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The Maybot is desperate to hold the warring factions in the Tory Party from full on blue on blue civil war. At some point, she will have to face the fact that this is not acheivable, in the circumstances she has created.If Treeza were a bright lass, she would agree to rule out "no deal", and widen the potential support base for a viable alternative.The ERG would be livid, but also between a rock and a hard place. They are content to drift towards the rocks, as long as no deal remains the default.Once it is off the table, they can either row in behind a revision brought via an amendment, or split off from the parliamentary Tory Party.There would be payback from the members for May, but she is standing down anyway, so does not need to keep them sweet.But Treeza is not the sharpest blade in the toolbox......not by a long chalk!
Quote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 09:40:22 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 09:30:17 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 07:04:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:55:18 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 06:47:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.Oh, you've been invited to them have you? That's what been reported by the BBC as happening. The other parties (LibDems, SNP, Plaid Cymru, Green), although they have met with her have also asked May to take No Deal off the table before talking and she's refused, so end of discussion.What's your version of what has been happening?She'd be damn right stupid if she took no deal off the table, it's her strongest bargaining chip. it's a funny bargaining chip when it's preventing other parties from being persuaded to back her in Parliament.It's not preventing them at all. The irony that is lost on you is that in order to stop exiting on WTO terms, then NOW is the time for sensible discussion and discourse. If they don't come to the table, they are proving themselves to be self serving idiots. WTO terms is a real possibility otherwise. Much more likely than a people's vote. May is playing a blinder here.
Quote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 09:30:17 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 07:04:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:55:18 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 06:47:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.Oh, you've been invited to them have you? That's what been reported by the BBC as happening. The other parties (LibDems, SNP, Plaid Cymru, Green), although they have met with her have also asked May to take No Deal off the table before talking and she's refused, so end of discussion.What's your version of what has been happening?She'd be damn right stupid if she took no deal off the table, it's her strongest bargaining chip. it's a funny bargaining chip when it's preventing other parties from being persuaded to back her in Parliament.
Quote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 07:04:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:55:18 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 06:47:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.Oh, you've been invited to them have you? That's what been reported by the BBC as happening. The other parties (LibDems, SNP, Plaid Cymru, Green), although they have met with her have also asked May to take No Deal off the table before talking and she's refused, so end of discussion.What's your version of what has been happening?She'd be damn right stupid if she took no deal off the table, it's her strongest bargaining chip.
Quote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:55:18 pmQuote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 06:47:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.Oh, you've been invited to them have you? That's what been reported by the BBC as happening. The other parties (LibDems, SNP, Plaid Cymru, Green), although they have met with her have also asked May to take No Deal off the table before talking and she's refused, so end of discussion.What's your version of what has been happening?
Quote from: Glyn_Wigley on January 17, 2019, 06:47:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.Oh, you've been invited to them have you?
Quote from: Boomstick on January 17, 2019, 06:42:42 pmSo your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening? If you can call something like :"What will you compromise on, PM?""Nothing, you have to vote for my deal""Goodbye"as a discussion, then yes, they are taking place.
So your saying these discussions that are happening, aren't happening?
BSNo Deal/WTO Brexit isn't on the agenda. There are 550+ MPs who will not allow it. If May doesn't see sense and kill that idea, she will be sidelined, by Cabinet, Tory Party or the Commons and a bill will be brought to put that stupid concept where it belongs.
Indeed. And what I'm waiting for someone to explain to me (because I genuinely do not know) is the Parliamentary process that will happen to thwart a no deal. The fact that there are allegedly hundreds of MPs against it is all well and good. But Article 50 is enshrined in UK Law. Overturning that requires the government support overturning it and the same goes for a second referendum. I'm interested to know how certain people can be so absolutely and vehemently convinced that no deal is never going to happen. It really doesn't appear that clear cut to me. Hence the vote of no confidence, of which there will be more and the "amendment" to the Finance Bill last week. If it were so simple to revoke or delah article 50, why haven't they done it yet? The closer we get to a no deal, the more votes of no confidence you are going to see. Hence my earlier comment that those 30 Europhile MPs are at some point going to find themselves choosing between no deal or bringing down the government.
Interesting piece by Preston, Glyn.That sums up what I mean by being worried about May's connection with reality. She is outwardly acting as though she truly was a Strong and Stable leader. She's behaving as though she is dictating the agenda. But she's not dictating anything. No-one is listening to her. She doesn't have the power to direct anyone to follow the path that she wants. It's bizarre and, from a human point of view, a bit sad to watch. She's acting like she thinks she's Churchill. Everyone else sees her as Captain Mainwaring.
Actually, I'm quite pleased with that Captain Mainwaring analogy. He had a massively over-inflated sense of his own ability and authority. He "led" a team that squabbled like kids, were absolutely hopeless at what they were doing, and were convinced that nasty Europeans were trying to destroy their way of life. When faced with the enemy, he had nothing whatsoever to fight with. And everything he touched turned to shite.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on January 18, 2019, 10:31:46 amInteresting piece by Preston, Glyn.That sums up what I mean by being worried about May's connection with reality. She is outwardly acting as though she truly was a Strong and Stable leader. She's behaving as though she is dictating the agenda. But she's not dictating anything. No-one is listening to her. She doesn't have the power to direct anyone to follow the path that she wants. It's bizarre and, from a human point of view, a bit sad to watch. She's acting like she thinks she's Churchill. Everyone else sees her as Captain Mainwaring. That's a bit generous. Captain Birdseye would appear more statesmanlike than her.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on January 18, 2019, 10:54:04 amActually, I'm quite pleased with that Captain Mainwaring analogy. He had a massively over-inflated sense of his own ability and authority. He "led" a team that squabbled like kids, were absolutely hopeless at what they were doing, and were convinced that nasty Europeans were trying to destroy their way of life. When faced with the enemy, he had nothing whatsoever to fight with. And everything he touched turned to shite. Nah, Mainwaring's troops actually followed him.Oh, and , even though they were hopeless and had no real weaponry, you know that every one of them would fight to the death regardless if faced with the real enemy.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on January 18, 2019, 10:31:46 amInteresting piece by Preston, Glyn.That sums up what I mean by being worried about May's connection with reality. She is outwardly acting as though she truly was a Strong and Stable leader. She's behaving as though she is dictating the agenda. But she's not dictating anything. No-one is listening to her. She doesn't have the power to direct anyone to follow the path that she wants. It's bizarre and, from a human point of view, a bit sad to watch. She's acting like she thinks she's Churchill. Everyone else sees her as Captain Mainwaring. She’s not a “normal” person though is she. The world is evolving so fast and the parliamentary system is still the same as it was 200 years ago and we end up with leaders like May. The whole system needs changing. You only have to watch the way MPs behave in the commons. It’s completely unprofessional at times and a lot of them just appear rude with their shouting out and grumbling. It’s completely outdated.