horrific job as Chatman so in terms of valuing him he gets the stick he deserves. I actually think he deserves more flack as most of the abuse said/written about Baldwin should be directed at Blunt.
If you read further down the thread I did retract that to a point where I said I was unsure about his initial investment and I would check my records. I also meant to say that between them they'd invested millions, but it didn't read that way.
I’ve also defended GB for a number of years now because of his commercial acumen and the ability to generate the profits that CD does.
I have no issue at all with Baldwin as I said. He seems to do a very good job at generating income which is essentially his job role. That can’t be easy in this climate. Blunt however again as I’ve said appears to be doing an absolutely terrible job and should not be in the job he is in. From the outside I can’t see one reason why he should be our chairman, especially after the god awful last few years.
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Morecambe have an average home gate of over 4500 in League One.
Accrington Stanley have had 5 seasons in League 1 with around 3000.
Bradford City have had four seasons in League 2 with over 10000.
Accrington Stanly have the best manager of all 92 Premier league and EFL clubs.
Based on the size of the club, attendances and budget Coleman should have had Manager of the season for 6 yrs running imo.
He has produced a miracle at that club.
What happens when a manager plays pragmatic, realistic football based on resource not ideology ; and an owner backs said manager with realistic resources required whilst building the clubs infrastructure responsibly towards a grander vision.
We have built up great infrastructure, I can't deny that. however I certainly question the rest.
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Seems my offer of the banners has now been taken up! Protests arranged before the Tranmere game, meet outside the East Stand at 7:15pm. “Sack the Board”
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Grow up
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Seems my offer of the banners has now been taken up! Protests arranged before the Tranmere game, meet outside the East Stand at 7:15pm. “Sack the Board”
Pathetic
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Seems my offer of the banners has now been taken up! Protests arranged before the Tranmere game, meet outside the East Stand at 7:15pm. “Sack the Board”
Will there be enough room for all 20 of you?
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Seems my offer of the banners has now been taken up! Protests arranged before the Tranmere game, meet outside the East Stand at 7:15pm. “Sack the Board”
Clown
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The club seems to be on the decline from a football perspective but I've got a feeling 'Sack the board' campaign could finish up like Brexit. When we've got a consortium of local/foreign crooks in charge, who's going to launch the petition to ask for TB to come back?
We're not happy because we've maybe seen such riches, maybe we as the supporters need to change our perspective. We're a pub team who had an excursion to sunlit uplands and have returned to the pub league. At least we've got a nice ground and a training ground, if no real assets on the pitch.
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Sacking the board is shortsighted, if not impossible!
A better option would be to get Terry and others to dig a bit deeper, which is the message I've passed on.
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Seems my offer of the banners has now been taken up! Protests arranged before the Tranmere game, meet outside the East Stand at 7:15pm. “Sack the Board”
Tilting at windmills. And the wrong bloody windmills at that.
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Bradford City have played in the old First Division as well as two Seasons in the Premier League.
in their history have won the FA Cup.
Lost in a League Cup Final at Wembley.
Played in Europe.
Been to Wembley in play off finals three or four times.
They have been stuck in the lowest league since 2019.
There fans have sadly held up over the last few years far better than a lot of ours.
I’m as disappointed as anybody but some comments beggar belief.
We more or less have to write this season off now and hope that lessons have been learned and we can turn it around in the summer.
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I hope the OP realises that it’s a school night and his chums may have homework
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Cant we organise a counter protest against the sack the board idiots.
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Cant we organise a counter protest against the sack the board idiots.
Think there would be more there
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How did the protest go ?
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How did the protest go ?
There was a protest?
COYR
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No protest, just sack the board chants in the south stand, ten seconds later rovers till I die, got to laugh eh.
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No protest, just sack the board chants in the south stand, ten seconds later rovers till I die, got to laugh eh.
It's fine to be both isn't it?
People are rightly allowed to be disgruntled.
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Rovers till they die, isn't support the board till they die, is it?
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I understand there frustrations. They are the younger supporters of our club who have generally seen a winning team. What they do have to understand what this board have done for the club. I think they need to put things into perspective.
I was in the forefront of Richardson protests, they were validated protests.
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Bradford City have played in the old First Division as well as two Seasons in the Premier League.
in their history have won the FA Cup.
Lost in a League Cup Final at Wembley.
Played in Europe.
Been to Wembley in play off finals three or four times.
They have been stuck in the lowest league since 2019.
There fans have sadly held up over the last few years far better than a lot of ours.
I’m as disappointed as anybody but some comments beggar belief.
We more or less have to write this season off now and hope that lessons have been learned and we can turn it around in the summer.
Season tickets of just £100 would have helped alot
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I can't blame the mainly younger supporters who are disgruntled with the board.
As the club has spiralled into self-perpetuating decline one of the things I refer to from the glory days of the millennium onwards is the sea change in the children of Doncaster being swept up in the surge of positivity around the club and proud to wear Rovers shirts.
When I was a kid there were two or three of us in my entire school year who regularly attended Rovers matches and we were very much the laughing stocks of the playground for doing so.
The ambition and success that came with our redemption from the doldrums led to kids proudly "being" their favourite Rovers players as they kicked a ball about in the street. You couldn't drive through town without seeing a youngster or two in red and white hoops.
Those kids are now in their late teens/early twenties and have seen a dream turn to heartbreak and those with the power to fix it don't seem to care. They don't share the passion or the engagement that the fans do. They're not interested in bringing back the glory that led to the whole town benefitting from the success of its football club.
As life gets inexorably tougher with the cost of living, lack of decent employment opportunities and crippling cuts to public services, now more than ever a good result for the Rovers on a Saturday is crucial to lift spirits but dreadful performances and poor results are compounding the misery.
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There is a lot of work to be done to get fans back on-site, however THE biggest driver is success on the field, I think whilst ever we are failing on the pitch there will be disgruntled fans.
Unfortunately we have no divine right to success and the road is littered with clubs that thought they only had to throw money at a squad
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I heard a few chants, well the same one about 4 times it might more noticeable in a few years time when the singers have deeper voices and perhaps have started shaving, it just sounded like Aled Jones and half a dozen mates
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Bradford City have played in the old First Division as well as two Seasons in the Premier League.
in their history have won the FA Cup.
Lost in a League Cup Final at Wembley.
Played in Europe.
Been to Wembley in play off finals three or four times.
They have been stuck in the lowest league since 2019.
There fans have sadly held up over the last few years far better than a lot of ours.
I’m as disappointed as anybody but some comments beggar belief.
We more or less have to write this season off now and hope that lessons have been learned and we can turn it around in the summer.
Season tickets of just £100 would have helped alot
My point NR was that a bigger club with far more fans accepted their failings far better than some of our fans. Living in Bradford and having a lot of mates that watch City I do hear the moans when they do but it doesn't seem as vicious as a lot of ours.
Maybe it could be because my mates are all knocking on a bit and I also don't go on their forum.
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I heard a few chants, well the same one about 4 times it might more noticeable in a few years time when the singers have deeper voices and perhaps have started shaving, it just sounded like Aled Jones and half a dozen mates
You'd think the waves of red seats would tell the answer. There's 6 of us who have STs together. Yes two are kids so don't go to Tues night games but last night I was on my own and couldn't give the tickets away to friends or family. Plenty of fans I know but all disengaged and doing other things. Varying reasons but the lack of success is the clear winner.
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The fact that “football” on show is verging on unwatchable doesn’t help like. I don’t have a ST anymore but had to beg my son who does, to come with me last night. The lad’s not daft.
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It isn’t just Rovers supporters who are talking about our current situation.
I had Football Heaven on the radio this evening as I drove back home from Derby and Andy Giddings was speaking with a Sheff Utd fan and they also discussed “the things that are going off right now at Doncaster Rovers”.
It seems to be common knowledge among South Yorkshire football fans that their is much going on at our club.
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In Idler’s post: “hope that lessons have been learned”. How many years have we been saying the same thing? And it only seems to get worse!
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In a post the other day it’s only 2 years since we were 3rd in L1.
We’re on a bad run as a club and need to stop the rot. We can soon be on a good run as a club again.
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In a post the other day it’s only 2 years since we were 3rd in L1.
We’re on a bad run as a club and need to stop the rot. We can soon be on a good run as a club again.
So 3rd in League one to mid-table league two is classed as a bad run.
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In a post the other day it’s only 2 years since we were 3rd in L1.
We’re on a bad run as a club and need to stop the rot. We can soon be on a good run as a club again.
So 3rd in League one to mid-table league two is classed as a bad run.
So an owner who wanted to put back into the community and is keeping drfc above water as a club is a bad owner?
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Have we been really good off the field? I think our player and manager recruitment over the past couple of years would suggest otherwise.
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Have we been really good off the field? I think our player and manager recruitment over the past couple of years would suggest otherwise.
That’s on the field stuff.
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In a post the other day it’s only 2 years since we were 3rd in L1.
We’re on a bad run as a club and need to stop the rot. We can soon be on a good run as a club again.
And as I posted in response to that very valid point about us being in at the top of League 1, we were told in 2018 that we had a budget that "flirted" with being the 6th highest in League 1. At that time we had a number of quality players on permanent contracts (mainly signed by Ferguson) and the teams assembled by McCann and to a lesser extent Moore, were still benefiting from the presence of those quality players. Those quality players were sold for relatively large fees and that quality has not been replaced. I would say McCann and Moore benefited from the budget we had under Ferguson. The club acknowledged that it was moving away from a model whereby we paid fees for players or had players under long contracts and instead we were going to rely on the loan market and short term deals. McCann and Moore operated under that model but still had the benefit of the Fergie signings. Those quality players have gone and have not been replaced. So that run that saw us at the top of League 1 was based on quality signings we added during the Fergie era and a budget that was allegedly top 6 in League 1. McCann in particular made great use of the loan market so all credit to him for making it work. But it was a model that was built on sand and the chickens have now come home to roost.
I did ask on another thread if SM or someone else could confirm if our budget currently would rank 6th in League 1 and if not, where exactly it now ranks by comparison to our competitors. I haven't had a response yet. Didn't manage to get a ticket for the Meet the Owners but if there's a facility to email that question in, I will do so.
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Ah yes, that pandemic that didn't affect the other 91 football league clubs.....
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Ah yes, that pandemic that didn't affect the other 91 football league clubs.....
Of course it did.
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Ah yes, that pandemic that didn't affect the other 91 football league clubs.....
Of course it did.
Yes, I know it did.
So why have we fared so badly by comparison? The pandemic affected all football clubs and budgets will have been hit in all clubs big or small. That's why an answer to the question of where our budget currently places us out of the 92 seems quite a pertinent question. Baldwin stated the figures were very easy to quantify and he wasn't shy about crowing about how highly we ranked in League 1 back in 2018 at the launch of the Five Year Plan for Championship football.
So come on guys, we're five years down the line so now would seem a good time to assess whether or not that Five Year Plan was successful or not. Where does our budget rank as of today? Is it still a top half of League 1 budget? If so then I absolutely agree that the likes of Wellens and those who have followed him, have absoultely p***ed it away. But if, as I suspect, we now have a mid table League 2 budget....should we be surprised that we find ourselves mid-table in League 2?
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It’s a very short sighted view if people think that clubs aren’t going to suffer from the pandemic year/s going forward financially
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I would think that everyone accepts that football clubs will have suffered as a result of the pandemic.
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Maybe the idea is to get the gates down to an average of 3000 so that we can compete in League One, like pandemic-immune Accrington are doing. :silly:
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The more I read it, the more that interview with Baldwin in 2018 yields up everything you need to know. It's all in here.
“And they choose to put well into seven figures into the club but that purely goes into the playing budget because they want a Championship club.
“But that is now purely their choice."
So do they still want a Championship club? Do the owners still put seven figures into the playing budget? One might suspect this all changed when Dick Watson sadly died and the Watson family left a while later. If that's not the case then bloody well tell us so and we can moderate our expectations accordingly!
And to those of you shouting about "it isn't about the money, it's how you use it....." Mr Baldwin also had this to say.....
“More often than not, budgets will equate to league position, roughly. There are anomalies such as Shrewsbury. That makes it exciting. Over five years your squad budget will tell you where you come in the league. Therefore we do post a lot of credence on benchmarking and giving the manager the best possible chance of getting the play-off position.”
There you have it.
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
Have you not been to Fish Bits?
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
This is the problem, people don’t understand what club doncaster is or what it does.
Without club doncaster we’d be in a far worse position.
Club doncaster helped us get through the pandemic, the cheap season tickets are because of club doncaster, the money spent on the playing budget comes from club doncaster
So if club doncaster didn’t exist the ticket prices would be more and the new signings would be much less frequent,
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Maybe the idea is to get the gates down to an average of 3000 so that we can compete in League One, like pandemic-immune Accrington are doing. :silly:
Only reason they are where they are is down to John Coleman. Nothing ro do with attendances, budget etc they just have a damn good manager for that level.
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
Ditch Club Doncaster.
So the football side immediately goes back to losing £3mill a year.
How would you concentrate on the footballing side then?
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
This is the problem, people don’t understand what club doncaster is or what it does.
Without club doncaster we’d be in a far worse position.
Club doncaster helped us get through the pandemic, the cheap season tickets are because of club doncaster, the money spent on the playing budget comes from club doncaster
So if club doncaster didn’t exist the ticket prices would be more and the new signings would be much less frequent,
don’t often agree with you lad but you’re spot on. It’s really not difficult to understand but some of these halfwits don’t or refuse to get it.
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Maybe the idea is to get the gates down to an average of 3000 so that we can compete in League One, like pandemic-immune Accrington are doing. :silly:
Only reason they are where they are is down to John Coleman. Nothing ro do with attendances, budget etc they just have a damn good manager for that level.
I think you've reinforced my point for me Bessie. They make the best of the resources they've got, and recruit smartly for their club and system. If we were able to do so we would be a damn sight higher than mid-table L2.
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
This is the problem, people don’t understand what club doncaster is or what it does.
Without club doncaster we’d be in a far worse position.
Club doncaster helped us get through the pandemic, the cheap season tickets are because of club doncaster, the money spent on the playing budget comes from club doncaster
So if club doncaster didn’t exist the ticket prices would be more and the new signings would be much less frequent,
Well said
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Maybe the idea is to get the gates down to an average of 3000 so that we can compete in League One, like pandemic-immune Accrington are doing. :silly:
Only reason they are where they are is down to John Coleman. Nothing ro do with attendances, budget etc they just have a damn good manager for that level.
I think you've reinforced my point for me Bessie. They make the best of the resources they've got, and recruit smartly for their club and system. If we were able to do so we would be a damn sight higher than mid-table L2.
Not always easy to recruit a damn good manager who will be loyal and stay for more than a couple of years though.
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I find it odd, TB has had joint ownership of this club for the last 16 years thereabouts, and yet the last 2 years , which followed a global pandemic, we’ve been really poor on-field, been really good off-field, and these are the reasons for the abuse that’s being dished out?
I think some of our supporters need to give their head a shake.
Ah yes, that pandemic that didn't affect the other 91 football league clubs.....
Of course it did.
Yes, I know it did.
So why have we fared so badly by comparison? The pandemic affected all football clubs and budgets will have been hit in all clubs big or small. That's why an answer to the question of where our budget currently places us out of the 92 seems quite a pertinent question. Baldwin stated the figures were very easy to quantify and he wasn't shy about crowing about how highly we ranked in League 1 back in 2018 at the launch of the Five Year Plan for Championship football.
So come on guys, we're five years down the line so now would seem a good time to assess whether or not that Five Year Plan was successful or not. Where does our budget rank as of today? Is it still a top half of League 1 budget? If so then I absolutely agree that the likes of Wellens and those who have followed him, have absoultely p***ed it away. But if, as I suspect, we now have a mid table League 2 budget....should we be surprised that we find ourselves mid-table in League 2?
Tommy we were told in the Summer of 2021 before last season that we had a top half league 1 budget.
That to me means at least 12th highest.
This season we were told from what I can remember that it was at least a play off budget.
Now I would be very surprised if any other club barring, Bradford, Stockport, Swindon and maybe Salford have a bigger budget than us this season.
I would expect, Leyton Orient, Mansfield, Wimbledon & Northampton, to be similar to ours possibly less but not more.
I don’t have any facts but that’s how I would read it.
stevenage, Carlisle, Barrow, Sutton are all overachieving based on budgets. We are under achieving.
The fact is we underachieved last season ( that’s some understatement ) due to poor management and recruitment. The same can be said this season. The emphasis more this season on the management as the recruitment was better last summer. GM simply wasn’t up to the job and so far DS hasn’t been able to get this team to its capabilities. Hopefully he will. Time will tell on that one.
So to me the budget is just something that’s hardly relevant, but it seems some people are hell bent on pursuing the budget as the cause for our ills.
It simply isn’t the case. Unless we have been lied to. Now what purpose would that serve. Where is the benefit in the board lying to us.
They are not stupid people. They are not rogues with ulterior motives. The want success for this football club just as much as all the supporters do.
Big mistakes on recruitment time after time, that’s why we are 11th in league 2 after being 3rd in League 1 on Boxing Day 2020 under Darren Moore in Season 20/21
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To say budget is no relevance is clearly wrong. I would refer you to Gavin Baldwin's own comments that directly contradict what you say. He said himself that there is direct correlation between budget and League position. Anomalies occur occasionally yes where someone massively overachieves or underachieves by reference to their budget but those are rare exceptions. But by and large, your budget dictates your league positon. His words, not mine.
If we still had that top half of League 1 budget I would be in full agreement with all those saying the fault lies with how the budget was spent. However given it sounds like we now have a budget that places us slap bang in League 2, it seems to me we are where we should be.
The budget has been reduced and we're broadly where we deserve to be.
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The football side of club Doncaster won’t improve till the ditch the club Doncaster farce and just concentrate on a football team, and keep club Doncaster separate. A fish and chip shop is no good selling Pizza and Kebabs, but brilliant at providing good fish & chips
Ditch Club Doncaster.
So the football side immediately goes back to losing £3mill a year.
How would you concentrate on the footballing side then?
As a massive dons fan as well as rovers.
I’d genuinely love for someone to explain this one…
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One problem is we haven’t had a manager for some time who has used his budget well. With some of the players Wellens brought in that pre season it must have been a whip a round budget.
I don’t think our budget will be as good as Bradford City’s, you have to look at the fans they get watching their games. The budget was always going to drop when instead of three owners, we have one. The club Doncaster helps to make up some of that shortfall but probably isn’t allowing us to be extravagant with signings.
The players we sign now most tend to not give you that buzz of excitement we’ve had in the past. Hurst is a good young player. Molyneux we just haven’t got out of him what he did for Hartlepool. Miller has been a good signing, would be better if the manager’s formation allowed him to succeed.
We have to look at young hungry players that need a chance to play, also bits of experience to help them along.
Our side for me at the minute is paying for the ups and downs of young players form naturally going up and down. The disappointing thing is the experienced players have been very poor or injured. A great result against Tranmere, now let’s see if we can win away at Swindon, at least get a point.
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
Absolutely spot on. I could not agree more.
Through a combination of smoke and mirrors, deliberate obfuscation and generally appalling communication and disconnection with the fans, they have totally failed to manage expectations.
For example, I had no idea the much trumpeted Five Year Plan had been ditched and I was still under the apparently false delusion we aspired to Championship football and had a budget that year on year would have us in or around the playoff spots in League 1. We've never had a meaningful update regarding that plan and I certainly wasn't aware it had been ditched. All we get are deliberately vague assurances that the budget is "competitive" or "good" or "what it was" or that the appointments of Butler and McSheffrey weren't "cheap". The credibility of certain people has not been served well by that, even if what they have said on here or in the press were beliefs honestly held.
Had I known that our budget was no longer what it was and our vision, ambitions and aspirations reduced so drastically, I daresay I too may have moderated my expectations.
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Baldwin stated in 2018 that the club was at a point where the Directors didn't need to put any money in at all as we were pretty much self sustaining, but they chose to invest a seven figure sum straight into the playing budget because they wanted Championship football.
Fast forward to now and we are told that we still have a self sustaining club where the Directors don't have to put any money in and apparently they don't, unless they need to balance the books. Pats on the back all round for us being self sustaining but ignoring the elephant in the room that the owners no longer invest in the playing budget. All they've done is put a positive spin on the fact that the owners don't put any money in anymore.
I'm not criticising that. It is what it is. Its their money and they can do wjat they want with it. But some honesty might help appease the fans. People don't like being bullshitted.
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To say budget is no relevance is clearly wrong. I would refer you to Gavin Baldwin's own comments that directly contradict what you say. He said himself that there is direct correlation between budget and League position. Anomalies occur occasionally yes where someone massively overachieves or underachieves by reference to their budget but those are rare exceptions. But by and large, your budget dictates your league positon. His words, not mine.
If we still had that top half of League 1 budget I would be in full agreement with all those saying the fault lies with how the budget was spent. However given it sounds like we now have a budget that places us slap bang in League 2, it seems to me we are where we should be.
The budget has been reduced and we're broadly where we deserve to be.
We were told mid table was the realistic target & the budget for 2021/22 reflected that target.
So yes GB may well have said budgets in most cases reflect where you end up in the league table.
The fact is we massively underachieved. Just in the same way Accrington consistently over achieve.
It happens.
It does not mean we must have had a bottom 4 budget last season.
Please don’t tell me that Accrington, Morecambe, Burton, Crewe, Cheltenham, Cambridge, Shrewsbury Gillingham, Fleetwood had a higher budget than us last season. Possibly Wimbledon, Wycombe and a couple of others also.
I include Fleetwood because they had cleared out their high earners before last season.
So that’s 9 teams + possibly 2/3/4 others.
Yes this is not factual information but seriously would be astonished if any of that 9 had a higher budget than ours.
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Having said all that, Campsall, the truth is you, like me, don’t know. You choose to spin it how you want and others maybe differently.
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Just an add on to the previous post.
Accrington, Burton, Cambridge, Cheltenham, Shrewsbury all finished well above us because they had better managers than we had.
Good managers over achieve. Poor ones under achieve.
Of course the budgets matter Tommy I didn’t say they didn’t.
What I was saying in our case it wasn’t the budget that landed us in relegation.
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Having said all that, Campsall, the truth is you, like me, don’t know. You choose to spin it how you want and others maybe differently.
Well did GB lie to us then?
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Having said all that, Campsall, the truth is you, like me, don’t know. You choose to spin it how you want and others maybe differently.
Well did GB lie to us then?
He has omitted to highlight the fact that the owners are no longer investing in the playing squad to the extent they once were. Not a lie, but an omission all the same. As Alan says, you can spin things however you like without them being out and out lies.
"We are self sustaining requiring no investment from the Directors. A club that can stand on its own two feet and is secure for the future"
Sound so much better than......
"The owners by their own choice used to put millions into the playing budget. They didn't have to do that as we were self sustaining club but they wanted a Championship club. But they changed their mind and stopped doing that a couple of years ago so we're just ticking over now. "
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One problem is we haven’t had a manager for some time who has used his budget well. With some of the players Wellens brought in that pre season it must have been a whip a round budget.
I don’t think our budget will be as good as Bradford City’s, you have to look at the fans they get watching their games. The budget was always going to drop when instead of three owners, we have one. The club Doncaster helps to make up some of that shortfall but probably isn’t allowing us to be extravagant with signings.
The players we sign now most tend to not give you that buzz of excitement we’ve had in the past. Hurst is a good young player. Molyneux we just haven’t got out of him what he did for Hartlepool. Miller has been a good signing, would be better if the manager’s formation allowed him to succeed.
We have to look at young hungry players that need a chance to play, also bits of experience to help them along.
Our side for me at the minute is paying for the ups and downs of young players form naturally going up and down. The disappointing thing is the experienced players have been very poor or injured. A great result against Tranmere, now let’s see if we can win away at Swindon, at least get a point.
We need to go to Swindon with the mindset of firstly not getting beat and look to score on the counter. There were signs on Tuesday that we are capable of keeping a clean sheet so that should be the major aim on Sat. get a point min and get out of there. We need to start building some consistency and that starts with a solid defence.
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
You think that would stop anything? No chance.
People like you would continue to take two separate conversations, years apart, quote them out of context and without any justification link the two together, just like you have in this thread.
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I don’t need to justify anything about what people have said. They said it - are you saying they didn’t?
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Maybe the players we signed were on high wages and bonuses that they haven’t justified
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
You think that would stop anything? No chance.
People like you would continue to take two separate conversations, years apart, quote them out of context and without any justification link the two together, just like you have in this thread.
I don't think it unreasonable to discuss a "Five Year Plan" at the five year point. Do you?
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
The problem is the usual suspects will immediate say they don't believe what they're being told and off we go round the mulberry bush again.
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
You think that would stop anything? No chance.
People like you would continue to take two separate conversations, years apart, quote them out of context and without any justification link the two together, just like you have in this thread.
I don't think it unreasonable to discuss a "Five Year Plan" at the five year point. Do you?
I know you're trying to pick a fight, but to keep misquoting and misinterpreting what I type is not the way.
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I don’t need to justify anything about what people have said. They said it - are you saying they didn’t?
I didn't ask you to justify anything, what I mentioned is that you've taken two separate remarks from Gavin, several years apart, and without any context, and then you've interpreted those comments to attempt to discredit what he said.
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No, I havn’t.
I never mentioned Gavin, did I?
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Out of curiosity does anyone know what the boards plan or vision of the future of the club is?
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Out of curiosity does anyone know what the boards plan or vision of the future of the club is?
Hopefully find out Monday night
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Out of curiosity does anyone know what the boards plan or vision of the future of the club is?
I can’t go on Monday night, I have to isolate before day surgery on Tuesday, but I would hope this type of question is directed to the Chairman, he seems to remain silent, while to world around him burns
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I really get fed up of reading comments from some of the rose tinted glasses brigade on here.
We have been told the the club is now running sustainably and TB no longer needs to put in any money to keep the club going.
Why do some people have a problem believing this????
The proof is undoubtedly there .. we’ve gone from possible League1 promotion contenders to possible National League contenders! Yes we’re definitely sustaining something ?
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If we had transparency, where the budget is concerned, it may well stop all these arguments. For reasons, better known to the Board, we simply have no idea what the budget is. We’re one of a minority of Clubs, in the EFL, that chooses to go down this route.
It’s easy to stop the theorising, one way or the other, just tell us what it is!
You think that would stop anything? No chance.
People like you would continue to take two separate conversations, years apart, quote them out of context and without any justification link the two together, just like you have in this thread.
I don't think it unreasonable to discuss a "Five Year Plan" at the five year point. Do you?
I know you're trying to pick a fight, but to keep misquoting and misinterpreting what I type is not the way.
Where have I misquoted you?
No I'm trying to pick a fight. Your obfuscation speaks for itself, as do your indignant responses to those who question you.
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I really get fed up of reading comments from some of the rose tinted glasses brigade on here.
We have been told the the club is now running sustainably and TB no longer needs to put in any money to keep the club going.
Why do some people have a problem believing this????
The proof is undoubtedly there .. we’ve gone from possible League1 promotion contenders to possible National League contenders! Yes we’re definitely sustaining something ?
Slightly over dramatic don’t you think. We are 16 points off the relegation places and 2 off a play off place.
Yes we have had a fairly dramatic fall in the last 25 months but if we got relegated this season it would probably have to be even worse than the points tally we got in the last 4 months of the 2015/16 season.under Fergie.
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1969 just an add on to above post.
I reckon another 8 points from our last 17 games will keep us in league 2
If we fail to get 8 points then DS probably should be up for worst manager in our history.
Yes probably worse than any of the 97/98 managers. They only had non league footballers in our team and they didn’t even pick the team.
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So it’s fingers crossed then ?
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Still stands
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What does ?
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So maybe I was 60 days early before with the start of this post.
BUT we’re now in a worse position.
Join us 1pm Monday outside the East Stand to make our feelings known.
The plan is assemble outside then make our way as a group peaceful to the boardroom. Tweeter and Facebooker shows we have around 60/80 signed up so far.
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Still intrigued how the board can be sacked
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Out of curiosity does anyone know what the boards plan or vision of the future of the club is?
It’s a just let’s see we’re we go approach, we not bothered
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So maybe I was 60 days early before with the start of this post.
BUT we’re now in a worse position.
Join us 1pm Monday outside the East Stand to make our feelings known.
The plan is assemble outside then make our way as a group peaceful to the boardroom. Tweeter and Facebooker shows we have around 60/80 signed up so far.
You plan on getting inside the ground and up to the board room?
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Not only that but security have been pre warned mmmm!
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So maybe I was 60 days early before with the start of this post.
BUT we’re now in a worse position.
Join us 1pm Monday outside the East Stand to make our feelings known.
The plan is assemble outside then make our way as a group peaceful to the boardroom. Tweeter and Facebooker shows we have around 60/80 signed up so far.
You plan on getting inside the ground and up to the board room?
Stupid idea. A peaceful, noisy protest outside seems fine if that's what they want to do, but heading inside the offices etc is stupid, especially at a game with lots of police.
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It makes me laugh,how the stewards all stand at the bottom of the south stand at the end of a game,anybody wanting to get onto the pitch just need to buy a ticket in the east or west stand and plan you protest that way to get onto the pitch,thing is with these kids they are not that bright
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So maybe I was 60 days early before with the start of this post.
BUT we’re now in a worse position.
Join us 1pm Monday outside the East Stand to make our feelings known.
The plan is assemble outside then make our way as a group peaceful to the boardroom. Tweeter and Facebooker shows we have around 60/80 signed up so far.
You plan on getting inside the ground and up to the board room?
Stupid idea. A peaceful, noisy protest outside seems fine if that's what they want to do, but heading inside the offices etc is stupid, especially at a game with lots of police.
A bit Trumpesq.
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Your plan will not get off the ground…..hopefully
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
And there is absolutely no technological invention that might allow them to find out about it. If only!
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
And there is absolutely no technological invention that might allow them to find out about it. If only!
So you may as well demonstrate at Tesco’s and film both of the protesters
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
And there is absolutely no technological invention that might allow them to find out about it. If only!
So you may as well demonstrate at Tesco’s and film both of the protesters
Yes, that's exactly the same.
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
To big yourself up on Facebook of course!
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If there isn’t someone sporting a horned head dress, at this demonstration march I’ll be very disappointed
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It is not that long ago Fans carried a Coffin from The Park Hotel to the Ground in protest at the way the Club was being run (down)
It was a genuine heartfelt serious and important protest and attracted lots of news interest because it was true.
We were in S**t creek , and we needed to act to save the Club OUR Club
What is proposed on Monday , as seriously as the organisers feel about the Club and it's problems it will barely raise a media eyebrow as it is not in the same category at all as when we were truly in the S**t
Nip over to Bury and ask what they think about us having a sustainable Club with a poor manager and being mid table. I bet they would laugh at our "grumbles"
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Maybe the idea is to get the gates down to an average of 3000 so that we can compete in League One, like pandemic-immune Accrington are doing. :silly:
Only reason they are where they are is down to John Coleman. Nothing ro do with attendances, budget etc they just have a damn good manager for that level.
Said it before, he's an excellent manager working with players & a low budget.
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Don’t disagree the manager should be given a chance working with a budget and being backed.
Join us 1pm in the East Stand Reception.
We’ve invited press also.
The time to act is now!!! Don’t be silenced by the majority.
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Who has tried silencing you ?
Is it right for the minority to effect the majority it’s like the tail wagging the dog
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Don't be silenced? Don't be a d!ck!
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
Have they gone to head hunt a foreign coach or manager SM
They will come back with a youth coach from some Spanish 3rd tier club. That’l fix it. Terrific.
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
Have they gone to head hunt a foreign coach or manager SM
They will come back with a youth coach from some Spanish 3rd tier club. That’l fix it. Terrific.
Pretty poor attempt at sarcasm there Campsall. What’s got into you lately?
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Don’t disagree the manager should be given a chance working with a budget and being backed.
Join us 1pm in the East Stand Reception.
We’ve invited press also.
The time to act is now!!! Don’t be silenced by the majority.
I’ve spent 20 year’s campaigning on behalf of football supporters and yet I can’t think of a worse example than this one. You’re peeved because the footballs crap, I get that, but replace the board with who exactly? Somebody richer that TB?
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Well said SM. Also, sack the board chants. Why would the board sack themselves. Or maybe they might get fed up with what’s happening. Then leave, then no football club. Be careful what some wish for.
I agree it’s not good at the moment. But let’s not forget how much the owners have put in to the club.
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
Have they gone to head hunt a foreign coach or manager SM
They will come back with a youth coach from some Spanish 3rd tier club. That’l fix it. Terrific.
Pretty poor attempt at sarcasm there Campsall. What’s got into you lately?
Come on SM even you can’t defend what’s going on at present.
Where is Blunt. He is supposed to be Chairman of this football club. We are in crisis on the football field and you tell us the board are off to foreign climes.
Gone to escape the wrath of the fans at our game on Monday.
I have backed this board to the hilt SM on this forum for many years as you will know.
But for them to sit back and say nothing, do nothing about the absolute dross this coach has managed to get this group of players to serve up.
A coach who says his process is working and his players are buying into it. The more he keeps saying that the worse the performances get.
Any other club in the 92 Premier & EFL clubs would have sacked DS after Saturday, no i am wrong, after Crawley and the unbelievable contemptuous clap trap DS came out with after the match.
I am at my wits end SM at what is happening to the football club i am passionate about.
85% of the forum members want him out. This is not the Netto brigade on here SM.
These are genuine long standing Rovers supporters.
Some of us have been supporters for 40/50/60 even 70+ years.
This coach has to go NOW
He will take this Club into non league football if he is allowed. That in no circumstances should be allowed to happen.
It would be criminal to allow that to happen again.
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SM I have never once said “ sack the board” not once
That’s crazy. Who replaces them. There is no queue at the door.
I just want a Chairman who is accountable.
I want a Chairman who just every now and then we here from
I want a Chairman who at least looks as though he cares.
I want a Chairman who doesn’t hide when the going gets tough
I want a Chairman who isn’t going to hide behind the HoF and allow him to take all the flack.
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I think Campsall echoes a lot of the concerns of us on here, has always been balanced and is remaining so.
SM
You previously said that the board had acknowledged there are problems, but that you could not comment on the detail as “the work is not yet complete”. Has there been any progress on this before their holiday? Or can you update us on what aspect of the operation has been identified as a problem please?
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So if it’s not a campaign started by SM then it’s a waste of time. The club is rotting away both on and off the field. Attendances next season will be between 4-5000k. Fans are started to vote with their feet. Change is needed before it’s too late
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Don’t disagree the manager should be given a chance working with a budget and being backed.
Join us 1pm in the East Stand Reception.
We’ve invited press also.
The time to act is now!!! Don’t be silenced by the majority.
I’ve spent 20 year’s campaigning on behalf of football supporters and yet I can’t think of a worse example than this one. You’re peeved because the footballs crap, I get that, but replace the board with who exactly? Somebody richer that TB?
Whilst I won't be attending this protest, that response does strike me as somewhat flippant and dismissive.
So basically the concern of supporters in regards the overall downward spiral of the club as a whole is dismissed as a hissy fit due to the football being rubbish. That is a blinkered naive and insulting response.
As for who we would get richer than TB, I'd be saying the same thing if we were owned by Jeff Bezos or Bill Gates. Doesn't matter how rich they are, if they are unwilling to support even a moderately ambitious football club, then i don't see it as unreasonable for the fans to express their displeasure.
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I think personal dislike of SM means some posters will have a go at him no matter what he posts. I can tell you that SM is first and foremost a Rovers fan and he’s as unhappy with what’s happening on the pitch as the rest of us, he’s also let the board know in person, not just his concerns but that of all Rovers fans, how many of you that have a go at him have done the same? He gives up his free time to ask the questions put by Rovers fans, again how many who post on here do the same, or are willing to give up their own free time? Things are happening just not as quickly as we would all like.
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Added to all these points it's the constant ability to get it wrong.
It's great knowing about it and their process is not yet complete but everyone currently has no belief in what their next decision is going to be.
We are now losing our core support and Locally we are a joke.
Yet nobody is saying anything.
They have the money, thankful that they have been willing to put it in, but the mismanagement of it is crazy.
At least take responsibility for getting it wrong for a start.
This is almost a Richardson era. Whilst spending the money, destroying us. Its just total mismanagement of the funds.
Every fan could see we have needed experience for the last 3 appointments and then for the copps appointment.
It's been a total shambles of decisions.
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I think the point SM makes is perfectly valid. There is as yet no viable alternative to the current owners so trying to force them out seems stupid, where does that leave us.
It's absolutely though right to question the current setup and funding and I don't necessarily have an issue with doing that at games either, but let's hope those that do attend do act sensibly. I'm not even going to the game but I don't think right now I'd attend a protest either.
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When you say you wouldn’t attend a protest right now BFYP, when would you? And what would it take? How much longer are you prepared to wait?
The communication and passion shown by the chairman is none existent.
SM - when you say someone with more money than TB, why does it need to be? Because for all his wealth he won’t invest it in the club anyway. He knew when he took ownership of the club that funds were needed, football clubs need heavy investment each year to compete. But instead he is happy to run the club on a shoestring and see it fall.
We need action now, we need to know the plan for the next season, we need to know if we plan to complete or fight relegation.
If TB doesn’t want to be a part any more then please pack up and p!ss off. Put the club up for sale and tell the truth for once that it’s not for you. But currently we get lies lies lies and then silence.
I’d really like another meet the owners event with unlimited tickets to get in, not ones that sell out the 80 tickets to the quiet brigade in the first 10 minutes.
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Don’t disagree the manager should be given a chance working with a budget and being backed.
Join us 1pm in the East Stand Reception.
We’ve invited press also.
The time to act is now!!! Don’t be silenced by the majority.
I’ve spent 20 year’s campaigning on behalf of football supporters and yet I can’t think of a worse example than this one. You’re peeved because the footballs crap, I get that, but replace the board with who exactly? Somebody richer that TB?
Whilst I won't be attending this protest, that response does strike me as somewhat flippant and dismissive.
So basically the concern of supporters in regards the overall downward spiral of the club as a whole is dismissed as a hissy fit due to the football being rubbish. That is a blinkered naive and insulting response.
As for who we would get richer than TB, I'd be saying the same thing if we were owned by Jeff Bezos or Bill Gates. Doesn't matter how rich they are, if they are unwilling to support even a moderately ambitious football club, then i don't see it as unreasonable for the fans to express their displeasure.
There’s a way to express your displeasure though. And this campaign doesn’t have enough justification for me.
It started out as a personal attack on Gavin, and I said at the time this was wrong. The one person who was responsible for guiding us through the Covid debacle, the one person who had built a business model for DRFC that will endure for the foreseeable future had become a target for those with a personal grudge.
But the point I’m really making is that turning up at 1pm and holding a demonstration outside an empty stadium hours before any owners turn up is a complete waste of time. What will that achieve?
Demanding that owners spend some of their millions on our club is not, as some seem to think, a right that we as supporters deserve. It’s not a’given’ that goes with club ownership, not by a long way.
The debates over the Fan Led Review and the subsequent White Paper over the case for an Independent Regulator are all about sustainability and sorting out the mess that football has found itself in. And we as supporters are adopting that attitude of ‘it’s our right’. No it’s not. The performance on the pitch is dreadful, I get that. But we don’t have rights.
Having said that, do I think that TB will make the right decisions for the good of the club, yes I do. He’s not a reactionary by any means, and being forced out of the club doesn’t sit well with me. As I’ve said before, the best option for this club is for TB to be encouraged to spend more money and for GB to remain as CEO. That’s the message I’ve been delivering to the club.
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Considering the millions that TB has put into the club over the years, "pack up and p!ss off" is completely out of order.
If he did, then the club would be coming cap in hand to the supporters in no time asking us to help cover unexpected bills - the very thing that TB is doing now to keep the club from going belly up.
If TB has given all he can, or wants to, then I agree that it is probably time for change so that new owners can start to push us forward again, but that change has to be orderly and planned or we will end up in a right mess. If in some way TB could be persuaded to invest more again, then a stable club with significantly more added to the playing budget by TB would strike me as the perfect solution.
However, I agree wholeheartedly with Campsall that this is the time for the Chairman to step up and explain where we are going as a club in the short and medium term. His silence over the last few weeks as things have gotten significantly worse on the field is not acceptable.
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When you say you wouldn’t attend a protest right now BFYP, when would you? And what would it take? How much longer are you prepared to wait?
The communication and passion shown by the chairman is none existent.
What would I be protesting against? Effectively it's a protest because someone isn't spending their money how others want them to isn't it? They aren't taking money out of the club, they aren't trying to make a huge profit and keep it, they aren't actively trying not to seek new investment or consider changing, they're not banning fans or anything like that, they simply just aren't funding to the level we'd like. I don't think that justifies a protest outside the stadium personally. If those things mentioned were happening then it would be a very different story.
Fans can push for the owners to leave all they like, so say they do with no viable alternative, what happens then? What if a new owner comes in spends a load of money for a few months, saddling the club with debt and then runs out, what then? Have those protesting genuinely considered that?
To me I see people pissed off because on the pitch we're rubbish. I am aswell and I absolutely think there needs to be a change as a fresh outlook would do no harm at all. But there is a limit and we can't just demand a fantasy change without it actually being there. For me there's better ways to go about it and painting the owners as clowns on a banner isn't it for me.
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From above
To me I see people pissed off because on the pitch we're rubbish. I am aswell and I absolutely think there needs to be a change as a fresh outlook would do no harm at all. But there is a limit and we can't just demand a fantasy change without it actually being there. For me there's better ways to go about it and painting the owners as clowns on a banner isn't it for me.
Agree .... get a Coach (with Seats) and visit Bury. Tell them we are mid Table but feel the Powers at the Club are not spending enough , and our Coach (the one with a Track Suit) has no idea on Tactics , and is dragging us down AND next Season we might go down again !!!
They will PTSL
Failing that visit Tier6 bound Scunny and ask a representative 100 of their Fans whether they would swap us at the moment - and 99 of them would and the other would be bloody minded and say NO
They PTSL laughing at us in the Richardson and now its come full circle. Am I laughing at them . You bet I am. I know when im relatively well off in Club Terms. Would I swap with them ? Not a f*****g chance
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My concern would be that it's not just about "spending money", it's the extremely poor decision-making on the football side that needs more urgently addressing, and on the non-football side it would be good to know if there is a plan to sort out the many frankly shoddy things about the club that are alienating fans as well.
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I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, be careful what you wish for. Those old enough will remember a benefactor who ran the club into the ground and did time for trying to burn down the main stand.
COYR
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I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, be careful what you wish for. Those old enough will remember a benefactor who ran the club into the ground and did time for trying to burn down the main stand.
COYR
And for those not old enough, they would do well to watch this
https://youtu.be/HCiXrQINBJs
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
Have they gone to head hunt a foreign coach or manager SM
They will come back with a youth coach from some Spanish 3rd tier club. That’l fix it. Terrific.
Pretty poor attempt at sarcasm there Campsall. What’s got into you lately?
Come on SM even you can’t defend what’s going on at present.
Where is Blunt. He is supposed to be Chairman of this football club. We are in crisis on the football field and you tell us the board are off to foreign climes.
Gone to escape the wrath of the fans at our game on Monday.
I have backed this board to the hilt SM on this forum for many years as you will know.
But for them to sit back and say nothing, do nothing about the absolute dross this coach has managed to get this group of players to serve up.
A coach who says his process is working and his players are buying into it. The more he keeps saying that the worse the performances get.
Any other club in the 92 Premier & EFL clubs would have sacked DS after Saturday, no i am wrong, after Crawley and the unbelievable contemptuous clap trap DS came out with after the match.
I am at my wits end SM at what is happening to the football club i am passionate about.
85% of the forum members want him out. This is not the Netto brigade on here SM.
These are genuine long standing Rovers supporters.
Some of us have been supporters for 40/50/60 even 70+ years.
This coach has to go NOW
He will take this Club into non league football if he is allowed. That in no circumstances should be allowed to happen.
It would be criminal to allow that to happen again.
What’s the old saying Campsall
Silence speaks volume?
I just wish that Blunt would say something, even if was to apologise to fans for the poor performance on the field.
I believe (Silence is worse; all truths that are kept silent become poisonous.”)
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The thing that i feel gets most going is that its not just about the football being crap just now. There's an air of decomposition all around the club.
The ground is starting to look grotty, the catering has been a joke for years, failing infrastructure ie, dusty and dirty concrete walkways and terracing that has not been swept or washed down, broken scoreboard, floodlights that have more defective than working, stadium interior lighting that only comes on occasionally, sharp exposed rivet holes in the back plates on the stadium walls at the back of the stand(i've ruined a decent jacket with it catching on the sharp edge) all the stadium perimeter advertising hoardings look like they have disappeared or fell to bits(lack of commercial performance?)Stadium facilities look very tired, toilets, sports bar, training rooms that are hired out, all look like they need some care and attention..
When you look at this overall it just looks like the club is being run on a tight budget and it will no doubt get tighter as our performance on the field continues to go from bad to worse. The fact that supporters are getting nothing like the right level of communication with the club only hammers it home that it looks like a rudderless ship with no one prepared to make the difference.
This to me is what is alienating the fans from the club, we could say that during the John Ryan era we were in effect spoiled with the engagement he had with the supporters, no one is expecting this from the current board, but some appreciation that they understand the dire situation we all feel the club is in and that they are working on it, begrudging platitudes from exterior sources is not what's required in this situation the fans would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
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Regarding the comments about SM, I find them distasteful.We may represent two different sections of the club in the VSC & the Shadow Board) but together we both want the same thing. First & foremost we are fans of the club, no more than the next one. We give up our time, a lot of it I may add, to challenge the club & improve things for the benefit of our fellow fans.
Gavin listens to our comments about all fans concerns & endeavours to take them on board..no pun intended.
Gavin is the glue holding this club together right now & without him we’d be in serious trouble.
I may not agree with everything SM ( Martin) says, but between us we have an excellent grasp of what’s happening behind the scenes. It does need GB in place & it also needs TB to make his decision on what his intentions are.
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The thing that i feel gets most going is that its not just about the football being crap just now. There's an air of decomposition all around the club.
The ground is starting to look grotty, the catering has been a joke for years, failing infrastructure ie, dusty and dirty concrete walkways and terracing that has not been swept or washed down, broken scoreboard, floodlights that have more defective than working, stadium interior lighting that only comes on occasionally, sharp exposed rivet holes in the back plates on the stadium walls at the back of the stand(i've ruined a decent jacket with it catching on the sharp edge) all the stadium perimeter advertising hoardings look like they have disappeared or fell to bits(lack of commercial performance?)Stadium facilities look very tired, toilets, sports bar, training rooms that are hired out, all look like they need some care and attention..
When you look at this overall it just looks like the club is being run on a tight budget and it will no doubt get tighter as our performance on the field continues to go from bad to worse. The fact that supporters are getting nothing like the right level of communication with the club only hammers it home that it looks like a rudderless ship with no one prepared to make the difference.
This to me is what is alienating the fans from the club, we could say that during the John Ryan era we were in effect spoiled with the engagement he had with the supporters, no one is expecting this from the current board, but some appreciation that they understand the dire situation we all feel the club is in and that they are working on it, begrudging platitudes from exterior sources is not what's required in this situation the fans would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
I well remember back in the early JR days one pre-season they asked for fans to volunteer their help to go and paint the crush barriers, tidy up the terraces and surroundings and the like. I was away at university at the time so couldn't help out but plenty did and it was that sort of "all in it together" spirit that laid the foundations for a really strong symbiotic relationship between the club and the supporters.
I would gladly get stuck in with a bucket and sponge or a jet washer to clean 15 years' worth of dust and grime off the seats. I'd happily give the Belle Vue Bar a lick of paint. I'd even be prepared to clean the bogs and fix the locks on the cubicle doors. It might sound very amateur but if come the close season they put out a statement saying something along the lines of:
"Enough is enough, standards have slipped too far so we're going to make improvements in all areas. We'll back the (new) manager with a strong transfer budget and we want to make the Eco Power Stadium a home of which we can all be proud so we're asking for a taskforce of supporters to chip in and give the place a makeover. In return those who help out will be rewarded with a £50 voucher to spend on anything at the club from merchandise to tickets or catering."
I would jump on that chance to give some extra support as would many others.
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I’m old enough to remember but those who are not need only think that the guy in question was given the nickname firestarter for a reason. However, the two episodes, although different and have completely different people involved, are leading to very similar outcomes, footballing-wise. There is simply no getting around the fact that we’re in a mess right now and it certainly needs addressing.
Talking to Bury or Scunthorpe fans does not change a thing in the same way as us talking to Brentford or Bournemouth fans. Yes, there’s always someone worse off than you, that’s pretty much how the football pyramid works, by definition. None of that, however, puts right what is wrong at the Club and having the good sense to realise there is a major problem that’s still not been sorted is a pretty good way to start to resolve things.
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It does need GB in place & it also needs TB to make his decision on what his intentions are.
I find it interesting that you make no mention of DB in this sentence.
To me there are two separate issues. (1) Club Doncaster is clearly well run as a business. The 3 directors are business men and that is their expertise. (2) Doncaster Rovers Football Club is not well run. In my view, none of the directors is sufficiently competent to make the correct decisions regarding football itself.
The deteriorating state of the stadium facilities is clearly the responsibility of Club Doncaster, and needs to be addressed. Inevitably that will require additional funds, which would reduce the amount available to other areas, such as the football club.
Doncaster Rovers desperately needs someone in charge who understands the problems on the pitch, and is authorised and prepared to do something about it. The hope was that Copps would fill that role, but as time goes by it seems that he is out of his depth. Either that, or his hands are tied.
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Sadly the protesters are indicative of the world Thatcher created. I want it all and I want it now. Personally they all remind me of the little girl from Just William.
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Don’t disagree the manager should be given a chance working with a budget and being backed.
Join us 1pm in the East Stand Reception.
We’ve invited press also.
The time to act is now!!! Don’t be silenced by the majority.
I’ve spent 20 year’s campaigning on behalf of football supporters and yet I can’t think of a worse example than this one. You’re peeved because the footballs crap, I get that, but replace the board with who exactly? Somebody richer that TB?
Whilst I won't be attending this protest, that response does strike me as somewhat flippant and dismissive.
So basically the concern of supporters in regards the overall downward spiral of the club as a whole is dismissed as a hissy fit due to the football being rubbish. That is a blinkered naive and insulting response.
As for who we would get richer than TB, I'd be saying the same thing if we were owned by Jeff Bezos or Bill Gates. Doesn't matter how rich they are, if they are unwilling to support even a moderately ambitious football club, then i don't see it as unreasonable for the fans to express their My concern would be that it's not just about "spending money", it's the extremely poor decision-making on the football side that needs more urgently addressing, and on the non-football side it would be good to know if there is a plan to sort out the many frankly shoddy things about the club that are alienating fans as well.
Exactly this. It's not about the money, it's the constant poor decision making, the lack of drive & enthusiasm to move us forward. All this lies squarely at one mans door, & that's the chairmans in my opinion.
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I think the point SM makes is perfectly valid. There is as yet no viable alternative to the current owners so trying to force them out seems stupid, where does that leave us.
It's absolutely though right to question the current setup and funding and I don't necessarily have an issue with doing that at games either, but let's hope those that do attend do act sensibly. I'm not even going to the game but I don't think right now I'd attend a protest either.
If there's no alternative why do Radio Sheffield keep mentioning investors still being interested in the club?
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My concern would be that it's not just about "spending money", it's the extremely poor decision-making on the football side that needs more urgently addressing, and on the non-football side it would be good to know if there is a plan to sort out the many frankly shoddy things about the club that are alienating fans as well.
I couldn’t agree more but we can thank our missing chairman for not addressing these issues or engaging with the fans, the buck stops with Blunt for not being diligent in his duties
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I think the point SM makes is perfectly valid. There is as yet no viable alternative to the current owners so trying to force them out seems stupid, where does that leave us.
It's absolutely though right to question the current setup and funding and I don't necessarily have an issue with doing that at games either, but let's hope those that do attend do act sensibly. I'm not even going to the game but I don't think right now I'd attend a protest either.
If there's no alternative why do Radio Sheffield keep mentioning investors still being interested in the club?
Being interested and actually putting a business plan in place are worlds apart, as yet no interested parties have gone beyond saying they are
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The thing that i feel gets most going is that its not just about the football being crap just now. There's an air of decomposition all around the club.
The ground is starting to look grotty, the catering has been a joke for years, failing infrastructure ie, dusty and dirty concrete walkways and terracing that has not been swept or washed down, broken scoreboard, floodlights that have more defective than working, stadium interior lighting that only comes on occasionally, sharp exposed rivet holes in the back plates on the stadium walls at the back of the stand(i've ruined a decent jacket with it catching on the sharp edge) all the stadium perimeter advertising hoardings look like they have disappeared or fell to bits(lack of commercial performance?)Stadium facilities look very tired, toilets, sports bar, training rooms that are hired out, all look like they need some care and attention..
When you look at this overall it just looks like the club is being run on a tight budget and it will no doubt get tighter as our performance on the field continues to go from bad to worse. The fact that supporters are getting nothing like the right level of communication with the club only hammers it home that it looks like a rudderless ship with no one prepared to make the difference.
This to me is what is alienating the fans from the club, we could say that during the John Ryan era we were in effect spoiled with the engagement he had with the supporters, no one is expecting this from the current board, but some appreciation that they understand the dire situation we all feel the club is in and that they are working on it, begrudging platitudes from exterior sources is not what's required in this situation the fans would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
I well remember back in the early JR days one pre-season they asked for fans to volunteer their help to go and paint the crush barriers, tidy up the terraces and surroundings and the like. I was away at university at the time so couldn't help out but plenty did and it was that sort of "all in it together" spirit that laid the foundations for a really strong symbiotic relationship between the club and the supporters.
I would gladly get stuck in with a bucket and sponge or a jet washer to clean 15 years' worth of dust and grime off the seats. I'd happily give the Belle Vue Bar a lick of paint. I'd even be prepared to clean the bogs and fix the locks on the cubicle doors. It might sound very amateur but if come the close season they put out a statement saying something along the lines of:
"Enough is enough, standards have slipped too far so we're going to make improvements in all areas. We'll back the (new) manager with a strong transfer budget and we want to make the Eco Power Stadium a home of which we can all be proud so we're asking for a taskforce of supporters to chip in and give the place a makeover. In return those who help out will be rewarded with a £50 voucher to spend on anything at the club from merchandise to tickets or catering."
I would jump on that chance to give some extra support as would many others.
Totally agree, been thinking the exact same for a while.
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The club has seriously gone through the motions this year and just expected to be up there with the likes of Orient, Bradford, Stockport because we have came down from a higher division and are an above average sized club for the division.
If we could hear a critical voice from within the club speak openly about what needs to be done, the worries of the fans can be alleviated.
Copps blaming the budget is not good enough for me.
Is Schofield under pressure from those above? If not why? Or are those above looking at either Copps or themselves for what they can do better? This is all stuff we need to know because the club is in turmoil.
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I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, be careful what you wish for. Those old enough will remember a benefactor who ran the club into the ground and did time for trying to burn down the main stand.
COYR
There’s no one on here that is “wishing” as you keep saying, we are wanting the board to be honest, open and start talking to the fans, and if they have no interest in doing any of those, then it’s going to upset people. So there’s no wishing, a wish is something that won’t come true anyway. I do believe there’s people on the board not bothered about DFFC and if that’s the case should move on.
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The thing that i feel gets most going is that its not just about the football being crap just now. There's an air of decomposition all around the club.
The ground is starting to look grotty, the catering has been a joke for years, failing infrastructure ie, dusty and dirty concrete walkways and terracing that has not been swept or washed down, broken scoreboard, floodlights that have more defective than working, stadium interior lighting that only comes on occasionally, sharp exposed rivet holes in the back plates on the stadium walls at the back of the stand(i've ruined a decent jacket with it catching on the sharp edge) all the stadium perimeter advertising hoardings look like they have disappeared or fell to bits(lack of commercial performance?)Stadium facilities look very tired, toilets, sports bar, training rooms that are hired out, all look like they need some care and attention..
When you look at this overall it just looks like the club is being run on a tight budget and it will no doubt get tighter as our performance on the field continues to go from bad to worse. The fact that supporters are getting nothing like the right level of communication with the club only hammers it home that it looks like a rudderless ship with no one prepared to make the difference.
This to me is what is alienating the fans from the club, we could say that during the John Ryan era we were in effect spoiled with the engagement he had with the supporters, no one is expecting this from the current board, but some appreciation that they understand the dire situation we all feel the club is in and that they are working on it, begrudging platitudes from exterior sources is not what's required in this situation the fans would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
I well remember back in the early JR days one pre-season they asked for fans to volunteer their help to go and paint the crush barriers, tidy up the terraces and surroundings and the like. I was away at university at the time so couldn't help out but plenty did and it was that sort of "all in it together" spirit that laid the foundations for a really strong symbiotic relationship between the club and the supporters.
I would gladly get stuck in with a bucket and sponge or a jet washer to clean 15 years' worth of dust and grime off the seats. I'd happily give the Belle Vue Bar a lick of paint. I'd even be prepared to clean the bogs and fix the locks on the cubicle doors. It might sound very amateur but if come the close season they put out a statement saying something along the lines of:
"Enough is enough, standards have slipped too far so we're going to make improvements in all areas. We'll back the (new) manager with a strong transfer budget and we want to make the Eco Power Stadium a home of which we can all be proud so we're asking for a taskforce of supporters to chip in and give the place a makeover. In return those who help out will be rewarded with a £50 voucher to spend on anything at the club from merchandise to tickets or catering."
I would jump on that chance to give some extra support as would many others.
Totally agree, been thinking the exact same for a while.
We had the Belle Vue Owl and we may have more Birds in West Stand where a huge nest is in the Roof right above players Tunnel
It needs moving before Eggs or worse Chicks are in it
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What a waste of time! I understand the board are out of the country over the Easter break so I’m not sure how effective any demonstration can be to an empty boardroom!!
The whole board?
The board that’s allegedly working 24/7 to ensure things get better on & off the pitch?
I hope they’re all in the same foreign hotel then?
No not the whole board.
But even still, what’s the point of a demonstration at 1pm when there’s nobody there?
Have they gone to head hunt a foreign coach or manager SM
They will come back with a youth coach from some Spanish 3rd tier club. That’l fix it. Terrific.
Pretty poor attempt at sarcasm there Campsall. What’s got into you lately?
Come on SM even you can’t defend what’s going on at present.
Where is Blunt. He is supposed to be Chairman of this football club. We are in crisis on the football field and you tell us the board are off to foreign climes.
Gone to escape the wrath of the fans at our game on Monday.
I have backed this board to the hilt SM on this forum for many years as you will know.
But for them to sit back and say nothing, do nothing about the absolute dross this coach has managed to get this group of players to serve up.
A coach who says his process is working and his players are buying into it. The more he keeps saying that the worse the performances get.
Any other club in the 92 Premier & EFL clubs would have sacked DS after Saturday, no i am wrong, after Crawley and the unbelievable contemptuous clap trap DS came out with after the match.
I am at my wits end SM at what is happening to the football club i am passionate about.
85% of the forum members want him out. This is not the Netto brigade on here SM.
These are genuine long standing Rovers supporters.
Some of us have been supporters for 40/50/60 even 70+ years.
This coach has to go NOW
He will take this Club into non league football if he is allowed. That in no circumstances should be allowed to happen.
It would be criminal to allow that to happen again.
he’s right!^ Absolutely bang on the button.
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Football people making decisions the board have not interfered with when they probably should have are the reasons why we are where we are.
Where the board has failed is not over riding some of the decisions and giving money to people to waste on players not up to the standard required, some who were brought here by identification staff no longer at the club because of their performance and judgment.
When signing players and staff they are on contracts both sides must honour, and nobody likes to see anyone loose their job, but I am afraid it is time to separate the chaff from the wheat, and that now is the main job the board has, to lay down the way the club needs to go and give it direction, and as it is their money people are fooling around with I think that they need to get on with the job at hand and show leadership, then the club can move forward, them leaving enmas would leave us high and dry and them out of pocket and no need for it, it is the playing and management side that needs operating on.
The board have been too trusting and let down IMHO.
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I think there’s two issues here, though - there’s the how it’s been spent and then there’s the how much was needed!
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It was spent badly, teams spent less and ended up with better players and teams, and that is the only test worth bothering about, the rest is all guess work and if only dreaming.
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I think the point SM makes is perfectly valid. There is as yet no viable alternative to the current owners so trying to force them out seems stupid, where does that leave us.
It's absolutely though right to question the current setup and funding and I don't necessarily have an issue with doing that at games either, but let's hope those that do attend do act sensibly. I'm not even going to the game but I don't think right now I'd attend a protest either.
If there's no alternative why do Radio Sheffield keep mentioning investors still being interested in the club?
They may simply know more than we do as fans. Personally until I see genuine evidence of an actual change then there isn't evidence of an alternative just a wishlist.
I guess there is a question as to what people do want the alternative to be?
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I think the point SM makes is perfectly valid. There is as yet no viable alternative to the current owners so trying to force them out seems stupid, where does that leave us.
It's absolutely though right to question the current setup and funding and I don't necessarily have an issue with doing that at games either, but let's hope those that do attend do act sensibly. I'm not even going to the game but I don't think right now I'd attend a protest either.
If there's no alternative why do Radio Sheffield keep mentioning investors still being interested in the club?
They may simply know more than we do as fans. Personally until I see genuine evidence of an actual change then there isn't evidence of an alternative just a wishlist.
I guess there is a question as to what people do want the alternative to be?
I think it's more likely to be cheap lazy journalism where they believe the crap circulating on Twitter.
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If it hasn’t already happened I would think a meeting between football and the financial side is needed. I would want to be knowing why the money I have put in has so badly wasted. The board are to blame for the appointment of the managers.
With Coppinger there, they still have to sign the contracts off. They have gone cheap quite a few times and it’s cost us. Getting the right man who will use any funding well is paramount. Until the right man is manager things will continue to go wrong and money will carry on being wasted. Get the right person in that role and things will fall into place.
The manager position is the most important at the club and we keep appointing novices.
A club like ours needs to be great at scouting players and getting them early, we are not producing enough good signings from scouting work done.
When we have promising young players why are they not playing?, especially when we’ve been so poor.
The place needs new people with new ideas.
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The thing that i feel gets most going is that its not just about the football being crap just now. There's an air of decomposition all around the club.
The ground is starting to look grotty, the catering has been a joke for years, failing infrastructure ie, dusty and dirty concrete walkways and terracing that has not been swept or washed down, broken scoreboard, floodlights that have more defective than working, stadium interior lighting that only comes on occasionally, sharp exposed rivet holes in the back plates on the stadium walls at the back of the stand(i've ruined a decent jacket with it catching on the sharp edge) all the stadium perimeter advertising hoardings look like they have disappeared or fell to bits(lack of commercial performance?)Stadium facilities look very tired, toilets, sports bar, training rooms that are hired out, all look like they need some care and attention..
When you look at this overall it just looks like the club is being run on a tight budget and it will no doubt get tighter as our performance on the field continues to go from bad to worse. The fact that supporters are getting nothing like the right level of communication with the club only hammers it home that it looks like a rudderless ship with no one prepared to make the difference.
This to me is what is alienating the fans from the club, we could say that during the John Ryan era we were in effect spoiled with the engagement he had with the supporters, no one is expecting this from the current board, but some appreciation that they understand the dire situation we all feel the club is in and that they are working on it, begrudging platitudes from exterior sources is not what's required in this situation the fans would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
I well remember back in the early JR days one pre-season they asked for fans to volunteer their help to go and paint the crush barriers, tidy up the terraces and surroundings and the like. I was away at university at the time so couldn't help out but plenty did and it was that sort of "all in it together" spirit that laid the foundations for a really strong symbiotic relationship between the club and the supporters.
I would gladly get stuck in with a bucket and sponge or a jet washer to clean 15 years' worth of dust and grime off the seats. I'd happily give the Belle Vue Bar a lick of paint. I'd even be prepared to clean the bogs and fix the locks on the cubicle doors. It might sound very amateur but if come the close season they put out a statement saying something along the lines of:
"Enough is enough, standards have slipped too far so we're going to make improvements in all areas. We'll back the (new) manager with a strong transfer budget and we want to make the Eco Power Stadium a home of which we can all be proud so we're asking for a taskforce of supporters to chip in and give the place a makeover. In return those who help out will be rewarded with a £50 voucher to spend on anything at the club from merchandise to tickets or catering."
I would jump on that chance to give some extra support as would many others.
Totally agree with that Mike, I think the key thing that has been lost is pride in a lot of areas. Criticise anything to do with the team or off-field things like this and what you’re mostly met with is excuses…. Covid, we haven’t got the funds, we can’t do X because of External supplier Y. Whether it’s the team performances or the dried up 2-year old reeking puddle of piss on the floor of the gents toilets in the south stand (no, seriously I’ve moved on from the first team now) there always seems to be a reason/excuse for it not getting sorted.
I would also add that there are people working at the club who are genuine fans who I’m sure would be happy to pitch in and help co-ordinate etc.
However what the above all requires to sort out is some gumption, pride and determination from the top to go, “ok everyone, this has become a rubbish experience, let’s get some ideas going and solutions in place”
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On Instagram, Roversbible there’s a post about the meeting at 1 O’clock, but the bright sparks say it’s Saturday 10th April ?? How you try be serious when the day/date is wrong, also they planning to protest on a day when there will be a large police presence because who the opposition are, not very well thought out
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What diff does having a large police presence make to having a protest . The police will actually facilitate peaceful protest if they are spoken to
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The protest still going ahead. The police will be no problem as it will be peaceful.
The statement this morning was to try to stop the protest is what the organisers are saying, it’s purely hot air and more lies upon lies.
Why should we believe them now? The blame lays at David Blunts feet and we need a new chairman next season to wipe the slate clean.
The only way we will stop this protest and the protests every game is for David Blunt to resign.
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The protest still going ahead. The police will be no problem as it will be peaceful.
The statement this morning was to try to stop the protest is what the organisers are saying, it’s purely hot air and more lies upon lies.
Why should we believe them now? The blame lays at David Blunts feet and we need a new chairman next season to wipe the slate clean.
The only way we will stop this protest and the protests every game is for David Blunt to resign.
Don't kid yourself, the announcement this morning has nothing to do with your protest.
The announcement has been coming for quite some time, it was always about getting agreements in place and budgets set.
Go ahead though, knock yourself out, a protest at 1pm designed to remove the Chairman has no impact on what the clubs decisions are.
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The protest still going ahead. The police will be no problem as it will be peaceful.
The statement this morning was to try to stop the protest is what the organisers are saying, it’s purely hot air and more lies upon lies.
Why should we believe them now? The blame lays at David Blunts feet and we need a new chairman next season to wipe the slate clean.
The only way we will stop this protest and the protests every game is for David Blunt to resign.
Desperate mental gymnastics here to try and stay relevant.
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The protest still going ahead. The police will be no problem as it will be peaceful.
The statement this morning was to try to stop the protest is what the organisers are saying, it’s purely hot air and more lies upon lies.
Why should we believe them now? The blame lays at David Blunts feet and we need a new chairman next season to wipe the slate clean.
The only way we will stop this protest and the protests every game is for David Blunt to resign.
Desperate mental gymnastics here to try and stay relevant.
I hope that empty room they're protesting to takes notice!
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Peaceful but they are hoping to invade the building to get to the Board room, yep even SY finest will soon put a stop to that
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Peaceful but they are hoping to invade the building to get to the Board room, yep even SY finest will soon put a stop to that
Good luck to anyone that tries this. Aggravated trespass is straight arrest.
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So TB was so scared of the protest he’s decided to throw even more money at the club….really get real
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It is what it is and TB should be allowed full respect for him just being at the club . He has by his on admission said that football isn’t a big thing in his life but HAS backed the club and wants success but not any price I’d assume . The club has reached its crossroads and TB is prepared to invest further, so who are we to question or brandish his statement without seeing what materialises . I’ve bought my season ticket before his statement and feel vindicated, in-spite of my feelings about how things have been going for a few seasons . So I will keep my fingers crossed that we are emerging from a dark place into the light once again !!