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Interesting how the UK is messaging Russia re the mercenaries sentenced to death by the DPR. I suspect they will be compelled to contact the DPR itself, but will they acknowledge its existence?
It's evidence based. It doesn't claim anything it can't support. I wouldn't trust any other source. Especially one from a governemtn that has made misinformation a specialism.
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 04:30:11 pmInteresting how the UK is messaging Russia re the mercenaries sentenced to death by the DPR. I suspect they will be compelled to contact the DPR itself, but will they acknowledge its existence? So let's see.You repeat Russian claims that the destruction of cities in the Donbas is due to Ukrainian actions.You publish Russian Govt data on Ukrainian casualties and materiel losses.You repeatedly follow the Russian line of calling foreigners fighting on the Ukrainian side "mercenaries".And yet you take umbrage when I suggest that you're playing the Useful Idiot, parroting the Russian Govt line?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 04:35:02 pmIt's evidence based. It doesn't claim anything it can't support. I wouldn't trust any other source. Especially one from a governemtn that has made misinformation a specialism.Yep, and as I said, and you ignored, the real figures are significantly higher than what it has. So there we have it, solid for what it is, but by its own admission, wildly inaccurate.
This is grimly symbolic of the Russian approach.https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical/status/1539260812371677185?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5EtweetTheir strategy now is simply to rain down cheap, shit accuracy rockets on the Ukrainian positions from 20 miles behind the front line. Then they send in a few troops in armoured vehicles. If they don't encounter any resistance, they move the front on. If they are wiped out because the shit accuracy rockets did a shit job, rinse and repeat.Their much-lauded air strike forces have proved in battle to be hopeless. They have been totally unable to establish the air superiority needed to surgically isolate and defeat the defenders. So they resort to the brutal old method of carpet bombing - putting people and infrastructure through a grinder and spitting them out.I wish I didn't swear as much as I do, because I'm struggling to find words to express my revulsion here. I can only repeat what my Russian friend said to me at the weekend - and I've never in my life heard him swear before. He said they are f**king savages. Both on the geo-political level, where their strategy is to bully whoever they can into being in their sphere of influence, not with the promise of a better tomorrow if they collaborate, but with the threat of extermination if they resist. And on the battlefield level, where they have a total disregard for the lives of combatants on both sides, and on the collateral damage that their disgusting war is doing.On both counts, they are pulling us back into a dark, brutal past. They cannot be allowed to succeed.
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 05:52:30 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 04:35:02 pmIt's evidence based. It doesn't claim anything it can't support. I wouldn't trust any other source. Especially one from a governemtn that has made misinformation a specialism.Yep, and as I said, and you ignored, the real figures are significantly higher than what it has. So there we have it, solid for what it is, but by its own admission, wildly inaccurate.Do you understand the difference between upper bound and lower bound estimates?
And it appears that a lot of the munitions being used by Russia are banned Internationally
Mercenaries usually get paid.Do you know if Ukraine are paying these fighters and if so how much?
BST, that youtube link is a weird example to use. The Ukraine troops would be in all those buildings. Seems the targetting was very accurate. Maybe you know which one they were hiding in?From what I can see, your description is not what happens. Certainly not carpet bombing - where do you egt that from?Hopeless air strikes? As you know, they are not using huge bombs, nor carpet bombing, so we're talking about generally speaking targetted strikes against very very well dug in positions.Savages - I think you'll find most troops around the world are savage, it's the nature of the beast. Train a guy to be cold in the face of death and destruction and you get a psycho. Of course they are. But to bring us to Ukraine - what kind nurturing are you seeing in trrops shelling civilian areas of Donetsk, including a maternity hospital? One with no Russian troops in it. 100s of shells a day for weeks. Isn't that your definition of carpet bombing?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 06:07:46 pmQuote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 05:52:30 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 04:35:02 pmIt's evidence based. It doesn't claim anything it can't support. I wouldn't trust any other source. Especially one from a governemtn that has made misinformation a specialism.Yep, and as I said, and you ignored, the real figures are significantly higher than what it has. So there we have it, solid for what it is, but by its own admission, wildly inaccurate.Do you understand the difference between upper bound and lower bound estimates?Yup, but both are wrong. What do you think the true figures are? For Ukraine and Russia? Lets go with planes, tanks, and troops dead/injured/captured. O'm not saying I know, but from your angle of dismissing what teh Russian MoD say, and giving me your low estimate, which has to be noted isn't balanced, I guess you might be coming from somewhere?
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 09:22:53 pmBST, that youtube link is a weird example to use. The Ukraine troops would be in all those buildings. Seems the targetting was very accurate. Maybe you know which one they were hiding in?From what I can see, your description is not what happens. Certainly not carpet bombing - where do you egt that from?Hopeless air strikes? As you know, they are not using huge bombs, nor carpet bombing, so we're talking about generally speaking targetted strikes against very very well dug in positions.Savages - I think you'll find most troops around the world are savage, it's the nature of the beast. Train a guy to be cold in the face of death and destruction and you get a psycho. Of course they are. But to bring us to Ukraine - what kind nurturing are you seeing in trrops shelling civilian areas of Donetsk, including a maternity hospital? One with no Russian troops in it. 100s of shells a day for weeks. Isn't that your definition of carpet bombing?You mean the "targeting" that basically had rockets falling in random places over a hectare area?You don't HAVE to take umbrage at every criticism of Russia you know?By the way, I'm talking about the senior military commanders and their political masters. Unless you think the grunts on the ground are choosing strategy?
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 09:27:36 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 06:07:46 pmQuote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 05:52:30 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 21, 2022, 04:35:02 pmIt's evidence based. It doesn't claim anything it can't support. I wouldn't trust any other source. Especially one from a governemtn that has made misinformation a specialism.Yep, and as I said, and you ignored, the real figures are significantly higher than what it has. So there we have it, solid for what it is, but by its own admission, wildly inaccurate.Do you understand the difference between upper bound and lower bound estimates?Yup, but both are wrong. What do you think the true figures are? For Ukraine and Russia? Lets go with planes, tanks, and troops dead/injured/captured. O'm not saying I know, but from your angle of dismissing what teh Russian MoD say, and giving me your low estimate, which has to be noted isn't balanced, I guess you might be coming from somewhere?Right. This is my absolutely final response to you, because I really should know better.1) You are providing Russian MoD data with zero supporting evidence.2) That is data of what they claim are Ukrainian losses.3) I am linking to am independent source of evidence-based RUSSIAN losses.You equate the two as "wrong". Which misses the point so badly, that you must either be incapable of processing information, or you're deliberately obfuscating. Have fun. I'm out of this.
Quote from: ravenrover on June 21, 2022, 06:57:55 pmAnd it appears that a lot of the munitions being used by Russia are banned Internationally"a lot"? Like the cluster bombs? ie the ones that Ukraine is also using? And the one's that spread anti personel mines?
BRR.Your desire to see the positive in everything Russia does has made you unable to use your eyes. Watch that video again. There are 14 rocket strikes. Spread over an area that I'd guess is maybe 200m right-left by 100m up-down. That's as far as we can see anyway - some of the strikes are right at the very edge of the screen and it's quite possible that others landed outside the field of view.Which is precisely my point. That is indiscriminate laying down of non-precision munitions over a wide area. Picture that attack now in an urban area and multiply it by 50 or 100 or 1000. And picture the collateral damage done for every rocket that by fortune finds a target that it is meant for. Go outside today, where you live. Pace out 200m X 100m. And count up how many houses there are. Pick a dozen at random and imagine those are the targets. Then imagine that indiscriminate rain of rockets pouring down. Maybe, one day, you might start to question why you support this Russian bestiality, rather than unconditionally condemning it.
I have just read a report where Russian intercepted signals are reporting Ukrainian forces pushing down the sides of the Russian advance in some areas and the Russian advance forces are in danger of being surrounded. If they are surrounded they will come in for some of their own medicine and will be bombarded. Also the manpower reserves they have are of very poor quality as far as being recognised as a good fighting unit.
Quote from: Bristol Red Rover on June 21, 2022, 09:29:42 pmQuote from: ravenrover on June 21, 2022, 06:57:55 pmAnd it appears that a lot of the munitions being used by Russia are banned Internationally"a lot"? Like the cluster bombs? ie the ones that Ukraine is also using? And the one's that spread anti personel mines?Missing out Phosphorous and Thermobaric. Cluster bombs on civilians are illegal
Quote from: ravenrover on June 21, 2022, 06:57:55 pmAnd it appears that a lot of the munitions being used by Russia are banned Internationally"a lot"? Like the cluster bombs? ie the ones that Ukraine is also using? And the one's that spread anti personel mines?