truss

[BillyStubbsTears]

Surely you'd just extend the term?  Anyone on a fix should be looking to do that now and pay the money in to a savings account of some form.

It will be interesting to see what labour propose.  It appears they wouldn't reverse the cuts to 19% and national insurance but the 45% cut they would. Not sure that their policies are that much radically different from what I've heard so far.

Do the maths.

For a £150k repayment mortgage, extending the term from 25 years to FORTY years saves you less than £2k per year. So in this example, someone still has to find another £5k per year. And they are shelling out for another 15 years.

There's no avoiding it. There's an absolute disaster coming down the line.

[drfchound]

In the above case the lender might only be paying for an extra 15 years if the mortgage rate didn’t come down of course.
And potentially they could pay off chunks of outstanding loan as their personal finances improved over the years.

On the dark side of this though, I heard today from a family member who works at the Halifax that they have opened an office in Yorkshire (Sheffield I think) that will employ 300 people specifically to deal with repossessions.

[ravenrover]

Why wasn't fuel duty cut or even mentioned?

Cutting fuel duty would have led to everyone benefitting and not just the wealthy.

Not those that done buy fuel. We need to reduce fuel use not increase it.

So reduce in duty has no effect  on say goods distribution by road or bus users prices stay stable or possibly reduce  You don't have to be the buyer of fuel to benefit there are indirect benefits

[Branton Red]

Incredulous!

Government borrowing has necessarily increased massively firstly due to Covid now due to the energy crisis. Who is ultimately going to pay for this?

Not the richest with the broadest shoulders.

Removing the 45% tax band alone means someone on a £1m salary will save £42,500 per year in income tax - a saving 50% higher than the gross average salary in the UK.

Simply despicable.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Tories gonna Tory.

Although in fairness, they've rarely ever been as explicit as this in waging Class War on behalf of the rich.

Yesterday's announcement had the feel of a payback clause being actioned by all the wealthy folk who have bankrolled the Tories in general and Truss in particular. The breathtaking audacity of it is quite admirable in some sense.

One thing's sure. Any working class person now has zero excuse for telling themselves the Tories are on their side. Although in sure a few will try to find one.

[Panda]

Rarely agree with Billy but this post is as accurate as it gets.

I hate Labour with a passion but there really is no option left but to put aside pride and principle and to lend my vote Labour to get these evil parasites out of office.

This mini budget proves beyond doubt that the Tories think ordinary people are stupid. Trying to create the illusion that it is people's best interests in the long run to make rich people richer and poor people poorer. Payback time in the next election for these shitehouses.

[no eyed deer]

Rarely agree with Billy but this post is as accurate as it gets.

I hate Labour with a passion but there really is no option left but to put aside pride and principle and to lend my vote Labour to get these evil parasites out of office.

This mini budget proves beyond doubt that the Tories think ordinary people are stupid. Trying to create the illusion that it is people's best interests in the long run to make rich people richer and poor people poorer. Payback time in the next election for these shitehouses.

Never have I voted Labour.... but they get my vote next time.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Just imagine the reaction if a Labour Chancellor had presented a new fiscal plan, with zero attempt to have an independent costing, and the markets had reacted by the Pound dropping 4% and the interest rate that Govt pays on debt increasing by the most in a single day for 31 years.

Just close your eyes and try to imagine it.

As I was saying.

https://twitter.com/GavinBarwell/status/1573196526729498624?s=20&t=Tgpn70vm-C76Nzfqsv_VPQ

This is a dyed in the wool Tory by the way. May's Chief of Staff.

[SydneyRover]

For the record, I entirely agree that we desperately need stronger growth. Been saying that ever since the Austerity disaster. But the way to do that is by Govt investment in high quality education, training and capital infrastructure. Not giving away billions to people who already have plenty.

I agree actually listening to the statement this morning.

45% tax cut - utterly unnecessary.
20% cut to 19% - fine with that to a point though I still preferred increasing the tax thresholds.
NI Cut - should never have been done in the first place, fix the tax policy as a whole.
Stamp duty changes - can see the logic given interest rates, seems sensible enough.
CT hold - massive for businesses actually and that's one that can stimulate growth so seems sensible.
Enterprise zones - make good sense on paper, be interesting to see the details and if it helps unlock the potential of areas like ours.

Overall the handouts are too generic, they don't necessarily stimulate growth all that well and I doubt they'll work personally.  All I see some of it doing is enabling those who are better off to cream more money from the higher interest rates.  I'm not at all sure it's targeted enough.  Rishi Sunak was wrong to want to put bigger tax increases in, Liz Truss has took it too far.

I'd still like to get your thoughts on the enterprise zones pud, if I remember correctly the previous ones launched in 1984 and were closed by the gov't in 2012.

[ncRover]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

[drfchound]

The Labour conference might give us an idea of what they propose to do to improve the situation.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

You think Labour would deal with this situation by giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest, releasing the cap on bankers'bonuses, allowing fracking while banning wind farms and solar farms, cutting income tax and keeping VATat 20% etc, etc?

I suggest that's some seriously impressive Bothsides Koolaid you're drinking there.

[ncRover]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

You think Labour would deal with this situation by giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest, releasing the cap on bankers'bonuses, allowing fracking while banning wind farms and solar farms, cutting income tax and keeping VATat 20% etc, etc?

I suggest that's some seriously impressive Bothsides Koolaid you're drinking there.

Labour wouldn’t have prevented brexit, lockdowns or the Ukraine invasion. They were also complaining about the Tories high taxes a matter of months ago.

I think VAT should have been cut to get people spending. But don’t really see the harm in anything else. Let’s see how it plays out in a non-partisan way. This way of growing the economy is tried and tested.

No need for intrusive countryside wind farms if we’re going nuclear. Wind farms getting expanded at sea instead where nobody lives, surely you and our wildlife would prefer that?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Growing the economy from where we currently are by giving tax cuts massively skewed to the wealthy is absolutely not tried and tested.

[Filo]

Hedge fund managers had dinner earlier in the week with the Chancellor, days later the same managers made a killing shorting the pound when the Chancellor tanked the pound, insider trading?

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

For the record, I entirely agree that we desperately need stronger growth. Been saying that ever since the Austerity disaster. But the way to do that is by Govt investment in high quality education, training and capital infrastructure. Not giving away billions to people who already have plenty.

I agree actually listening to the statement this morning.

45% tax cut - utterly unnecessary.
20% cut to 19% - fine with that to a point though I still preferred increasing the tax thresholds.
NI Cut - should never have been done in the first place, fix the tax policy as a whole.
Stamp duty changes - can see the logic given interest rates, seems sensible enough.
CT hold - massive for businesses actually and that's one that can stimulate growth so seems sensible.
Enterprise zones - make good sense on paper, be interesting to see the details and if it helps unlock the potential of areas like ours.

Overall the handouts are too generic, they don't necessarily stimulate growth all that well and I doubt they'll work personally.  All I see some of it doing is enabling those who are better off to cream more money from the higher interest rates.  I'm not at all sure it's targeted enough.  Rishi Sunak was wrong to want to put bigger tax increases in, Liz Truss has took it too far.

I'd still like to get your thoughts on the enterprise zones pud, if I remember correctly the previous ones launched in 1984 and were closed by the gov't in 2012.

Not much I can say about 1984 I wasn't born!

As you say, you've ran a business where are you going to invest.  Somewhere with business rates relief, lower tax contributions and tax breaks or somewhere without?  It clearly helps if used in the right way to get places like south Yorkshire moving forwards.

[ravenrover]

Was it on here I read that Tory is derived from the Irish for bandit or robber?

[Glyn_Wigley]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

You think Labour would deal with this situation by giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest, releasing the cap on bankers'bonuses, allowing fracking while banning wind farms and solar farms, cutting income tax and keeping VATat 20% etc, etc?

I suggest that's some seriously impressive Bothsides Koolaid you're drinking there.

Labour wouldn’t have prevented brexit, lockdowns or the Ukraine invasion. They were also complaining about the Tories high taxes a matter of months ago.

I think VAT should have been cut to get people spending. But don’t really see the harm in anything else. Let’s see how it plays out in a non-partisan way. This way of growing the economy is tried and tested.

No need for intrusive countryside wind farms if we’re going nuclear. Wind farms getting expanded at sea instead where nobody lives, surely you and our wildlife would prefer that?

Labour wouldn't have been panicked into having a referendum by UKIP eating into their voting base in the first place.

[SydneyRover]

I'll put your quote here pud so it doesn't get overly large

''Enterprise zones - make good sense on paper, be interesting to see the details and if it helps unlock the potential of areas like ours''

Can you expand on what you've read then, it would be good to get your input.

A few things to think about are for me is what would the main focus be, financials-manufacturing or both? would a SEZ draw wealth creation to it but away from other areas that badly need it? would those working inside the zone have there employment rights protected?

At a glance it could be seen as the government admitting failure of brexit and the global britain fantasy.

[ncRover]

Growing the economy from where we currently are by giving tax cuts massively skewed to the wealthy is absolutely not tried and tested.

Way more so than Corbyn’s politics, did you vote for him?

The model itself is tried and tested. We can’t predict the future, so let’s see. I’m sure even if it’s positive you’ll have your own negative slant on it anyway.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Enterprise zones do precisely zero to grow the economy. There's tonnes of evidence on that. What they do is to move economic activity from one place to another.

[ncRover]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

You think Labour would deal with this situation by giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest, releasing the cap on bankers'bonuses, allowing fracking while banning wind farms and solar farms, cutting income tax and keeping VATat 20% etc, etc?

I suggest that's some seriously impressive Bothsides Koolaid you're drinking there.

Labour wouldn’t have prevented brexit, lockdowns or the Ukraine invasion. They were also complaining about the Tories high taxes a matter of months ago.

I think VAT should have been cut to get people spending. But don’t really see the harm in anything else. Let’s see how it plays out in a non-partisan way. This way of growing the economy is tried and tested.

No need for intrusive countryside wind farms if we’re going nuclear. Wind farms getting expanded at sea instead where nobody lives, surely you and our wildlife would prefer that?

Labour wouldn't have been panicked into having a referendum by UKIP eating into their voting base in the first place.

Their own fault for the Corbyn years. Unpatriotic at heart and a threat to National security.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Growing the economy from where we currently are by giving tax cuts massively skewed to the wealthy is absolutely not tried and tested.

Way more so than Corbyn’s politics, did you vote for him?

The model itself is tried and tested. We can’t predict the future, so let’s see. I’m sure even if it’s positive you’ll have your own negative slant on it anyway.

What you are saying is: "Some countries have low taxes on the wealthy and have strong economies. Therefore cutting taxes on the wealthy makes your economy stronger."


You see the flaw in the logic.

[scawsby steve]

I'm changing my prediction for 2024(if Putin hasn't nuked us all by then). I said IMO that it would be a hung parliament, but now I'm pretty certain that the Tories will get slaughtered.

This attack on the working class and lower middle classes isn't sustainable, and that so called mini-budget was a suicide note.

[Panda]

The rich got richer as a result of the lockdowns and the rich got even richer as a result of the cost of lockdown crisis.

As for the rest of us:

You will own nothing but you will be happy.   

[ravenrover]

And they'll get even richer when BoE increase interest rate, win win if you are rich enough

[BillyStubbsTears]

Budget's going well...

Once again, just imagine if a Labour Chancellor had given away £50bn in tax cuts to the poorest and the £ had tanked.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Budget's going well...

Once again, just imagine if a Labour Chancellor had given away £50bn in tax cuts to the poorest and the £ had tanked.

Are labour proposing to reverse the tax cut or halt the energy freeze?  With the exception of the 45% tax cut there isn't that much labour wouldn't do.  They've largely done exactly what everyone has been crying out for them to do.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Growing the economy from where we currently are by giving tax cuts massively skewed to the wealthy is absolutely not tried and tested.

Way more so than Corbyn’s politics, did you vote for him?

The model itself is tried and tested. We can’t predict the future, so let’s see. I’m sure even if it’s positive you’ll have your own negative slant on it anyway.

Go on then, which country - not a theoretical 'model' - has tried and tested it with any success? I'd love to know.

Not having low taxes, but funding lost tax revenue with government borrowing.

[Glyn_Wigley]

I remember when the conservatives used to wrongly blame Labour for the ‘08 recession when they wouldn’t have done anything different to avoid it themselves.

The same is now happening in reverse.

You think Labour would deal with this situation by giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest, releasing the cap on bankers'bonuses, allowing fracking while banning wind farms and solar farms, cutting income tax and keeping VATat 20% etc, etc?

I suggest that's some seriously impressive Bothsides Koolaid you're drinking there.

Labour wouldn’t have prevented brexit, lockdowns or the Ukraine invasion. They were also complaining about the Tories high taxes a matter of months ago.

I think VAT should have been cut to get people spending. But don’t really see the harm in anything else. Let’s see how it plays out in a non-partisan way. This way of growing the economy is tried and tested.

No need for intrusive countryside wind farms if we’re going nuclear. Wind farms getting expanded at sea instead where nobody lives, surely you and our wildlife would prefer that?

Labour wouldn't have been panicked into having a referendum by UKIP eating into their voting base in the first place.

Their own fault for the Corbyn years. Unpatriotic at heart and a threat to National security.

Brexit was voted for before Corbyn so cut out the word salad replies, eh?