Meet the owners

[EasyforDennis]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Or perhaps the DFP has got it's sums wrong leading to you in turn not getting your sums right.

[pib]

I'll be interested to hear the whole thing if it gets released. Couldn't make it last night but judging by the way it's been written up though, some of the answers to questions from DB and TB don't half sound defensive, and almost like they object to being scrutinised on the way things are being run. Maybe I'm wrong.

Putting £X millions into the club obviously ought to buy you some gratefulness, and I think most supporters genuinely are grateful to TB and the late DW for that. But I don't think it makes you immune to scrutiny and it almost seemed to come across like TB and DB had been lumbered with this thing they didn't really want and that we should be thankful for their every move because nobody else is stupid enough to take it on.

I would put out there that the supporters have no say in choosing the club's owners either, and the reason why people express their frustrations is that running a football club isn't like running any other business is that the fans are a massively important stakeholder, but one that only has the power to express their thoughts and feelings, and can't (for most of us anyway) actually be involved in the club.

[steve@dcfd]

I would expect you say that Glynn it was Martin who said £25m before that it was £20m. So if there was more transparency in the accounts we could see what are the true figures.
What is true in two MTO meetings TB as said he’s not Bramellovich and not Radcliffe another big exaggeration to make his point like posters on here say clubs are going to the wall yet they are still here and signing better players

[steve@dcfd]

Replying to NN. The team that were promoted under Rob Jones were paid £7m in wages the last full accounts that were available shows that.

The manager that got us relegated was hired by Mr Brunt and Mr Bramall so they must take responsibility for our demise and also the reduction in people coming through the turnstiles.

[silent majority]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

[EasyforDennis]

Or perhaps the DFP has got it's sums wrong leading to you in turn not getting your sums right.

Are you suggesting that SM is giving us wrong information then?

[silent majority]

Replying to NN. The team that were promoted under Rob Jones were paid £7m in wages the last full accounts that were available shows that.

The manager that got us relegated was hired by Mr Brunt and Mr Bramall so they must take responsibility for our demise and also the reduction in people coming through the turnstiles.

I think you're wrong on the £7m figure.

But lets keep pointing fingers and attributing blame though.

[steve@dcfd]

Martin looking at the full accounts ending 2012/2013 the wages shows the £7m figure that the season we were promoted back to the Championship from league 1.

[steve@dcfd]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

No conspiracy but in last nights meeting TB linked £25m with a league 2 club which is wrong as the Watson family have not been contributing in the period of league 1 relegation or league 2 present time.

[Chris Black come back]

Martin looking at the full accounts ending 2012/2013 the wages shows the £7m figure that the season we were promoted back to the Championship from league 1.

This is absolutely correct. For the season 2012/13 total staff costs (playing and non playing, wages, taxes and pension contributions) amounted to £7.05m.
 
Worth also balancing that for this season, we made a huge pre-tax loss of £4.38m. Which means very broadly speaking and in simplistic terms that our actual ‘sustainable’ wage bill was around £2.75m that season and our owners basically paid the rest themselves in order to get us promoted.

[silent majority]

Martin looking at the full accounts ending 2012/2013 the wages shows the £7m figure that the season we were promoted back to the Championship from league 1.

I'll take your word for it, I always assumed that was the season before.

[silent majority]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

No conspiracy but in last nights meeting TB linked £25m with a league 2 club which is wrong as the Watson family have not been contributing in the period of league 1 relegation or league 2 present time.

I'm struggling here, what is the actual point you're making?

Surely, we're a LG2 club that has had millions invested in it in recent years. Isn't that the point he made?

[Canadian Rover]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

No conspiracy but in last nights meeting TB linked £25m with a league 2 club which is wrong as the Watson family have not been contributing in the period of league 1 relegation or league 2 present time.

I'm struggling here, what is the actual point you're making?

Surely, we're a LG2 club that has had millions invested in it in recent years. Isn't that the point he made?

Rightly or wrongly I think people see us as a Championship or promotion chasing league one club with a couple of million invested. And as of the latter a relegated league one club and now a league two club with no additional investment.  Until recently the noises from the club weren't the latter. It is what it is and we can't control it; I think people feel hurt over the early soundbites from the board not the reality of self sustainability.

[steve@dcfd]

Yes TB said he’d put £12.6m into the club a total of £25m  with DW and family and we are a league 2. But the money he’s put in was spread over a period of at least 14 years in the Championship, League 1 and League 2. So the point I was making the £25m was not just as a league 2 club.

[silent majority]

Yes TB said he’d put £12.6m into the club a total of £25m  with DW and family and we are a league 2. But the money he’s put in was spread over a period of at least 14 years in the Championship, League 1 and League 2. So the point I was making the £25m was not just as a league 2 club.

Right, but that's not the point he made. My understanding was that despite the money they've invested we're still a LG2 club. He then said that maybe we should have made better use of the money.

You also have to contrast that with the other part of the discussion which was about how much money LG2 clubs will be losing this season.

[EasyforDennis]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

I know the Watson family wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club but how does that equate to the Watson family and TB both contributing almost equal amounts  when the family stood back some years ago.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

So I couldn't make the meeting this am relying on the bits I've seen written.

Was the feeling one of the owners wanting to just carry on as we are or is there an acceptance that things haven't been going well?

[silent majority]

So reading the report on the DFP website TB has put in £12.6m and the late DW £12.4m.
SM has said that they have put in £25m so........DW passed away 5 years ago, does that mean that TB has only put in £200k in the last 5 years? Either my sums are wrong or we are not being told the whole truth.

No, you and Steve are getting it wrong by assuming it was DW and only DW. The fact is the Watson family continued to contribute until very recently. When they stepped back they wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club.

Some conspiracy hey!

I know the Watson family wrote off all the funds they had invested in the club but how does that equate to the Watson family and TB both contributing almost equal amounts  when the family stood back some years ago.

They decided to take a step back in July 2020, but honoured their commitments beyond that. So, lets say 18 months? Not so long really.

[mushRTID]

So I couldn't make the meeting this am relying on the bits I've seen written.

Was the feeling one of the owners wanting to just carry on as we are or is there an acceptance that things haven't been going well?

They are definitely happy to carry on as we are. Nothing was spoken about regarding extra investment from either themselves or looking for help elsewhere.

[5minstogo]

It sounds very much like they are happy with the work they've done and now hope to stumble upon a magic formula of winning football matches and developing players to boost the playing budget. Odds on that ending in promotion to and then from League 1 are gonna be fairly slim I'd say.

[Alan Southstand]

Apparently, according to Mr Blunt, if we increase the crowd by 50%, we would be sustainable.

No acknowledgement that they’re driving supporters away with this frugal approach.

Gavin made it perfectly clear that we need to be out of league 2, meaning back in league 1. However, with the quality/standard of player dropping, due to affordability, how do they think we’re going to get out this league without more investment?

[ravenrover]

Martin looking at the full accounts ending 2012/2013 the wages shows the £7m figure that the season we were promoted back to the Championship from league 1.

This is absolutely correct. For the season 2012/13 total staff costs (playing and non playing, wages, taxes and pension contributions) amounted to £7.05m.
 
Worth also balancing that for this season, we made a huge pre-tax loss of £4.38m. Which means very broadly speaking and in simplistic terms that our actual ‘sustainable’ wage bill was around £2.75m that season and our owners basically paid the rest themselves in order to get us promoted.

ALL wages playing and non playing so not just the team then

[i_ateallthepies]

Apparently, according to Mr Blunt, if we increase the crowd by 50%, we would be sustainable.

No acknowledgement that they’re driving supporters away with this frugal approach.

Gavin made it perfectly clear that we need to be out of league 2, meaning back in league 1. However, with the quality/standard of player dropping, due to affordability, how do they think we’re going to get out this league without more investment?

Yes, I too noted that remark.  Seems to contradict the claim that the club has already achieved sustainability.

[selby]

  SM why get involved with the toing and frowing with people with questions for the owners who couldn't even be bothered to turn up to a meeting that they could have asked their questions at freely, and got their answers, and now want to take issue with someone who has put at least £12.5 million into the club on how much and how he spends his money.
   They want to think themselves lucky the owners gave the answers they did, the way they did, a lot would have been a lot blunter with their replies.
 

[pib]

  SM why get involved with the toing and frowing with people with questions for the owners who couldn't even be bothered to turn up to a meeting that they could have asked their questions at freely, and got their answers, and now want to take issue with someone who has put at least £12.5 million into the club on how much and how he spends his money.
   They want to think themselves lucky the owners gave the answers they did, the way they did, a lot would have been a lot blunter with their replies.
 

Why does not going to a hastily arranged event on a Monday night preclude you from being involved in the discussion or asking questions?

Not everybody is able to do these things on a whim - some people have jobs, families to look after, and some live considerable distances from Doncaster. I didn't go last night because it would've meant a 100+ mile round trip to the ground - a trip which I am going to be making tonight for the match, and doing it twice in as many days I couldn't justify.

[EasyforDennis]

  SM why get involved with the toing and frowing with people with questions for the owners who couldn't even be bothered to turn up to a meeting that they could have asked their questions at freely, and got their answers, and now want to take issue with someone who has put at least £12.5 million into the club on how much and how he spends his money.
   They want to think themselves lucky the owners gave the answers they did, the way they did, a lot would have been a lot blunter with their replies.
 

Get off your soapbox. Was everyone present last night guaranteed to get their questions answered?
Not everyone can drop everything to attend a meeting arranged at short notice.

[normal rules]

Apparently, according to Mr Blunt, if we increase the crowd by 50%, we would be sustainable.

No acknowledgement that they’re driving supporters away with this frugal approach.

Gavin made it perfectly clear that we need to be out of league 2, meaning back in league 1. However, with the quality/standard of player dropping, due to affordability, how do they think we’re going to get out this league without more investment?

I wonder if he meant the football side would be self sustainable. As opposed to the wider club Doncaster.

[DonnyOsmond]

  SM why get involved with the toing and frowing with people with questions for the owners who couldn't even be bothered to turn up to a meeting that they could have asked their questions at freely, and got their answers, and now want to take issue with someone who has put at least £12.5 million into the club on how much and how he spends his money.
   They want to think themselves lucky the owners gave the answers they did, the way they did, a lot would have been a lot blunter with their replies.
 

Why does not going to a hastily arranged event on a Monday night preclude you from being involved in the discussion or asking questions?

Not everybody is able to do these things on a whim - some people have jobs, families to look after, and some live considerable distances from Doncaster. I didn't go last night because it would've meant a 100+ mile round trip to the ground - a trip which I am going to be making tonight for the match, and doing it twice in as many days I couldn't justify.

It was sold out fairly quickly too, so people who would want to go didn't get the chance.

[selby]

  So if the answer is if you can't attend for whatever reason financially or make the time to attend you get on your soap box and keep banging away at what the owners do with their money on here, yes ok.