Are we actually doing ok?

[benaldo]

Despite the injuries we've had, and let's face it, we've had a lot, are we actually doing ok? I mean, we've had a, what can only be described as, pathetic defence all season. In addition to that our midfield has constantly changed and we've had an injured Billy for the entire first half of the season (First his groin was knackered but he played on, then the blunts injury to his hamstring). Yet, I don't think we have to worry about relegation, if only because teams like the blunts and Scunny are in the league!

Are we too used to doing well? We've been blessed for sure in the past 10 years, but it's like the party is over, we've reached our creative peak and it's downhill time.  Iwasn't expecting to get to the premier league, but I was expecting really good football from us on a regular basis.

It's defeats like this against Milwall that gut me the most. I don't mind losing to good teams who consistantly play well - I seem to remember losing 0-4 or 1-4 to Swansea a couple of years ago and I left the stadium thinking \"We've just got beaten by a great team, so what, we played ok (which we actually did! they were just awesome\"). But now we appear to lose not because the other team is ace, but because we play like a team of overweight, asthmatic, one legged, binmen (I await a response from Sir Largestoncough McHoppistink). I hate losing, like most of us, but it's the fact we aren't playing well that galls me. Am I wrong? What do others think?

[RedJ]

We're doing averagely. We've had injuries to key players that's stopped us doing \"well\", but all things considered, we're not doing badly. It just feels as though we are when we think about how we started the season. Not badly, but not \"well\". Just OK.

[MrFrost]

We are exactly where we deserve to be in the league.

[Surrey Rover]

Most clubs would find it difficult given the amount of injuries we have had this season. It might be that staying in the Championship this season will be one of great credit (more so than the last two) given the amount of bad luck we've had on the injury front.

[MrFrost]

Rigoglioso wrote:

I still think that you should all just be happy if Donny stay up again this season!

They will always have to punch well above their weight in the Championship because they are one of the smallest clubs. On the pitch, the football is nice and it's refreshing to see a side play such an entertaining brand of football.

However, every summer when the games are over and the clubs battle with each other to attract new players, Donny will always be seen as \"small fish\" and \"easy pickings\" by other clubs. Quite simply, Doncaster Rovers cannot afford the same amounts of money that other teams in the division can afford to pay out - which means at the start of every season, despite the nice football, despite the success of previous years, they are in a handicapped predicament.

The board of directors pushed the boat out in the summer and signed a good, proven player in Billy Sharp. But despite his talents, Sharp cannot do it alone. Just like Brian Stock or John Oster can't do it alone. And ultimately, when you come up against clubs with bigger wage budgets and transfer budgets than DRFC, the opposition always have more proven players within their respective squads - and quite often more capable players in back-up (i.e. on the bench), who can come on and change a game.

I know some people will say Blackpool went up, so why can't Doncaster. But the thing is, a club like Blackpool getting promoted was a once in a blue moon occurance. A club of a similar size to them may not achieve promotion to the Premier League for another 10/20/30 years!

21st in the Championship, ultimately survival, is a fine achievement for Doncaster Rovers! People go on about disasters and sh*t games at the moment and how the team looks passionless and all that b*llocks, but it could be worse. Just think how bad relegation would be!

And lets face something else as well, if Sean O'Driscoll left Doncaster Rovers tomorrow, most people would soil their pants, because they would then expect the club to struggle to survive in this league.

You use the term \"you\", and they.

You no longer a supporter Rigo? Not having a go, just wondering, just comes across in how you're talking.

[RedJ]

I say \"they\" when talking about Donny to a non-supporter. I don't know why, just force of habit.

[benaldo]

I say \"they\" too. Considering I don't play for Doncaster Rovers I think I'm right in saying \"they\" when referring to the team. I refer to us supporters as \"we\" though, as in we are rubbish at singing.

[RedJ]

I think that might be my logic behind it actually (never been too certain).

[The Red Baron]

Rigoglioso wrote:

I still think that you should all just be happy if Donny stay up again this season!

They will always have to punch well above their weight in the Championship because they are one of the smallest clubs. On the pitch, the football is nice and it's refreshing to see a side play such an entertaining brand of football.

However, every summer when the games are over and the clubs battle with each other to attract new players, Donny will always be seen as \"small fish\" and \"easy pickings\" by other clubs. Quite simply, Doncaster Rovers cannot afford the same amounts of money that other teams in the division can afford to pay out - which means at the start of every season, despite the nice football, despite the success of previous years, they are in a handicapped predicament.

The board of directors pushed the boat out in the summer and signed a good, proven player in Billy Sharp. But despite his talents, Sharp cannot do it alone. Just like Brian Stock or John Oster can't do it alone. And ultimately, when you come up against clubs with bigger wage budgets and transfer budgets than DRFC, the opposition always have more proven players within their respective squads - and quite often more capable players in back-up (i.e. on the bench), who can come on and change a game.

I know some people will say Blackpool went up, so why can't Doncaster. But the thing is, a club like Blackpool getting promoted was a once in a blue moon occurance. A club of a similar size to them may not achieve promotion to the Premier League for another 10/20/30 years!

21st in the Championship, ultimately survival, is a fine achievement for Doncaster Rovers! People go on about disasters and sh*t games at the moment and how the team looks passionless and all that b*llocks, but it could be worse. Just think how bad relegation would be!

And lets face something else as well, if Sean O'Driscoll left Doncaster Rovers tomorrow, most people would soil their pants, because they would then expect the club to struggle to survive in this league.

I can't disagree with most of what you say there Rigo. I did think Sharp might just drive us on to the play-offs, but in the final analysis his goals will probably keep us up. For me, the season could end tomorrow and I'd be happy with 15th.

I don't think the the team looks passionless, by the way. I thought they were excellent on Tuesday and from what I was told they were unlucky not to get a point today. Staying up is an achievement, and if we manage it this time round (and five wins from 18 games should do the trick) we should celebrate it.

I too dread the day that Sean goes. I don't think it will happen this season, but I fear he might not be here next time around.

[billdoor]

Would anyone swap this season,to go back to winning ways in a lower divison. Does it matter which tier of football you are playing in,as long as your winning? Discuss.

[RedJ]

That's a very interesting question BD. I'm not too sure, I loved winning week in week out, but then I also love seeing the football we play under Sean and love seeing the calibre of opposition we have visiting the Keepmoat (which we didn't have at lower levels - not knocking BV, mind).

[BigH]

An interesting one. In the late 60s and early 80s we were a yo-yo team between the 3rd and 4th divisions. If we become a yo-yo team between the (old) 2nd and 3rd divisions then that's great progress.

Look, there's a core group of supporters - I'm one - for whom these really are glory days. Every goal scored, every point earned has a wow factor. And then there are 'new' fans who think, and I can understand this, that the only way is and should be up. I don't want to pour cold water on people's dreams/expectations but, quite frankly, the only reason we are in this division is because of the input of the Board and SOD/ROK. If we get unlucky and the gods say too many injuries/not enough points then we should accept it and get on with it whatever state/league the team may be in next season.

One of the best bits about being a Rovers fan is that our teams have always had the capacity to give another team a real good smack. We might go and blow it the following week with a 6-0 defeat to the likes of Hartlepool but we've always been able to have a go at some of the smug smartarses out there. And that's why I'd love us to stay in this division if we could.

[RoversAlias]

billdoor wrote:

Would anyone swap this season,to go back to winning ways in a lower divison. Does it matter which tier of football you are playing in,as long as your winning? Discuss.

Of course it matters. You can be winning every week in the Conference North...you're still in the Conference bloody North!

The football is better, the players, teams and stadiums are all better...I'd not trade being average in this league for being 'successful' in ones below. Especially as the aim of being successful in those leagues is to get to where we are now!

[Nudga]

For me this Rovers team is too careful. If the team were set out to be a bit more gutsy then we could/should have 9 to 12 more points on the board. The triangles are lovely to watch sometimes but it enables the other side to re-group and then we hit a brick wall. Maybe with the injuries we can't do this but i'd like to see more bravery and then the home crowd would respond as well. But then, that's just my preference on how I like to see a team play.

[PDX_Rover]

I really think we are in a weird place at the moment.  I don't know whether SO'D is unsettled with all these links with other jobs and that filtered down to the players. It seems unsettled right now. Yes we have been unlucky with injuries and it's been nigh impossible to player a settled side for the most part and we just do not have the strength in depth that other clubs enjoy.

That said, this division is wide open... I mean really wide open.  It's interesting to see that clubs that have put runs together mid-season and are going up the league - Leicester for one.  We've had a rough patch since Christmas but I think we'll come through it.

I don't envisage SO'D or RO'K going anywhere for a while, personally.

Whether I would trade this for playing at a lower level - NO fcukING WAY!!!!  Like many others on here, I've supported Rovers all my life and I've seen some incredible lows and some amazing highs - on and off the pitch.

Right now, I think we're going through another transition. Arguably we're an 'established' Championship club, this being our third season here....  We saw several such transitions in the past 12-13 years. We went from the conference to Division 3 with one set of players - Fossie, Sarge, Blundell, Barnesy, Warrington, Tokyo etc then stepped up a division and started to bring in new players - Stock, Copps, Heffs, Hayter etc and then again.... got promoted and now we're looking at bringing in different players over time.  I just get the feeling that we are in that place now of transition - maybe I am wrong but it just feels that way.  Off the pitch too, I think things are FINALLY beginning to evolve.  I hope so anyway.

IMO, we've been winging it a bit so far and this season, it's got serious all of a sudden.

Or am I talking b*llocks?  Sometimes even I don;t know

[vaya]

Bloke next to me at KMS reckons the same - that we're in a transitional period. Witness the performance and tactics on Tuesday night, not something you'd initially expect from a SOD side.

Question remains though above this, can you remain consistent without a consistent side? I'd be interested to know how many times we've fielded the same 11, and how many times we've fielded the same back four.

Would this correlate with our strongest performances?

[billdoor]

But wouldn't you rather have that\"happy feeling\" on a Saturday evening,because you have won.Or be gutted,like tonight. I'm talking about a successful season,were your at the top of the divison or near to it. Who cares how they play,as long as they win.You only admire the top players in each team,but there are always top players in each division. If you only go to home matches,who cares about the other staduims.

[Viking Don]

If I wanted that happy feeling on a Saturday night I'd become a Man U fan and takes loads of coke. It's OK to feel down when your team loses, who wants to be bloody happy all the time?  

[donnyproletarian]

Were doing better than okay given our injuries.Take the positives 1 goal leaked in 2 matches an improvement surely and evidence that the defence is getting its act together.

[vaya]

billdoor wrote:

But wouldn't you rather have that\"happy feeling\" on a Saturday evening,because you have won.Or be gutted,like tonight. I'm talking about a successful season,were your at the top of the divison or near to it. Who cares how they play,as long as they win.You only admire the top players in each team,but there are always top players in each division. If you only go to home matches,who cares about the other staduims.

It's an standpont predicated on the assumption that we watch football in a bubble, with no reference to the wider context. I doubt after getting a warm feeling stuffing for instance York I'd enjoy going back to work in Sheffield on the Monday.

Apply this to another sport and it doesn't work either eg - \"I'm the best skier in Britain\"

whoopeee.........

[RoversAlias]

billdoor wrote:

But wouldn't you rather have that\"happy feeling\" on a Saturday evening,because you have won.Or be gutted,like tonight. I'm talking about a successful season,were your at the top of the divison or near to it. Who cares how they play,as long as they win.You only admire the top players in each team,but there are always top players in each division. If you only go to home matches,who cares about the other staduims.

Well no...cos football isn't just about winning. Yeah I'm a bit disappointed we lost today but at the end of the day it isn't the end of the world, and it's much better to come away from a last minute league defeat to Millwall than it is to come away from a last minute league defeat to Southport. I've done both, and I can assure you on that!

I care how well they play because I go to football to be entertained. I don't just admire the top players in each team...I'm currently wearing a #15 Wilson shirt after all! And the top players in this division are a hell of a lot better than the top players in lower divisions at any rate. Plus...I love to go to the away games, they're great fun. So I guess really all that you've said there doesn't really apply to me.

[Lesonthewest]

We are where we are purely because of our horrendous injuries in my opinion, it's been ridiculous, but the manager has got on with it, & hopefully when a few more return we will get the points needed to stay in this division. If Sean had had a fully fit squad to choose from I am convinced we would be in or around the play-offs. I doubt many other managers with a club & squad our size could have coped with these injuries & not been in the bottom three. The main aim now must be to obtain the next eighteen or so points to keep us here. Surely next season cannot see us suffer such injuries.

[PDX_Rover]

Some good points here - football is about more than winning - for me personally it makes my weekend/evening when we win, but more then that, Rovers is in my heart, it's part of what defines me.

Barnstoneworth!

[nice one rovers]

Me and my lads have only missed 4 games this season home or away, and we're stuggling to think of any where we've been truly gutted at the quality of entertainment ( Barnsley , & Wolves away excepted). For me, as long as we finish this season a league position higher than last,  then thats good enough. Continually improving every year. We are doing ok with what we,ve got to work with.

[nice one rovers]

I am going to  miss the Portsmouth game though, The wife's been given 2 good tickets for Arsenal v Wolves, and its testament to  how enjoyable The Rovers are, that I really would prefer to stay at home and watch them struggle against Portsmouth.   I say arsenal, but I prefer to call them the Donny of the premiership.

[RedJ]

nice one rovers wrote:

Me and my lads have only missed 4 games this season home or away, and we're stuggling to think of any where we've been truly gutted at the quality of entertainment ( Barnsley , & Wolves away excepted). For me, as long as we finish this season a league position higher than last,  then thats good enough. Continually improving every year. We are doing ok with what we,ve got to work with.

Me too, although it would've been nice to make the playoffs.

[billdoor]

Thanks everyone for your views on that. For the record i agree with what most people are saying. I prefer to be in the highest league possible,but losing really spoils my weekend.

[RedJ]

Yeah, mine too, especially when it's a team I hate/we lose badly.

[CottyRover]

I had become a bit despondant after recent results. After reading this thread yesterday and thinking about it later I started to get things into perspective. I had begun to raise my expectations. Realistically I would much rather we stay in this league, but I've been a Donny fan almost as long as JR and I will still get a warm glow on a Saturday night whoever we beat and still feel crap whoever we lose to. That's what it's about, not watching Manure on Sky and thinking you're a fan. And there's still a lot we can get out of the season, and we will still be here next season.

[ravenrover]

I agree with just about all the comments, injuries have IMHO ruined any playoff chances this season and staying in this division will be an achievement in my book.
SO'D is the best manager we have had in a long long time but if we do dare to dream of a push for the Premiership is SO'D the man to get us there? Has he perhaps reached that position that Penney got to, unable to take us to the next level? I thoroughly enjoy the football we USUALLY play win lose or draw, I obviously prefer the win, and even now look forward to the next match even if I can't attend the actual game, my wife has learned to leave me alone in the living room with SSN when I am not at the match.
But and it's a big but can we achieve the Premiership with the type, and size, of player that SO'D seems to favour and will his style of playing and tactics be the right ones for that final push. Do we, not counting JR, want the Premiership?
It won't bother me if we stay in this division with SO'D at the helm but will it bring in the crowds that JR seems to expecting if we can't \"guarantee\" the KM to be a fortress even if we win the odd scruffy game to go along with our champagne football.
Not trying to be inflammatory just asking the question and throwing it open for discussion.