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Precisely DO.This is party politics returning. I'm struggling to see what else Starmer could or should do other than to say to Johnson, "you cooked up this shit storm. You sit down and eat it and don't expect me to sort it out for you, or give you a target to chuck it at."We are in a totally different world to where we were 18 months ago when there was a chance of forming a political alliance to let the (by then) actual opinion of the majority prevail. That's gone now. Brexit is going to happen. Those who wanted it and worked for it need to own the consequences.That starts with Johnson. Good luck to him on pushing through a policy that will shave more big chunks off an economy that has already had its worst shock for 300 years.Brexit belongs to him. He masterminded it. He can manage it.
Sadly, Boris already has a get out of jail card, it's called Covid 19. The majority of ills post Brexit will be blamed on that, the remainder on the EU. And his followers and Brexiteers will lap it up. Even a hard Brexit becomes easier for him to manage as CV19 won't be over by then and we will, in effect, roll seamlessly, (so far as blame is concerned), from one to another.
Unfortunately IDM either those that voted for him and his party last time chose to ignore or forget his own an his party's failures and lies over the previous 10 years.
Quote from: SydneyRover on May 12, 2020, 09:18:48 amUnfortunately IDM either those that voted for him and his party last time chose to ignore or forget his own an his party's failures and lies over the previous 10 years.The last GE was all about brexit and folks not wanting Corbyn. In a few weeks, Starmer has come across far better than Corbyn ever did. You have to hope that Starmer is genuine and not putting in a good face..Next GE brexit will be completely done and dusted and we will know more about the after effects, as well as the performance of this government after coronavirus, and any more cock ups they may have.If Starmer plays his cards right he could have a win next GE similar to Blair’s first.
Quote from: Not Now Kato on May 12, 2020, 08:37:53 amSadly, Boris already has a get out of jail card, it's called Covid 19. The majority of ills post Brexit will be blamed on that, the remainder on the EU. And his followers and Brexiteers will lap it up. Even a hard Brexit becomes easier for him to manage as CV19 won't be over by then and we will, in effect, roll seamlessly, (so far as blame is concerned), from one to another.He'll find it a bit difficult to explain away why everybody else's economy recovers after Covid while ours continues to go down the toilet though. Because it'll be either Brexit to blame, or his management of Covid/the economy.
Unless Johnson is truly insane, his negotiating position is a busted flush. It relies on him genuinely being prepared to walk away without a trade deal in December.Really?In the current situation?After seeing folk fist fighting over the last shit roll in Waitrose, are we REALLY going to choose to collapse our supply chains while we are still dealing with this epidemic?
Quote from: IDM on May 12, 2020, 09:47:49 amQuote from: SydneyRover on May 12, 2020, 09:18:48 amUnfortunately IDM either those that voted for him and his party last time chose to ignore or forget his own an his party's failures and lies over the previous 10 years.The last GE was all about brexit and folks not wanting Corbyn. In a few weeks, Starmer has come across far better than Corbyn ever did. You have to hope that Starmer is genuine and not putting in a good face..Next GE brexit will be completely done and dusted and we will know more about the after effects, as well as the performance of this government after coronavirus, and any more cock ups they may have.If Starmer plays his cards right he could have a win next GE similar to Blair’s first.As I've already said on here IDM, Starmer is a decent guy, and could well be a good Labour leader, or even a good Prime Minister.However, there are two factions of people who have issues with him; Corbyn supporters and fans of Momentum; and Northern Brexit voters. For him to win a majority the size of Blair's in 1997, he MUST get all of them back on board.I honestly can't see how he'll do it.
Steve, he is also going to have to overcome the realignment of mostly London Boroughs constituencies that could win the Tories up to 20 more seats.
Sydney, it is quite clear now, we would like a free trade deal similar to what other countries have got with the EU such as Canada, we also will not be beholden to the EU courts. If they do not agree that, then we leave at the end of the year and trade under World Trade rules. The free trade rules are what we trade under now with other countries such as the USA so are known to both parties, the Eu courts will have no jurisdiction so there is nothing to agree only a few minor points, manufacturing standards we already adhere to and have agreed to the same standards or better. We also already trade with nations under WTO rules, and both parties know the end date. Barnier is not saying tic tock tic tock now, he is saying it is a short time to get an agreement. That is because it is his arse that is in the firing line buddy.
Quote from: scawsby steve on May 12, 2020, 04:20:16 pmQuote from: IDM on May 12, 2020, 09:47:49 amQuote from: SydneyRover on May 12, 2020, 09:18:48 amUnfortunately IDM either those that voted for him and his party last time chose to ignore or forget his own an his party's failures and lies over the previous 10 years.The last GE was all about brexit and folks not wanting Corbyn. In a few weeks, Starmer has come across far better than Corbyn ever did. You have to hope that Starmer is genuine and not putting in a good face..Next GE brexit will be completely done and dusted and we will know more about the after effects, as well as the performance of this government after coronavirus, and any more cock ups they may have.If Starmer plays his cards right he could have a win next GE similar to Blair’s first.As I've already said on here IDM, Starmer is a decent guy, and could well be a good Labour leader, or even a good Prime Minister.However, there are two factions of people who have issues with him; Corbyn supporters and fans of Momentum; and Northern Brexit voters. For him to win a majority the size of Blair's in 1997, he MUST get all of them back on board.I honestly can't see how he'll do it.And where exactly do Momentum have issues with him? In the pages of the right wing press? Momentum's former National Coordinator was one of Starmer's main backers. This is what Momentum tweeted about him yesterday https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1259888498280067072Its the Daily Mail, Daily Express & S*n that have issues with him. I wonder why they might not want him to be successful?
I don't read newspapers Wilts, so I wouldn't know what their issues are with anybody. I personally know lots of ultra-left people, and they didn't want Starmer, they wanted Long-Bailey.That's hardly the issue though. The issue is turning an 80 seat Tory majority into a huge Labour majority. Anyone thinking that's going to be a doddle is seriously deluded.The reason I'm able to be so objective on all of this, is because I'm completely non-partisan, and therefore unblinkered.