Just how long HAS Rishi been plotting to take No 10?

[Bentley Bullet]

BST, I've given you one example already and you refuse to accept it. Others have given you other examples and you refuse to accept them. if I or anyone else gave you more examples of his lies or his fellow party members lies, you would continue to refuse to accept them.

You continue to live in a dream world of make-believe, it's no skin off my nose.

[selby]

  Every time the  t**t  caught the train at Waterloo station to go to Brussels, A quisling, a 5th columnist, who was hell bent on undermining a referendum vote by the  population of the UK.
  A stabber in the back, not to be trusted, a waste of breath.

[tyke1962]

  Every time the  t**t  caught the train at Waterloo station to go to Brussels, A quisling, a 5th columnist, who was hell bent on undermining a referendum vote by the  population of the UK.
  A stabber in the back, not to be trusted, a waste of breath.

Be fair Selby at least a tyt is useful .

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wrong Ldr. So, so wrong if you think Objective Truth doesn't matter.

Do you think it doesn't matter when Johnson stared down a camera and said that crime was down 14%, when in fact the number of recorded crimes had INCREASED by 14%? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60250678

Do you think it doesn't matter when Johnson repeatedly said the Tories were going to build 40 new hospitals, then had his Health Secretary instruct civil servants to refer to re-fits and renovations, and building new PARTS of a hospital as "new hospitals"?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/59372348

Do you think it doesn't matter when Johnson lied about a matter, then lied about correcting the lie? https://boris-johnson-lies.com/i-think-i-took-steps-to-correct-the-record-earlier

And on, and on, and on. This isn't about ducking and diving. about changing positions on policies. You can hold politicians to account for that by questioning them and deciding whether you agree with their positions and ideas. This is entirely different. It's about destroying the basic foundation of truth that any discussion has to be based on. You KNOW where that leads. Or you should do if you think about it for a moment instead of making lazy smart-arse remarks.

[Ldr]

I condemn unreservedly lying by Boris Johnson

TRUTH matters Billy, all truth not just your argument of “Objective Truth” you, however, seem content to accept Starmers lies.

Maybe you don’t have the principles you like to portray?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Ldr.

There are objective facts which are undeniable.

Today is Tuesday.

The sun is 93 million miles away.

Boris Johnson couldn't give a f**k about COVID rules.

These facts are unarguable, and acceptance of them forms the basis for any logically based exchange. Denying Objective Truths makes any exchange of views literally meaningless, because you can just choose to invent your own convenient reality.

I'll say again what I've been saying for years. No politician until very recently EVER lied on matters of Objective Truth and survived the day.

On the other hand, there are policies, opinions, interpretations where someone can be flip their position. You can denounce that as untrustworthy, even untruthful if you want. But if you denounce every politician who does that, you'll end up with no-one left.

Because politics is a messy, massively imperfect process. Where people who genuinely want to change society, often for idealistic, committed reasons, run into the difficulty of reality, where if they are always entirely open, it will be used against them.

You can choose not to vote for someone who does the latter, although you'll go a long way to find someone to vote for in that case

What you really can't do is equate the two issues of "truthfullness". The two issues of  aren't remotely comparable.

[Ldr]

Truth is truth Billy, I’m sad your so desperate that you will condone it in Starmer. I always thought you were a man of integrity?

[belton rover]

Truth is truth Billy, I’m sad your so desperate that you will condone it in Starmer. I always thought you were a man of integrity?

Did you really, LDR? Have you really only just noticed?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wrong Ldr.
If Starmer starts outright lying, I will condemn him. As I would any politician.

When he ducks and dives and dissembles, flips policies and changes position, I will judge him as I judge all politicians.

Feel free to find any examples of Starmer lying over some matter of fact.

Equally, feel free to find me an example of any successful politician  who had never ducked and dived and been less than straight.

[drfchound]

Wrong Ldr.
If Starmer starts outright lying, I will condemn him. As I would any politician.

When he ducks and dives and dissembles, flips policies and changes position, I will judge him as I judge all politicians.

Feel free to find any examples of Starmer lying over some matter of fact.

Equally, feel free to find me an example of any successful politician  who had never ducked and dived and been less than straight.

More confirmation of all the same.  Thank you.

[drfchound]

Wrong Ldr.
If Starmer starts outright lying, I will condemn him. As I would any politician.

When he ducks and dives and dissembles, flips policies and changes position, I will judge him as I judge all politicians.

Feel free to find any examples of Starmer lying over some matter of fact.

Equally, feel free to find me an example of any successful politician  who had never ducked and dived and been less than straight.

More confirmation of all the same.  Thank you.

Coooeeee.

[SydneyRover]

To be fair some of you could put Boris Johnson in a labour rosette and you'd support him.  There's not much it any substance from any of the candidates yet, I'm sure that will come.

More of this nonsense.

There's never, ever been a person in any other party who has lied like Johnson.

You have no grounds whatsoever for saying that, because Johnson's lies were ignored by this Tory party, they'd be ignored by other parties.

You are assuming, with no evidence that the Labour party is as morally bankrupt as this Tory party. It's this normalisation. Of previously unacceptable stances that I've been banging on about for years. 10 years ago you'd have thought it unbelievable that ANY party would embrace a liar like Johnson. Now it's just blithely asserted that any party would.

There are people around who would vote for a party no matter what and hate the opposition whatever, you know it aswell as I do, you can't deny that. The rest of us flip flop largely based on our own circumstances and thoughts.

Have we not been here before about who you vote for pud? I think your answer was that for GEs you have always flopped but never flipped in the current context. Correct me if incorrect.

In a way I prefer bb's commentary, it's straight forward he votes tory no matter what, that he can't tell you why without mentioning labour is another matter, wouldn't it be good for a tory voter to occasionally come out and say ................ 'I vote tory for these reasons x, y, z' but they don't, why? because it wouldn't stand up to scrutiny so they use labour as a prop.

[danumdon]

Ldr.

There are objective facts which are undeniable.

Today is Tuesday.

The sun is 93 million miles away.

Boris Johnson couldn't give a f**k about COVID rules.

These facts are unarguable, and acceptance of them forms the basis for any logically based exchange. Denying Objective Truths makes any exchange of views literally meaningless, because you can just choose to invent your own convenient reality.

I'll say again what I've been saying for years. No politician until very recently EVER lied on matters of Objective Truth and survived the day.

On the other hand, there are policies, opinions, interpretations where someone can be flip their position. You can denounce that as untrustworthy, even untruthful if you want. But if you denounce every politician who does that, you'll end up with no-one left.

Because politics is a messy, massively imperfect process. Where people who genuinely want to change society, often for idealistic, committed reasons, run into the difficulty of reality, where if they are always entirely open, it will be used against them.

You can choose not to vote for someone who does the latter, although you'll go a long way to find someone to vote for in that case

What you really can't do is equate the two issues of "truthfullness". The two issues of  aren't remotely comparable.

Quite pathetic really, your constant pandering about Johnson in this argument about the integrity of Starmer is quite revealing in your partisan approach to it all.

We ALL know what Johnson is, you don't need to keep using him as an example to try to make Starmer look presentable, two wrongs don;t make a right even when you bleat on that it does.

All this nonsense about ducking and diving and no politician ever got anywhere without being a bit savvy. Just admit it to yourself BST, Starmer is cut from the same cloth and is not to be trusted.

We're talking about a man who made it his life's work to walk back a democratic vote and did his utmost to connive and plot with his cronies in the EU to cause this country(his own country) the maximum harassment in their negotiations with a mendacious EU.

To top it all off he now expects the country to forget his 2 years of desperation and his championing of a fixed and corrupt speaker and parliament to now agree with him that his policy is now what he states.

Nobody believes him or the desperate agitators who try to promote him and manage to convince no one.

If i now wait for a short time, numb nuts will be along shortly to offer up some asinine crud for his buddy.

[SydneyRover]

So I guess you'll never vote tory again, if you have ever voted dd because they have collectively broken the law ans lied to queenie.

[SydneyRover]

''Footage resurfaces of Rishi Sunak who was fined for attending lockdown parties saying he didn't''

https://www.indy100.com/news/rishi-sunak-attended-lockdown-parties

[danumdon]

So I guess you'll never vote tory again, if you have ever voted dd because they have collectively broken the law ans lied to queenie.

Christ , i thought you may just give it a min or two.

What are you blaterhing on about now, no one's bothered about what Johnson did, hes todays chip paper, he wont be the first or the last to do so.

You on the other hand are so prdictable, nearly as a good as a robotic troll.

[SydneyRover]

So I guess you'll never vote tory again, if you have ever voted dd because they have collectively broken the law ans lied to queenie.

Christ , i thought you may just give it a min or two.

What are you blaterhing on about now, no one's bothered about what Johnson did, hes todays chip paper, he wont be the first or the last to do so.

You on the other hand are so prdictable, nearly as a good as a robotic troll.

Then the leadership contest must be one of those figments dd? is this how you see the future, it's ok guys it's safe now all is forgiven, you don't appear to be able to forget something that Starmer hasn't even done ffs, unless you want to tell us where he deliberately lied.

by the way have you ever voted in a GE?

[SydneyRover]

busadvertising

I accidentally attended an illegal gathering ........... then I lied about it in parliament.

I'm just like you.

Rishi.

Vote tory

[danumdon]

So I guess you'll never vote tory again, if you have ever voted dd because they have collectively broken the law ans lied to queenie.

Christ , i thought you may just give it a min or two.

What are you blaterhing on about now, no one's bothered about what Johnson did, hes todays chip paper, he wont be the first or the last to do so.

You on the other hand are so prdictable, nearly as a good as a robotic troll.

Then the leadership contest must be one of those figments dd? is this how you see the future, it's ok guys it's safe now all is forgiven, you don't appear to be able to forget something that Starmer hasn't even done ffs, unless you want to tell us where he deliberately lied.

by the way have you ever voted in a GE?

We all know what Johnson did and is, why would we now waste any time on this imbecile, no ones going to forgive him.we move on.

Starmer attempted to high jack the democratic will of the country and not allow it to run its course, if you want to have influence you first have to have the consent of the electorate, Starmer had neither, that's why no one trusts him.

I've voted in every GE i've been able to and i'll be having an influence and voting in the next, unlike some eh.

[SydneyRover]

So you cannot find a single example of Starmer deliberately lying dd, thank you for confirming that.

[danumdon]

So you cannot find a single example of Starmer deliberately lying dd, thank you for confirming that.

Ive called Starmer many things but i dont recall having to justify if he deliberatly lied, to you or anyone.

Thank you for confirming that your a wally.

[SydneyRover]

You don't have to do anything dd, which shows with you comments over time. Can't wait for your next essay.

[SydneyRover]

Penny Mordaunt FRSA VR

Did you know 'Dame Angela Lansbury is her grandmother's cousin''

more on a need-to-know basis

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penny_Mordaunt

[ravenrover]

Does it really matter which of this shower is appointed  they are all  of a muchness. What really matters to me is that competent people are put in the key positions of Cabinet and not the current bunch of no hopers

[SydneyRover]

Unfortunately it does matter RR, as everyone has witnessed this bunch of spineless losers being willingly led into ditching all morals and being more than willing partners into breaking international and local laws.

I was just following orders doesn't cut it

[SydneyRover]

I think most would agree even tory supporters that there is a dearth of talent at the top table, the party needs to sort itself out but not at the expense of everyone else.

[albie]

So you cannot find a single example of Starmer deliberately lying dd, thank you for confirming that.

Sorry Syd, but there are many examples of Starmer lying.

For example, saying on Twitter that candidates should not be imposed on local parties, then doing exactly that in Wakefield and Stroud, leading to local members resigning.

[drfchound]

But it was an honest mistake.

[ravenrover]

Unfortunately it does matter RR, as everyone has witnessed this bunch of spineless losers being willingly led into ditching all morals and being more than willing partners into breaking international and local laws.

I was just following orders doesn't cut it

Which is why whoever gets it surrounds themselves with competent Ministers, which limits the chaos the man or woman at the top can cause

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

To be fair some of you could put Boris Johnson in a labour rosette and you'd support him.  There's not much it any substance from any of the candidates yet, I'm sure that will come.

More of this nonsense.

There's never, ever been a person in any other party who has lied like Johnson.

You have no grounds whatsoever for saying that, because Johnson's lies were ignored by this Tory party, they'd be ignored by other parties.

You are assuming, with no evidence that the Labour party is as morally bankrupt as this Tory party. It's this normalisation. Of previously unacceptable stances that I've been banging on about for years. 10 years ago you'd have thought it unbelievable that ANY party would embrace a liar like Johnson. Now it's just blithely asserted that any party would.

There are people around who would vote for a party no matter what and hate the opposition whatever, you know it aswell as I do, you can't deny that. The rest of us flip flop largely based on our own circumstances and thoughts.

Have we not been here before about who you vote for pud? I think your answer was that for GEs you have always flopped but never flipped in the current context. Correct me if incorrect.

In a way I prefer bb's commentary, it's straight forward he votes tory no matter what, that he can't tell you why without mentioning labour is another matter, wouldn't it be good for a tory voter to occasionally come out and say ................ 'I vote tory for these reasons x, y, z' but they don't, why? because it wouldn't stand up to scrutiny so they use labour as a prop.

Prefer what you like, I'm 34 the number of elections i have voted in is pretty small.