Levelling up agenda

[belton rover]

Last week I took food from one Academy School around here to a School 10 miles away in the same academy, I can confirm the food I took, in bulk, was broadly in line with the pictures posted during last week

How broadly?

[Filo]

Last week I took food from one Academy School around here to a School 10 miles away in the same academy, I can confirm the food I took, in bulk, was broadly in line with the pictures posted during last week

How broadly?

Very close, bread, bananas, biscuits, condensed milk  potatoes, Carrotts

[drfchound]

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

[SydneyRover]

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

Can you support your claim hound?

[Filo]

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

You either trust my word or you don’t, I don’t do lies, and that is what you are implying, frankly I don’t care if you believe me or not

[wilts rover]

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

Belton has evidence from his personal experince. I have evidence from my personal experince, Filo has from his personal experience.

Non of us yet has found evidence to say what most of the children on free school meals in the country are recieving - other than what parents and school staff have posted on social media.

Most pertinantly, no-one has provided any evidence to say that the vast majority of these children, in England, are not receiving school packages in line with offical government recommendations that Johnson himself described as unacceptable.

I would be delighted to see it, but as yet all we have is the odd school ignoring the government and going beyond these.

Personally I think the government should link up with local cafes/restaraunts/pubs/taxi firms and get them to provide the FSM - this would provide an income for those businesses and a meal for the children.

Failing that the vouchers do seem to be the way to go as then the money allocated to the child for food will be reaching the family, rather than being scammed off by the corporate service company.

[Filo]

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

Belton has evidence from his personal experince. I have evidence from my personal experince, Filo has from his personal experience.

Non of us yet has found evidence to say what most of the children on free school meals in the country are recieving - other than what parents and school staff have posted on social media.

Most pertinantly, no-one has provided any evidence to say that the vast majority of these children, in England, are not receiving school packages in line with offical government recommendations that Johnson himself described as unacceptable.

I would be delighted to see it, but as yet all we have is the odd school ignoring the government and going beyond these.

Personally I think the government should link up with local cafes/restaraunts/pubs/taxi firms and get them to provide the FSM - this would provide an income for those businesses and a meal for the children.

Failing that the vouchers do seem to be the way to go as then the money allocated to the child for food will be reaching the family, rather than being scammed off by the corporate service company.

We as a taxi firm do the delivery from one school to another from the same academy

[BillyStubbsTears]

Wilts.

Point of fact. Johnson didn't describe them as "unacceptable". He described them as "disgraceful".

[drfchound]

 

Belton, some posters will ask you for evidence of what you have seen but they won’t ask Filo to provide evidence of what he saw.

You either trust my word or you don’t, I don’t do lies, and that is what you are implying, frankly I don’t care if you believe me or not

Filo, read my post again in the context of where it was written in the thread.
I personally don’t doubt you and certainly wasn’t implying that you were lying.
I wrote it because wilts had questioned Beltons observation.
I brought your observation into it because as one of our Labour supporting posters you are very unlikely to be put under the microscope.
Belton on the other hand is not likely to be able to post without being chased down.

[Not Now Kato]

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hound.

Could you point out for us where Wilts questioned Belton's observation? I'm struggling to find it.

[drfchound]

I accept it Billy
You’re only criticising the things you think are worthy of criticism.

But you also posted a menu of food that is absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving.

Scandalous.

Do you have any evidence for this Belton?

The only contradictory evidence that I have seen of schools, sending out more than what the government has recommended is from me and you here and a few callers on the radio who say they are local resteraunts providing school meals in their area free of charge. This would appear to be individual schools going against government guidance rather than praise for companies following it.

Marcus Rashford said he had been contacted by thousands of parents, there have been dozens of callers on the radio from all over the country and photos and reports in many local papers, including in Wiltshire, of schools sending out parcels similar to that Billy posted.

I would like to think most are not - but I haven't seen any evidence of that?

BST.  This one.

[drfchound]

I accept it Billy
You’re only criticising the things you think are worthy of criticism.

But you also posted a menu of food that is absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving.

Scandalous.

Do you have any evidence for this Belton?

The only contradictory evidence that I have seen of schools, sending out more than what the government has recommended is from me and you here and a few callers on the radio who say they are local resteraunts providing school meals in their area free of charge. This would appear to be individual schools going against government guidance rather than praise for companies following it.

Marcus Rashford said he had been contacted by thousands of parents, there have been dozens of callers on the radio from all over the country and photos and reports in many local papers, including in Wiltshire, of schools sending out parcels similar to that Billy posted.

I would like to think most are not - but I haven't seen any evidence of that?

No evidence in terms of thousands of people contacting Marcus Rashford to say they are happy with free school meals, or dozens of people on the radio expressing their thanks for the meals.

I listened to a radio show where callers were urged to call in about the disgraceful free meals. Several did. I called in to give an alternative opinion from my own experience of local kids and parents being happy with their parcels. I never got past the producer.

I can only assume my views didn’t fit in with the radio station’s narrative.

So you don't have any evidence that the menu that posted is not what most of our needy children are recieving then?

Despite it being the offical government guidance of what our needy children should recieve?

BST, and this one.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Hound.

I'm not sure what point you are making here.

Belton commented on what he knew. No one has queried that observation.

He then stated that most children were getting a much better free school meal than the ones under discussion. That wasn't an observation. It was an unsupported assertion. Wilts, simply asked for the supporting evidence for that assertion.

[belton rover]

It’s a very clear point, Billy.
Wilts asked me if I had evidence to support my personal experiences, and than pushed for further clarification that I had no evidence.
Filo also described his personal experiences (different to mine) but no evidence appeared to be needed for his experience to be accepted.

To be fair to Wilts, he doesn’t appear to have completely dismissed my views because of lack of evidence, but Hound’s very clear and valid point remains.

[drfchound]

Belton, thanks for the support there but as usual the same suspects pile in to cause a scene that is totally unnecessary.
I agree with what you say about wilts and he is generally a fair and reasoned poster.

[Filo]

I’ll be doing the same run tomorrow, I won’t be revealing the identity of the schools, but hopefully I can get some pics of the bulk order for the week

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton. Where  did Wilts ask you for evidence of your personal experiences?

[belton rover]

I’m going to move on now Billy.
Thanks for your input in this part of the debate.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Never changes does it? You misrepresent what people say and when you are picked up on it, you can't find it in yourself to accept the mistake with good grace.

Then you periodically give us a lecture on the approach to discussion in here being toxic.

[wilts rover]

It’s a very clear point, Billy.
Wilts asked me if I had evidence to support my personal experiences, and than pushed for further clarification that I had no evidence.
Filo also described his personal experiences (different to mine) but no evidence appeared to be needed for his experience to be accepted.

To be fair to Wilts, he doesn’t appear to have completely dismissed my views because of lack of evidence, but Hound’s very clear and valid point remains.

No he didn't.

I accept it Billy
You’re only criticising the things you think are worthy of criticism.

But you also posted a menu of food that is absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving.

Scandalous.

Do you have any evidence for this Belton?

The only contradictory evidence that I have seen of schools, sending out more than what the government has recommended is from me and you here and a few callers on the radio who say they are local resteraunts providing school meals in their area free of charge. This would appear to be individual schools going against government guidance rather than praise for companies following it.

Marcus Rashford said he had been contacted by thousands of parents, there have been dozens of callers on the radio from all over the country and photos and reports in many local papers, including in Wiltshire, of schools sending out parcels similar to that Billy posted.

I would like to think most are not - but I haven't seen any evidence of that?

You said that what had been posted was 'absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving'.

I have never questioned your personal experince, I have thanked you for your personal experince. What I have asked for is the evidence to know that this is what most of the needy children across the country are receiving. Becuase their parents were saying it was what they were receiving.

I presumed you had evidence of what was happening nationally that we were unaware of.

[Bentley Bullet]

Belton, It's OK for you to have personal evidence of school meals being of higher quality than the ones shown in the photos but unless you have evidence that most of our UK children are receiving similar higher quality meals your view doesn't amount to much.

 The way this forum works, the government is guilty until proved innocent!

[belton rover]

Billy. What never changes is your incessant goading, and your narcissistic need to play your control game on here.


You will keep going until your last breath to ensure you come out on top of any debate on here. I promised myself I would not lower myself to this pathetic level again, hence my ‘I’ll leave it there’ post. An absolutely genuine post to nip this in the bud Before it becomes toxic.

But that has actually riled you even more, hasn’t it?
How dare I not give you the opportunity to ridicule and condescend, and show your superior intellect, wisdom and humour.


I’m a t**t of bad faith when I argue with you, and I’m a t**t of bad faith when I refuse to.

You, and you alone have turned what was actually a rare respectful discussion into yet another personal attack.

Your true colours shown right there.

But I will not be pushed into it anymore by you. I meant what I said a few weeks ago about feeling remorse for my part in any ill feeling, and I don’t intend to be a part of that anymore.

You do whatever you feel is right. You have my pity.

[SydneyRover]

Wilts.

Point of fact. Johnson didn't describe them as "unacceptable". He described them as "disgraceful".

This must be the biggest indication that the food provided wasn't anywhere near good enough across the board, if johnson is admitting it then it must be bad as maybe this is the first time in his career he has owned up to anything.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton.

I asked you a perfectly respectful question. As I have done countless times over this past 6 months when you have clearly misrepresented something. Your response every single time has been to point blank refuse to address the fact that you had misrepresented the original post, and you then complain of bullying when people point it out. Over and over and over again.

All you needed to do in this thread was hold your hand up and say, "Yep. I misread. Wilts didn't say what I accused him of saying." Dead easy. But you don't. Ever. And that's why I get pissed off with your approach. You say you chose to move on to "nip this in the bud." And if that was your intention, I apologise for misreading it. However, it doesn't address the underlying problem. That you continue to, accidentally or deliberately, misrepresent other people's posts.

That's your right of course. But don't then complain about it being pointed out to you, as though that is unacceptable bullying.

If everyone demands the right to regularly, clearly and unambiguously misrepresent what people say, and refuses ever to correct that, the whole concept of respectful, sensible discussion is out the window.

[belton rover]

It’s a very clear point, Billy.
Wilts asked me if I had evidence to support my personal experiences, and than pushed for further clarification that I had no evidence.
Filo also described his personal experiences (different to mine) but no evidence appeared to be needed for his experience to be accepted.

To be fair to Wilts, he doesn’t appear to have completely dismissed my views because of lack of evidence, but Hound’s very clear and valid point remains.

No he didn't.

I accept it Billy
You’re only criticising the things you think are worthy of criticism.

But you also posted a menu of food that is absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving.

Scandalous.

Do you have any evidence for this Belton?

The only contradictory evidence that I have seen of schools, sending out more than what the government has recommended is from me and you here and a few callers on the radio who say they are local resteraunts providing school meals in their area free of charge. This would appear to be individual schools going against government guidance rather than praise for companies following it.

Marcus Rashford said he had been contacted by thousands of parents, there have been dozens of callers on the radio from all over the country and photos and reports in many local papers, including in Wiltshire, of schools sending out parcels similar to that Billy posted.

I would like to think most are not - but I haven't seen any evidence of that?

You said that what had been posted was 'absolutely not a true reflection of what most of our needy children are receiving'.

I have never questioned your personal experince, I have thanked you for your personal experince. What I have asked for is the evidence to know that this is what most of the needy children across the country are receiving. Becuase their parents were saying it was what they were receiving.

I presumed you had evidence of what was happening nationally that we were unaware of.

You are right Wilts. Perhaps I could have worded it differently. It is my belief that it it is not a true reflection. It is also a fact that not every child has received the same substandard food.

Unfortunately, we seemed to get a little sidetracked. The problem I have with lists and photos such as we’ve had, is the assumption, that this IS across the board so that it can be used as another reason to vilify the government when, as you quite rightly say, the evidence is not there.

[belton rover]

Belton.

I asked you a perfectly respectful question. As I have done countless times over this past 6 months when you have clearly misrepresented something. Your response every single time has been to point blank refuse to address the fact that you had misrepresented the original post, and you then complain of bullying when people point it out. Over and over and over again.

All you needed to do in this thread was hold your hand up and say, "Yep. I misread. Wilts didn't say what I accused him of saying." Dead easy. But you don't. Ever. And that's why I get pissed off with your approach. You say you chose to move on to "nip this in the bud." And if that was your intention, I apologise for misreading it. However, it doesn't address the underlying problem. That you continue to, accidentally or deliberately, misrepresent other people's posts.

That's your right of course. But don't then complain about it being pointed out to you, as though that is unacceptable bullying.

If everyone demands the right to regularly, clearly and unambiguously misrepresent what people say, and refuses ever to correct that, the whole concept of respectful, sensible discussion is out the window.

That was perhaps a conversation for Wilts and I to have. As I said, it was actually quite an interesting debate. I’ve tried to address that now with wilts.

But then you had to flex your metaphoricalls again, and turn the discussion directly towards you. I have no interest in that. As soon as I realised what you were up to, I pulled pack.

Much to your annoyance.

I really would like to leave it now, if you don’t mind.

[wilts rover]

Thanks Belton, I too thought we were having a good and interesting debate and its easy to see where I got confused. I should have made myself clearer, earlier, I think.

And yes I agree with you about some of the other contributions to it. I have no idea why other people decided to use my name and tell me what I think, I'm quite good at doing that myself thanks.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Belton

If that was a conversation for you and Wilts, maybe you should have stuck to talking to Wilts instead of bringing me into it?

For the record, YOU chose to post to ME, not the other way round. I wasn't talking with you. You initiated the conversation. And in doing so, you said something that was clearly and unquestionably incorrect and not helpful to the discussion. You said Wilts had asked you "if I had evidence to support my personal experiences, and than pushed for further clarification that I had no evidence." He clearly didn't do either of those things. If you post to me and say something that is quite obviously untrue, do you think it's my problem if I pick you up on it?

I asked you to clarify what you had said in your post to me and you chose not to take the opportunity to correct it. Something that has happened depressingly frequently over recent months.

It's a bit rich then to accuse me of spoiling the discussion. If you want to move on, that's grand. Maybe you should have considered that before you dragged me into the discussion?

Wilts. If your post was aimed at me, I've no idea what point you were making. I didn't and wouldn't tell you what you were thinking. I commented in response to Belton's post to me, on what you clearly wrote, with no comment on what I thought you thought.

[belton rover]

Belton

If that was a conversation for you and Wilts, maybe you should have stuck to talking to Wilts instead of bringing me into it?

For the record, YOU chose to post to ME, not the other way round. I wasn't talking with you. You initiated the conversation. And in doing so, you said something that was clearly and unquestionably incorrect and not helpful to the discussion. You said Wilts had asked you "if I had evidence to support my personal experiences, and than pushed for further clarification that I had no evidence." He clearly didn't do either of those things. If you post to me and say something that is quite obviously untrue, do you think it's my problem if I pick you up on it?

I asked you to clarify what you had said in your post to me and you chose not to take the opportunity to correct it. Something that has happened depressingly frequently over recent months.

It's a bit rich then to accuse me of spoiling the discussion. If you want to move on, that's grand. Maybe you should have considered that before you dragged me into the discussion?

Wilts. If your post was aimed at me, I've no idea what point you were making. I didn't and wouldn't tell you what you were thinking. I commented in response to Belton's post to me, on what you clearly wrote, with no comment on what I thought you thought.

I’ll try a different approach, as my first attempt to avoid unnecessary antagonism failed:

I agree, Billy, with everything you’ve said on the matter.