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It's a deeply weird situation. She is in a position where she is untouchable in Parliament, but utterly impotent. What you've just seen tonight was a PM venting her fury over that situation. But a British PM saying to the UK people that she is on their side and Parliament isn't? f**k me! Just stop and think about that.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 08:55:13 pmIt's a deeply weird situation. She is in a position where she is untouchable in Parliament, but utterly impotent. What you've just seen tonight was a PM venting her fury over that situation. But a British PM saying to the UK people that she is on their side and Parliament isn't? f**k me! Just stop and think about that. Wasn’t Hitler on the side of the German people?
Does she have advisors feeding her crap saying everyone loves Brexit and thinks she's doing brilliant?
Quote from: Boomstick on March 20, 2019, 03:55:59 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 02:44:10 pmYou know what? It's a sad statement on where discussion has got to when a smart bloke like Wing Co thinks that any of us are taking pleasure in seeing our country humiliate itself like this, and run the risk of stumbling into economic catastrophe. Isn't it possible for intelligent, honest people to disagree without being seen as simply wanting to win an argument?Intelligent and honest people can disagree, but intelligent honest people give alternatives too. You lot don't, just moan and criticise and don't come up with realistic alternatives. This is a gem. I think I'm going to print it out and frame it. I assume you've not bothered reading g the 70 pages on this thread or the 100 and odd on the other one where the pros and cons of everything from No Deal to Ref2 have been discussed to exhaustion? You see that as just moaning and criticising?Here's the summary:No Deal. Total freedom for us to do whatever we want trade wise and politically. But the consequence being that we have a long, slow hit to our economy over the long term, and an unknown immediate hard and sharp hit. No one suggests we can come out net positive for a generation or more. Crisis in NI. Absolutely not what anyone on the Leave side was proposing in 2016. Supported now only by people on the Far Right.May's deal: Sorts out the Irish problem short term by tying us into the CU. Possibility of us leaving if a technical solution to NI is found in the future, but no-one knows what that is. Supported by centrist Tories. Opposed by everyone else. Still results in a long slow economic hit. Norway+ deal: Keeps us in the SM and CU. We leave the political aspects of the EU Minimises the economic hit. Proposed loudly and frequently by Farage in 2016. Now apparently it's a betrayal of Brexit. Possibly supported by Labour and a group of other MPs Ref 2: Puts the question back to the people with a proper understanding of the issues,and multiple options. Difficult to implement given the number of politicians who have upped the ante by calling it a betrayal of democracy. There you go. Take your pick. Discuss any of the above like an adult.Or just complain that everyone who disagrees with you is a moaning traitor. Your choice.
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 02:44:10 pmYou know what? It's a sad statement on where discussion has got to when a smart bloke like Wing Co thinks that any of us are taking pleasure in seeing our country humiliate itself like this, and run the risk of stumbling into economic catastrophe. Isn't it possible for intelligent, honest people to disagree without being seen as simply wanting to win an argument?Intelligent and honest people can disagree, but intelligent honest people give alternatives too. You lot don't, just moan and criticise and don't come up with realistic alternatives.
You know what? It's a sad statement on where discussion has got to when a smart bloke like Wing Co thinks that any of us are taking pleasure in seeing our country humiliate itself like this, and run the risk of stumbling into economic catastrophe. Isn't it possible for intelligent, honest people to disagree without being seen as simply wanting to win an argument?
I'm beginning to actually believe a lot of you take pleasure in the uk's predicament just so you can lambast the Tory's and May..Which I believe is Labours plan as well in the forlorn hope they can get a GE.. personally I don't give 2 hoots what the EU want..I want what's best for the UK..
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 05:39:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on March 20, 2019, 03:55:59 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 02:44:10 pmYou know what? It's a sad statement on where discussion has got to when a smart bloke like Wing Co thinks that any of us are taking pleasure in seeing our country humiliate itself like this, and run the risk of stumbling into economic catastrophe. Isn't it possible for intelligent, honest people to disagree without being seen as simply wanting to win an argument?Intelligent and honest people can disagree, but intelligent honest people give alternatives too. You lot don't, just moan and criticise and don't come up with realistic alternatives. This is a gem. I think I'm going to print it out and frame it. I assume you've not bothered reading g the 70 pages on this thread or the 100 and odd on the other one where the pros and cons of everything from No Deal to Ref2 have been discussed to exhaustion? You see that as just moaning and criticising?Here's the summary:No Deal. Total freedom for us to do whatever we want trade wise and politically. But the consequence being that we have a long, slow hit to our economy over the long term, and an unknown immediate hard and sharp hit. No one suggests we can come out net positive for a generation or more. Crisis in NI. Absolutely not what anyone on the Leave side was proposing in 2016. Supported now only by people on the Far Right.May's deal: Sorts out the Irish problem short term by tying us into the CU. Possibility of us leaving if a technical solution to NI is found in the future, but no-one knows what that is. Supported by centrist Tories. Opposed by everyone else. Still results in a long slow economic hit. Norway+ deal: Keeps us in the SM and CU. We leave the political aspects of the EU Minimises the economic hit. Proposed loudly and frequently by Farage in 2016. Now apparently it's a betrayal of Brexit. Possibly supported by Labour and a group of other MPs Ref 2: Puts the question back to the people with a proper understanding of the issues,and multiple options. Difficult to implement given the number of politicians who have upped the ante by calling it a betrayal of democracy. There you go. Take your pick. Discuss any of the above like an adult.Or just complain that everyone who disagrees with you is a moaning traitor. Your choice.Christ, I know what the options are. Its how you implement them that's the issue? I'm waiting.....
Actually, thinking again, that speech was sinister. She's gone full-on populist. No PM has EVER castigated Parliament like that. It is deeply, deeply dangerous. I genuinely DO think she's unhinged because no sane PM would ever do that.
f**k me. I'm still a Corbyn supporter (just about), but that is f**king dismal behaviour. I have no doubt the meeting was a sham to begin with, but to flounce out under any circumstances is shocking this close to D-day.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584For anyone interested x
Quote from: MachoMadness on March 20, 2019, 10:58:26 pmf**k me. I'm still a Corbyn supporter (just about), but that is f**king dismal behaviour. I have no doubt the meeting was a sham to begin with, but to flounce out under any circumstances is shocking this close to D-day. After him saying you need to speak to people you disagree with i.e. IRA, Hezbollah.
BST I am with you totally on the unhinged bit because time and again she seems to take a breath and then come out with exactly the same viewpoint / proposal / mantra. It is truly bizarre
* Egoism: an excessive preoccupation with one's own advantage at the expense of others and the community* Machiavellianism: a manipulative, callous attitude and a belief that the ends justify the means* Moral disengagement: cognitive processing style that allow behaving unethically without feeling distress* Narcissism: excessive self-absorption, a sense of superiority, and an extreme need for attention from others* Psychological entitlement: a recurring belief that one is better than others and deserves better treatment* Psychopathy: lack of empathy and self-control, combined with impulsive behaviour* Sadism: a desire to inflict mental or physical harm on others for one's own pleasure or to benefit oneself* Self-interest: a desire to further and highlight one's own social and financial status* Spitefulness: destructiveness and willingness to cause harm to others, even if one harms oneself in the process
Apparently it only started last night. Crazy how quick it's grown.
Quote from: DonnyOsmond on March 21, 2019, 07:27:43 amhttps://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584For anyone interested xDone and shared, thanks for the link Donny, it's amazing to watch how fast the number is rising.
Quote from: Boomstick on March 20, 2019, 11:14:56 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 05:39:48 pmQuote from: Boomstick on March 20, 2019, 03:55:59 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 20, 2019, 02:44:10 pmYou know what? It's a sad statement on where discussion has got to when a smart bloke like Wing Co thinks that any of us are taking pleasure in seeing our country humiliate itself like this, and run the risk of stumbling into economic catastrophe. Isn't it possible for intelligent, honest people to disagree without being seen as simply wanting to win an argument?Intelligent and honest people can disagree, but intelligent honest people give alternatives too. You lot don't, just moan and criticise and don't come up with realistic alternatives. This is a gem. I think I'm going to print it out and frame it. I assume you've not bothered reading g the 70 pages on this thread or the 100 and odd on the other one where the pros and cons of everything from No Deal to Ref2 have been discussed to exhaustion? You see that as just moaning and criticising?Here's the summary:No Deal. Total freedom for us to do whatever we want trade wise and politically. But the consequence being that we have a long, slow hit to our economy over the long term, and an unknown immediate hard and sharp hit. No one suggests we can come out net positive for a generation or more. Crisis in NI. Absolutely not what anyone on the Leave side was proposing in 2016. Supported now only by people on the Far Right.May's deal: Sorts out the Irish problem short term by tying us into the CU. Possibility of us leaving if a technical solution to NI is found in the future, but no-one knows what that is. Supported by centrist Tories. Opposed by everyone else. Still results in a long slow economic hit. Norway+ deal: Keeps us in the SM and CU. We leave the political aspects of the EU Minimises the economic hit. Proposed loudly and frequently by Farage in 2016. Now apparently it's a betrayal of Brexit. Possibly supported by Labour and a group of other MPs Ref 2: Puts the question back to the people with a proper understanding of the issues,and multiple options. Difficult to implement given the number of politicians who have upped the ante by calling it a betrayal of democracy. There you go. Take your pick. Discuss any of the above like an adult.Or just complain that everyone who disagrees with you is a moaning traitor. Your choice.Christ, I know what the options are. Its how you implement them that's the issue? I'm waiting.....You need to pick one first.
Quote from: SydneyRover on March 21, 2019, 07:54:39 amQuote from: DonnyOsmond on March 21, 2019, 07:27:43 amhttps://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584For anyone interested xDone and shared, thanks for the link Donny, it's amazing to watch how fast the number is rising.Already 620.000 signed up for this in 12 hours but my Reply #2120 above would still apply I am guessing