Local Elections And Hartlepool

[Filo]

This must be tongue in cheek too, no?

Hartlepool

''Winning Tory candidate Jill Mortimer says Labour has taken Hartlepool for granted for too long''

The Hartlepool MP will be like the Don Valley MP, lots of words on social media but nothing happens, just another Johnson yes person

[River Don]

The Labour Party obviously need an inquest to understand fully what's going on in places like Hartlepool.

My guess, only a guess, is that Brexit is still alive in the minds of voters and Starmer is seen as being against it. Voters in places like Hartlepool feel let down over the years too. My hunch is there is a feeling in red wall seats with the Tories that if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

Obviously the lies and deceit of Johnson aren't cutting through. I think the Tories are getting credit for the vaccine rollout.

For me, I felt able to vote for Labour, for the first time in a while yesterday but it was only for a police and crime commissioner.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Interesting to see John McDonnell stating the same as I had previously. Labour went in to these elections with no policies how could they persuade people to vote for them?

I'm still surprised how badly they have seemingly done.  Boris had seemingly had a few tough weeks with questions around government funds yet the government just got a bit stronger and seem to be picking up more votes.

[wesisback]

The Labour Party obviously need an inquest to understand fully what's going on in places like Hartlepool.

My guess, only a guess, is that Brexit is still alive in the minds of voters and Starmer is seen as being against it. Voters in places like Hartlepool feel let down over the years too. My hunch is there is a feeling in red wall seats with the Tories that if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

Obviously the lies and deceit of Johnson aren't cutting through. I think the Tories are getting credit for the vaccine rollout.

For me, I felt able to vote for Labour, for the first time in a while yesterday but it was only for a police and crime commissioner.

Labour shed 7'000 votes from the 2019 Election yesterday in Hartlepool which was an atrocious performance by Labour on the back of their Brexit stance. 7'000 people willing to vote for Labour then have either decided that the party isn't the one that best represents them or even more worryingly, that they didn't vote at all.
However this has come at a good time for Labour, there's loads of time until a general election, they should be sending every figure they've got up there now and digging deep into where these votes have gone. No reactionary blame game but to quietly work out how they will change their current perception.

[River Don]

The Labour Party obviously need an inquest to understand fully what's going on in places like Hartlepool.

My guess, only a guess, is that Brexit is still alive in the minds of voters and Starmer is seen as being against it. Voters in places like Hartlepool feel let down over the years too. My hunch is there is a feeling in red wall seats with the Tories that if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

Obviously the lies and deceit of Johnson aren't cutting through. I think the Tories are getting credit for the vaccine rollout.

For me, I felt able to vote for Labour, for the first time in a while yesterday but it was only for a police and crime commissioner.

Labour shed 7'000 votes from the 2019 Election yesterday in Hartlepool which was an atrocious performance by Labour on the back of their Brexit stance. 7'000 people willing to vote for Labour then have either decided that the party isn't the one that best represents them or even more worryingly, that they didn't vote at all.
However this has come at a good time for Labour, there's loads of time until a general election, they should be sending every figure they've got up there now and digging deep into where these votes have gone. No reactionary blame game but to quietly work out how they will change their current perception.

It perhaps looks more dramatic now because the shift had previously been hidden by the UKIP vote.

[selby]

  Wesisback, there is no good time to be a loser. and when they have been serial losers for so long life becomes a bitch and people realise they are becoming irrelevant.

[River Don]

In this election I voted against Johnson more than anything.

I think his handling of Covid has been generally shite. I know a lot of people give the Tories credit for the vaccine but beyond that it's been a shambles, even sinister. It's blatantly obvious he's a lying incompitent. There's nothing radical in that thought, it's what most of his party thinks.

I don't have any idea of what the candidates wanted to bring to the police commissioners role. I don't think I was really voting for anything in Starmers Labour Party. It was just a vote against Johnson.

[SydneyRover]

  Wesisback, there is no good time to be a loser. and when they have been serial losers for so long life becomes a bitch and people realise they are becoming irrelevant.

you'd know all about that of course selby

[drfchound]

The Labour Party obviously need an inquest to understand fully what's going on in places like Hartlepool.

My guess, only a guess, is that Brexit is still alive in the minds of voters and Starmer is seen as being against it. Voters in places like Hartlepool feel let down over the years too. My hunch is there is a feeling in red wall seats with the Tories that if you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

Obviously the lies and deceit of Johnson aren't cutting through. I think the Tories are getting credit for the vaccine rollout.

For me, I felt able to vote for Labour, for the first time in a while yesterday but it was only for a police and crime commissioner.

Labour shed 7'000 votes from the 2019 Election yesterday in Hartlepool which was an atrocious performance by Labour on the back of their Brexit stance. 7'000 people willing to vote for Labour then have either decided that the party isn't the one that best represents them or even more worryingly, that they didn't vote at all.
However this has come at a good time for Labour, there's loads of time until a general election, they should be sending every figure they've got up there now and digging deep into where these votes have gone. No reactionary blame game but to quietly work out how they will change their current perception.

It perhaps looks more dramatic now because the shift had previously been hidden by the UKIP vote.

The people who had previously voted Brexit still had a choice though and they didn’t vote Labour.

[wesisback]

  Wesisback, there is no good time to be a loser. and when they have been serial losers for so long life becomes a bitch and people realise they are becoming irrelevant.

Whether that is Labour or not an opposition will emerge. I've not even found a staunch Tory that believes a one party state is a good thing (there really is no good examples of this).
In my opinion (and its only mine as it would defeat the point that there shouldn't be an instantaneous reaction) Labour has become even more complacent in the last year of offering a substantial difference. I'm sure they exist but if the majority of voters on this post who care enough to comment don't know, what chance does Joe Public have?

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Labour wins the Doncaster Mayoral election

I think the Tories will be pleased to increase their vote share and taking it to second preferences.  They'll be disappointed if they pick up no councillors though surely?

[Ldr]

  Wesisback, there is no good time to be a loser. and when they have been serial losers for so long life becomes a bitch and people realise they are becoming irrelevant.

Whether that is Labour or not an opposition will emerge. I've not even found a staunch Tory that believes a one party state is a good thing (there really is no good examples of this).
In my opinion (and its only mine as it would defeat the point that there shouldn't be an instantaneous reaction) Labour has become even more complacent in the last year of offering a substantial difference. I'm sure they exist but if the majority of voters on this post who care enough to comment don't know, what chance does Joe Public have?

100% our system works best with effective opposition to curb the incumbent party (whichever way round they are at the time).

[drfchound]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/may/04/labour-tories-voters-keir-starmer

......and that is from The Guardian.
Says a lot.

[SydneyRover]

but if you don't read the guardian how would you know hound?

[drfchound]

but if you don't read the guardian how would you know hound?

Have a guess.

[SydneyRover]

the travellers told you?

[drfchound]

the travellers told you?

.   





You know what, if that article had been supporting Starmer you would probably have been the first to post the link.
Instead you are quietly licking your wounds and trying to provoke people into arguments.

[selby]

  Syd, go to bed, curl up in a little ball and have a bit of time to yourself, go no you know you want to do it.

[SydneyRover]

You and hound should get a room together

[MachoMadness]

Seems particularly relevant today.

[SydneyRover]

MM, the same thing happens when DRFC has problems, some supporters rip apart the players, the management the board and anyone else with to whom they can direct their frustrations, then there is the WUMs who keep poking and prodding but are totally surprised and miffed when someone has a go back.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Interesting to see John McDonnell stating the same as I had previously. Labour went in to these elections with no policies how could they persuade people to vote for them?

I'm still surprised how badly they have seemingly done.  Boris had seemingly had a few tough weeks with questions around government funds yet the government just got a bit stronger and seem to be picking up more votes.

If only it were that simple.

Labour went into the 2019 election with policies pouring out of every orifice, but they would still have lost Hartlepoo if the Brexit party hadn't taken 20-odd percent of the vote.

Anyone who clicks their fingers and proposes a simple solution to a complex problem that has been a generation in the making should stop and think a bit harder. Hartlepool is a perfect example of the skill with which the Tories have directed people's ire over economic stagnation into the culture war. How Labour addresses that, I honestly don't know, but simply suggessting that a suite of policies would have made it alright is nonsense.

[Ldr]

BST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fb

I’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only

[normal rules]

The Labour Party would do well to spend less time bashing the tories and actually getting on at being a proper opposition party. I think it’s too late for them though for now. We won’t see a re appearance of the Labour Party, as a meaningful political force in this country for some time IMO. People have had enough of the he said, she said politics that has been rife in this country for some years now.
No- one actually knows what the Labour Party actually stand for anymore. And that is their biggest issue.

[SydneyRover]

This was never going to be the time NR but it could have been better, it's too close to a very bad GE defeat.

[wilts rover]

BST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fb

I’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only

And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!

Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.

Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...

But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.

[normal rules]

The current government are certainly riding the crest of the covid wave. But starmer has inherited a trashed brand from 20 years of Corbyn, brown, milliband and co.

[Ldr]

BST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fb

I’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only

And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!

Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.

Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...

But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.

That's the crux Wilts, perception and image are everything these days.

[normal rules]

BST this is what you are up against and is a widespread thought in my experience. Nicked from a friends fb

I’ve always voted Labour and couldn’t stomach voting Tory because of the memory of my late grandad who was a proper Labour man - however this present lot have lost the working class completely in this country they represent nothing but a very narrow metropolitan elite who sneer at ordinary working people - it’s a crime really that despite everything we’ve only got an opposition in name only

And yet the working class are prepared to vote for the party of the proper elite who certainly sneer at ordinary working people - indeed have written books and newspaper articles on how lazy and overpaid they are!!

Thats the conundrum. People seem to think that 'Labour' sneer at the working class -when they actually dont and the vast majority of their membership are working class - you wanna see my bricklaying certificates - but that the Tories dont - when they properly despise them.

Labour need a postive agenda/policies - but they also need better media management to get that positive message over. Can Starmer do that, well...

But well done Boris, big win, everybody should be gracious enough to accept that.

Whilst the opinion of the likes of Johnson towards the working class may be that of a “sneering” type, you cannot dispute  the fact that this govt has helped pay the wages of millions of people over the last year. I wonder what a Labour govt would have done?

[SydneyRover]

Why wouldn't they have done it is a better question, they are after all the better economic mangers out of the two parties and have never to my knowledge implemented ''austerity''