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Author Topic: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson  (Read 82219 times)

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SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #60 on August 02, 2019, 12:53:24 am by SydneyRover »
an independent NI, and Scotland for that matter, would be light years away from being in a credible position to meet the EU joining requirements.
There is nothing to stop Ireland, Scotland, NI and Wales for that matter joining a common trading group.



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SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #61 on August 02, 2019, 07:28:49 am by SouthStandFan »
Good for them if they do, I wish we could be in a trading partnership with our neighbours that didn't include politics and third party control of our national interest

Scotland, Wales and NI receive more than their fair share of UK Govt total money, 10 to 20 percent more per person per year. Once they've made up for their current net deficit input, and accounted for their portion of the UK national debt.... I'd wish them all the very best.

However, I think the SNP for one should be careful what they wish for. Scotland is currently reliant on the other UK nations to top up its income. As per the other thread I'd be interested to see where Scottish cuts would come.

If scotland had gone independent last time around they would already be bankrupt. They clearly need a better plan

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #62 on August 02, 2019, 07:37:38 am by SydneyRover »
Lets hope the Scots don't ask for their North Sea Oil money back aye?

Dude, where's my North Sea oil money?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/13/north-sea-oil-money-uk-norwegians-fund


Filo

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #63 on August 02, 2019, 07:48:27 am by Filo »
Lets hope the Scots don't ask for their North Sea Oil money back aye?

Dude, where's my North Sea oil money?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/13/north-sea-oil-money-uk-norwegians-fund



That does not surprise me one bit, what does surprise me is the people of this Country keep on letting it happen

SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #64 on August 02, 2019, 07:50:15 am by SouthStandFan »
Interesting read. Is there any agreement in place that says the oil fields would be in Scotlands territorial waters in the event of a UK divide? As it stands the waters are british not scottish.

Let's hope we dont ask for our Barnett formula subsidies back eh?

It works both ways. Perhaps not to the tune of the billions of oil money but the principle is the same.



SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #65 on August 02, 2019, 08:16:54 am by SydneyRover »
Interesting read. Is there any agreement in place that says the oil fields would be in Scotlands territorial waters in the event of a UK divide? As it stands the waters are british not scottish.

Let's hope we dont ask for our Barnett formula subsidies back eh?

It works both ways. Perhaps not to the tune of the billions of oil money but the principle is the same.

So isn't the answer that when we are in the UK together they are our debts and our profits? You haven't commented on Thatcher's profligacy?

SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #66 on August 02, 2019, 08:22:06 am by SouthStandFan »
Our debts and profits... you were the one saying they should claim the oil money back!

I cant comment on the figures as I cant find a link to back them up. If they're right then of course it doesn't paint a great picture.

That doesn't mean we should end austerity now because of the past bad decisions. We are continuing to get into more debt at a rate of over £5000 per second. And you would have us spend more???

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #67 on August 02, 2019, 08:29:47 am by SydneyRover »
Our debts and profits... you were the one saying they should claim the oil money back!

No, that's not what I said.

I cant comment on the figures as I cant find a link to back them up. If they're right then of course it doesn't paint a great picture.

I'm patient.

That doesn't mean we should end austerity now because of the past bad decisions. We are continuing to get into more debt at a rate of over £5000 per second. And you would have us spend more???

Austerity is what is shackling the economy, putting more money into the hands of those that will spend it all is better than putting it into the hands of those that will squirrel it away. Are we going around in circles here?

BillyStubbsTears

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #68 on August 02, 2019, 08:50:46 am by BillyStubbsTears »
Good for them if they do, I wish we could be in a trading partnership with our neighbours that didn't include politics and third party control of our national interest.

That'd be good wouldn't it? Getting all the benefits of a trading partnership without giving up any control. I'll have some of that.

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #69 on August 02, 2019, 09:01:16 am by SydneyRover »
I'd like to get your take on the Lynton Crosby headlines today BST, it's a bit scary what these bas**rds are getting up to?

foxbat

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #70 on August 02, 2019, 02:27:57 pm by foxbat »
We are in the midst of a right-wing coup & have been for 3+ years. Getting us to vote on leaving the EU was never about whether our EU membership was good for us or not, it was simply the vehicle for those who wanted to seize absolute power to achieve their nefarious goals.

Johnson's "War cabinet" will spend at wartime levels on state propaganda. Because it's a war against you, the poor, the students, the old, the sick, the young families - oh and manufacturing. It's a war for greed and racism.



SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #71 on August 02, 2019, 03:37:00 pm by SouthStandFan »
We are in the midst of a right-wing coup & have been for 3+ years. Getting us to vote on leaving the EU was never about whether our EU membership was good for us or not, it was simply the vehicle for those who wanted to seize absolute power to achieve their nefarious goals.

Johnson's "War cabinet" will spend at wartime levels on state propaganda. Because it's a war against you, the poor, the students, the old, the sick, the young families - oh and manufacturing. It's a war for greed and racism.
What's wrong with right wing. Why has that become a dirty word. A few years of proper, right wing, conservative (little C) values might get the country back on track.

Conflating the right with automatic racism is insulting and unnecessary.

I'm open to debate but there is some rampant socialist elements here it seems. Also, and not necessarily in this post, but in general, more than a hint of patronizing tone, as I've said before... which, if you understand those right of center, and if you truly understood the working class (which I am but it depends my which metric you use)... you would avoid.

Patronising Brexit voters, patronising right wingers, I can assure you is only a route to the cementing of their/my views. Perhaps if Labour/Lib Dems understood that they would win more people over.

RedJ

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #72 on August 02, 2019, 03:40:06 pm by RedJ »
Just my opinion but in recent years the centre ground appears to have shifted to the right to the extent that the far right isn't as, well, far as it once was. Perhaps why it's become something of a dirty word.

foxbat

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #73 on August 02, 2019, 04:44:13 pm by foxbat »
'  proper, right wing, conservative (little C) values ' ? a big contradiction in this for me.

I think they hark back to Macmiliian's days and were replaced by Thatcher's values , that devastated this country and Doncaster in particular, that set up a virtual police state to destroy the mining industry .

anyone who criticised this was a 'socialist' , heaven forbid , almost an enemy of the state.

and this government and cabinet have moved a long way on from even that.
Bring back capital punishment Patel ? bring back pounds shillings and pence Mogg ?

there was a good programme on the history of spain and Franco in the week.
As he marched through the country , town by town , anyone who he didn't like , critic, different religion , gay,  was declared an 'enemy of spain ' , lined up against the wall and shot.

That's right wing for you.








scawsby steve

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #74 on August 02, 2019, 04:51:26 pm by scawsby steve »
What's wrong with right wingers? Johnny Mooney was f*cking brilliant for us.

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #75 on August 02, 2019, 11:44:00 pm by SydneyRover »
We are in the midst of a right-wing coup & have been for 3+ years. Getting us to vote on leaving the EU was never about whether our EU membership was good for us or not, it was simply the vehicle for those who wanted to seize absolute power to achieve their nefarious goals.

Johnson's "War cabinet" will spend at wartime levels on state propaganda. Because it's a war against you, the poor, the students, the old, the sick, the young families - oh and manufacturing. It's a war for greed and racism.
What's wrong with right wing. Why has that become a dirty word. A few years of proper, right wing, conservative (little C) values might get the country back on track.

Conflating the right with automatic racism is insulting and unnecessary.

I'm open to debate but there is some rampant socialist elements here it seems. Also, and not necessarily in this post, but in general, more than a hint of patronizing tone, as I've said before... which, if you understand those right of center, and if you truly understood the working class (which I am but it depends my which metric you use)... you would avoid.

Patronising Brexit voters, patronising right wingers, I can assure you is only a route to the cementing of their/my views. Perhaps if Labour/Lib Dems understood that they would win more people over.

SSF, you think boris piffle johnson is a reputable person, a person of integrity and sound judgement, enough to be running the country, think back over the highlights of his career of his journalism career, mayor of London and then as an MP, couldn't even bring himself to cast a vote for an airport expansion.

''Conflating the right with automatic racism is insulting and unnecessary.''

How can you not conflate the right with racism when your party of the right has just elected a racist for a leader?

 The racism shit we fight it on a local level in sport while boris piffle johnson exported it in his role as Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, is this the sort of conservative you want to run britain? the choice appears at the moment to be the continuation of the highly discredited Austerity or throwing money around like sailors on shore-leave.

''What's wrong with right wing. Why has that become a dirty word'' - this is what's wrong and you appear to be happy to vote for him. It appears to be OK to say you are a moderate conservative but elect a right wing government.

Is it not patronising and absolving your party of blame to address the issue of millions living in poverty in Britain to say "that's not real poverty" it's poverty in name only? How many food banks are there in Britain?

You still haven't addressed the question over Thatcher's frittering away the 10s of billions of oil money instead of investing in the country's future nor have you addressed Austerity or are you an adherent of trickle down.

''A few years of proper, right wing, conservative (little C) values might get the country back on track''

This is taking the piss, right? and patronising to the extreme.



« Last Edit: August 03, 2019, 01:56:58 am by SydneyRover »

wilts rover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #76 on August 03, 2019, 09:24:36 am by wilts rover »
Just my opinion but in recent years the centre ground appears to have shifted to the right to the extent that the far right isn't as, well, far as it once was. Perhaps why it's become something of a dirty word.

Extremism is still extremist however popular it is - there are plenty of examples from history to show that.

But you are correct in the way media propoganda is trying to change/shape public opinion. For example a publicly funded, free at the point of service, health service is now 'far-left'. Whilst privatisation of public services and tax cuts for the top 10% was the choice of 40% of people in Brecon last Thursday.

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #77 on August 03, 2019, 09:45:55 am by SydneyRover »
Those that control the media/message shape the future.

SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #78 on August 03, 2019, 03:02:11 pm by SouthStandFan »
It's odd that a thread that has turned into calling right wingers racist started with an accusation that boris' name and background mean he cant possibly support the people of donny.

If I started a thread with the same connotations about a stereotypically black or asian or middle eastern name what would the reaction be?

I think that very post, post one of this thread, speaks volumes about the openness and tolerance of the left.

SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #79 on August 03, 2019, 03:26:07 pm by SouthStandFan »
I never said it's not real poverty. I said our UK idea of poverty is different to the UNs more widely recognised levels.

Do I want people to have to use food banks, or course I dont and I help those less fortunate where I can. But through years of left wing policies where have we ended up?

I havent answered the Thatcher points as I wasnt alive and havent the time or inclination to research it.

Neither you nor I are going to reverse our position, and that's fine by me. I've not written anything with the intent of winding or patronizing anyone. Apologies if it does or is recieved that way.

Right wingers can be compassionate, can be promoters of diversity, inclusion, fairness.... those qualities aren't purely indicative of the left despite the moral high ground some people perceive that they hold.

SouthStandFan

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #80 on August 03, 2019, 03:27:01 pm by SouthStandFan »
Excuse my crap English, on mobile.

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #81 on August 03, 2019, 09:29:58 pm by SydneyRover »
Excuse my crap English, on mobile.

What about you a small 'C' electing a right wing racist leader? who talks about ''Watermelon smiles'' and ''piccaninnies''

If you read up about Thatcher (and Austerity which you keep avoiding) maybe you would understand more why the UK is in a fiscal hole today and there is this disbelief when people trot out that conservatives understand economics.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2019, 09:34:39 pm by SydneyRover »

Glyn_Wigley

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #82 on August 03, 2019, 10:13:20 pm by Glyn_Wigley »
The Conservatives run the economy like an accountant would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #83 on August 05, 2019, 12:13:16 am by SydneyRover »
Do you think boris is a small 'c' or a big 'C'  :blink:

Glyn_Wigley

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #84 on August 05, 2019, 12:32:17 am by Glyn_Wigley »
Depends on whether he's got his mouth open or not.

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #85 on August 05, 2019, 08:57:37 pm by Bentley Bullet »
The Conservatives run the economy like an accountant would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

Corbyn would run the country like a communist would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

Glyn_Wigley

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #86 on August 05, 2019, 09:03:43 pm by Glyn_Wigley »
The Conservatives run the economy like an accountant would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

Corbyn would run the country like a communist would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

Salt mines of Middlewich for you then!

wilts rover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #87 on August 05, 2019, 09:11:52 pm by wilts rover »
The Conservatives run the economy like an accountant would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

Corbyn would run the country like a communist would instead of trying to run it like an economist would.

If that is so then he will only be the 2nd communist in No.10 this year. Johnson's new Director of Policy is a former member of the Revolutionary Communist Party. Among other policy announcements she has called for an 'erosion of public freedoms'.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/05/boris-johnson-ushers-in-radical-new-era-of-special-advisers

Bentley Bullet

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #88 on August 05, 2019, 10:43:53 pm by Bentley Bullet »
Some of the best of us had Communist tendencies when we were young 'uns. Even I did. Most of us grow up though. Poor old Jezza's leaving it a bit late!

SydneyRover

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Re: Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson
« Reply #89 on August 05, 2019, 11:07:26 pm by SydneyRover »
Pulling up the ladder, I'm alright syndrome.

''Does Money Make People Right-Wing and Inegalitarian? A Longitudinal Study of Lottery Winners''

''The  causes  of  people’s  political  attitudes  are largely  unknown.    We  study  this issue by exploiting longitudinal data on lottery winners.  Comparing people before and after a lottery windfall, we show that winners tend to switch towards support for a right-wing political party and  to  become  less  egalitarian.    The  larger  the  win,  the  more  people  tilt  to  the  right.    This relationship is robust to (i) different ways of defining right-wing, (ii) a variety of estimation methods,  and  (iii)  methods  that  condition  on  the  person  previously  having  voted  left.   It  is strongest for males.  Our findings are consistent with the view that voting is driven partly by human self-interest.  Money apparently makes people more right-wing''

https://warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/economics/research/workingpapers/2014/twerp_1039_oswald.pdf


 

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