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DW...I've never voted Labour in my life,i voted Liberal when I was younger but have been a Tory ever since.My position right now is that I'm not anything..I'm waiting to be swayed by a party who is prepared to show some proper unity and strength and if that was Labour then I would vote for them... I've always said if you cant be bothered to use your democratic right to go and put a cross in a box,dont argue about the concequences,but right at this minute if we had a GE tomorrow I couldn't in all faith go out and support any of them and that's a sad reflection on were we are...
Wing CommanderAs I've posted before, I was a fervent Corbyn supporter prior to the last election and wasn't surprised by the surge in Labour support then.However I think that horse has now bolted and have been very disappointed by his performance since. The last straw for me is his refusal to engage in these cross party talks. In the past he's engaged with all sorts of dodgy and dangerous organisations to try to sort things out with dialogue but refuses to get involved in this and orders the rest of his MP's to do the same. He does not appeal to anyone other than a few MPs and Momentum. He needs to step down as his public persona is f***ed.
Thing about praising Cable or Lucas for being open, is that neither of them have a shot at power and neither of them have a fractious, split party and electorate to keep happy. Corbyn had a reputation for being direct and honest as a backbencher. That literally did not last 3 months when he took over as Labour leader. He was immediately into fudging answers on everything from whether he would kneel in front of the Queen to whether he wanted us out of NATO. Because he knew that a straight, honest answer would alienate people who he had to attract.It's not the fault of the individuals. It's our idiotic party system where the two main parties are designed facto coalitions, covering wide ranges of opinion. So the leaders HAVE to fudge and evade if they are not going to piss off one part of their support.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on January 18, 2019, 11:56:09 amThing about praising Cable or Lucas for being open, is that neither of them have a shot at power and neither of them have a fractious, split party and electorate to keep happy. Corbyn had a reputation for being direct and honest as a backbencher. That literally did not last 3 months when he took over as Labour leader. He was immediately into fudging answers on everything from whether he would kneel in front of the Queen to whether he wanted us out of NATO. Because he knew that a straight, honest answer would alienate people who he had to attract.It's not the fault of the individuals. It's our idiotic party system where the two main parties are designed facto coalitions, covering wide ranges of opinion. So the leaders HAVE to fudge and evade if they are not going to piss off one part of their support.Interesting to me BST that you say that Cable and Lucas can be honest because they dont have a shot of aging power.That reminded me of the election promises that Corbyn made at the last GE in an attempt to gain votes, particularly the young vote.He knew he had no chance of winning and so was in a position where he could promise anything without having to deliver.Wing commander, I also have voted Tory for quite a few years now, however I always feel that my vote is wasted because of where I live, knowing full well that Labour will always win the local election.Whether I vote or not, the outcome is always going to be the same.
The politicians trying to block Brexit are all traitors and no respecters of democracy. If remain had won the referendum we would have heard no more about this and had we still been banging on about it two and a half years later would have been branded as bad losers.It's funny that this area for so strong a vote for leaving but there are so many on here that oppose the common view.
Quote from: Axholme Lion on January 18, 2019, 04:27:58 pmThe politicians trying to block Brexit are all traitors and no respecters of democracy. If remain had won the referendum we would have heard no more about this and had we still been banging on about it two and a half years later would have been branded as bad losers.It's funny that this area for so strong a vote for leaving but there are so many on here that oppose the common view.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36306681https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nigel-farage-wants-second-referendum-7985017https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/01/11/brexit-bulletin-nigel-farages-business-looks-unfinished/Farage was agitating for a second vote before the first was even held so that's b*llocks. Not to mention that petition that was actually started by a leave voter thinking they'd lost.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6606197/German-industry-looking-abyss-warns-countrys-business-chiefs.htmlThey will bottle it if we stand firm.
Quote from: RedJ on January 18, 2019, 04:40:09 pmQuote from: Axholme Lion on January 18, 2019, 04:27:58 pmThe politicians trying to block Brexit are all traitors and no respecters of democracy. If remain had won the referendum we would have heard no more about this and had we still been banging on about it two and a half years later would have been branded as bad losers.It's funny that this area for so strong a vote for leaving but there are so many on here that oppose the common view.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36306681https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nigel-farage-wants-second-referendum-7985017https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/01/11/brexit-bulletin-nigel-farages-business-looks-unfinished/Farage was agitating for a second vote before the first was even held so that's b*llocks. Not to mention that petition that was actually started by a leave voter thinking they'd lost.Say what you want, it would have all been forgotten by now.
Indeed. And what I'm waiting for someone to explain to me (because I genuinely do not know) is the Parliamentary process that will happen to thwart a no deal. The fact that there are allegedly hundreds of MPs against it is all well and good. But Article 50 is enshrined in UK Law. Overturning that requires the government support overturning it and the same goes for a second referendum. I'm interested to know how certain people can be so absolutely and vehemently convinced that no deal is never going to happen. It really doesn't appear that clear cut to me. Hence the vote of no confidence, of which there will be more and the "amendment" to the Finance Bill last week. If it were so simple to revoke or delah article 50, why haven't they done it yet?
I wonder if Boles will get more messages like this as a result?https://mobile.twitter.com/NickBoles/status/1082919112404357120Or more phone calls like the one a couple of nights ago threatening to burn his house down?
Well personally I can't see how the UK Government threatening the UK Parliament that the British public will have a shortage of some foods and medicine whilst being catastrophic for manufacturing and farming if they don't vote for their deal is a good look for 'bargaining', but maybe that's just me.
Aye. What bargaining!Give us what we want or we'll...or we'll...or we'll blow our f**king heads off.