Coronavirus

[SydneyRover]

I guess that depends on where your vantage point is?

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Yep. Rather people just be honest because, like Boris Johnson, they are fooling nobody and people can see straight through their BS.

[drfchound]

I guess that depends on where your vantage point is?

You are using  “ I guess” in lots of your recent posts SR, which means you don’t really know and are assuming you are right.
A bit like TT then.

[BillyStubbsTears]

The internet gives you some depressing insights into how w**k some folk are at understanding other people's minds.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

The internet gives you some depressing insights into how w**k some folk are at understanding other people's minds.

Absolutely. You are a perfect example of that.

[SydneyRover]

Sheesh!

''Department of Health writes off £9bn spent in England’s Covid PPE drive
Billions were spent on unusable or overpriced protective equipment, annual accounts show''

hmmmm, and no one else could do any better, I think we need some new selectors.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/feb/01/department-of-health-writes-off-9bn-spent-in-uk-covid-ppe-drive

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Not at all surprising Sydney, is always going to happen in a time of excessive demand isn't it?

The other options were to purchase lower qualities (hard to do when you don't know just how bad it will get), mess about arguing over price - not going to work when demand is that high.

I posted about it before from.thr perspective of the company I worked for at the time.  The price of PPE went up 10* in a matter of days.  Now if you still have that supply in stock you have to lower the price to what an accountant would call the net realisable value.  In essence what they paid at the time was probably often the right price in a massively excessive market. They just bought too much of it clearly in a time of panic, hence now the value has dropped you have to devalue it.

[SydneyRover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

[wilts rover]

And yet there were many examples of hospitals, care homes and other health settings running out of PPE? Remember the Robert Jenrick plane load from Turkey that wasn't fit for NHS use?

It's what happens when you order it from the ex-landlord of your local pub or a company set-up by a member of the House of Lords, five days after getting a contract, but refuse to deal with a company that actually makes PPE.

For interest this waste of money on unusable PPE added to Sunak giving £4.7 billion to fraundsters equates to a cost of £21 million a year, every year, since the extinction of the dinosaurs.

[SydneyRover]

And totally ignores all the warnings about impending pandemics and the need to be prepared, so much so Cygnus was run to find potential problems

''What were its findings?

The Cygnus report was frank about the state of the UK’s readiness. “The UK’s preparedness and response, in terms of its plans, policies and capability, is currently not sufficient to cope with the extreme demands of a severe pandemic that will have a nationwide impact across all sectors,” it found.

One problem was that while each government body participating in the exercise had its own bespoke plans, enabling a flexible and decentralised response, nobody in the centre had oversight over everyone else.

In the absence of any “overview of pandemic response plans and procedures”, participants found it much harder to shift resources between one another so as react to unexpected rises and falls in demand for services such social care beds.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/07/what-was-exercise-cygnus-and-what-did-it-find

yep, no one could have handled anything this government did any better even though the disaster scenario spelled out the dangers.

[SydneyRover]

''Revealed: PPE stockpile was out-of-date when coronavirus hit UK
By Channel 4 News Investigations Team
Channel 4 News obtains full inventory of the national pandemic stockpile – revealing vital safety gear was years out of date''

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk

Gee, I wonder if it could be made into glove puppets and sold on ebay?

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

[SydneyRover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

I been waiting for the real pud to show up, you have been defending this government for quite a while, tell me what I posted that is incorrect, shouldn't be to hard with all your schooling.

[drfchound]

''Revealed: PPE stockpile was out-of-date when coronavirus hit UK
By Channel 4 News Investigations Team
Channel 4 News obtains full inventory of the national pandemic stockpile – revealing vital safety gear was years out of date''

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk

Gee, I wonder if it could be made into glove puppets and sold on ebay?

Funny that you should highlight in bold print, those words.
I can recall a few posters on here complaining that the government had not been pre prepared for the pandemic by holding enough stock of things like PPE.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

I been waiting for the real pud to show up, you have been defending this government for quite a while, tell me what I posted that is incorrect, shouldn't be to hard with all your schooling.

Absolutely right to defend spending huge sums on ppe in the circumstances.  I am politically sided to a small state and not wasting money but it is not one size fits all and no government could have control on the market.  It highlighted a large failure in the global economy and the weakness of international procurement (and arguably the inefficiency of state procurement).

I once came across a similar situation in work. It related to some equipment for high post birth care for newborn babies.  There was a choice, be efficient and pay a fair price and wait 3-4, weeks or pay 5* the price and have it tomorrow.  The risk was there was no cover for that equipment for 3-4 weeks. Without hesitation the money was paid it's morally correct. Same thing happens with that stock you write it off, but should value for money in times of crisis be the number 1 driver? Absolutely not but you should then fix the situation that got you in to that position in the first place.

[tommy toes]

''Revealed: PPE stockpile was out-of-date when coronavirus hit UK
By Channel 4 News Investigations Team
Channel 4 News obtains full inventory of the national pandemic stockpile – revealing vital safety gear was years out of date''

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk

Gee, I wonder if it could be made into glove puppets and sold on ebay?

Funny that you should highlight in bold print, those words.
I can recall a few posters on here complaining that the government had not been pre prepared for the pandemic by holding enough stock of things like PPE.

Oh dear, hound.
That's because the Government, who had been in charge since 2010, didn't renew PPE as they should have like previous Governments had.

[SydneyRover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

I been waiting for the real pud to show up, you have been defending this government for quite a while, tell me what I posted that is incorrect, shouldn't be to hard with all your schooling.

Absolutely right to defend spending huge sums on ppe in the circumstances.  I am politically sided to a small state and not wasting money but it is not one size fits all and no government could have control on the market.  It highlighted a large failure in the global economy and the weakness of international procurement (and arguably the inefficiency of state procurement).

I once came across a similar situation in work. It related to some equipment for high post birth care for newborn babies.  There was a choice, be efficient and pay a fair price and wait 3-4, weeks or pay 5* the price and have it tomorrow.  The risk was there was no cover for that equipment for 3-4 weeks. Without hesitation the money was paid it's morally correct. Same thing happens with that stock you write it off, but should value for money in times of crisis be the number 1 driver? Absolutely not but you should then fix the situation that got you in to that position in the first place.

So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?

[drfchound]

''Revealed: PPE stockpile was out-of-date when coronavirus hit UK
By Channel 4 News Investigations Team
Channel 4 News obtains full inventory of the national pandemic stockpile – revealing vital safety gear was years out of date''

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed-ppe-stockpile-was-out-of-date-when-coronavirus-hit-uk

Gee, I wonder if it could be made into glove puppets and sold on ebay?

Funny that you should highlight in bold print, those words.
I can recall a few posters on here complaining that the government had not been pre prepared for the pandemic by holding enough stock of things like PPE.

Oh dear, hound.
That's because the Government, who had been in charge since 2010, didn't renew PPE as they should have like previous Governments had.

So what would have happened to the out of date stuff that the new updated stuff would have replaced?
I presume it would have had to have been scrapped, so would still have been included in a high value of outdated stuff and probably have been in bold type in your mates post.
According to your logic, the previous government must have thrown lots of outdated PPE away to keep on top of things.
Have you any evidence to support that the previous government did update PPE and how much was the value of outdated stuff that was binned.


Anyway, I thought you didn’t care about what I posted.

[SydneyRover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

[WheatleyRover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

You really do have a crownvirus don't you Sydney, repeating it's a pandemic is not going to make it true, you don't seem to have broken the cycle of believing in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

No objectivity is fine. Your comment "wouldn't want you working for me" was completely unobjective and was nasty. Doesn't bother me I'm in a great position for my age.  Out of interest what do you do for a living and life?

As to your other points there's lots and lots of them all in varying different angles.  On ppe, we'd never have had enough even with a stockpile. You can't stockpile everything without huge cost and waste anyway (we could have nuclear war tomorrow but we won't hold enough kit for that eventuality either).

I don't see everything as perfect, black or white or simple.  It's not one way or the other you can say some criticism is unjustified whilst agreeing that some is.  I also don't think it's possible to get everything right in every case, nor do I think any political party would have done much different.

[drfchound]

Great post bfyp. Very concise and sensible.

[Bentley Bullet]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

No objectivity is fine. Your comment "wouldn't want you working for me" was completely unobjective and was nasty. Doesn't bother me I'm in a great position for my age.  Out of interest what do you do for a living and life?

As to your other points there's lots and lots of them all in varying different angles.  On ppe, we'd never have had enough even with a stockpile. You can't stockpile everything without huge cost and waste anyway (we could have nuclear war tomorrow but we won't hold enough kit for that eventuality either).

I don't see everything as perfect, black or white or simple.  It's not one way or the other you can say some criticism is unjustified whilst agreeing that some is.  I also don't think it's possible to get everything right in every case, nor do I think any political party would have done much different.

What an absolute top post. The best one of the entire thread. It is incisive and unquestionably true for any right-minded person without a political agenda. It sums up in a nutshell what honest, reasonable and sensible people have been saying all along.

Take a bow BFYP.

[belton rover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

No objectivity is fine. Your comment "wouldn't want you working for me" was completely unobjective and was nasty. Doesn't bother me I'm in a great position for my age.  Out of interest what do you do for a living and life?

As to your other points there's lots and lots of them all in varying different angles.  On ppe, we'd never have had enough even with a stockpile. You can't stockpile everything without huge cost and waste anyway (we could have nuclear war tomorrow but we won't hold enough kit for that eventuality either).

I don't see everything as perfect, black or white or simple.  It's not one way or the other you can say some criticism is unjustified whilst agreeing that some is.  I also don't think it's possible to get everything right in every case, nor do I think any political party would have done much different.

What an absolute top post. The best one of the entire thread. It is incisive and unquestionably true for any right-minded person without a political agenda. It sums up in a nutshell what honest, reasonable and sensible people have been saying all along.

Take a bow BFYP.

Ditto

[Metalmicky]

Not sure if posted.... PPE write off

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60176283

[belton rover]

Great post bfyp. Very concise and sensible.

Ditto

[selby]

Looks like Syd has gone to bed, or should that be put to bed.
 Oh by the way Ditto.

[wilts rover]

Wouldn't want you working for me pud

Pretty much sums up your nastiness that other posters have mentioned doesn't it given you know f**k all about the background of anyone on here from the other side of the world.

Here in the real world we actually experience the truth on the ground not just what we read on the internet....

For clarity the valuation of stock at a point in time isn't a choice it's a regulation.

Come on pud back yourself in, i've put down a whole paragraph (below) why you are wrong and nothing?

Is truth nastiness? can't you handle the truth? I've told many before you that I'm not going to stand by and allow you and them to rewrite history, too many dead pud, too many British people died unnecessarily.

''So tell me what is acceptable about a government that was warned about an impending pandemic, did nothing to prepare the country, allowed the resources to run out of date, then gave contract to it's buddies, did not fully fund the hospital system and ran it short staffed by around 50000 nurses the result being 10s of thousands of unnecessary deaths and one of the worst death rates in Europe, all the while the health minister was on the shag and #10 was in party mode almost all of the time?''

No objectivity is fine. Your comment "wouldn't want you working for me" was completely unobjective and was nasty. Doesn't bother me I'm in a great position for my age.  Out of interest what do you do for a living and life?

As to your other points there's lots and lots of them all in varying different angles.  On ppe, we'd never have had enough even with a stockpile. You can't stockpile everything without huge cost and waste anyway (we could have nuclear war tomorrow but we won't hold enough kit for that eventuality either).

I don't see everything as perfect, black or white or simple.  It's not one way or the other you can say some criticism is unjustified whilst agreeing that some is.  I also don't think it's possible to get everything right in every case, nor do I think any political party would have done much different.

What an absolute top post. The best one of the entire thread. It is incisive and unquestionably true for any right-minded person without a political agenda. It sums up in a nutshell what honest, reasonable and sensible people have been saying all along.

Take a bow BFYP.

But is it true?

Not all of the money is due to write-downs, only just over half . The rest was stuff that was unsuitable, useless and not fit for purpose.

And if you can't stockpile - why are we paying £1million A DAY to store this stuff.

Did they really go the right people to source this - or was it used as a means of funnelling taxpayers money to Tory MP's friends and donors. There are a number of court cases underway about the procurement - in those that have concluded the government has been found to have acted illegally.

Seems some people like stuff that suits their political agenda rather than the facts.

https://www.cips.org/supply-management/news/2021/july/10000-shipping-containers-of-ppe-still-to-be-unpacked/

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/stacks-of-unused-ppe-costing-taxpayer-1-million-a-day-to-store-300231/

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

News emerging that the unjabbed NHS staff whose jobs were salvaged at the death will now have any job promotions or job changes refused due to being unvaccinated.

Not sure whether this is a Government ruling or NHS ruling but either way whoever has made it needs dumping in a canal forthwith.

[SydneyRover]

The rebuilding of NHS procurement (a good thing) whereby all things NHS procured would be listed and recorded and known.

Why then when the pandemic struck was there out of date PPE in the system?

Why was the virtually brand new procurement system by-passed?

Policy paper
NHS e-procurement strategy
Actions on e-procurement to be taken by the NHS and the government under the NHS Procurement Development Programme.

Department of Health and Social Care
7 May 2014

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-e-procurement-strategy

''Revealed: value of UK pandemic stockpile fell by 40% in six years
This article is more than 1 year old
£325m wiped off value of health department’s emergency stockpile including PPE''

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/12/revealed-value-of-uk-pandemic-stockpile-fell-by-40-in-six-years

I can't imagine what those (800+ died of covid) working in health care went through during the pandemic, knowing that the people they were caring for were dying from an extremely contagious disease and they didn't have the protective equipment to keep them safe, but they kept turning up.