Worried

[The Red Baron]

By my reckoning (BST will probably disagree!) we need 16 points to add to the current 36. That will give us 52. A point a game from here.

48-51 might be enough, but I wouldn't bank on it. Colchester look practically doomed and both Oldham and Crewe struggle to win games.

You'd say the final relegation place will be between Chesterfield, Shrewsbury, Blackpool and Fleetwood. History tells us though that one of the relegated teams is usually one whose previously acceptable form collapses in the second half of the season. Look at Notts County last season for an example.

There are two mid-table sides currently going through a slump. One is Bury, who lost 6-0 yesterday, and the other is us. Time to turn it around, of course, but the longer this kind of run goes on, the more the pressure grows. 2010-11, anyone?

Trouble is, neither of the next two games offer much prospect of change. A local derby- please god we turn up for that one,  then a home game against a side with one of the best away records in the division. March looks slightly better, but the rot may have well and truly set in by then.

[dickos1]

We've only lost 3 on the bounce it's not good but it's not as desperate as what it's been made out to be

[BigH]

To my mind, the loss of Grant has been the biggest single factor behind our slump. His arrival brought an attacking focus to our play that inspired confidence in our forwards/midfield that, in turn, helped ease the pressure on our abject defence. Grant's absence has seen the team revert to the bad habits of ponderous, lethargic play, with hit-and-hope balls, mindless running around and no end product.

This is very much a problem for DF to solve. Most of the players we have are distinctly average and a good half a dozen or so will be on their way in the summer. You can call it Dickov's legacy but we've seen DF get the better ones to play. It's a question of restoring this mindset and confidence before we get well and truly sucked into the clart. The sooner Grant returns the better; if we're still in a slump once he's back then we really should be worried.

[The Red Baron]

We've only lost 3 on the bounce it's not good but it's not as desperate as what it's been made out to be

Yes, three on the bounce isn't a lot. Trouble is that team yesterday looked like it would struggle to beat a Sunday League side. Can't see much to enthuse about in the next two games either.

The return of a fit Grant and Coppinger could make a difference but will it be enough to get anything from two in-form sides?

[Copps is Magic]

I look at all the next five fixtures and think we can get something from them. I think teams have found a way to play against us at home and that needs sorting. Scunny, Walsall, Sheff U - all didn't look particularly brilliant but they tactically outmatched us then spent a lot of the time slowing the games down.

[Bentley Bullet]

I think visiting teams have worked out a reliable system to beat us on our own turf. If you study the way they play, they tend to pass the ball to each other, while progressing up the field towards our goal. If they lose the ball, they simply go and take it back off our player. if they are competing for a ball with one of our players, they put more effort into the challenge than our player, and if one of their players are chasing after a ball with one of our players, they run a bit faster in order to get to the ball before our player.

[steve@dcfd]

He seems to be a little obstinate about strengthening defences, he has been the same at other clubs. I'm hoping he realises that the defence we have needs at least one in until the end of the season.
With our defence you need two ball winners in front of them, so a signing until the end of the season we could do with in there. The loan signings are good when everythings going well, but we don't have enough ''Blood and guts'' type players that drag you back into games.

When our team are in the s..t, we have the collective heart size of a thimble.
No doubt we will get some results against poor teams, but while we have a misfunctioning back 3/4 and midfield we will struggle against any team run of the mill upwards.

Sammy you need money to strengthen the side that's why DF is trying to loan players out. He may then get a player.

If the midfield as a collective was better then perhaps the defence would not be as bigger problem.

It wasn't yesterday the midfield was the problem all game. But again more money is required to make it better.

[grayx]

This is what happens when you give up on play offs and settle for mid table mediocrity.
You get drawn into a relegation battle.
I reckon DF's been trying to cut the budget by off loading high wage earners and perhaps trying to build up a transfer kitty to spend in the summer.

[Chris Black come back]

If (as cruelly looks the case) we are entirely dependant on a young lad on loan to make our side of professionals look vaguely professional, then we really are in the shit.

[mrfrostsdad]

We've only lost 3 on the bounce it's not good but it's not as desperate as what it's been made out to be

You're right. But we've only won 9 out of 30 all season which is as bad as it looks.
Ferguson always had money to spend at Peterborough. Real money. On transfer fees. If he doesn't have the same here and things go poorly next season, I reckon that the first opportunity he has, he'll be gone.

That's based on nothing at all. Just my own feelings

[dickos1]

It's irrelevant what we did before he got here he's been here 18 games and until the last 4 we've been very good

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

All this talk about defence. It's the midfield that's terrible not defence. No balance right now.

[Campsall rover]

At the moment Fergie is having to fit round poles into square pegs.
No one has mentioned the loss of Fillipe Mattioni. He is a natural right wing back in Fergie's preferred 3-5-2  neither Alcock, Lund or Stewart are. Alcock and Lund are natural right backs in a flat back 4 and Stewart is not a defender and yesterday he was pinned back in his own half which is a total waste of his ability to create.
I think it might be worth trying Copps in that position as he has shown that he can play at right back in an emegency.
Yes we desperately need a fully fit Connor Grant, he has shown he is a quality player and will provide the cutting edge we need.
Williams and Tyson are feeding on scraps without him.

[Campsall rover]

Oh and forgot to mention Grant can score goals as well.
First goal scoring midfielder we have had since Paul Green!!!

[eastender]

I think visiting teams have worked out a reliable system to beat us on our own turf. If you study the way they play, they tend to pass the ball to each other, while progressing up the field towards our goal. If they lose the ball, they simply go and take it back off our player. if they are competing for a ball with one of our players, they put more effort into the challenge than our player, and if one of their players are chasing after a ball with one of our players, they run a bit faster in order to get to the ball before our player.

I've worked out that away teams don't need a system to beat us.
Just go about your business in a busy like manner , watch us huff and puff without causing you any threat , then wait and pounce on the inevitable defensive blunder and bag the 3 easy points.

[drfchound]

This is what happens when you give up on play offs and settle for mid table mediocrity.
You get drawn into a relegation battle.
I reckon DF's been trying to cut the budget by off loading high wage earners and perhaps trying to build up a transfer kitty to spend in the summer.

Gates of 5000 and less for the remaining games won't bring in much revenue though will they grayx?
The bringing in of young kids to replace experienced pro's has been a bad move and will bite hard in the summer when Df will not be getting the money he will need to bring in quality players.

[MrFrost]

I think we all know Ferguson will only need to look for free transfers in the summer.

[dickos1]

Why? Dickov paid money for players, why wouldn't Ferguson

[MrFrost]

Why? Dickov paid money for players, why wouldn't Ferguson

Who?

We've been reliant on freebies and loans for far too long.

Look at the squad vs Leeds in the play offs. We paid transfer fees for several players back then, and the quality shows.

[MachoMadness]

Why? Dickov paid money for players, why wouldn't Ferguson

Who?

We've been reliant on freebies and loans for far too long.

Look at the squad vs Leeds in the play offs. We paid transfer fees for several players back then, and the quality shows.

Theo and BUtler. . Hasn't Fergie already paid a fee for Alcock? Not exactly massive sums in any event, but think the days of us signing Jimmy O'Connor-level players for £175k are long gone. As they are for most league clubs apart from the ones who flaunt FFP rules and get away with it.

[MrFrost]

Why? Dickov paid money for players, why wouldn't Ferguson

Who?

We've been reliant on freebies and loans for far too long.

Look at the squad vs Leeds in the play offs. We paid transfer fees for several players back then, and the quality shows.

Theo and BUtler. . Hasn't Fergie already paid a fee for Alcock? Not exactly massive sums in any event, but think the days of us signing Jimmy O'Connor-level players for £175k are long gone. As they are for most league clubs apart from the ones who flaunt FFP rules and get away with it.

FFP is only for wages though isn't it?

All the fees for those players were nominal or undisclosed.

There's still plenty of teams in the football league splashing cash on transfers.

For me it is no coincidence that we are struggling considering how reliant we are on free signings and loans.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Free transfers since we got back into the League include.

Rob Jones
Chris Brown
Richie Wellens (twice)
Paul Green
David Cotterill
Billy Paynter
John Oster
Neil Sulivan
Andy Williams

Money signings include
Sean Thornton
Theo Robinson
Byron Webster
Harry Forrester

Just saying, like.

[Bentley Bullet]

Those days (L**ds play-off) seem a lifetime ago now. I think at this moment in time it's reasonable to assume that sort of investment is a thing of the past.

Now i might be wrong (for once), but I reckon we have a choice of two directions to take;

1) We simply base our budget for players on our home attendances.

or

2) We increase our budget for players in order to increase our home attendances.

[MrFrost]

Free transfers since we got back into the League include.

Rob Jones
Chris Brown
Richie Wellens (twice)
Paul Green
David Cotterill
Billy Paynter
John Oster
Neil Sulivan
Andy Williams

Money signings include
Sean Thornton
Theo Robinson
Byron Webster
Harry Forrester

Just saying, like.

Using examples for your argument I see BST

Money signings also include

Billy Sharp
James Hayter
Matt Mills
Jimmy O Connor
Brian Stock
Paul Heffernan
Gareth Roberts

Just saying like

[wilts rover]

Mr Frost

The team who are 5 points clear at the top of the league, 27 ahead of us, brought in 8 players during the summer, guess how much they paid for these 8 in total? Yes, nothing, they were all free transfers. To strengthen their squad for a promtion push in January they brought in Stephen Bywater. They have four players on loan.

Thats the team 5 points clear at the top of the league, 27 ahead of us, who have got there reliant on free transfers and loans.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Frosty

Missing the point mate. Point being that you've assumed that we can only pick up dross on free transfers and loans. Whereas the record shows that we can and have picked up some all-time greats on free transfers over the past few years.

It's down to the manager's skills and the salaries. Increasingly, at this level, paying mo Ey for signings is fan porn. Makes you feel satisfied but it's not where the real work on building a team goes.

[MrFrost]

Mr Frost

The team who are 5 points clear at the top of the league, 27 ahead of us, brought in 8 players during the summer, guess how much they paid for these 8 in total? Yes, nothing, they were all free transfers. To strengthen their squad for a promtion push in January they brought in Stephen Bywater. They have four players on loan.

Thats the team 5 points clear at the top of the league, 27 ahead of us, who have got there reliant on free transfers and loans.

It isn't working for us though is it?

[MrFrost]

Frosty

Missing the point mate. Point being that you've assumed that we can only pick up dross on free transfers and loans. Whereas the record shows that we can and have picked up some all-time greats on free transfers over the past few years.

It's down to the manager's skills and the salaries. Increasingly, at this level, paying mo Ey for signings is fan porn. Makes you feel satisfied but it's not where the real work on building a team goes.

The last team we had of any real quality at this level was built on a sizeable transfer budget.

The Saunders team was devoid of any real quality.

[BillyStubbsTears]

TRB.

None of the bottom 7 currently has a season long PPG close to 52 points. Only one (Blackpool) is currently on target for more than 47.5 points.

If 52 points ends up being the target, 4 of the bottom 7 are going to have to up their performance significantly over the next 15-17 games. None of them are looking like going so at the moment.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Frosty

Pointless discussion once again. You dismiss a title winning side because it had no quality.

Bye.