Immigration

[Bentley Bullet]

I think language and family connections here are the reasons many want to come

Almost 1 in 5 people speak English globally. More people speak English than any other language. To have the ability to speak English as justification to come and live here would sink us.

Good point BB. What do you think about those that have family already here living as citizens. Should they be allowed in?

If it benefits the country and not simply because they have relations living here then they should have the same rights as every other immigrant.

[sf9944]

How would you determine benefit to the country? A points based system?

Is it ok to accept unskilled workers with family members here if we cannot find enough brits to do unpaid work?

[sf9944]

Sorry I mean unskilled work

[Bentley Bullet]

Yep, a point-based system, which automatically excludes criminals.

First, we should encourage our people to do unskilled work.

Unskilled workers should be allowed if it benefits the country, irrespective of whether they have family members living here.

[SydneyRover]

Yep, a point-based system, which automatically excludes criminals.

First, we should encourage our people to do unskilled work.

Unskilled workers should be allowed if it benefits the country, irrespective of whether they have family members living here.

In what context?

[danumdon]

How would you determine benefit to the country? A points based system?

Is it ok to accept unskilled workers with family members here if we cannot find enough brits to do unpaid work?

Good luck finding anyone to do that type of work!

[sf9944]

Yep, a point-based system, which automatically excludes criminals.

First, we should encourage our people to do unskilled work.

Unskilled workers should be allowed if it benefits the country, irrespective of whether they have family members living here.

In what context?

Yes I was going to ask how given how nothing seems to have worked previously. Also if we can’t get our own citizens to do unskilled or semi skilled work is it still ok to bring people in to do these jobs if net migration continues to be so high as a result?

[SydneyRover]

Yep, a point-based system, which automatically excludes criminals.

First, we should encourage our people to do unskilled work.

Unskilled workers should be allowed if it benefits the country, irrespective of whether they have family members living here.

In what context?

Yes I was going to ask how given how nothing seems to have worked previously. Also if we can’t get our own citizens to do unskilled or semi skilled work is it still ok to bring people in to do these jobs if net migration continues to be so high as a result?

Cut off benefits and starve them into submission.

[SydneyRover]

oops already tried that with Austerity tens of thousands died.

[Bentley Bullet]

sf9944.

I was made redundant 8 years ago and went on the dole for 6 months. Every week I had to produce evidence of at least 3 jobs I had applied for the previous week, to receive my £60 odd benefit payment.

If this rule applies to everyone capable of working, how on earth do they get away with receiving benefits long term?

[SydneyRover]

oops already tried that with Austerity tens of thousands died.

Correction:

''Over 300,000 'excess' deaths in Great Britain attributed to UK Government austerity policies. Recent evidence has shown people across the UK are dying younger as a result of austerity, with people living in the poorest areas hardest hit''

https://www.gla.ac.uk/news/archiveofnews/2022/october/headline_885099_en.html#:~:text=University%20news-,Over%20300%2C000%20'excess'%20deaths%20in%20Great%20Britain%20attributed,to%20UK%20Government%20austerity%20policies&text=Recent%20evidence%20has%20shown%20people,the%20poorest%20areas%20hardest%20hit.

I guess this is just one of the many reasons the government is on the nose.

[TonySoprano]

Seriously, what's Labour's plan to stop illegal immigration?

I've heard Labour describe their plans to reduce immigration generally and to tackle so called illegal immigration on multiple occasions throughout this campaign.

I've also heard them describe their plans on pretty much every other issue.

I'm genuinely confused why people keep saying they have no plan. Fair enough if you disagree with their plan by the way.

Seriously, again. What is their plan ?
I've only heard they plan to scrap the Rwanda plan, which will be a waste of money and just remove the only deterent we have.

What about you use this thing called the Internet to go and look for yourself?

I'm asking the labour fan boys on here.
See if they can articulate the plan.
Which I highly doubt, because labour simply don't have one.

[danumdon]

When my dad was induced to come her to work in this country it was made very clear to him and all the others in his cohort what was required of them.

They had to present themselves at the police station every week to declare that they were still employed by the same employer, they still lived at the same address(a hostel that they had no choice but to live in) and that they had not been arrested for any reason. Any deviation from this would lead to instant deportation back to where they came from, and at least 30% ended up this way.

This lasted for a whole year, after which they were allowed to move out of the hostel and buy a property and apply for naturalisation if they wished.

The main point being they had to be able to provide for themselves without any recourse to the state in handouts or benefits, if they could not do this then as above they were deemed a burden and would be deported back to their home country, no questions asked, no right to appeal.

Fast forward to today, just WTF have we become?

[sf9944]

sf9944.

I was made redundant 8 years ago and went on the dole for 6 months. Every week I had to produce evidence of at least 3 jobs I had applied for the previous week, to receive my £60 odd benefit payment.

If this rule applies to everyone capable of working, how on earth do they get away with receiving benefits long term?

I honestly don’t know BB but there must be a reason we have felt it necessary to import such large numbers of unskilled and semi skilled workers. Whatever policies we have been employing to try to get our own to do these jobs they don’t seem to have worked.

[SydneyRover]

sf9944.

I was made redundant 8 years ago and went on the dole for 6 months. Every week I had to produce evidence of at least 3 jobs I had applied for the previous week, to receive my £60 odd benefit payment.

If this rule applies to everyone capable of working, how on earth do they get away with receiving benefits long term?

Who is getting away with what bb, show some figures and a bit of evidence please?

[sf9944]

Seriously, what's Labour's plan to stop illegal immigration?

I've heard Labour describe their plans to reduce immigration generally and to tackle so called illegal immigration on multiple occasions throughout this campaign.

I've also heard them describe their plans on pretty much every other issue.

I'm genuinely confused why people keep saying they have no plan. Fair enough if you disagree with their plan by the way.

Seriously, again. What is their plan ?
I've only heard they plan to scrap the Rwanda plan, which will be a waste of money and just remove the only deterent we have.

What about you use this thing called the Internet to go and look for yourself?

I'm asking the labour fan boys on here.
See if they can articulate the plan.
Which I highly doubt, because labour simply don't have one.

Tony why can’t we have a reasoned debate without resorting to name calling?

In a nutshell labour don’t believe that deporting a tiny proportion of asylum seekers to Rwanda will act as an effective deterrent and there doesn’t currently seem to be any evidence that it will. They don’t want to spend hundreds of millions on a scheme they don’t think will work.

Labour want to tackle the isssue at source by taking out the people smugglers. Keir Starmer has experience of successfully prosecuting organised criminals and he thinks that with a more organised approach this can be achieved. Labour also want to agree returns policies with countries such as the one that turkey has with Afghanistan. Labour also wants to process asylum claims more quickly and efficiently such that asylum seekers aren’t waiting years for a decision whilst being supported by the tax payer. There may be more but these are the central planks of their plan.

So you see labour does have a plan. Why don’t you think it will work?

[Sprotyrover]

I know quite a few Brits who have moved to live abroad for a better quality of life. I don’t know any that have moved abroad to escape poverty, persecution or war thankfully.

Many choose to live in countries like Spain and don’t learn the language but surround themselves with other brits so it doesn’t really matter.

Read up about Ireland during the potato famine and Scotland during the clearances.Oh and not forgetting when America stopped accepting convicts they were shipped to NSW.

You read it up got nothing to do with this thread!

[SydneyRover]

I know quite a few Brits who have moved to live abroad for a better quality of life. I don’t know any that have moved abroad to escape poverty, persecution or war thankfully.

Many choose to live in countries like Spain and don’t learn the language but surround themselves with other brits so it doesn’t really matter.

Read up about Ireland during the potato famine and Scotland during the clearances.Oh and not forgetting when America stopped accepting convicts they were shipped to NSW.

You read it up got nothing to do with this thread!

why?

[Sprotyrover]

I know quite a few Brits who have moved to live abroad for a better quality of life. I don’t know any that have moved abroad to escape poverty, persecution or war thankfully.

Many choose to live in countries like Spain and don’t learn the language but surround themselves with other brits so it doesn’t really matter.

Read up about Ireland during the potato famine and Scotland during the clearances.Oh and not forgetting when America stopped accepting convicts they were shipped to NSW.

You read it up got nothing to do with this thread!

why?

Because it’s ancient History! Nothing to do with this thread you are trying to divert the thread as usual you monger!

[SydneyRover]

No, I meant why would I have to look it up I already know about it aye?

[Sprotyrover]

No, I meant why would I have to look it up I already know about it aye?

I do too Syd we were taught it in History class back in the 1970’s

[SydneyRover]

No, I meant why would I have to look it up I already know about it aye?

I do too Syd we were taught it in History class back in the 1970’s

I'd have thought it was way earlier than that.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Seriously, what's Labour's plan to stop illegal immigration?

I've heard Labour describe their plans to reduce immigration generally and to tackle so called illegal immigration on multiple occasions throughout this campaign.

I've also heard them describe their plans on pretty much every other issue.

I'm genuinely confused why people keep saying they have no plan. Fair enough if you disagree with their plan by the way.

Seriously, again. What is their plan ?
I've only heard they plan to scrap the Rwanda plan, which will be a waste of money and just remove the only deterent we have.

What about you use this thing called the Internet to go and look for yourself?

I'm asking the labour fan boys on here.
See if they can articulate the plan.
Which I highly doubt, because labour simply don't have one.

Yeah.

I know exactly what you are doing.

And I'm telling you to go and look for it yourself because there's plenty out there on it.

Life tip. Educate yourself on topics before you mouth off about them.

[Axholme Lion]

Rather than wasting our defence budget on arming the Ukrainians in an unwinnable war, why not build a fleet of armed patrol boats to deter any dodgy asylum seekers in boats by any means necessary? The eventual end game of uncontrolled immigration is that we become a minority in our own country, and before bst starts boring on calling me a fascist, this is a view shared by many of my Polish friends.

[DonnyOsmond]

Seriously, what's Labour's plan to stop illegal immigration?

I've heard Labour describe their plans to reduce immigration generally and to tackle so called illegal immigration on multiple occasions throughout this campaign.

I've also heard them describe their plans on pretty much every other issue.

I'm genuinely confused why people keep saying they have no plan. Fair enough if you disagree with their plan by the way.

Seriously, again. What is their plan ?
I've only heard they plan to scrap the Rwanda plan, which will be a waste of money and just remove the only deterent we have.

Hi Tony, I've already linked you higher up this page, you might have missed it.

[Bentley Bullet]

I suspect the question should be what is Starmer's plan that is different to that of the Tories, apart from cancelling the Rwanda plan?

Starmer says, "Where people have no right to be here, they will be removed."

He says he would "negotiate returns agreements with individual states and the European Union, creating a mechanism for those in Britain unlawfully to be removed."

Would a Labour government want to sign returns agreements with countries which have terrible human rights records, like Afghanistan? Or are in the grip of civil war?

Since Brexit, even negotiating returns agreements with our European neighbours would be challenging.

So, WHAT EXACTLY IS KEIR STARMER GOING TO DO DIFFERENT THAN THE TORIES HAVE ALREADY TRIED TO DO?

In other words, what is his NEW plan?

[Herbert Anchovy]

I suspect the question should be what is Starmer's plan that is different to that of the Tories, apart from cancelling the Rwanda plan?

Starmer says, "Where people have no right to be here, they will be removed."

He says he would "negotiate returns agreements with individual states and the European Union, creating a mechanism for those in Britain unlawfully to be removed."

Would a Labour government want to sign returns agreements with countries which have terrible human rights records, like Afghanistan? Or are in the grip of civil war?

Since Brexit, even negotiating returns agreements with our European neighbours would be challenging.

So, WHAT EXACTLY IS KEIR STARMER GOING TO DO DIFFERENT THAN THE TORIES HAVE ALREADY TRIED TO DO?

In other words, what is his NEW plan?

Indeed. It's a difficult one for sure BB and no solution would please everyone. Options are extremely limited.

[normal rules]

Starmer saying labour will
Tackle the gangs is like him saying he will
Stop organised drug supply coming into the uk .
Utterly, utterly futile. A pipe dream. A political carrot.
Don’t take my word for it . Let’s re visit this in 4 years time. There will be a few headline grabbing successes but they will be like grains of sand in a desert on the grand scheme.
History will show that the single biggest failure of this incoming labour government will be its inability to stem the tide of migrants crossing the channel. If I’m Honest I don’t envy them .

[Iberian Red]

Starmer saying labour will
Tackle the gangs is like him saying he will
Stop organised drug supply coming into the uk .
Utterly, utterly futile. A pipe dream. A political carrot.
Don’t take my word for it . Let’s re visit this in 4 years time. There will be a few headline grabbing successes but they will be like grains of sand in a desert on the grand scheme.

Rishi stopped the boats.

Johnson got Brexit done.

What a horrible future we have.

[i_ateallthepies]

I suspect the question should be what is Starmer's plan that is different to that of the Tories, apart from cancelling the Rwanda plan?

Starmer says, "Where people have no right to be here, they will be removed."

He says he would "negotiate returns agreements with individual states and the European Union, creating a mechanism for those in Britain unlawfully to be removed."

Would a Labour government want to sign returns agreements with countries which have terrible human rights records, like Afghanistan? Or are in the grip of civil war?

Since Brexit, even negotiating returns agreements with our European neighbours would be challenging.

So, WHAT EXACTLY IS KEIR STARMER GOING TO DO DIFFERENT THAN THE TORIES HAVE ALREADY TRIED TO DO?

In other words, what is his NEW plan?

People arriving from countries with terrible human rights records and claiming asylum are unlikely to be sent back to those countries since that is the whole purpose of asylum arrangements.  Come on BB, do keep up.