NHS

[SydneyRover]

We all know the risks to the NHS but you should identify the risk with Corbyn's foreign policy so we know what you mean?

[DonnyOsmond]

We all know the risks to the NHS but you should identify the risk with Corbyn's foreign policy so we know what you mean?

Must be the hypothetical he's going to pally up with terrorists. It's not like how we've been supplying Saudis for years while they've massacred Yemenis.

[hoolahoop]

The problem is most people know that the nhs needs sorting out, I’m not saying privatise it but something needs to change, you could throw 10 billion a year extra at it and it still would not be right

Trouble is that if you are a leaver, when you back Johnson because of that, you also buy in to the sale and break up of the NHS.

I would guess that most leavers also want to keep and support the NHS, without moving to a US insurance based system.

Same point about other policy choices, which is why a GE focussed on brexit comes with a package many will find unacceptable.

So what to do!

What to do?

Isn’t that why we have politicians ?

I thought it was only the " will of the people on 1 day in 2016 " that REALLY  mattered

[hoolahoop]

Vote in HoC tonight on privatisation in the NHS.

Corbyn proposed it should be halted, but the proposal fell.
Swindleson and the LibDems did not support it;
https://evolvepolitics.com/jo-swinsons-lib-dems-refuse-to-support-motion-to-halt-nhs-privatisation/

Unreal, unless she is angling for a new coalition with Johnson after a GE.
After all, the last coalition worked so well!

Albie perhaps you can enlighten me as to what effect Lib/ Dem votes would have made here . Would it mean that the NHS would be safe in the hands of the Tories had they have voted with Labour  ? .....OF COURSE NOT .

YOU are making something out of nothing here , don't let reality get in the way of your prejudice will you . It's obvious that a Party that is unequivocally against Brexit and any privatisation of the NHS - IS FOR THE NHS

[SydneyRover]

brexit is a magic turd Hoola, it has been said that you can squeeze and shape it into anything you want it to be as it's been 'sold' to the masses as a cure-all. It is brightly coloured like cluster bomb fragments and coated in sugar but will blow up in the face of anyone without 'means' in the years to come.

[bpoolrover]

We all know the risks to the NHS but you should identify the risk with Corbyn's foreign policy so we know what you mean?

Must be the hypothetical he's going to pally up with terrorists. It's not like how we've been supplying Saudis for years while they've massacred Yemenis.

to be be fair he did call hezbollah his friends

[SydneyRover]

So what are the risks to foreign policy?

[bpoolrover]

Well calling hamas and hezbollah friends would be a risk to start, in the morning I will put some of your famous links up mate as there are quite a few that question them

[albie]

Hoola,

You are right that the LD decision to abstain made no real difference to the outcome.
That was not my point.

IMO the reason the LD's did not commit is that they are paving the way for a new LD/Tory coalition if we get a hung parliament.

They are avoiding a statement of support for the NHS so that it can't be quoted back if they sign up with Johnson to the trade deal Trump wants to see.

A point of principle is unhelpful if you want to preserve full wriggle room.
As always, I could be wrong.

We might find out after Dec 12!

[SydneyRover]

Well calling hamas and hezbollah friends would be a risk to start, in the morning I will put some of your famous links up mate as there are quite a few that question them

I think you need to get your facts right first bp as you don't appear to grasp the context in which the word 'friends' was used, so maybe you could show some initiative and dig out what Corbyn actually said, when he said and the context before you go any further.

[bpoolrover]

Lol I don’t need to dig out anything, how do you know what context it was said in? You only know what he has said, you believe him if you like I won’t no problem, none of us can prove it either way

[SydneyRover]

lol? watch this and then write 100 times don't believe all you read in the tabloids.

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4News/videos/10153074175846939/

[bpoolrover]

That’s just his him getting round it lol means nothing what so ever

[bpoolrover]

If a Tory mp had said that then said what Corbyn said you would rip them to pieces, you would not just accept what he said as being true

[SydneyRover]

What it actually means is you didn't watch as you haven't had time, yeah I know you've seen it before but you allow shallow journalism to give you an opinion instead of reading and learning from many sources and then having an informed opinion, mate

[bpoolrover]

No your just taking his word for it, if boris had said it then said what Jc had said would you believe him?

[bpoolrover]

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrP4lHa6bhdknsAamp0g81Q;_ylu=X3oDMTByZzJoOXByBGNvbG8DaXIyBHBvcwM0BHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--/RV=2/RE=1572428378/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fnews.sky.com%2fstory%2fsalisbury-attack-jeremy-corbyn-accused-of-appeasement-towards-russia-11289753/RK=2/RS=sUZYn9GVoOdn5GgR6XR9Wvmh1OU- A bad way of going about things again

[SydneyRover]

remind what this got to do with the 'friends' discussion or have you abandoned that, mate

[bpoolrover]

I’ve already answered you on that, but yes I’ve abandoned it as there I as no proof either way to prove it, so we will keep going round in circles and there is no point really

[SydneyRover]

I’ve already answered you on that

no you haven't you just said ner ner ner, which really doesn't mean anything.

ADDED:Are you related to Bentley, just asking?

[bpoolrover]

Are you related to Vladimir? Just asking

[SydneyRover]

dammit I knew you'd be the one to out me

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hoola.

I worry that you haven't learned from 2010.

The LDs like to paint themselves as being a party of the soft left, but you know exactly what happened in 2010 when they had to make a choice.

They CHOSE to sign up to the most devastating and destructive hard right economic policy since the 1930s.

They CHOSE to enable Austerity and all the shite that has followed it.

I don't understand how anyone who leans left could ever even consider voting LD in a GE again after that.

[wilts rover]

I came upon this today and thought it worth sharing. You can make up your own minds as to what it tells you about the priorities and policies of the last 3 Tory governments. And what might change under Corbyn or Johnson.

https://twitter.com/FromSteveHowell/status/1190215004596948992

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wilts.

Doesn't that just perfectly capture the Tory philosophy?

They used to get away with it by having a reputation for general good economic management. They used to pride themselves on being competent hard headed bas**rds.

 But this decade has been the most spectacular failure of economic management. The worst decade of growth for over 150 years.

Now they are incompetent grabbing bas**rds.

How does anyone from round here even begin to contemplate voting for them?

[wilts rover]

And you and I and many others on this board know there is a lot more where that came from. We probably wont change many minds. But we will let them know what they are voting for...

[BillyStubbsTears]

There IS a lot more to come Wilts.

Here's one example. While the wealth of the richest 100 people in the country has been exploding under the Tories, this is what's happened to average wages for the rest of us, once you allow for inflation.



It's there. Right in front of you in those two graphs folks.

[BillyStubbsTears]

A bit of context to that average weekly earnings figure. This extends the time backwards to see what happened under Blair and Brown.

Of course, folk will say "well wages had to come down because of the Great Crash".

But look at how Labour had stabilised the fall before the 2010 election. And look at how first Austerity, then the Brexit vote hit us.

And, if wages had to fall, how come the richest 1000 have ween their wealth rise by getting on for 200% while the rest of us have had a decade of Tory-imposed wealth loss?

You want to know why the political debate is so toxic these days? It's there. In that graph. a decade of folk working hard and going backwards because of the economic stupidity and greed of the Tories.

[BillyStubbsTears]

After every recession, even the hardest ones, if we manage the recovery correctly, wage growth returns to pre-recession rates. If we hadn't made the once in a lifetime calamitous mistake of Austerity in 2010, average wages ought to have been something like £600-650 per week now.

The fact that they aren't means that, on average, everyone working has lost something between £30-50,000 in income over the past decade under this set of thieves. While their wealthy mates have been coining it in.

And we have idiots in here saying that Labour always hammers the working man. Give me strength.

[drfchound]

Clearly, since 2014, according to those graphs, we are in recovery mode.

Again, with no political allegiance, am I right in saying that whoever was in power after the global crash would have had difficulty in stabilising the fall.

Also, would Labour opposition say that we were inevitably in another boom and bust period leading to the big crash?
The graph shows a fall in average wages lasting around three years before Labour were voted out and a further three to four years to fix the damage.

As for the top 100 getting richer, come on BST, most people know that money makes money.
I doubt that you are skint and even during Austerity you will have done allright.