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Here's the problem with Corbyn. This is HIS organisation.https://www.stopwar.org.uk/article/responding-to-the-terrible-events-in-ukraine-requires-context/This is typical of their mentality."Yes it's terrible in Ukraine and yes Russia shouldn't...mumble, mumble blah, blah...BUT! NATO, NATO, NATO, NATO!!!"At best, it's the politics of a fourth form school debate. At worst, they are Putin's fellow travellers.
Wilts.I get that Corbyn's heart is in the right place. But the Road to Hell and all that...Two days into this war, his Stop the War group was still calling this a Russian "movement" into Ukraine and blaming NATO. Even as the missiles were landing, they couldn't bring themselves to call it an unprovoked invasion. A war of aggression.Weakness like that is catnip to aggressors.
The discussion of how much of Ukraine to give away is an acceptance of where the state of play now is. You want to tell me how Ukraine is supposed to drive Russia out of Crimea and the Donbass?And on that topic, how much of Ukraine do you reckon would now be under Russian control had their army not been trained and armed by NATO countries? Which, presumably, Corbyn wouldn't have taken part in, because he believes if we just hold hands and sing songs, everyone will be nice to each other.
He's already used chemical weapons in Syria. He's used nerve agent in Salisbury. Radioactive salts in London. Are YOU going to trust your instincts that he wouldn't go further?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 26, 2022, 12:14:31 pmHere's the problem with Corbyn. This is HIS organisation.https://www.stopwar.org.uk/article/responding-to-the-terrible-events-in-ukraine-requires-context/This is typical of their mentality."Yes it's terrible in Ukraine and yes Russia shouldn't...mumble, mumble blah, blah...BUT! NATO, NATO, NATO, NATO!!!"At best, it's the politics of a fourth form school debate. At worst, they are Putin's fellow travellers.Would I have felt safe with Corbyn trusted with national security ?Absolutely not .But are the Tories any less dangerous Billy given what we know and have known about dirty Russian money inside the Tory Party and the city of London , money that's bought political influence in the government .Six and two three's perhaps .
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on March 26, 2022, 11:44:49 amWilts.I get that Corbyn's heart is in the right place. But the Road to Hell and all that...Two days into this war, his Stop the War group was still calling this a Russian "movement" into Ukraine and blaming NATO. Even as the missiles were landing, they couldn't bring themselves to call it an unprovoked invasion. A war of aggression.Weakness like that is catnip to aggressors. I believe you have missed my point. If Corbyn had been PM we wouldn't be here - it wouldn't have started.Johnson was clearly part of Putin's foreign policy and his actions over the past few years have clearly played a part in this start of this invasion/war. How much or how knowingly I doubt we will know in our lifetime.And a bit rich to be discussing how much of Ukraine to give away and then accuse someone else of giving 'catnip to aggressors'.
Video going round of Ukrainian soldiers (allegedly) shooting Russian POW in the knee caps. Brutal and not good at all.
It's not understandable.There are some vicious neo-fascist militias in Ukraine. They are as evil as Putin, just on a smaller scale.There is never, ever justification for killing, mutilating or torturing prisoners of war. If Ukraine militia have been doing that, they should be decried, not excused. And they should be considered war criminals.
Wilts.That is wishful thinking of a very high order. You really think that Corbyn as PM would have prevented Putin's attack on Ukraine?The only ways that the attack could have been averted were.1) If Putin had known his forces were going to get a proper kicking.Or2) If Ukraine had been forced by the West to accept a status as a Russian vassal state.Which of those do you think Corbyn would have been able to facilitate?
Lads,None of you is going to get the chance to have a crack at Vlad, so get back to the point.If Russia now retreats to a position where Donbas and the Russian speaking areas become neutral, then what is the plan for the reconstruction?Costs will be astronomical, and there is the difficulty of munitions and assault rifles distributed without recall.These arms will in some part find a home with the ultra nationalist militias.Cessation of military hostilities is paramount, but there has to be a strategy for after the conflict ends.