Messi

[ravenrover]

It sticks in my throat a bit how everyone goes on about Messi being the GOAT!
He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship
Could he hack it in The Prem or even Seria A week in week out. It’s OK being the GOAT in one league but surely to be called GOAT you should have proved yourself in other major leagues?
Seriously I just dont get it

[Donnywolf]

I think he is a great Player and has been rumoured to have been tapped up by Prem Clubs in the past so they must have fancied him at the time. He was really good in the first leg but never relly got started yesterday and maybe he is reaching his zenith - or he is plain fed up as the rest of the Team are not as good as he is used to.

Still think he is a belting player and I am sure Man U for one would be delighted to have him - maybe swap Pogba for him ?

I take your point of the La Liga standard as well - especially if you take out the big 6 - the rest Getafe Girona et all would struggle in the Championship

[Campsall rover]

It sticks in my throat a bit how everyone goes on about Messi being the GOAT!
He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship
Could he hack it in The Prem or even Seria A week in week out. It’s OK being the GOAT in one league but surely to be called GOAT you should have proved yourself in other major leagues?
Seriously I just dont get it

I can see what your saying but he would still have been brilliant in our Premier League imo.
He wouldn’t score 40+ goals every season though. Ronaldo wasn’t too bad at Man U

[silent majority]

Messi has never performed on the world stage with Argentina either. He's a great player that's for sure, but his performances are enhanced by the league he plays in.

[wing commander]

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

[MachoMadness]

Messi could hack it in any league in the world at any point in history. Easy to forget that Barca were only 3 goals to the good in the first place because of him.

[RoversAlias]

Messi is the best player I've ever seen, he is a maestro with the ball and has carried Barcelona at times. Indeed, they are a great side but they haven't always been that irresistible force during the Messi era. He has really pulled Argentina through in tournaments before too, for them to have made the 2014 World Cup final was something I don't believe they would have been capable of without him.

He would make a fool of the majority of defenders in the Premier League, and his accomplishments and performances against the very best teams, in La Liga and certainly in the Champions League too, stand up against anyone elses.

It's a fallacy, this "could he do it in a tougher league" narrative. La Liga is a good league, the clubs are of a good standard and, although no one hits the level of Barca or Real, there is a very strong core of sides in that tier below that easily match up to the equivalent in England, and I would say outstrips the overall quality found in the other major leagues of Italy, Germany and certainly France, Holland or Portugal.

[NickDRFC]

Messi has phenomenal passing, dribbling, balance, control and vision. He's amongst the best in the world for each of those, and worth the entrance fee to any game just to watch him with the ball at his feet.

On top of that, he has 112 Champions League goals in 135 games and 417 goals in La Liga in 450. Those strike rates are absolutely unbelievable.

He and Ronaldo are on a different planet to everyone else. For me personally, though, Messi's the best. Ronaldo is undoubtedly a supreme athlete, an unreal competitor, a predatory goalscorer, and a natural winner. I think the last bit is why a lot of people rate him as the greatest, but for me football's about so much more than winning (also see point below about Ronaldo being a winner and Messi not). Would I rather be mesmerised by Messi for 50 games a season, or see Ronaldo drag a team to glory? Joga Bonito all the way for me.

PS I think it's a fallacy as well that Ronaldo is a serial winner and Messi not. Messi has also won 10 La Ligas, 6 Copa Del Reys and 4 Champions Leagues. Ronaldo has won 2 La Ligas, 2 Copa Del Reys and 4 Champions Leagues at Real, and has an overall record of 6 league titles, 3 domestic cups and 5 Champions Leagues. He's also 2 and a half years older than Messi.

[NickDRFC]

Messi has never performed on the world stage with Argentina either. He's a great player that's for sure, but his performances are enhanced by the league he plays in.

He got the golden ball at the 2014 World Cup. Admittedly it surprised a few but Argentina would have been nowhere near the final without him, so to say he's "never performed on the world stage" is just wrong. If he was just a flat track bully he wouldn't have such a good record in the CL either.

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

Never understood why people think he's "stayed in his comfort zone" and Ronaldo hasn't. Ronaldo moved from Manchester United to the richest club in the world, and from there onto a team who'd won the Scudetto about 7 times in a row. Ronaldo's moved about but let's not kid ourselves that each move was a surprising challenge. It's not like he's gone to see if he can win Serie A with Lecce is it? Also, Messi obviously loves Barcelona, he's adored by the crowd and he has the opportunity to win a lot there - is it any real surprise that he's not moved on?

[silent majority]

Messi has never performed on the world stage with Argentina either. He's a great player that's for sure, but his performances are enhanced by the league he plays in.

He got the golden ball at the 2014 World Cup. Admittedly it surprised a few but Argentina would have been nowhere near the final without him, so to say he's "never performed on the world stage" is just wrong. If he was just a flat track bully he wouldn't have such a good record in the CL either.

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

Never understood why people think he's "stayed in his comfort zone" and Ronaldo hasn't. Ronaldo moved from Manchester United to the richest club in the world, and from there onto a team who'd won the Scudetto about 7 times in a row. Ronaldo's moved about but let's not kid ourselves that each move was a surprising challenge. It's not like he's gone to see if he can win Serie A with Lecce is it? Also, Messi obviously loves Barcelona, he's adored by the crowd and he has the opportunity to win a lot there - is it any real surprise that he's not moved on?

No, I stand by what I say. He's scored a grand total of 6 goals in World Cups, 4 being in the 2014 tournament and, as you admit, totally unexpected in reaching the final. His goals came against Bosnia, Iran and Nigeria.

I still said he was a great player, but he hasn't performed on the World stage, possibly because the teams he's played in have let him down. There have been moments of brilliance, but as a consistent performer on the World stage? No, not for me.

[IDM]

He’s got better international team mates than George Best had.!!

[Bessie Red]

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

For me it's not really about stats its more to do with who I prefer to watch. I could watch Messi all day long as he plays football in a magical way. Ronaldo although very athletic and a great footballer I could not be bothered stopping what I was doing to watch him!! It's all about opinions & in my opinion Messi wins the argument. Also pro footballers tend to side with Messi in debates about who is the greatest and I'm sure they k ow alot more about what it takes to be the best than any of us!!

[RoversAlias]

Messi has never performed on the world stage with Argentina either. He's a great player that's for sure, but his performances are enhanced by the league he plays in.

He got the golden ball at the 2014 World Cup. Admittedly it surprised a few but Argentina would have been nowhere near the final without him, so to say he's "never performed on the world stage" is just wrong. If he was just a flat track bully he wouldn't have such a good record in the CL either.

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

Never understood why people think he's "stayed in his comfort zone" and Ronaldo hasn't. Ronaldo moved from Manchester United to the richest club in the world, and from there onto a team who'd won the Scudetto about 7 times in a row. Ronaldo's moved about but let's not kid ourselves that each move was a surprising challenge. It's not like he's gone to see if he can win Serie A with Lecce is it? Also, Messi obviously loves Barcelona, he's adored by the crowd and he has the opportunity to win a lot there - is it any real surprise that he's not moved on?

No, I stand by what I say. He's scored a grand total of 6 goals in World Cups, 4 being in the 2014 tournament and, as you admit, totally unexpected in reaching the final. His goals came against Bosnia, Iran and Nigeria.

I still said he was a great player, but he hasn't performed on the World stage, possibly because the teams he's played in have let him down. There have been moments of brilliance, but as a consistent performer on the World stage? No, not for me.

What are the comparative records of Messi and Ronaldo in the World Cup? And perhaps a Copa America/Euros comparison? A good way to judge their respective performance on the so-called "world stage", although again, Messi's achievements individually and for Barcelona speak for themselves in my opinion.

[NickDRFC]

Messi has never performed on the world stage with Argentina either. He's a great player that's for sure, but his performances are enhanced by the league he plays in.

He got the golden ball at the 2014 World Cup. Admittedly it surprised a few but Argentina would have been nowhere near the final without him, so to say he's "never performed on the world stage" is just wrong. If he was just a flat track bully he wouldn't have such a good record in the CL either.

   That's why whenever the question is asked who is best Ronaldo or Messi for me it's Ronaldo everyday of the week..

   Ronaldo's stats maybe aren't quite as good as Messi's over his career but he's proven himself in La Liga,premiership and Serie A..Messi has been happy to spend his career in his own comfort zone at Barca playing only 6 or 7 really competitive games a year..

Never understood why people think he's "stayed in his comfort zone" and Ronaldo hasn't. Ronaldo moved from Manchester United to the richest club in the world, and from there onto a team who'd won the Scudetto about 7 times in a row. Ronaldo's moved about but let's not kid ourselves that each move was a surprising challenge. It's not like he's gone to see if he can win Serie A with Lecce is it? Also, Messi obviously loves Barcelona, he's adored by the crowd and he has the opportunity to win a lot there - is it any real surprise that he's not moved on?

No, I stand by what I say. He's scored a grand total of 6 goals in World Cups, 4 being in the 2014 tournament and, as you admit, totally unexpected in reaching the final. His goals came against Bosnia, Iran and Nigeria.

I still said he was a great player, but he hasn't performed on the World stage, possibly because the teams he's played in have let him down. There have been moments of brilliance, but as a consistent performer on the World stage? No, not for me.

What are the comparative records of Messi and Ronaldo in the World Cup? And perhaps a Copa America/Euros comparison? A good way to judge their respective performance on the so-called "world stage", although again, Messi's achievements individually and for Barcelona speak for themselves in my opinion.

SM - you're now saying that he's not a consistent performer on the world stage - very different to he's never performed on the world stage. He was named the best player at the World Cup - hardly indicative of someone who's never done it for anyone other than Barcelona.

RA - I'd imagine that Ronaldo has a better record but I don't think it would be that much better. Judging those two on that is daft though - presumably those that belittle Messi's (or Ronaldo's) achievements because they haven't done it "on the world stage" think that Kane is a better player than both given he's got a golden boot to his name?

[andysly]

Ok.
Which one would you have at Donny next season

[MachoMadness]

Even though I prefer Messi as a player I think Ronaldo would do a better job for us. Bigger, more physical, and more direct. Get the offer on the table, bloody shite Bramhall.

[Campsall rover]

Ok.
Which one would you have at Donny next season

Silly question. Both of them of course 

[drfchound]

Both Ronaldo and Messi are up there as the best in the world over the last few years.
Nothing between them in my eyes.
However, the greatest player I have seen is George Best.

[scawsby steve]

Both Ronaldo and Messi are up there as the best in the world over the last few years.
Nothing between them in my eyes.
However, the greatest player I have seen is George Best.

The greatest I've seen is Alick at 17 years old. He just had everything.

[ravenrover]

I look at the lIkes of Lineker a proven goalscorer in England went to Barca and still scored plenty. Obviously not classed as GOAT but carried on his trade in another country. This is why Messi good footballer that he is can't be considered as GOAT in my opinion he has never proved himself outside of Spain, and for me you can forget about International football as a yardstick

[GazLaz]

Messi is an absolutely unbelievable player.

[sha66y]

Messy Goat ..............kidding

[andysly]

Even though I prefer Messi as a player I think Ronaldo would do a better job for us. Bigger, more physical, and more direct. Get the offer on the table, bloody shite Bramhall.

Pretty much exactly my thoughts.

[Bentley Bullet]

Both Ronaldo and Messi are up there as the best in the world over the last few years.
Nothing between them in my eyes.
However, the greatest player I have seen is George Best.

The greatest I've seen is Alick at 17 years old. He just had everything.

As for the greatest of all time Rover, I suspect that opinion depends on the age of the supporter. Some of the younger fans who never saw Alick would claim it's Billy Sharp.

So, to be fair to the younger generation of supporters I'd say:

20th century= Alick Goat
21st century = Billy Goat

[Donnywolf]

Both Ronaldo and Messi are up there as the best in the world over the last few years.
Nothing between them in my eyes.
However, the greatest player I have seen is George Best.

The greatest I've seen is Alick at 17 years old. He just had everything.

As for the greatest of all time Rover, I suspect that opinion depends on the age of the supporter. Some of the younger fans who never saw Alick would claim it's Billy Sharp.

So, to be fair to the younger generation of supporters I'd say:

20th century= Alick Goat (Ive heard it said a few times)
21st century = Billy Goat

[DonnyOsmond]

It sticks in my throat a bit how everyone goes on about Messi being the GOAT!
He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship
Could he hack it in The Prem or even Seria A week in week out. It’s OK being the GOAT in one league but surely to be called GOAT you should have proved yourself in other major leagues?
Seriously I just dont get it

https://twitter.com/PeriodicoWarca/status/1119204487628038144?s=19

4th most goals against the top 6, when he doesn't even play in England but yeah  he'd be shit in England.

[NewDonny]

It sticks in my throat a bit how everyone goes on about Messi being the GOAT!
He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship
Could he hack it in The Prem or even Seria A week in week out. It’s OK being the GOAT in one league but surely to be called GOAT you should have proved yourself in other major leagues?
Seriously I just dont get it

He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship

Seriously, you think the quality of La Liga is no better than the English Championship, are you mad, the technical ability of players in that league, even the poorer sides is light years ahead the Championship in this country and you are deluded to think otherwise.

[ravenrover]

Both Ronaldo and Messi are up there as the best in the world over the last few years.
Nothing between them in my eyes.
However, the greatest player I have seen is George Best.

The greatest I've seen is Alick at 17 years old. He just had everything.

As for the greatest of all time Rover, I suspect that opinion depends on the age of the supporter. Some of the younger fans who never saw Alick would claim it's Billy Sharp.

So, to be fair to the younger generation of supporters I'd say:

20th century= Alick Goat
21st century = Billy Goat

Why bring me into this one BB?

[ravenrover]

It sticks in my throat a bit how everyone goes on about Messi being the GOAT!
He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship
Could he hack it in The Prem or even Seria A week in week out. It’s OK being the GOAT in one league but surely to be called GOAT you should have proved yourself in other major leagues?
Seriously I just dont get it

He is playing in a league that with the exception of 3-4 clubs is no better than the Championship

Seriously, you think the quality of La Liga is no better than the English Championship, are you mad, the technical ability of players in that league, even the poorer sides is light years ahead the Championship in this country and you are deluded to think otherwise.

It's either me or thee then, and maybe one or two others

[Red wizard]

Messi would not and I repeat would not perform like he does week in week out at Barca in the prem. When you play 2 3 games per week and have to be on top of your game every week getting knocks and playing on like you have to over here. Even pep didn't realise how tough it was going to be and he has said that. His first season  showed him that. Still a great player but he isn't the athlete Ronaldo is. And that's why he's never come to play in the best league in the world.